The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
When your trust is betrayed and you become the wife whose A husband was untrue to you by internet porn and phone sex. How did you or do you learn to trust again. Does that innocent trust ever come back again. They say that the unforgiveness of someone is worse on you than the other person. If you have any experience, strength and hope I would like to hear it. ...Oldergal
__________________
Don't Worry About Growing Old, It Is A Privilege For Some Of Us.....
When your trust is betrayed and you become the wife whose A husband was untrue to you by internet porn and phone sex. How did you or do you learn to trust again. Does that innocent trust ever come back again. They say that the unforgiveness of someone is worse on you than the other person.
*************************
Hi...I didn't go through this part of my A's (2 of them) but my alanoner best friend, and others all said "NO the trust will never be the same" Trust can be rebuilt over a long time, but its never the same....yes, reconciliation is possible and some marriages can "survive this catastrophe" and the couple can still love each other and the spouse who was the one hurt, can love and come to terms w/this but the "old trust" is gone...new , different trust, can be re-built, but it would have to take sustained "good fruit" from the one who betrayed the marriage....This is according to my close ones who went through this...
I, myself, and this is just me, but the "deal breakers" for me are ......abuse....adultery.......substance abuse........and to me, porn and internet/phone texting, sexting or talking on phone re: phone sex , to me is cheating.....
there would be no turning back for me, yea, I could in time forgive, but b/c I was so betrayed as a child, it would not work for me....Some couples can get past this...some cannot....the injured spouse would need a lot of program, a lot of "proof" that he /she has repented....turned away from the behaviour....In active therapy /program to get to the what happened part of this situation and work a strong program so as to not repeat...
I wouldn't be able to trust the guy again.....It would be a breaker for me....the sanctity of marriage, the exclusivity of being "together" in a bond, sworn to forsake all others is sacrosanct to me
this is just my experience...U will possibly get a lot of differing esh on this, the bottom line is...How do YOU feel about it??? What is the best thing for you?????
my co-recovery mate and fellow alanoner had a "internet sex" and porn issue w/her husband and it was the final straw for her....She booted him out and they have been divorced for a couple of years now....
I can only tell you what I think and what others in my life have thought, responded, but to me, when trust is betrayed that deep, well some wounds one can reconcile with but the scar will always be there and how do you forget something like that??? you can't...
My sire was into porn and debase types of sexual activity and I do think that contributed to his escalating it into incest and attacking other under aged girls....To me it is a dark type of behaviour, I would never want to be around anyone who indulged in that...
JUST my take...PLEASE use what you can and leave the rest.....
__________________
Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
The trust that got fractured was mine and over time the solution for me was to be more selectful with patience, open mindedness and spoken and exercised boundaries. My naevite(?) went away and I grew up. I had dreams and didn't try to make them a reality. Infidelity was a deal breaker in all of my relationships and I had to address the question why do I let people like this in my life? I learned from "if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...THEN IT'S A DUCK!!" ((((hugs))))
In the same relationship there are a lot of well it depends. It depends on if the offender is willing to address what happened and be open to not doing the same transgression. It depends if the other person is able to work on the relationship and trust issues with you. It depends on can I move past the betrayal because that for me was ultimately the deal breaker. I choose to not trust someone who can't be honest with themselves because they aren't trustworthy people. I'm sorry for your hurt. There is a difference in not trusting someone and forgiving someone. Forgiveness is about moving past the pain not condoning the actions of the other person. First I have to forgive myself and then move to forgive the other person. Trust is something completely different .. hugs p :)
__________________
Stepping onto a brand-new path is difficult, but not more difficult than remaining in a situation, which is not nurturing to the whole woman.- Maya Angelo
I have experienced other types of betrayal and can share from this. I have found that I needed to work on trusting myself, developing and maintaining effective boundaries, being open to other perspectives and choices. Forgiveness of myself and others and trusting myself is freeing; and is a better place for me to make decisions.
Forgiveness comes when I accept humaness in myself and in others. When I'm overwhelmed with hurt and having difficulty, I ask HP for help. I've observed that I can forgive others more easily than I forgive myself, but am working on this... letting go of expectations, accepting my imperfectness and shortcomings, loving myself, and striving for serenity.
The rebuilding of trust hopefully is a more mature and robust bond than before; so it's not the same, but possibly much stronger and better. Regaining trust after a betrayal is a process that means that I've worked on myself and the other person has done the same- and, there is enough willingness and progress for both people... and, that is the tricky part because it requires honesty and vulnerability. I must be honest with myself. Only in time will I know if the other person is able to be honest with themselves and others.
