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I wasn't snooping. As his drinking and gaming take a deeper and deeper hold on him, his efforts at "being human" subside. Now, nothing is out of bounds. Every dish in the house lives in his room, covered in slime next to his bed amongst the piles of empty bottles and cans. So if we want to eat, I have to forage amongst the filth and find plates and cutlery to wash. And saucepans, baking dishes, it doesn't matter. He'll eat off whatever he finds now. I think if I broke off the toilet-seat lid and left it on the "clean dishes" side of the sink, he'd probably serve himself a meal on it and throw it into the pile of filth he sleeps next to when he was done. Maybe when there are no more dishes he'll start prying up the floor-boards and serving himself food on them. Nothing would shock me. Time to start keeping my own clean dishes in my room again.
So I went foraging for dishes and there, open on his bed was his arrest warrant. For fines unpaid for so long that there's no more MR Nice Guy payment plans. Pay now or be arrested and have your property seized. What does that mean for me? Will they come to the house when he isn't here and take whatever they deem worthy? Will I have a chance to defend my own property? How will I prove it's mine? The letter states that they will take his vehicle. Can they take my car, since he drives it every day? Will they accept that he doesn't own it, since I don't even have a lisense? Or will they think he registered it in my name to get a cheaper rate? Where do I stand legally? There's no point asking him. He will just deflect, blame and spin me his hard-luck story. "Don't worry about it. Stop hassling me. If you had just..."
He skipped work again this week, it's at least once a week now, the end can't be far away. And every day, he tries to tell me "I tried last night but you weren't interested". He is suggesting he "tried to spend time with me". Which is complete fabrication. He walks in and asks, "you got anything for us to watch" and I say "well we could watch X or X or X" and he says "nah I don't feel like that, I might go to my room for a while". The next day, the same crap. "I tried but you weren't interested". Tried what? What does that even mean? "I tried to get you to find something interesting for me to do with you but you failed so I got drunk and gamed instead?"
I can't sleep in my bedroom anymore because he is shouting on vent in the next room all night every night. I'm really sick of the couch but I JUST DONT WANT TO GET INTO ANOTHER FIGHT. When I tried to bring it up a couple of weeks ago he said "it's your own fault; I was using the other room but you wouldn't leave me alone so now I have to be in a room with a door that locks". Of course. It's my fault. Early this morning he woke me on the couch and said "I was hoping we could sleep together". I said OK, thinking I could get a few hours of peace in my bed without the stupid shouting. He spent a good hour talking to me about his retarded computer game, while I asked "can you stop? Please, I don't care, I just want to sleep". Then when I woke, he was creeping out of the room, back to his game. I suppose that was him "trying" as well. I couldn't help it, I said "really" the first time you have woken next to me in weeks and you're sneaking out to your computer?" and he said "you're the one who is making it happen". How did I make it happen? By calling him out on the fact that he was doing it? What devil's logic is this?
Just Gah.
How can anyone be this stupid? Or keep on pretending everything is fine? Or actually expect me to buy that "I am making him do this"?
But, I guess, I keep pretending everything is fine too. What's the alternative? Try to call him out and watch him spin it back around on me? Smile, nod, whatever. Not my problem.
I'm not in distress, friends. Just jaded. Tired. Disappointed. Tired of living with a baby in a man's body. So over it.
-- Edited by Melly1248 on Saturday 9th of November 2013 08:38:46 AM
Venting is helpful and I think a necessary part of the process. It hurts and it's sad and frustrating but you're also developing a healthy detachment. It sounds more like tolerating than pretending- you've been beaten down and know that wasting energy speaking out to someone who isn't listening isn't productive. I see it as a time we prepare for the next steps, which is taking action for ourselves- taking care of ourselves, creating new dreams and start living them- regardless of what the A is or isn't doing. We only get to go around once- what will you do with your one wild and wonderful life?
