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This is a bit of a long story and all very new to me just a heads up... I'm just trying to understand everything.
I began dating this guy about 3 months ago. I really fell for him in the beginning because we have similar careers and passions. We both work with children with special needs and I loved talking to someone who understood the things I go through each day at work. He also seemed so complex and "with it". We live about an hour away so we only see each other on the weekends. For the first two months I always felt like he liked me when we were in person face to face on the weekends, and then throughout the week his texts and calls were scarce and I questioned how much he really liked me. Around Thanksgiving he blew up at me, saying horrible things to me because he felt I talked about other guys too much. We got past it. Ever since then I would tiptoe around everything I said to him because I was afraid of his temper. Fast forward to two weeks ago. We had spent a really emotional day together and that night he told me he loved me. I was shocked because I really didn't have any idea he felt that way. Then the next day he got really drunk and slowly throughout the day admitted to me that he was an alcoholic. He had been lying to me the whole time and couldn't continue the lie. He said he loved me and wanted to rise above this. That night I took him to his house to prepare for detox. He got really angry with me that night again, saying that I was abandoning him. I realized that to argue back would be pointless, that he was in an altered state so I just sat with him and consoled him. I stayed with him the whole next day through many emotions and some sickness while he was waiting to go to detox.
I'm proud to say he detoxed successfully and has been sober now for two weeks. Since then, unsurprisingly, he has been a hotbed of emotions and he has been really mean to me a few more times. We got in a big argument where he completely picked me apart for a few hours. I hardly spoke because he would shoot down everything I had to say. He's convinced I am lying to him about things that I'm not lying to him about. He's suspicious of me... for no reason. Once I started to cry and gather my things to just leave it was like he completely snapped out of it. He was so sorry, knows he can't keep doing this to me, he's going to do better, I've been so good to him, etc. Then he asks if we can have makeup sex. I told him no as I was still really down from the argument and just exhausted. He escorted me to my car, would hardly hug me goodbye, when I asked him what was wrong he saluted me and walked away saying he doesn't understand what I want. That night he sent me a text breaking up with me saying that he was in the wrong and he can't be a boyfriend right now that I deserve so much more and he needs to focus on therapy and meetings. When I called him to talk about it he flipped again, saying he thought I wanted to work it out. We didn't speak for a few days and did speak today. He feels like I'm dating other people and he told me he went out with someone, that if I can't be with him right now then he doesn't want to be with someone whose going to abandon him, he can't do the in between or give it time. He has been going back and forth between telling me goodbye and saying "what do I need to do to make you happy?" He just got upset again telling me to lose his number and that I'm a dime a dozen...
So my dilemma.... how much of this do I chalk up to the disease and the anger? How much is forgivable? I feel like I have EVERY right to be uncertain about things... and just as I'm typing this I get another long apology from him.. This is all completely new to me. I feel like I should have left 5 blow-ups ago but I'm stuck on the idea of him being better and healthy and happy. I feel like I spent so much time trying to reach him before I knew there was a problem... and once the problem came out it's either that he loves me or he hates me. Have I even scratched the surface of the person he is? He was really good at hiding the drinking in the beginning so I don't know how much to believe about our time together those first two months since I don't know at any given time if he was drunk or not. Hopefully someone has some insight that will help. I would truly appreciate some!
Aloha Boston...Wow!! It's (the disease) has hooked you. I am glad you have found us...glad you are here. There will be many who will come to your aid besides me and I have some suggestions. First read your post here and ask your self if someone else had written it what would you say about her choices and situation? Another suggestion is please get to know as much as you can about alcoholism as you can before attempting to think your expectations and responses are sane. Alcoholism is a cunning, powerful and baffling disease that can never be cured, only arrested by total abstinence. If not totally arrested it is progressive and if the alcoholic was to stop drinking the way he does for any period of time and then continue (relapse) the outcome will be worse. The alcoholic has but three choices ...Sobriety, insanity and death. From my experience you are in the insanity stage and also from my own experience as a recovering alcoholic myself he is not sober just marginally dry.