My best growth comes when I work the steps and situations with a sponsor or Alanon member.
87 percent of men watched porn within the past year (one study)
75-77 percent of males have downloaded porn in their lives. (another)
More than 50 percent of men now look at pornography regularly, thanks to easy access and constant bombardment of images on the Internet. (another)
That specific behavior is just not unusual for males. Doesn't make it right - just saying. I wouldn't view it as cheating but that's just me.
That's when communication between partners is very important. What is the definition of cheating? Did Clinton cheat with Monica? Did they engage in a sex act. For me cheating is when something happens between two people and my partner can't share what transpired .. this includes communicating with another woman and getting from them emotionally, sexually whatever what they should be turning to me for. Everyone is different. To many internet porn is cheating or a form of if it interferes with the sexual relationship and phone sex is a definite yes again for me. Those are my boundaries. Good topic!!
__________________
Stepping onto a brand-new path is difficult, but not more difficult than remaining in a situation, which is not nurturing to the whole woman.- Maya Angelo
I'd be more concerned with my husband being mentally/emotionally/physically/spiritually involved with a person who is equally involved with him on the sneak and exposing me unknowingly to disease, the actions of a jealous mistress, the use of our resources to fund his clandestine behavior, the risk of our children's security being shaken up by his behavior and the deception of his portraying himself to be one kind of person to me while sneaking around being another kind of person. I'd also be very concerned that I was married to an immature adult when I chose to marry what I thought was a grown up like me. That type of self-centeredness is a waste of energy for me and once that happened and I knew that it happened, I'd say no more. I picked the wrong guy.
In my situation I am just as guilty. Looking for attention in all the wrong places. Seeking instant gratification and ignoring the consequences of your actions. You have to decide for yourself what are the things you can live with, accept and move forward from. Sometimes moving forward means together and sometimes it means moving in separate directions. My worst mistake was responding to the situation in very negative ways. My thoughts were "Fine, you don't want me, someone else will". Its like a poisoned apple being dangled in front of a starved person. You know its bad for you but you are so hungry you want to eat it anyway. Two wrongs definitely don't make a right. One thing I have been trying to understand is that its possible an A may not have the ability to nurture a relationship, they may not have the ability to take care of themselves, functioning or non functioning. They may make poor choices so often that they are slowly killing themselves, knowing they are. Trusting an A is may be asking them to do something for you they can not do for themselves. Detachment and sending their poor choices up to the HP. You did nothing to provoke their poor choices. I can't blame my poor choices on the things he has done. Do not hold yourself accountable for the things others have done. We can not control others in what they say and do. Set your boundaries and don't beat yourself up because you don't trust them. Let go and let God.
Forgiveness requires the action(s) of ONE.....Me....letting it go...releasing the hurt/pain/resentment from ME so I dn't get consumed by it
Trust/Reconcilliation, is an action that requires TWO.....trust is between 2 people or one person and their HP, but it requires TWO entities.....reconciliation requires TWO rather then one....
Pushka echoed my sentiments.....betray my trust and its over....I can't get past betrayal.....so therefore reconcile wont work for me b/c it requires an action of TWO...and I am the missing link in that "twosome" re: reconcile....
if a person can't be honest w/him self and respect his own body/mind/spirit, how can I????? there again reconcile/trust is an action that requires TWO.....if he/she breaks that...that "chord" or "bond" is broken........program says "love begins within" and how can I expect or hope for others to love me if I can't love me......does your partner/husb. really love himself to have doen what he did???? he wants YOU to love and forgive (I am assuming) but he can't even love and respect himself to get into program/therapy to address this.....
JUST my take.....Please use what u can and leave the rest
__________________
Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
My AH cheated on me three years ago and whilst I found the actual deed fairly easy to get over I am still struggling with the lack of respect and protection of 'us' that the whole cruel episode entailed. So my question to myself now is what am I asking to trust in? Am I seeing the protection that a true partnership should, in my humble opinion, have? I have been trying for all this time to get over my hurt and I'm afraid that it is not working so I'm learning to get used to that. My own anger gets in the way. I need to see awareness and change in AH before I open the door to trust.