In support
-- Edited by bud on Saturday 9th of November 2013 09:11:46 AM
Then it is my issue, not yours...this isn't the greatest, but sometimes it works for me...in my head I say to those impatient people FU (since I was raised Catholic, I then ask for forgiveness, lol).
-- Edited by PP on Saturday 9th of November 2013 11:37:34 AM
F it. Going to my mums. Spend time with my brothers, musicians. Alive people. Mum offered to pick my daughter up on her way home from her beach-house tomorrow. Why not? This house is like a cemetery. Daughter might miss half a day of school on Monday. Does it matter? Dog wont get walked either.
Those that depend on me can make a few concessions. It's probably better for them than watching me go bat-$%$% crazy.
-- Edited by Melly1248 on Saturday 9th of November 2013 11:51:08 AM
It's gonna take something to snap and you will just start doing what's necessary to get him out of your life Melly. You sound like you are almost there and he's almost so sick you don't have alternatives. I do see growth in you though and you will be able to handle whatever comes down the pike. Just keep working on yourself. Take the next steps needed to get to full functioning. Learn to drive...think about places to with just you and daughter - roommates you could have after an industrial cleaning of his mess if he were to leave. Not saying do these things, but just knowing you have options will help you. You have choices Melly and you are getting stronger.
Thanks Pink. I know it isn't helpful to wallow. These weekends when my daughter is away it all becomes so stark and clear...I can't just ignore him and get along being mum, I have to come face to face with this sad, sad situation I am in, all alone (or so it feels) and really, it's probably the only time I am REAL with myself. No pretending. It's just ghastly.
I am new here so I cant really embark any al anon wisdom, but as a woman I can say sometimes we just need to talk about it and to feel like someone is actually listening is healthy and rare for people living our lives. I know how hard it is and I wish you only peace and serenity. I think being here and working this program will help you to get where you need to be personally. Take care of YOU. best wishes...
Yeah, that is exactly right and thanks, Bud, for validating me. Ignoring him and placating him isn't really denial now but I was struggling, wondering about it. What he does is SO rude and SO outside of acceptable, and am I sick and messed up because I don't scream and yell and demand better? I don't have any illusions that if I ignore it, it will get better, there just isn't any point trying to have any sort of conversation. There's no point trying to make boundaries or demand this or that. There is no getting through to him. He will do and take whatever he wants and expect me to lick his hand and say thank-you. If I get angry enough, he'll turn back into monster-man and treat me as if I have the plague until I fall apart wondering why. And there will be violence. That's what happens when I get mad and start demanding better.
When he talks of his ex's, he says "oh they begged me not to leave but I was sick of their crap". Sure. That's why they all live in separate states now and won't tell him where they live. He will say the same of me. Does it matter? Do I need him to see the light and beg me not to go? Do I need to prove to him that I AM GOOD and HE WAS WRONG before I can leave?
But today, although it really has been a bad day, I've kept a few thoughts in mind. The first has been, "let it go" and I've asked HP to take care of it and please, just give me a little spark of inspiration and hope for myself. Just a tiny thread of an idea or a little bit of energy. The second has been- what do I want? Me? I've recognised that I have become completely lost in his world of addiction and denial and I really want to grab hold of my life again and live it the way I know I can. But what do I want? I have no idea. The more i strip away the layers, the more I see that. I have no idea what I want. What I would enjoy. Who the hell am I?
Awareness and acceptance is better than denial but the truth comes with its own price. Next comes action and that can be the hard part. It involves change. It can be easier to wait until it all crashes down but then we are victims again. What are you waiting on? Same question I ask myself at times.x
It's just so bloody hard, el-cee. Such massive upheaval; pulling my daughter from her school, moving so far away, and for what? I could just ignore him and live as a single mum and treat him as a lodger. The alternatives are awful. I'm getting by here; would I be doing better if I packed my bags and went to my mothers? What would change? I would be in an even worse situation. I don't have the funds to rent alone right now. There's no clear path. I feel like I am at the bottom of the ocean with concrete blocks chained to my body. I keep hoping and praying for a spark, an idea, a path but there's just silence.
