The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
There have been a few discussions on here, and they make a lot of sense.
When detaching and letting someone suffer natural consequenses, how do we as Wives, husbands, parents, know who's consequenses they are.
How after so many years of doing the wrong things, do I pull the plug?
When we get married we establish a family. We do things buy a home, a car, furniture. Then pay bills.
Okay, young and naive, I started picking up the slack as many did when he didn't. It was maintaining the family. We are taught in non A homes that families work together. Wives help their husbands. Somewhere along the line, things got uncontrollable. Now years later, and many bills later, we are told that to fix this we need to detach. To stop picking up the slack. Let the A suffer natural consequenses of their actions. If we stop doing these things we are "supposed" to do. And he doesn't come through and realistically by many of their track records they won't. Who suffers the consequenses? We are warned in early meetings that A's are great at finding new enablers. So they find another and we are left, to clean up the mess, that we now have to live in. If they don't find another, they just continue on in drunken Lala land not caring and again we get to live with the mess.
I am afraid to stop doing, not because I don't want him to sufffer, to be honest, I really don't care what he suffers. I am afraid of what the rest of us will suffer.
How do we step back when we have families and responsibilities, and allow them to suffer natural consequenses, without the rest of us suffering more?
How do we detangle their consequenses from our own, and our kids. Is it selfish to not want to give up the small shred of comfort us and our families have left?
Jeannie--I so understand where you are coming from!!! Everything is in my name because he had bad credit, now if things don't get paid what happens? they come after me. I am not willing for that to happen--so the bills get paid and he lives up in comfort because I make sure to find the money (this he does help with sometimes--but he doesn't worry about it because why should he, he has me for that). I am not willing to go without elec. or phone because I want them and my kids need elec. (granted I could do without the satellite, but I love my TV escape!)
I do think we get the consequences too because we thought (no matter how mistaken we were) that we were getting a family, a mate (someone to get through the times and life with). We picked up the slack because we thought eventually it would be our turn to let go, that's life the give and take--unfortunately they don't see it like that.
The joke this morning was there wasn't any cold DR.Peppers in the fridge. He asked me why I hadn't put any in last night. I told him he was the last one up last night, he could've handled that. He stated (half jokingly and half seriously) but it's not my job to take care of me that's your job. Didn't you know that's what you signed on to when you said "I Do!"? I just laughed and said sorry I must not have gotten the memo!! While he knows he is perfectly capable of getting his own drink I think every a would love everyone else to give them everything they want when they want it and there should be no consequences!!! Oh if only we could feel that way and they could sit back and deal with it all!!!!
Like you, I believe in working on things, chipping in, helping out, etc. for the sake of the couple, the family, the team.
However, in situations where there is addiction, dysfunction, etc. whether in the workplace or at home, I think, as you indicated, it's a different ball game. Suddenly, chipping in can become picking up the slack, enabling, handling everything, etc.
I find it's important for me to take a really good look at how another's behavior impacts me, and to use that (rather than whether they are or are not suffering consequences) as the primary measurement for what needs to change. If, for example, my partner were not paying bills, it would be less important to me not to pay them so that they could face the consequences (that would be secondary to me). It would be most important for me how paying the bills that are not my responsibility is wreaking havoc on my own life: working a gazillion hours, elevated stress (and related health effects), anger, no savings for retirement, etc. It's from that place--reality of the impact of another's behavior on my own--that I now try to make my decisions. In the process, I try to look at the short and long-term impact, and do an inventory to really look at the situation realistically and thoroughly, so I can set boundaries in my own best interest. I've found the traditions a great place to go to for support of how best to set these boundaries.
