The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
T: One of the things that have helped me let go in relationships that aren't good for me or the other person is to stop judging or looking for whose the good guy? Whose the bad guy? Truth is, there is no good guy or bad guy. My story is about two people who aren't a match for each other and probably didn't even meet each other - the disease hasn't and won't allow it.
Taking confusing or bitter comments personally or listening to them or reading them at all to me is like standing in front of an archery practice target in shorts and a tank top while agreeing to let somebody shoot arrows at the target as we stand in the center trusting we won't get hurt or if we do, we can take it.
You get to decide who you are - nobody else. He is a child of God who is very, very sick and needs the help of a Power who is untouched by this disease. We just aren't that power. We're sick, too, and our HP can help us recover quicker if we continue to fill up our lives with people who lift us up and don't confuse us and by giving what we have to give in some type of service work even if that work for awhile is picking up litter in our neighborhood. The more hours in the day we do what helps us feel good about ourselves, the less hours in our days spent making ourselves available for target practice in actuality or in our minds. (((T))) You're making progress. Keep coming back.
-- Edited by grateful2be on Tuesday 10th of September 2013 09:32:29 AM
got email from A.... finally he is expressing all his feelings of gratitude towards the past... about the good times. I feel guilty now for being so distant, not taking the time to talk to him. I read the post about abuse cycle, and they also make sense. and the sentence : when in doubt, don't. am really confused. he calls me depressed girl with lost feelings and abandoned dreams. and I am ...with him. when I'm alone, like the past 3 weeks, I feel I'm being my own beautiful self again. dreams are there, courage is there. he is just not in it anymore. I can't see that future together. Not after what happened. It's kind of ruined, the scars are there, and together I gave up the hope that we can heal. I believe it's only possible when we are separated, on our own. I would love to take his actual words for real value...it would be wonderful. But I also experienced before, when I went back to him, that it takes only a few weeks into being close, a small argument or misunderstanding, that we are back on the roller coaster, back in the drama. he calls be B*** and i call him sick. I don't want to have that role. It's not the best I can be, for myself and others. i know I can be better, calmer, gentler.... I just don't believe we can do it.of course it's difficult, shutting up to him and not thinking or sharing the good memories with him. I wish I could write back to him with my true honest feelings. But he wouldn't take them for real, he would probably turn them around to being ugly. so I don't trust and come and write here instead. What also makes me sad, whenever he writes to me, he makes it sound as if he has been good and loving all along, and I have been the bad one all along. No chance to be heard, no moment that I can hear true compassion or understanding. I constantly am put in the situation to react, to defend myself, to justify. which makes me feel completely invisible.yes i am depressed along this kind of treatment. bUt when I'm with other people, I am being happy, kind, simple and joyous. It's like there is two parts of me.
I know I have been struggling with my co-dependency a lot over the past 10 years, but i also know I have been working against it, becoming more and more aware of what's actually happening. i am not perfect, but I know I am trying. I also know I have problems being genuinely close to someone, for I tend to loose myself and I got aware of that. So i am trained in taking my distances with people quite often, not to belong to cycle and not making it a habit. That same strategy of course keeps me quite isolated, for I really have a need of belonging. This is what I am struggling for at the moment with myself, independent of the behavior of the A. I know that is my real issue. But how can I work on that if I'm constantly criticized for my re-actions, I am also just scared with the rollercoaster unstable emotions of an A... and yes i got attracted by his company, his needs...that is my real co-dependeny behavior, and it was wrong, the reasons I got attracted were wrong. but how can I tell him that now? 'i really love you, and always have loved you, but for the wrong reasons...the reason being helping and understanding someone and thus making us dependent, making us close, more unlikely to leave each other!?'..... sounds horrible. because there have been genuine moments of affection and closeness between us also. He would turn my attempt to explain this into a complete horror again, declaring me a cold, lonely b***....
thanks for hearing me out. really trying....but it hurts!