"Do I need him to see the light?"
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I dont think he will ever see the light. He has shown you with his ex's that he has not seen the light. You have expectations that this time it will be different. You have awareness and are working on acceptance. His total lack of respect for you is glaring.... no matter his lack of respect for everything in his life. I hope you are working on separating your stuff and hiding it from him. I still keep a separate bank account even though he has not drank in 13 years....( oh, but there are those prescription drugs that the docs keep giving him. Ugh.)
Have you ever seen the movie with Julia Roberts in it where she is an abused woman who makes an escape plan and gets out? Her husband knew she didn't know how to swim, but she learned how to swim without telling him and she socked money away without him knowing, etc. Then, when the right moment came and they were out on a boat with friend's, she fell overboard and swam to shore while the boaters searched for her in the water thinking she doesn't know how to swim. She started her life over. Now, of course, because it was a movie it got all dramatic with this guy tracking her down and stalking her, etc and she finds a new nice guy in a new quiet town but the premise of the movie was quite good. It's actually a good movie overall if you like drama.
Anyway, when I read above that you don't know how to drive, that movie popped into my head, LOL!
I'm with you, Melly, in knowing that the alternatives are 'SO HARD', believe me that's one of the reasons that I still stay. My AH isn't nearly as far gone as yours is, though,and he doesn't drink in the home, but at some point I know I'm going to snap and I'm going to know and have peace that I need to change the situation or else I'll be near suicidal. You'll know when you know. You'll have that peace, just keep asking HP what his plan is for your life, be willing to be in HP's plan and in his will, and then take steps to prepare yourself for the worst case scenario. Then, make a plan B if that one won't work. The more you plan, the more you take ownership of your life and the more confident in yourself you'll become.
For me, I reached a point where for my sanity, my own program, and my life in general - YES it would have been better to move into a shelter. Anywhere but with the A. I tried a million different ways to try and shine up crap (him and the relationship) but in the end it was still crap. I see you as evovling Melly. Your post a few days ago about "I want better" is evidence of your growth. Eventually, that desire to want better will outweigh your fears of economic insecurity and so forth... Yeah - we can "get used to" and "tolerate" a bunch of stuff. I could get used to having a cancerous growth on my face, but I'd rather have it removed and start getting well even if it meant pain or feeling like I was worse off for a bit before getting better. In my experience, staying in a bad relationship and pretending you are alone doesn't work because I was still interacting with the person, never really let them go, and never addressed my own fears that were really blocking me. Where you are at today is growth and it is just fine though.
I've had the phone number on my desk for a long time to start driving lessons. It would change a lot for me but I'm such a nervy driver, and whenever I've tried before I've walked away feeling more hopeless than before. I just suck at it; I was in a heap of accidents when I was a kid (my mum was kinda a "hoon" and wrote off a bunch of cars while I was in them) I just hear the crash and remember the bruises and the long afternoons in hospital getting checked out and I am always expecting a crash so I hesitate and drive too slow. I don't trust that people will do what they are supposed to on the road so I can't change lanes unless the road is completely empty lol. I'm always expecting someone to just plow into me. And I get stuck at roundabouts for ages. Because just because they are indicating doesn't mean they are actually gonna turn, right? My uncle died in a car crash and so did one of my friends as a teenager and just last Christmas, A's sister-in-law (who is an ER nurse) was telling me how a guy was off his face the night before and hit an innocent couple head on and took both of their heads off. I mean it just terrifies me. It seems like a great way to get hurt, maybe horribly.
I don't know, I've tried. I usually end up crying and feeling hopeless afterwards. My grandmother says, I shouldn't feel bad about it, it's OK if I can't drive. She lived with an abusive A most of her life and she's the only person in my family who really gets me. But she drives lol. I feel so retarded.