My opinion of AH is, in the meantime, getting lower and lower and I struggle to reflect positively towards him. I keep my distance, especially when he is being nice. That is when my distrust is strongest. And of course that harms us both. It harms me because I know that I am not, in my heart, feeling loving or appreciating the good times. It is sad and insidious and I wish it weren't so. The important element for me is to get my own energy back, think about what I want in life and to rebuild my self esteem. I think in getting over a break in trust both parties have to know and respect the boundaries, without resentment. It ain't easy loosing ones faith in fairy tales! Sending you ((((hugs)))) - it is a sad question to have to ask.
Wow Oldergal, This was just my next topic! I've got one of those too, an AH who got messed up in the whole porn thing. A few years ago , all of a sudden MY laptop was FULL of porn popping up everywhere, and was so infected it completely froze up .I actually threw it away. The same week the phone bill came, and on it were a lot of charges for sending pictures. So it all came crashing down on top of me, what he had been doing. And to top it all off the porn was GAY. Seriously!!!!! I thought great not only am I married to an A, now I find out, after being married to him for 35 years, that he is Gay !!!! Well next I'll be on Jerry Springers show. I just about have to laugh at how redicules it all is. He was talking to, and receiving and sending pictures, to some guy. How far it actually went I will NEVER know. This whole thing sent a fracture through this marriage that will never be healed. it was out and out betrayl, and cheating. I will say whatever any of you have going on, one problen you probably don't have, is wondering if you are actually married to a gay person. Not knowing who the person is at all.
After this he agreed to have no axcess to my computer, and his phone has nothing but just phone. So basically I have become his mother, keeping him out of trouble. I lost all respect for him. And don't plan on him ever getting it back, he doesn't deserve it. I think I am done being mad and hurt about it. It just is what it is.
LOL pinkchip, any thoughts as to what you will do about it?
Seriously though, I spent 6 years living with a guy who grew more and more distant and mean; it turned out he was gay and I found out the same way- by looking at the porn he had been watching. It's not very nice to know that the person you have been turning yourself inside out to please couldn't be less attracted to you. I don't care that he's gay, I care that he treated me like crap for 6 years and used me as a costume and led me to believe that he loved me and wanted a future with me.
My current partner watches porn on a daily basis and believes it is his right and I'm mental if I think any differently. He even rubs my nose in it and tells me about it if he has decided to be "amorous" and I've been asleep or not interested. When I am interested, he usually locks himself in his room and watches porn anyway and when we're together he seems to be playing out scenes from porn. It's an addiction unto itself, I'm pretty sure. Society seems to give it the go-ahead so he has an excuse to tell me it's what "all guys do" and that's supposed to make it OK.
Sigh, I too have come across very questionable behaviour, in a man seeking man sense. My greatest concern when I found out was the fact he had been communicating with his personal email that had his name attached. He claimed they were screwing around like that at work they thought it was funny. (Not sure I believe that but why ask a question when you know you will not get a truthful answer).So I went on Google and searched his name and showed him how easily all his personal information was attainable for any stranger. Our home address where we have children living. There are so many very unstable people who hurt others. I refuse to ever leave my 11 year old home alone. The whole thing lingers in the back of my mind and is very disturbing, however, I need to let it go. Thank you to the message boards I feel like I have finally found an outlet. I hope that others have the same release with the things that disturb their minds. We are never alone. I send love out to all and hope you find peace in your travels.
It makes perfect sense to me, that since it is said that the A drinks, to stuff down his feelings ect, ect, When I saw all the gay porn, a light bulb went off, OH!!! that's what all this drinking has been about all these years. And truthfully I wasn't all that surprised. I thought ok, now you can come clean with all of it and free yourself. OH HELL NO !!!! he wouldn't admit it it, if his life depended on it. I truely believe he has never loved me. In my gut I think I know I have been married to a gay man all these years. The marriage has been one big fat lie. I always told him it seemed like he was drinking to hide something. I am a good person, and have no plan on going out and shouting from the rooftop that he is gay, even though it looks like this marriage is history. After all he is the father of our kids and grandpa of 7. I would not gain anything from trying to be vindictive (SP?) What's done is done. I believe in Karma. Sometimes I gotta say why me??? I concentrate on counting my blessings. Thank God I found you all !!!!!
no, I had on idea you were gay, good for you. Hope you didn't think I was gay bashing or anything like it. I am a live and let live kind of person. I just wish my AH would figure out what in the hell he is.. Or better yet I need to move on and quit caring
