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Post Info TOPIC: Share your experience, please.


Senior Member

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Posts: 142
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Share your experience, please.


My experience and healing process is leading me to ask a lot of very difficult questions.  Thank you for letting me share.

I am wondering - for all of you in marriages or relationships/partnerships with alcoholics - is abuse, in some form, a common element? 

I am examining myself, and the emotional/psychological abuse in my soon to be former marriage.  As I've mentioned, my AH was physically aggressive at times.  It was said that I "pushed his buttons," that the relationship drove him to lash out at me, and that he "wasn't a violent person."  No, he didn't punch me in the face - it was more like grabbing, pulling, rushing up to me and getting in my face while screaming or gritting his teeth, slamming a door on me. 

Is this just the result of an "alcoholic dynamic?"  Whereby I help to create an atmosphere of frustration, egg shell walking, anger and lashing out? 

I realize that a lot of alcoholics blame others, maybe particularly their partners, for their own problems.  I just can't wrap my brain around this.  Yes, I've held resentments, pulled away at times, felt despair and anxiety.  I also tried REALLY hard to connect, listen, understand, communicate, and ask for help - to GET help.  Repeatedly.  I feel like I have tried so hard, to the point of exhausting myself... Which is exactly what my AH would say is my problem - I am doing the wrong work, moving in the wrong direction, with the right intention.  Hmmm - makes some sense, doesn't it?  A piece of everything he said made some sense, but often felt very inaccurate or inappropriate.  He was/is so good at making me feel crazy.  I am SO good at getting sucked in.  So what's the answer?  More program, firmer boundaries, more counseling?  WAS I moving in the wrong direction - or was the wrong direction exactly that I was listening to HIM? 

I feel like I'm at a loss. 

KL

 



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"The first step toward success is taken when you refuse to be a captive of the environment in which you first find yourself."

 



~*Service Worker*~

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Whether you were a "trigger" for his behavior or not, he is responsible for his thoughts, feelings, actions. If you know a specific trigger that ALWAYS sets him off and purposely use it - then, you are responsible for doing what you know is not helpful to a healthy relationship. We are all responsible for our thoughts, feelings and behaviors in any kind of relationship. At least, that's my belief for now. It's one thing for him (or for you) to say, "When you yell at me, I feel small and hurt."(Self talk) It's another to say "You're off track - going the wrong direction." (Blaming and attempting to control)

Working your program, counseling, setting appropriate boundaries (not to control him but to take care of you) are all good ideas that you've had here.

All of these things if undertaken in earnest should slowly help to change your thinking from right/wrong to a more flexible way to think that you might find freeing. Good luck.




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"Darkness is full of possibility." Leunig



~*Service Worker*~

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In a recent conversation with my now grown daughter, who went through the chaos with me, I said - you know, there ARE some relationships where no one screams to get their own way, no one manipulates, the parties sit down in a conference and discuss the issue and its solutions - no one yells, no one pouts; its a quiet discussion of the pros and cons and solutions until a consensus can be reached and all parties, while not getting everything their own way, agree to the resolution of the problem.

I believe that abusers pick people who don't like to fight; if you don't like to fight its usually because you don't do it well, get lost in it, lose your footing, your bearing, aren't good at it, bawl at the conflict, don't think as fast as they do, etc. My ex got empowered by a battle (brings to mind John Travolta as an angel going head to head with a bull) the battle is everything to him, he loves it, gets fueled by the fire and stronger the hotter the conflict. I, on the other hand - HATE, and I mean HATE to fight; I don't do it well, I end up flustered, i try to explain my position in a rational arguement - oh wait - that's the problem - I want a rational discussion about the conflict - how silly is that of me, to want a rational discussion with an unrational person?

A good book I read is - The Verbally Abusive Relationship - in which I see that there are those who will always seek out only relationships with people they can exert Power Over - they don't bother trying to win over people who they cannot see themselves being successful at exerting power over them.

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I am strong in the broken places. ~ Unknown All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another! ~ Anatole France


~*Service Worker*~

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Aloha KL...grateful had a good response and I'd like to add some 2 cents of my own...ESH...Keep in mind that you are dealing with the disease of alcoholism and one of the usual natural consequences is insanity.  Learning when you are reacting or responding to your alcoholic or your husband is necessary and a skill.  You've learned that alcoholism is a cunning and powerful and baffling disease so keep that in the front of your mind when you start to "second guess" yourself and your reactions/responses to it.   Taking your own inventory is key especially when your motive is healing and recovery.  Letting another person take your inventory is a crap shoot and beyond just listening with an open mind and not self judging done with a good sponsor I wouldn't take as gospel.  You can't always count on honest motives from others especially if the "others" are the alcoholic and/or addicts in your life.  Keep the focus on the 1st step especially the words "powerless" and  "unmanageable" and that the first step is justification for powers greater than yourself; HP, program and sponsor.  One of the things I learned about second guessing yourself is that it actually reveals a "good character" of the enabler.  It is almost at times like giving grace and saying "Hey you might be right" I am a part of this problem however it gets crazy when the thoughts and the beliefs say it as "I am the only part of the problem" and no one else is or can be responsible or more responsible than I.   UHuh...no way...ain't true...not even buying that!!...not even close to being true.   I had to work this subject of responsibility long and hard to arrive anywhere close to that last word in step two.  I going to listen to what the others have to offer now.   (((((hugs))))) smile  