((((Tortuga))))...Recovery takes time and practice and the ability to keep willing and humble (teachable) . You really are doing so much better since first finding us. Yay!! I read your post and I hear a former sponsor tell me..."read your story as if someone else wrote it and then see what you think about where they are are and what they might do". That is an awesome "detaching from self tool". Because I was sooo addicted to taking phone calls and contacts from my Alcoholic/addict and ending up the worse for it my sponsor asked me "Does your phone have an "off" button...and does it work"? That one worked miracles. I also learned "don't let an unqualified person take your inventory" and stopped taking judgements from people who either didn't know me or didn't care. Your alcoholic isn't qualified...he doesn't get the job to tell you who or what you are...and you control that. If you're going to keep contact with him and he's going to make negative comments practice the response..."That isn't true" (or such) and then use the off button. If he trying to tell you he wants you back and is calling you a cold lonely bitch I'd have questions about the people he has relationships with...He should be alone somewhere...with himself. He's not telling you what he is willing to give...he's telling you what he wants to receive. That is called the alcoholic personality and I know from experience that it isn't primarily alcoholic...it is primarily unacceptable. Keep growing. The consequences of what you have been doing and practicing have been really good...keep doing that; let the other stuff loose. Keep coming back. I'm inspired. ((((hugs))))
Not sure if I'm allowed to say this but you really are in danger of being a guide in my life - so many times your posts answer questions that I'm still trying to form. Thank you.
Your progress sings out, I love you for being 'your own beautiful self' enjoying friends who care about you and I love to imagine you dancing with courage.
I think that we all have a need for belonging, we are human social beings. But for me standing on my own two feet is not as scary as I once thought, in fact I like the empowerment of it. Like you I am striving to develop discernment about who I feel safe being vulnerable with but for me my own self esteem is my most important asset at the moment and everything that I do in relationship to AH is based on that. Sometimes I ask myself if I would feel embarrassed saying to a friend that I'm still with him. The answer helps me to understand where I am at in our relationship and why and that it is ok for now. I remember how long I stood too close and the mere months that I've stood my distance then seem unimportant. If AH has to wait and tolerate my distance then he has a lesson to learn in patience. If he does not want to learn that lesson then I know that he does not measure up to the space by my side! Strong words, and I do find that it is easy to waver, but every day I just centre myself as best I can. I hope that you continue to trust your instincts and that you can read your post through with a friend's eyes - I think that you will like what you see. I'm cheering for you from the sidelines.
-- Edited by milkwood on Tuesday 10th of September 2013 12:07:18 PM
Sounds like you are still having some problems just accepting he's not what you want him to be. He's not qualified to take your inventory as Jerry said so his assessment of you means nothing. You are letting it bother you it seems because you really want him to think and feel differently than he does. But like you said - he's sick. Let go. Why even read email from a physically assaultive drunk?
I know we aren't suppose to take other people's inventory .. I guess I just have to ask .. where is his recovery and how is it benefiting you? It does not seem like he's showing you recovery .. this is just my opinion. Something I have discovered in my own journey is it is not an accident my stbax and I picked each other. As I try and untangle from the dysfunction the harder he tries to pull me in to it. He needs me far more than I need him to continue this crazy dance. Considering you have verbalized how much better you feel without him maybe it would help to look at why and what you are gaining from this kind of contact. I'm hearing you working your program and him manipulating now in writing who he thinks you should be .. why are you allowing a sick individual to define you?? Hugs p :)
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Stepping onto a brand-new path is difficult, but not more difficult than remaining in a situation, which is not nurturing to the whole woman.- Maya Angelo
Thank you for your share and good taking care of yourself, one day at a time.
Thanks to Alanon, I have come to understand that I am responsible (to myself) for defining who I am and what I'm feeling. A partner's kind actions, sweet words - whether sincere or not- it is problematic if the other person looks at us but sees their own reflection, or, lacks a general ability to have empathy.
I recently exited from a relationship and feel the sadness and awkwardness of loss; remember the many good times, but try not to romanticize the whole relationship- it would have been very unhealthy if I had tried to stay in it. The unhealthy behaviors showed up over the last several weeks, but there is no denying them. If I stayed, I would not have a voice and would have shouldered his blame when he felt something wasn't perfect. He could not accept the thought that he is capable of wrongdoing or having imperfection. Because of his limitations, he was unable to have a discussion- he could only have a one-way "conversation" in which he tied the truth into one knot after another to weave it into something else that supported his "being perfect".
I find it helpful to work the steps with a sponsor especially when I feel I could use extra support. Be gentle with you.