And also...pretending it's just like having a boarder in your house is not realistic given your history. Plus like you do deserve better than pretending....You deserve an actual awesome life.
lol, Pink, there isn't even any "economic security". It's just pretence. He pays half of the rent and repays me money he borrowed from me and with the other hand he takes it back. It has always been that way. I'd be financially a million times better off without him but, I'd either need to share the rent with someone or live with my mother for a while and both of those options have been nightmares in the past.
Now I've always hated when people have a million "reasons why they cant" and I'm not trying to do that. I just don't see a good option and I wish it would stop taking it's sweet-ass time and materialise.
Also, a shelter? My daughter's dad would swoop in and take custody and have me declared hopeless before I was even half-way in the door. That isn't an option. That would be the end of everything I have ever tried to defend. If I don't maintain an appearance of "in control" I'll lose absolutely everything.
When I dig in my heels and resist out of fear, the ante gets upped for me until I get so uncomfortable I have to jump. The landing is much softer than I feared it to be. You are a strong woman who can learn how to drive...so what if you initially suck.
((Melly)) It takes practice, but boundaries are for you- not for him. By creating boundaries for yourself, it helps to detach and carry on with your life. Write down some boundaries that you think would be helpful for you and review them objectively or let other Alanoners give some feedback, if you like. It will probably at first look like, a boundary for me would be if he _____. But that is about him and not about you. So take the _______ and make it about you- When ______ happens, I will _______. Boundaries are about your choices and what consequences you accept by having them or not having them... take it ODAT.
I pretended there was economic security for a long time. It was too scary not to pretend or sweep it under the rug... until the pretend tower based on sand started crumbling... and I felt no choice but to move out from under the piles of destruction. I'm still dealing with the aftermath. With the help of Alanon it is not the end but is a journey. I'm glad you're here.
Could I do ok as a writer if I just said F it and went for it?
Please don't placate me.
I keep trying to write but I get so twisted up in the net that is my life that I can't finish.
Anyone want to volunteer to read what I'm trying to write? Just a few pages, tell me if it makes sense and grabs attention?
I will apply this to al anon as best I can. When we do our inventory, we discover the boogars and the pearls, our defects and our gifts. Writing may be one of your gifts. So, you are powerless over the gift/desire to write, need to come to believe there is a power greater than you spurring you to do so and then surrender to your HP in this process without knowing where it will lead...it may be that you write to save your soul and that is enough! We get bogged down in wanting guarantees that we will be successful and we may be successful or we may not be, and it does not matter where creativity is concerned. Discipline and perseverance are the next best steps.
From my experience of your posts, you have a gift of writing. It seems that many others, too, have commented on your sense of humor. If you want, you can PM me and I can give you a link or two that might be helpful.
I am no expert, but am happy to read what you have written, and, at least tell you if your pieces make sense and grab attention and I will not placate.
It sounds as if you have a lot of awareness, which is the most crucial thing. I can see a lot of strength in there.
It's funny that in this process often we're put face to face with the thing we most tell ourselves we can't do -- in your case driving. I think this is probably not a coincidence. I know in my growth I had to put myself in a situation that gave me panic attacks. I was trying everything to think how to get around it. One day I said to myself, "Well -- maybe I just have to do this." It was a kind of surrender like one of the steps. Then suddenly my whole world opened out. Turned out that the fear in advance was the worst part. The actual doing was not bad at all. And compared to what I'd been living through, it was easy-peasy. It's funny that we can feel that one thing is super-scary when we've lived through other things that would terrify many people and we hardly blink an eye at them.
About the driving, I can see that you've known some scary experiences around driving. From what you say, being trapped (through not driving) at home with this increasingly insane guy is also a scary fate, maybe even more scary than being on the road. And I guess that when you have to go somewhere, he drives you? Because driving yourself, there's a tiny chance you'll encounter a drunk driver on the road; but being in the car with him, it sounds as if there's a 100% chance you'll be with a drunk driver on the road.