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~*Service Worker*~

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I might be on the wrong page, but I'm simply going to say that nothing justifies, excuses or makes abusive words or behaviors an acceptable part of any relationship. Once that ball starts rolling, especially in a active alcoholic relationship, it only progresses. Stop questioning yourself if you were responsible for his abusiveness in any way. That is not the question. The truer question would be why you would tolerate it as a part of the relationship at all.

John

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" And what did we gain?  A new life, with purpose, meaning and constant progress, and all the contentment and fulfillment that comes from such growth."

(Al-Anon's Twelve Steps & Twelve Traditions,Step 3. pg 21)

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~*Service Worker*~

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Most domestic abusers are not violent outside of the home and the relationship...hence the term "domestic" violence. They keep it well hidden and people (other family and community) are shocked to hear how violent this person was with their spouse and/or children. They groom victims by playing head games and enlisting others to enable them just like those others also enable their alcoholism. What allows him to stay that way is the fact that his parents do enable it. Also, this is not a dumb person you are dealing with. It is a person that systematically weakened your boundaries and set you up as a victim. It is basically a predator. My bet is that he will do this again in another relationship. It's not that "you" push his buttons, it's that any wife/girlfriend would do that.

So...I would work hard at getting rid of that nonsense about pushing his buttons.... The bigger question is for him ...um..."Why do you have buttons that make you terrorize and intimidate your wife and act violent?" THAT is the problem. Forget triggers. The violence and the triggers are HIS problem.

So...what I am also hearing is that you were making progress all along leading up to this, but when it became apparent that your growth was taking you further away from him and the marriage, you then got feedback about "having systemic problems" and that you were "heading down the wrong road but with the right intentions." In other words, psychobabble and manipulative BS from someone that was just bullying you to stay in a violent and abusive marriage. Someone that also has his #1 enabler (his mother) set up to be your only other main support. Of course there was an element of truth to some of his statements but we all doubt ourselves at times and we all want to believe the person that is supposed to know us best (our spouse). He played on that to control you and it was very abusive (as abusive as the actual violence). Don't buy those head games any more. He is also going to say he's "not a violent person" and you instigated violence for the purpose of this divorce and apealling to the judge for custody. Not to scare you, but later on, he may try the same tactic on your child (will she push his buttons too?). That very argument can also be his downfall. Again, having "violence buttons" is the problem. Not people pushing them.

I'm guessing you are having some doubts and fears of divorce which would be normal at 3 months in. #1. You just emerged from basically being intimidated and systematically brainwashed by, not just an alcoholic, but someone that uses sociopathic and manipulative ploys to make you doubt yourself. It's going to take longer than 3 months to feel comfortable in your choices and in your evolving identity apart from his severely sick and manipulative person (and his manipulative family too).

It would be pretty rare to find someone who at 3 months into a divorce was like "YAY! I feel great!" So - you have a right to feel confused and upset but keep moving forward. More will be revealed. Trust your HP. Clarity and serenity will develop over time, with more experience on your own and away from him.

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~*Service Worker*~

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In my case my partner is not an A but still can be a very violent abuser. In my last blowout with him I decided no matter what, I decided to stop my involvement forever. I don't need him to see it my way anymore or make any point. I can't change him or his way of thinking I have learned.

With me stepping back and dive head first into my program, all the arguing and abuse didn't happen. I let go... Now is the time to figure out what I NEED to do for me. That's all I can do



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 Lord, put your arm around my shoulder and your hand over my mouth

Speak only when you feel that your words are better than your silence.

 


~*Service Worker*~

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Posts: 5075
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I can relate. I think it's part of the manipulation. My ex was always so sure in his point of view, whereas I was unsure so I often acted on his view of any given situation. I remember admiring him thinking I wish I was as strong as him. I spent years being confused and a constant uneasy feeling that something was not quite right. When I left I felt like half my brain was missing because I so often went along with him so no thoughts of my own needed. It took me a while to trust my own decisions. Now I see that he and I were deep in denial and were both unhealthy, unhappy people. Today with 1 yr recovery I see how bitter and twisted his whole take on life was and still is. He's immature, self pitying and hateful a lot of the time. I am not and that uneasiness I felt was my lost self screaming at me to see the truth of our life together.

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