There is so much to know and then understand and then make decisions about for you. As the spouse of an alcoholic/addict myself I found the doors to the Al-Anon Family Groups and I firmly suggest you do the same if you are thinking that you want to try to have a "normal" relationship with this alcoholic which states that alcoholic is the normal. Alcohol as you now understand first hand is a mind and mood altering chemical and you will never change that and he will never not be altered because you are in his life. One of the psychological profiles for the participants in this disease is "risk takers"...you're taking a risk...and a big one...do you feel it? Because alcohol alters you actually are dealing with multiple personalities within one body...do you have the experience and awareness on how to do that? As I opened with you already seem "hooked" by the disease. You can find the hotline to the Al-Anon Family Groups in your area in the white pages of your local telephone book; please go look it up and call for where and when we meet in your area. When you get there look for the literature table to see how much literature is available to you. Many of the pamphlets are at no cost and others are reasonable. Make a commitment to your own sanity and safety by deciding on getting to as many open Al-Anon meetings as you can for the next 60 days and check in with MIP as often as you can. We are open 24/7 and I can relate that there is very solid ESH (Experience, Strength and Hope) here for you.
Keep coming back. I feel like I should have left 5 blow-ups ago but .... I pray that what comes after the word "but" is not a justification to remain in an insane situation which you are completely powerless over and has already resulted in mismanagement. (((((hugs)))))
Hiya. Welcome to the board. I am trying to recollect three months into my relationship with an a. I was high on the buzz of having a new best friend. So I read your post. And what I'm reading to me sounds like not only an alcoholic but someone who is highly emotionally and psychologically abusive. I also know how addictive that can be. Physiologically, when we are wooed to great heights then dropped then wooed again our brains produce chemicals, adrenaline when we are falling serotonin when we are "loved" again. So relationships can actually be chemically addicting. I share this only as there may be a chance knowing the process from a non emotional point of view may be of some assistance. If its just totally irrelevant to your situation I apologise and say take what you like, leave the rest. Back to your post, it is my view from what you've shared that this guy may have issues in addition to alcoholism. As far as the latter goes, well keep coming back, keep reading, come to some meetings, read some literature and remember above all to take care of your needs no matter how desperately in need of your help this person seems. It is very easy for us to get so caught up in the drama of an alcoholic, we forget ourselves. Eating well, getting enough sleep, spending time with friends and family, doing things that make us happy. Its very hard to get back to that once its lost.
It is a long hard road with an alcoholic. I have been married to a dry alcoholic
For 30 years and the disease is alive and kicking its ugly heels. The addict inside
Is still there and is very active. He is the only one that can change himself.
You can not cure it, control it and you did not cause it.
I am reading your post. This is supposed to be the courting/honeymoon stage. And already he is beating you up emotionally. I see anger issues that could escalate to physical abuse. Would u want your daughter with someone like this???
I would go to as many alanon meets as there are days to #1 get knowledge what u r getting yourself into
#2. Ascertain why would you settle for abusive relationship rather than claim your right to a happy relationship. His chances of beating this are very very low. U face a life of unimaginable struggle. Hope u get into meets and really listen and share. Had I known then what I do now I would have RAN.
Glad u r here. Sending prace
__________________
Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
Neshema I love your comments, they really make me think.
Dear Boston, I'm new here too, and received similar points from Neshema, as well as others. My situation is a lot like yours but the focus remains the same, and it's taken me a lot of anxiety and reflection to realize it. It has to be on your wellbeing, not what we can do to help, guide or get them to see the light. My boyfriend also told me that he will need the time away from me to work on himself and his recovery, and that being in a relationship right now isn't a possibility. The way I see it, it's a silver lining, I'm still single, not married to him. I have a chance to work on me, see why I feel the need to be with someone who isn't emotionally or physically healthy, and what I truly want for myself and my future.
Love and light, Kat
I guess my question back would be does it matter whether he is an alcoholic or not, and whether he treats you this way because of his disease or not? He seems to be treating you in a manner that you don't like, and I wouldn't like it either. If there wasn't alcohol involved, would you stick around with someone like this? And if there is alcohol involved, why would that make it any different?