I know with what I went through with my ex-AH's crazy behavior, I never would have agreed to it if someone had said, "Hey, how about being with someone who lives in chaos and squalor, and passes out and yells and lives like a hoarder and is full of blame?" I would have said, "No way, I'd never do that." But somehow the situation just got worse a little at a time and suddenly I was living like that. It's only in retrospect that I see how crazy things had gotten. When I started to say to myself, "Hey, this is insane, what am I doing in this situation?" that I started to live life again. It sounds as if you're thinking those thoughts too. Take good care of yourself!
Melly, based on my understanding of what you've written, it looks like you've been paying the rent all along? I know you love where you live - maybe you could afford it without him in it? If you don't drive, could you sell your car and use the proceeds to supplement your income for awhile to stay in your place? Like PC, only options to weigh. Nothing more.
When I dig in my heels and resist out of fear, the ante gets upped for me until I get so uncomfortable I have to jump. The landing is much softer than I feared it to be. You are a strong woman who can learn how to drive...so what if you initially suck.
OMG...for ENTIRELY different reasons,I needed to see this......i have been doing that until today's learning from good recovery mates...."digging in my heels and resist out of fear" that describes me to a tee....resisting and fighting---fighting and resisting and protecting.....no matter what religion or spirituality one embraces, I never saw one NOT embrace the NON resistance approach....that is not to say sit back and bend over to be kicked again, it means making CHANGE.......stop fighting the karma so I can think straight and work my options......i had this magical ideal that first the program would be my miracle maker and rescuer....it is merely my survival guide to life....to learn how to swim in rough waters better.......then second, i thought HP would be my rescuer, just jumping in and like cinderella, taking me away from my stuff......HP loves me, guides me, and maybe even protects me, perhaps, but one thing for sure...I have to be my own best friend...i have to save my own butt...HP will only guide me, but I have to make the changes, do the parts i am responsible for and distance myself from stuff out of my control realm
one day, Mellie, you will be YOUR own best friend and you will want to save YOUR own butt and part of that is acceptance....and "is this what i want , really?? for long term???" and if u r really straight with yourself, you will FIND a way to get out......I did on ZERO money and ZERO familial help......but i did it....where there is a real will, there is a way.....HP will guide you and you will succeed if you really truly want it and are willing to go for it....Paula is spot on.....resistence brings more bad karma.....i am learning that big time of late.....and hiding/pretending/coping finally gets old......when you have had enough, you will do something about it....
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Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
My mom did not drive until she was 40. I was the one who taught her. After a while she became a pro. I know you could too. Take baby steps and you can do it.
((((Mel))))...one of the best suggestions given to me early on in program was, "Listen to yourself tell your story as if you were someone else"...I did; got every sick and changed it. Try that with your post...as if you were someone else and see what comes up for you.
i have said to my sponsees over the years......"what would you say if your CHILD told you this story??? what would u ESH her????" that gives cause for thought....if the relationship is "ok" then no worries....but if it is a loser, then yea, it makes them think.....
so...I ask you....what would u say to your child or your best friend if they told you the story that you tell of your life?????
When you get sick and tired enough of it, you will be a good friend to you....and decide to let self preservation to kick in.....
treating him like a lodger isnt' going to work bc u had a different relationship.....pretending something isnt' when it is is still denial.....not a healthy thing...........
i wish you well in this and hope one day you will love you enough to do the right thing by you.....its hard to call an end to something even tho it is terrible.....its famililar...change is scary, but when the pain gets bad enough, we find a way to make the big jump.....I did...two times....I'll never go back to that way of life........i may have it rough with economy and repairs don't stop happening...things break down and leak whether i got the $$ or not, BUT, at least, there is noone here adding to my misery.......