Thanks all for your replies and support. I know this all is going around and around and around. Not only you get bored by the subject, me too....and quite hopeless, dealing with the same feelings. I know I need to let go, it's just not happening right now! Intellectually I know, but if that would be enough, I wouldn't be here right now, would I. I am sick and I know it. That's why I'm coming back....working on getting better. I'm just not loving myself enough that much yet...but something is happening. am just walking like a 1-year old, unsteady!
Right here with you, Tortuga. And certainly not bored.
As someone said to me when I joined, it's normal early on to express this stuff until you become sick of it yourself and start wanting something different. I'm waiting for that day to come too.
And I know exactly what it is to be labled a bitch anytime I try to express my feelings, wants or even random thoughts. It seems the only good relationship to him is one where I listen and care constantly no matter what he says- but I must watch my words and never ever be selfish enough to speak about anything other than to agree with what he has said. I must look interested and happy at all times too. Unless he's angry and then I think I'm supposed to look sorry. It's become so normal, to be in a relationship where I can never, ever say what I feel or think because it will make him go crazy. And anything nice I say or do or any attempts at communication are twisted into something ugly. Yes. I must be thinking about him and feeling miserable and upset about him at all times. It's been 7 years now. I don't even know how to think about myself or be happy without feeling terrible guilt.
I stayed at my parent's house a few months ago, for a night-that night my siblings and I played bananagrams and had a few beers and laughed until I really thought I might rupture something. God it felt good. When I emerged in the morning my brother was on his way to work but he said hi to me and made a joke. That made me crazily happy, it was just so unusual to wake up to someone friendly. I went downstairs with a smile on my face and my mum was eating breakfast and doing the crossword in the paper and wanted me to join in. It was so normal and happy I almost cried. She even made me some toast. Then she asked ME what I would like to do for the day, and we did it. I got irrational in the car, emotion sort of overcame me and I had a bit of a rant about what was going on- and then felt shocked and afraid (if I did that to the A after he had been friendly, it would be the End Of Days). She listened and then said "Obviously this is making you feel like %^$%. I don't know what else we can do to help you but when you're ready, we'll do whatever we can". And that was it, my explosion was forgotten and we had a nice day. I think that's how normal people interact. Sometimes the people you love get upset and you listen and make them feel supported and then get on with things. I think that's part of what we are missing out on by immersing ourselves in these relationships with abusive addicts who just aren't capable of give-and-take. We can never, ever say what we feel without being shamed and tortured for it.
I think, spending time with healthy happy people who treat us well is really paramount. So my parents are away but I mentioned to one of my brothers that I might stay at their house this weekend after I take my daughter to her dads house. OMG, suddenly I have a zillion messages from all of my siblings- so far on Friday night I'm going to a gig with one brother and getting hammered and going clubbing after, going to dinner and a movie with another brother who is an A and isn't drinking at the moment, watching movies at home with my sister and she's going to have dinner ready and what time will I be arriving? and my other brother will see me when he gets home from work for a "talk". (my siblings are all in their early 20's and still live at home). Part of me is driven to cancel it all and just stay at home with the A so he can ignore and abuse me. But oh, what a thing to have all of these people so happy and excited nd wanting to see me! Do you have any friends or family like that in your life? I think we need to surround ourselves with them. I think that will help us get well.
THANK YOU MEL for sharing this.
you describe quite well the sort of communication I have with the A. It's always all about him. When he is happy , everybody has to be happy. and beware if you express any negative feelings or have a low day ,or even have a flue. You will get smashed. you will get belittled, you will be called 'depressed and lonely'. and the other way around, if MR. King is low, which can happen sometimes only because I'm happy...then I need to put all my effort in caring for him. so actually there is never time for me to be who I just am, in the moment. that's probably what they call 'walking on eggshells'.... i never really understood this expression before.
so yes, I also could come to feeling guilty whenever I was away and happened to have a good time and enjoy myself.
and now it even more confusing, because he has turned all the situation around. He says I left him, poor thing, whereas it was him who moved out, and took our dream with him. It was him who hit me, and put me at the pint of no-return. But if I listen to his words now in the emails, well has to heal from the scars I left, he is getting better after I left the relationship.... he deserves better, he is himself again. at the same time he writes also the nicest things, the acknowledgment of what I have been, he talks about all the events that before he never mentioned, he expresses his full gratitude for my good traits...all the things I needed to hear when I was with him. But at that time, i just felt invisible,and hurt because he just made me low all the time, not one word of real appreciation, just keeping me in fear and anger all the time. Now he even manages to say the word sorry. He admits mistakes he has done.... the email is sounding like a different person. if he would have told me those things during the relationship, maybe I wouldn't have felt so lonely.