Welcome. My x did things while we were neighbors and dating that I didn't always understand like me coming home from work and him being sullen and uncommunicative. (We had apartments side by side.) I knew that the night before when we were hanging out with friends or watching TV in one of our apartments that everything was fine, so I'd get confused and try to talk with him but he would sit like a stone towards me and would talk to the others. There were other times when he'd seem to be jealous when I'd tell him stories of relationships I'd enjoyed in high school - even grade school - when we were storytelling as a group about our childhoods and high school dating history. I thought that showed he really cared about me and I was going to show him there was nothing he had to worry about. I was only interested in him. We would go to bars on occasion where there was dancing. He'd drink but then we all drank. I didn't see that as a problem. We were just doing what college age people sometimes do. Fast forward several months, we were married. I didn't know anything at all about alcoholism or abuse. I hadn't seen the signs or in seeing the signs when we were neighbors and dating didn't recognize them as red flags. Had I continued to date him rather than marry him within the first year of our getting to know each other, I would have broken off the relationship because I would have had more facts to go on in relationship to him. I didn't know the rest of the story until I had made my vows and then lived with him.
Today, if I met somebody who is behaving as your bf is behaving, I would know that those are huge red flags based on my own experience and I would back out slowly or simply say goodbye depending on me, the other person and the circumstances at hand. I would also know that Al-Anon recovery work is the best choice for me to make because I am and have been affected by alcoholism even though I'm not an alcoholic.
Keep coming back. You're not alone. There are many of us who have experienced what you are sharing and understand how crazy making this disease can be for us.
Thank you so much for your insightful reply! This is so new to me, I have never struggled with any sort of addiction. I realized after arguing about the state of things with him all day long yesterday that I don't stand a chance between him, his addiction, and his anger. He has pushed me so far away.
He also told me that in the few days we didn't speak he went on a date, that he is so glad he had a "back up plan". But the story kept changing. Next it was a double date with his best friend and her wife. Then it was a group work thing and she was just one of his friends wives coworkers. He insisted he didn't like her or talk to her and that he and his friend talked about me the whole time. He also said he spent all week thinking about me and how he can possibly make things up to me after all of the verbal abuse. If that's true then why wouldn't he have just talked to me? If he wanted to make it up to me why would he go meet another girl? If all him and his friend talk about is me then why is his friend trying to hook him up with someone? I can't be blatantly lied to anymore. Especially when it hurts my feelings and I continually feel like I need to prove/defend my feelings for him. It makes me feel like I have to PROVE I'm a nice person, PROVE I'm not a liar, EXPLAIN everything, but when I take a step back I realize I'm being manipulated. I am being sucked in.
I made things clear to him this morning and I was incredibly sweet and supportive in doing so and he texted me back telling me that I need help and that I am abandoning him the way his family did when he was a child. This really hurts me because I feel like during the past few months all I have tried to do is put him first and care for and about him, and then he throws the guilt on me that I'm abandoning him. It keeps roping me in, I keep feeling like I need to defend myself AND let him know I care all while telling him we cannot do this right now but I decided to just stop the communication. I am getting beat down each time I try and I feel like I'm being manipulated.
I am reading your post. This is supposed to be the courting/honeymoon stage. And already he is beating you up emotionally. I see anger issues that could escalate to physical abuse. Would u want your daughter with someone like this??? I would go to as many alanon meets as there are days to #1 get knowledge what u r getting yourself into #2. Ascertain why would you settle for abusive relationship rather than claim your right to a happy relationship. His chances of beating this are very very low. U face a life of unimaginable struggle. Hope u get into meets and really listen and share. Had I known then what I do now I would have RAN. Glad u r here. Sending prace
You bring up some really good points. I have realized how scared I am of him. I am an educated vibrant person and I have policing the things I do and say for fear of his reactions. Things that should be of NO consequence. He never physically hurt me but he did yell and say awful things about me, and one time threw things. I do deserve that happy relationship.
Sounds like you are putting a boundary in place. In my experience with boundaries, I tell the other person what the boundary of what I consider acceptable is, and it sound like you have. If the person violates the boundary, then that is their choice. I have already told that person what would happen if they boundary was violated.