take care
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Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
Oh now if someone else was telling my story...I'd be full of good ideas I'd probably want to jump up and down and SCREAM at that person! In fact I have an online "penpal" that is in an almost identical situation and I do! I get so frustrated telling her LISTEN LADY YOU ARE AWESOME, JUST WALK AWAY FROM HIM AND IT MIGHT BE TOUGH FOR A WHILE BUT THEN IT WILL GET BETTER! YOU ARE SO MUCH STRONGER THAN YOU THINK YOU ARE!!! And every time she leaves him, she goes back and he treats her even worse. I feel sad for her but, I get it. And I also want to slap the guy because he gets to lord it over my wonderful friend and think that he's something wonderful because she can't let him go. Yet I live in it and keep doing it myself.
But I guess if I really rip apart the whole story down to its bare nuts and bolts, none of it is "too hard". I've done "too hard" before; when my husband left me with a small baby and took all of my money and belongings and set out to destroy my credibility with everyone I knew....I ended up homeless in the end, sleeping on people's couches with a baby! I clawed my way back, rented a home, managed all by myself, I slept on the floor for the first 6 months! I went back to school and taught myself to save money and I was so proud. But I was lonely and instead of making sensible choices I grabbed on to the first guy that seemed exciting. Ugh.
So it isn't too hard. I know I CAN do it.
If I keep convincing myself it's the CIRCUMSTANCES that are too hard, I'll stay stuck because there is always a new one. Like right now, the fridge has broken down and it's going to take all of my remaining money to buy a new one. Great, an excuse to stay put?
What's too hard is leaving HIM because in spite of his absolutely awful behaviour, he does kiss me and say I love you when he leaves in the morning, and he does spend around 90 seconds when he gets home at night cuddling me and saying he loves me then too...before he starts a fight and goes to his room to drink and play games....and once a month or so he spends an afternoon or evening with me being a great guy...and how can I leave someone who LOVES me? Last night I spent the night away and he sent me messages saying he MISSES me!! So never mind the abysmal way he behaves 95% of the time because he gives me platitudes and throws the L word at me a lot.
Well maybe if I am real about what's keeping me here I have a better chance of defeating it. I'm afraid of how I will feel without him. I am afraid of giving up on the .000000000001% chance that he will grow up and we can have a decent life together. I'm addicted to the crumbs he throws me, I guess. Yuk.
You have written with a great deal of honesty and acceptance. That is the power of the program and how it truly works.
Keep coming back, sharing, using the tools and one day you will know, deep within your very being that HP loves you and wants a beautiful life for you and your daughter.
You have been given many talents and assets that will serve you well on this journey I can name a few: your intelligence, beauty, writing ability, humor, managerial skills, compassion, empathy, love of your daughter, self starter to name a few These assets, when directed toward building a life are all positive attributes that will no fail
Continue with program and when you are ready for another relationship trust that HP will provide the guidance for that as well . I do know that is very, very true.
M, here is something to consider, your daughter is not getting anything good out of watching a man live in filth, what kind of example are you setting for her? She is watching every step u take right or wrong. For her sake, try to make some changes. Never mind the driving for now, it will come when it is really necessary. "When the pain of where you are, is greater than the fear of where you will be, you will move" in support OG
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Don't Worry About Growing Old, It Is A Privilege For Some Of Us.....
OG, I actually care a great deal for my daughter's health, happiness and wellbeing and have much concern for the lessons I teach her. In fact there is nothing more important to me.
But I come here to MIP and to alanon to work on myself and to learn the tools I need to become a strong and independent woman who can live happily and freely and hopefully in turn pass those wonderful skills on to my child.
It is no secret that I have lacked those abilities in the past and have lived as a pretty miserable, codependent sort of person.
I come here for ME so that I can grow personally and make the decisions I need to make with self-assurance and serenity.
...this isn't the greatest, but sometimes it works for me...in my head I say to those impatient people FU (since I was raised Catholic, I then ask for forgiveness, lol).
.