I, too, can relate. If I don't do the dishes, they don't get done. If I don't clean the toilet, it stays dirty. If I don't pay the rent/cable/car payment/insurance/groceries/phone bill, then they don't get paid. So, unless I want to live in squalor with the creditors knocking, I have to pay up and clean up. Meanwhile, he doesn't work, generally speaking. He lies to me about working when he really is sitting home making up excuses why the money isn't coming in. I'm tempted to tell the landlord "Here's my half of the rent, E's responsible for his half," and seeing what happens. Either he pays up or if he doesn't maybe the landlord will evict him and I can pay the extra and keep the apartment. I don't even know how that works...I've never been in the situation where I had to be responsible for more than my bills. That's all I want...to be responsible for ME.
Anyway, I digress. I empathize with you. I definitely do. Where do you draw the line. How much do you have to suffer in order for him to really experience the consequences of his actions?
At the moment I'm so angry and all that comes to mind , and I don't mean to be offensive
EVERYBODIES
MUCH LOVE I NEED YA"LL THE PROGRAM AND HP BLESSINGS
__________________
I tell myself when times are rough, "this to shall pass!!!" Ask HP for guidance, if the door is open, and I know how to look, I will become aware! I also visit http://www.inspiringthots.net/ . Blessings , Your sister in Recovery
Hello Jeannie , good questions. to me detachment meant that I no longer suffer emotionally for the things he was doing had to stop taking them personally. It meant I no longer cover his checks tho the money came from our joint account he was the one who had to replace the check not me. He could face them it was not my job .
I no longer picked him up at the bar, stoped lying for him or making excuses for his behavior just kinda left him hanging out there to clean up his own mess. Helping with the bills etc I had n o problem with he always shared with us and we lived well. I also started a separate bank account with a little emergency money in it , for the just in case days ya know? And if u don't need it for emergency it makes a great suprise holiday fund.
Detachment is hard to get a handle on but possible just keep working on it and see if u can find our detachment pamphlet at the meetings , that little piece of paper changed my life. that and the july 14th reading in the ODAT.
Jeannie, for me, I made my life to depend on only me. It is hard. Much harder
with kids. But I did that too. For me I had to get everything in my name. Made sure my income did not depend on him at all. As it turns out, he got and gets worse, and the only thing I lose is him.Not my house, not my car, etc. Still is awful to lose him, but more secure not losing everything else.
My A has lost everything, and the twentieth he loses his freedom. Unfortunately not for very long. He has suffered all his consequences.
I understand the "normal" process of marriage kids home car...but when we marry someone with a disease, the same rules or what we think of as normal, cannot happen. At least they don't seem to.
Becuz we make the money, we pay the bills is not enabling to me. I am sure if our A's had cancer we would do the same things. We have to survive. Now I would not pay his bills, cars, cell phones whatever. I would set up my life with out him. Make it so if
he was around great, if not we would be ok.
Jeannie I am so sad you go thru this bs. Focus on you and those beautiful kids.
i think this is a difficult issue to deal with. I have to deal with it on a day by day basis. I did a lot to separate my stuff out from the A's. I also did a lot to not offer, to not volunteer to not play the martyr. I used to offer too much now I watch and wait and focus on me. Personally because of this issue the chaos, the car stuff I know I do not want to carry on with this insecurity on a long term basis. The problem with my over commiting and I did overcommit to someone who if I had had boundaries I would have left long ago is that I have to disentangle myself slowly but surely and it is difficult. I have disentangled a great deal since I came here. I do believe it is possible to disentangle. I think it is sometimes a moment by moment thing.
I know this disentangling and this detachment issues makes me have the energy to work on my issues. I try also not to focus on resenting although anger and resentment are natural when dealing with an A. I work hard on letting resentments go because I can get literally toxic with resentment. I try to monitor the resentment level every day so I can remain functional so I do it for me not for him. I will probably be angry with him for a long time because his self destruction affected me deeply and he just projects it back on me. Whatever it is I had something to do with it. That is one reason I rarely discuss those issues with him now. I rarely discuss much with him anymore because I just hear his self pity, justifications, backlash so I know I am not heard. I am not going to give that much time or energy to people anymore who do not wish to hear me out.