So, now that you have the insight that you need: I have no chance... our suggestion is to attend Al-Anon meetings, learn about alcoholism and how it affects us and recognize ways you can take good care of yourself with or without a relationship to an active alcoholic or addict. There is a push-pull in the active A - come here/go away in my experience. As a recovering codependent, I learned that I would tolerate that kind of behavior although friends of mine would never allow another person to treat them that way. I couldn't understand why some of my friends had such happy, comfortable relationships and mine was so hard. Al-Anon helped me with that. Today, I won't tolerate push/pull in somebody because I know they are very unhealthy, I'm not going to change them, and there are healthier people for me to enjoy. I know there is a saying that we train people how to treat us. I don't agree. I think we choose who we want to be around and not all people act in ways that are push/pull, disrespectful or scary.
-- Edited by grateful2be on Monday 12th of January 2015 09:12:28 PM
-- Edited by grateful2be on Tuesday 13th of January 2015 12:16:01 AM
I guess my question back would be does it matter whether he is an alcoholic or not, and whether he treats you this way because of his disease or not? He seems to be treating you in a manner that you don't like, and I wouldn't like it either. If there wasn't alcohol involved, would you stick around with someone like this? And if there is alcohol involved, why would that make it any different?
Kenny
This gives me a sense of relief. If he was not an alcoholic or a recovering alcoholic I would not tolerate this behavior. I didn't necessarily feel like the alcoholism means giving him a pass but I was just so uncertain as to whether it was the disease and he was going to apologize, or it was just him being mean. When he flips and gets mean it is like he is a completely different person. But you are right.
Welcome. My x did things while we were neighbors and dating that I didn't always understand like me coming home from work and him being sullen and uncommunicative. (We had apartments side by side.) I knew that the night before when we were hanging out with friends or watching TV in one of our apartments that everything was fine, so I'd get confused and try to talk with him but he would sit like a stone towards me and would talk to the others. There were other times when he'd seem to be jealous when I'd tell him stories of relationships I'd enjoyed in high school - even grade school - when we were storytelling as a group about our childhoods and high school dating history. I thought that showed he really cared about me and I was going to show him there was nothing he had to worry about. I was only interested in him. We would go to bars on occasion where there was dancing. He'd drink but then we all drank. I didn't see that as a problem. We were just doing what college age people sometimes do. Fast forward several months, we were married. I didn't know anything at all about alcoholism or abuse. I hadn't seen the signs or in seeing the signs when we were neighbors and dating didn't recognize them as red flags. Had I continued to date him rather than marry him within the first year of our getting to know each other, I would have broken off the relationship because I would have had more facts to go on in relationship to him. I didn't know the rest of the story until I had made my vows and then lived with him.
Today, if I met somebody who is behaving as your bf is behaving, I would know that those are huge red flags based on my own experience and I would back out slowly or simply say goodbye depending on me, the other person and the circumstances at hand. I would also know that Al-Anon recovery work is the best choice for me to make because I am and have been affected by alcoholism even though I'm not an alcoholic.
Keep coming back. You're not alone. There are many of us who have experienced what you are sharing and understand how crazy making this disease can be for us.
Thank you grateful2b!! He is the same way. always full of stories about his childhood and friends and even talking about how much women find him attractive but any time I mentioned another male it was a huge problem. I eventually stopped telling him anecdotes about things at all.
The part of my story I left out was the fact that he was physically abusive. He hit me over the head one or two days after we were married. I believed in my vow "For Better or Worse" and I was also stunned and didn't know what to do. My father was not abusive towards my Mom. His Dad was not abusive. I'd never had a boyfriend who even looked like he might hit me or blew up over nothing. That happened at a time when divorce was taboo. No supports for women were in place. Women were blamed for abusive husbands. As a survivor of domestic violence, I'm going to say clearly what I know: This man may be very volatile, too. It's up to you what you decide to do with the information, but I do hope you will consider if getting into a physically abusive relationship is something you really want for your life? He is already displaying mental and emotionally abusive behavior. My concern is that the physical isn't far behind.
-- Edited by grateful2be on Monday 12th of January 2015 11:15:24 PM
Grateful said As a survivor of domestic violence, I'm going to say clearly what I know: This man may be very volatile, too. It's up to you what you decide to do with the information, but I do hope you will consider if getting into a physically abusive relationship is something you really want for your life? He is already displaying mental and emotionally abusive behavior. My concern is that the physical isn't far behind.