But finally i think this is his last stroke of manipulation, making me feel bad now that we are separated, trying to make me feel good about him after all...it's amazing how that works...he completely sabotaged it all, and now he cleans the room and leaves no trace. only it doesn't work completely, because I was very aware all the time, the scars are there, the pain is still felt, and i have a diary which still mentions the FACTS. and I will certainly never forget that i got hit. I don't know how he thinks people can just ignore those things. People don't change over night! He stands there now like a well-behaved boy....because it's easier now, that I'm standing on a distance and can't see all facts anymore. and he tells me that he talks about me with his friends as being an angel . I think it's complete A delirium and drama...keeping the attention on him.
But I'm letting go. the truth is different...and my head was clearer all along. this fairy tell, as it sounds now, can turn around any minute, he is not stable. I'm also not , I agree on that, but positive people around me help me remind me who i am, and that I deserve love as much as anybody else. I'm slowly coming back to the real me. which now gives me the energy and courage to deal with my own REAL issues.
Thank you for giving me your perspective. It really adds to the visibility.
HUGS , in support. enjoy time out with your siblings, sounds like fun. mine are far away, but even when I'm home, and they invite me, I turn down many invitations, because I felt guilty in feeling good. those were my real mistakes.!!
lol, you call yours Mr King. That's my dad's name (for real). My boyfriend is either Dr Jeckyll or Mr Hyde.
When he's Dr Jeckyll, he talks non-stop and I had better be happy and excited and and make some popcorn and sit down and watch him perform his diatribe. If I disagree with anything he says or tell him I'm not interested or I'm busy, he becomes furious- and says I am "bringing him down" and how dare I, when I have asked him to talk to me more? If I do keep listening and give him the appropriate responses, he just keeps going, and going, for hours and hours until I am exhausted and I start to fall asleep and then he pounces. "See? You don't care. You never did".
When he is Mr Hyde, well I'd better listen to every word he says and be very, very sorry for how bad he is feeling and how angry he is and everything I have done to cause it. Or women in general. We're pretty evil too. As a species, we have ruined his life.
I can't offer you anything other than HUGZ.
Lets just agree to get better. Maybe you can share with me how you worked up the courage to leave. You seem to be doing pretty well
I too would like to know how you decided to leave without all the guilt and blame and getting sucked back in when the I am sorry's start and the I love you so much I would do anything for you's and the old him comes back even for a small window of time....
I am reading, too, that you are "hoping" for a change in him that is not going to happen....hes a non recovering , combative alcoholic who is working your inventory and not even doing a thing to help himself...
acceptance comes after we work through the anger, pain and grieving.....I know I am done w/someone when I refuse to answer emails or texts....if one is abusive, that is an instant and forever turn off for me.....abusers are abusers....the booze only makes them worse......so its in him to a degree to be abusive , drinking is making it come out
I would ignore his emails, just work on my meetings, steps, slogan practice, read the literature and discover myself and how much better of a life I deserve on my own, with myself...
I block people who are abusive in texts and emails...I don't mess around with them.....facebookkers who get abusive..POOF....Gone.....and blocked.....
Life is just too short for this kind of pain that will go on and on and on......U can do it...prgram will help you if you keep working a strong program......You had the guts to leave...that took guts....and self love.....you left b/c you knew it was the right thing to do for yourself......now he is gonna harrass you, try cajoling and harrassing, anything to wear you down....that is when you just quit reading texts or emails, don't take calls....if it is over, then let it be over.....
JUST saying.....Peace to you
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Live and let live and do it with peace and goodwill to all!!!!
Wow- Mely, you are where I am now... Reading your posts was like reading my own story these days.
Tortuga, you as well- except it seems like you are out of the a's house, right?
I think I'll spend more time with those who love me and are healthy when I return home. It can be hard since he is so needy and wants me home with him (but he really just puts the TV on and tells me to not talk. So I end up in the other room (on the uncomfortable couch he talked me into getting) with my loving dogs... Hm.