************************************
Now, I say, I was a DV survivor too.....it started the same stuff you are describing, then shoving, then the hair pulling, slamming me up against walls, etc.....i freaked and grabbed a bayonette and went after him to murder him...chop him to pieces...landlord stopped me and he and his brother let the A-hole know that they would break his legs if he ever came at me, shoved me or any abuse, he was THEIRS....i moved out and never looked back...
you can bail...no divorce, you are not married to him, thank god, no mess, you can RUN and no legal intanglements......as grateful said.....do you really want this in your life??? its not me thats at risk for beatings, doctor bills, being in pain all the time....so what you do is your choice, but as a survivor, i am telling you that this is leading to physical...i can smell it on your post....AND he isn't even married to you yet....THIS is is best foot forward??? his courting ritual???? my dear lady...it only gets worse when you are trapped into a marriage which, yea, you can end, but with more difficulty......think about what grateful said.....thats all....its your life or death, all i am saying is I would seriously THINK, if this was me writing this, and folks answered me the way you've been answered, i would seriously THINK, now??? if i even see anger /control/ toxic unhealthy behaviour on a date, I am GONE!!!! had one bad date whom I know would have been trouble....those red flags i don't ignore......i see them???? I am GONE!!!! Just saying.....We've been there...don't want to see another go through what we did..........Just saying.......
__________________
Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
This gives me a sense of relief. If he was not an alcoholic or a recovering alcoholic I would not tolerate this behavior. I didn't necessarily feel like the alcoholism means giving him a pass but I was just so uncertain as to whether it was the disease and he was going to apologize, or it was just him being mean. When he flips and gets mean it is like he is a completely different person. But you are right.
the disease does NOT create an abuser....they already are abusive.....he mentions being abandoned by his family....hes taking his unresolved anger out on you and that could be deadly...... an abuser is an abuser is an abuser.....same for a cheater......"the devil (booze) made me do it" just does not wash....it isn't true.....my 2nd EX woldn't harm a hair on my head, only left b/c i did not want to see him drink himself to death....
you got some good experience here on this board....
i urge you to get into alanon meetings 90 meets in 90 days to help you feel better about yourself so you never never want to be with someone like this again.....there is no 2nd chance on this...
my sire beat my mother so many times she drank herself to death b/c she married evil and thought she had no option to get out...he started w/verbal abuse....my aunt told me all about it....then it escalated to physical abuse..............he beat her hundreds of times............bought her flowers ONCE!!!! To put on her coffin..........the mortuary was unsuccesful at covering up the bruises on her neck and face.......
-- Edited by neshema2 on Monday 12th of January 2015 10:34:44 PM
__________________
Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
All of this has been so valuable to me. I ended it with him last night and confirmed it this morning. I won't go back. I am intrigued to learn more about this process though. I always have seen myself as a very strong woman. I know what I want but I am a people pleaser and really let myself get sucked in and absorbed by the roller coaster. It was not an enjoyable thing either but I kept holding on. Not anymore. It is crazy how once you take a breather and step away you can look into it from the outside with more perspective. Neshema2 is right, if this is what it is at three months then there really is nothing to hold on to.
From one boston pug mom to another, my inclination is to tell you to run like hell from this relationship. But as new as I am to al anon (4 days shy of 30 days), that's not really my place to say. I can tell you only that being in a relationship with an alcoholic (and they are alcoholics, whether they are actively drinking or sober in recovery) has been hell unlike any other hell I've endured. Best thing you can do is get to a face to face al anon meeting (and there are many in boston and the immediate suburbs). Sending you hugs and some serenity vibes.
"I am intrigued to learn more about this process though. I always have seen myself as a very strong woman. I know what I want but I am a people pleaser and really let myself get sucked in and absorbed by the roller coaster." Hold on to that piece of information about yourself because it is very important. Alcoholism loves characters that "think" they are strong because Alcoholism is a very very cunning, powerful and baffling disease. It is thousands of year old and it has destroyed governments along with marriages and friendships and businesses and more. Learn as much as you can about this disease. You have already been "hooked" good by it.
All of this has been so valuable to me. I ended it with him last night and confirmed it this morning. I won't go back. I am intrigued to learn more about this process though. I always have seen myself as a very strong woman. I know what I want but I am a people pleaser and really let myself get sucked in and absorbed by the roller coaster. It was not an enjoyable thing either but I kept holding on. Not anymore. It is crazy how once you take a breather and step away you can look into it from the outside with more perspective. Neshema2 is right, if this is what it is at three months then there really is nothing to hold on to.
Hey I lived in Boston suburbs too, for a long time when young...i see Irish is a Beantowner you all like the Bruins??? I love them...used to go to their games..my main home was Falmouth, MA
OK, back to this.....you ended it??? GREAT.....(breathing sigh of relief) I would RE read Jerry's post about being hooked....If this were me, NO contact...you got hooked once, it can happen again...that is why alanon meets and hanging out here on the board, on line meets here if face 2 face is a problem, but MEETS and hanging out w/other alanons is the way you reclaim yourself and you KEEP sober, emotionally....something drew you in.....don't know your past, but something drew you to this.....working alanon and its suggested parts will help you understand you so you know what happend, what caused you to even THINK of a relationship with this time bomb.....i know for me it was growing up with it and the domestic violence/child abuse i suffered at BOTH their hands.....so i was damaged big time, getting out the starting gate, but alanon has helped me find myself, validate myself, reconcile and get together with myself....
if alanon can help a mess like it it can help anyone.......
glad you did the right thing by you.....i love to see a happy ending...a person realizing that this is waaay to big and full of danger to mess with....so many don't listen, and they go down the tubes w/the alcoholic....sooo sad.....been there.......done that........i nearly killed the first ex husband, but all through my life, i gravatated to sick, fixer uppers, emotionally unavailable or down right dangerous men......now i run like hell......
glad you showed up here and reached out.....glad you took back your life........one of my recovery mates is still in the Baystate.....lives in Dedham, I think...she just moved and i get the town screwed up all the time, LOL....its been eons since i saw the NE........
you take care.....just keep working on you, hang out here, and you will be ok............
right now i want some Boston baked brown bread with the raisins in it..........yummmmmm
__________________
Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
Read your post as if it wasn't you, but your best friend and what would you want to tell her? This relationship is very new and seems messy already and with my exAH things only got worse especially after we got married and he thought he had me. He is already talking about dating other women and he is already verbally abusing you. You can't save him, he has to want to save himself. But you can save yourself and al-anon face to face meetings, MIP and finding a great sponsor can help you start your recovery journey. Two books come to mind that help me "Getting Them Sober" by Toby Rice Drews, and "Codependent No More" by Melody Beattie. Sending you love and support on your journey!
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Sending you love and support on your journey always! BreakingFree
Al-Anon/Alateen Family Group Headquarters, Inc. 800-344-2666
" Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional."
"Serenity is when your body and mind are in the same place."
The saga continues. I received a very long and sincere sounding apology text this evening. It really does tug at my heartstrings but from all the advice ive received on here it was easy to consider that he can flip at any moment. He said he was sorry for saying I was abandoning him, that after talking to his therapist he knows I'm not abandoning him, that he caused this. He told me I don't deserve any of this and he knows right now he needs to focus on rising above the anger he has and he needs to learn not to push his emotions on other people so that he doesn't have to feel them. He thanked me for being the only girl to never try to hurt him intentionally and he said he hopes we can be together someday. He even said I am the only girl he has met who he would want to have kids with because he knows I wouldn't leave them or treat them badly like his parents did him. He said he totally understands why I am afraid of him and he doesnt blame me for that.
I did reply. I kept it very positive and said that again he needs to focus on his health and letting go of the anger that is hurting others and himself and that we cannot be together through this and only God knows the future. I told him I hope he could respect that I wanted to end the conversation there because I didn't want anything else to surface and he respected that.
I'm shocked that he contacted me after telling me the other morning that he needed to block my number because I needed help and I was abandoning him. I really thought his ego would smash any decency of him apologizing. I won't be contacting him but I am curious to hear your thoughts...
Just goes to show how crazy it all is in Alcoholic World. Or mental issues world.
Imagine living with somebody who could say two things that are exactly opposite within 24 hours. Imagine living with somebody who could do that within the space of 15 minutes. And would.
Try really hard to not wonder how he ticks or how his mind works. Just close the door on that experience and get as much help as you can to get the focus back on you.
"He respected that." Not sure he is capable of any of the emotions or thoughts we would have. He can just be using a new tactic. And most people on here would tell you I think that after the non-A is really hooked, the apologies, the respect, the understanding become very scare commodities. It's back to all blame all the time.
Read Sam Vaknin on Narcissists if you want to get a glimpse into a really distorted world. It can happen. An Alanon or a CoDependent has very little chance on his or her own up against an alcoholic or a Cluster B Personality Disorder or a Sociopath. I think it all feels the same when one is in the crosshairs.
Good luck! Sorry for the advice. We aren't supposed to give any. I'm so excited because you seem to be on the threshold of saving yourself a whole lot of grief. That doesn't happen around here very often at such an early stage. "Normals" walk away at the first red flag and we don't see them here.
Take what you like and please keep posting. You can get a lot of help here.
Hugs,
Temple
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It's easy to be graceful until someone steals your cornbread. --Gray Charles
In the musical "Wicked," one of the characters involved sings: "Something bad" as he tries to tell others that he knows something is up but he has no facts to back up the alarm he is sounding to the others. Then, the something bad happens. What can guide us with program and in confusing relationships is our intuition - which tells us to watch out, be careful, something's amiss - even though we can't see it, hear it, or understand it. The disease can cut us off from that part of our humanity. The Al-Anon program helps us reconnect to it and utilize it as a self-protective tool.
-- Edited by grateful2be on Wednesday 14th of January 2015 09:51:01 AM
I read most of the replies here including your most recent. A friend of mine in Al Anon once told me that my AH was 'going fishing' with me. He was throwing out a line (his words and promises and his claim that he loved me so much and that I was his girl) just hoping that it was enough to keep me here. I was his comfort zone. Always here and ready to keep things neat and tidy while he was out screwing up and getting drunk and driving drunk and staying out until all hours, etc. Yet, here I was waiting for him to come home and keeping his life cleaned up and orderly.
If I'm honest I heard all of this when I started dating my husband 20 years ago and I believed it hook, line, and sinker. He even quit drinking for 15 years but the emotional and mental abuse was still there and I put up with up because I believed his sorries, and his lies, and his promises to change. I am going through with a divorce now and I've watched my 16 year old develop and anxiety disorder from growing up with an alcoholic father who emotionally abused him and a mother who wasn't strong enough to do anything about it.
I live with so much guilt and regret over what I put my son through. You seem to know better. Please keep stepping away from this man and do not bring children into the world with him. What he does to you, he will do to his children until he gets help and finds a recovery path for HIMSELF.
Don't be shocked if he keeps contacting you, either. I remember trying to end it with my AH when we were dating but he kept coming back around. He had found someone who was able to put up with his crap and he wasn't going to let me go that easily even though he'd come to me with his head in his hands crying and handing me my apartment key, etc. I forgave.....over and over. Now, here I am in my mid 40s and I'm hoping to start a new life for myself and my son but I will forever be tied to my alcoholic and so will my son.
I like what Grateful shared about the 'something bad' and listening to our intuition. That is such a huge key to keeping us in touch with ourselves and our desires and goals. I wish you the best of luck!
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Never grow a wishbone where your backbone ought to be!
Hi and welcome. What I hear in your posts is a lot of chaos and drama. Thats what my AH has brought to my life. that is what life is like with an alcoholic. Do you want to spend your life like this? My AH moods are all over the place. He told me he loved me very early in our relationship too. Looking back, I realize it was a big red flag that I chose to ignore. usually the alcoholic needs us more than we need them. they can be like a leech and suck the life out of you. I would suggest going to al anon meetings. theyve helped me a lot. And dont look at alcoholism as an excuse as to why he behaves this way.
Temple wrote...........Try really hard to not wonder how he ticks or how his mind works. Just close the door on that experience and get as much help as you can to get the focus back on you.
"He respected that." Not sure he is capable of any of the emotions or thoughts we would have. He can just be using a new tactic. And most people on here would tell you I think that after the non-A is really hooked, the apologies, the respect, the understanding become very scare commodities. It's back to all blame all the time.
Read Sam Vaknin on Narcissists if you want to get a glimpse into a really distorted world. It can happen. An Alanon or a CoDependent has very little chance on his or her own up against an alcoholic or a Cluster B Personality Disorder or a Sociopath. I think it all feels the same when one is in the crosshairs.
***************************************** I could not agree with this more.....I see him as borderline AND alcoholic, with a host of mental/abandonment/anger issues...
hes coming at you in a different way...sociopathic personalities (of which the borderline is part) they come at u one way and if that does not work, they try another....they charm, self deprecate, manipulate to get what they want..
I would stay away, block his number, run for the hills....hopefully he isn't a stalker....BP's can have that tendency....they HATE abandonment...they will fight it tooth and nail, so BE CAREFUL
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Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
I think it is so in my nature to believe an apology because there have been a few big situations in my life where I never got one. Being apologized to FEELS good. When someone apologizes I think you should be able to believe it. At this point though, I have to look at the track record over the course of our short relationship. What has he shown me thus far? The apology only ever lasts until the next time he gets mad. It is really sad though that it has to get to the point where you can't really believe someone's apology. I truly believe he FEELS remorse and wants me to know that. But I also know that he is a very skilled apologizer just as he is a skilled arguer. (I know those aren't real words "apologizer" and "arguer" :) ) He is very good at explaining exactly why he reacts the way he does, he projects his issues on other people and attacks them with it so that he does not have to address the feelings himself. That is why he would drink, so not to feel the feelings. I know he's sorry but I'm taking it with a huge grain of salt knowing that if I continued talking to him the respect would only last until the next time. I don't stand a chance against him and that is what I've told him.
He was abused as a child which is something I did not include in my description of him and he does have a history of anger issues as well. Never anything violent that I know of, but it is fascinating how everyone picked up on it.
The whole thing really just makes me sad. I genuinely feel like I want to cheer him on. He is going to multiple AA meetings a week and is in some really good work with a therapist for all of his other issues, working full time and going to school full time. I'm praying for him but I know the safest thing is just for me to stay away.
Boston said......The whole thing really just makes me sad. I genuinely feel like I want to cheer him on. He is going to multiple AA meetings a week and is in some really good work with a therapist for all of his other issues, working full time and going to school full time. I'm praying for him but I know the safest thing is just for me to stay away.
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Yes, it is sad to be so damaged...i am a survivor of child abuse and now i am entering my 13th year in recovery, i do still see anger rear its head, but not at others, but at me and its waaay less....But still..was i healthy in the first few years to be in a relationship??? NO WAY!!!! Now??? Yea, and you can bet i am looking at the body language, patterns, and paying attention to any red flags........
i hope he keeps up w/therapy, program, but for now and for a long while?? he is not fit to be in a relationship b/c of the simple thing, #1, he is too new in recovery and #2, he has anger issues that could very easily translate into physical abuse......people with anger issues, are potentially dangerous and i say that about the "old me" b4 I worked through my anger, grief and pain.......oh yea, child abuse should be punishable by at least life in prison for the perpetrators and some cases??? Death....I have NO mercy or compassion for he or she who "brings harm to a child" it leaves lifetime scars.......and you are soo right.....SAFETY is staying AWAY from him.....
move on...find someone with whom the relationship will be happy, not a drudgery, not a constant struggle....a relationship should for the most part be happy and mutual...yea, everyone goes through their bad times, but healthy people reach out, get help, do what they can to help themselves and they are not getting drunk or abusive to anyone.......Just saying.....
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Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
The danger (one of them) of being an enabler or the enabler in the life of the alcoholic I once was told was that I could easily be the person that "sent the alcoholic back out" (back to using and drinking). The statement sounded incredulous so I blew it off. I was also told that the alcoholic/addict (mine) would in fact come to me to cause that and again I said inwardly "no not me"..."I won't do that". I didn't understand the role of the enabler and that the enabler is naturally addicted also; to the alcoholic/addict. One night after her AA meeting she came home and came right to me and ask, "Do you think I am an alcoholic"? Without missing a tick I replied "no" and my alcoholic/addict wife went out on another 5 year run and the disease took everything which hadn't been taken before. It was a stunning lesson for me later when I reach that level of awareness and I had to own it that in spite of being forewarned I did my part.
Learning about myself and my part in the disease was and is sooooo important because so often in a disease of this nature words can kill.
Stay alert and with an open mind. Open mindedness is a "best" tool. (((((Hugs)))))
