The past .. - Al-Anon Family Group

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

The past ..

hotrod · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi P

I think this is a tall order and huge question I will try to tackle it

First how to deal with past when I have just learned about the situation--- as when someone decides to make an amend,- I can listen with an open mind, feel the feelings generated by the information, express my feelings in a constructive manner and then talk to my sponsor about it.

When I then look at the past, my anger, resentment, self pity and fear, I need to acknowledge my feelings, the sadness, the disappointment,the heartbreak then share about it to a trusted friend. Most importantly I need to remain objective and refuse to justify my actions or judge another. try to see my part in the situation. After I have felt the feelings, I can look for my part in the situation. Where was I manipulative, dishonest, living in denial what were my motives when dealing with the situation .

After I have done this usually I have seen the exact nature of my wrongs and then can see how the behavior HURT ME. Seeing how this hurts me, I can then be willing to ask HP to lift them as in the 7th step. Moving to 8th step--- List all persons I have harmed--- I would place myself at the top of the list and make amends to myself by seeking recovery in alanon

Just a few thoughts so that your question had an answer

hotrod · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi Again

I agree Mark. I have never forgotten one meaningful, hurtful, sad, upsetting incident in my marriage. Now, when I recall them, I no longer feel the pain of the incident. HP has lifted that.

When beginning to work the steps many years ago, I also discovered that I changed all my feelings into anger (a tool i learned in an alcoholic home).

What a gift alanon has been. Being able to be human and feel sadnesss, uncertainty, anger, disappointment also gave me the ability to feel joy, happiness, and serienity,

Keep showing up and sharing Pushka you are doing fine.

-- Edited by hotrod on Saturday 6th of April 2013 11:26:59 PM

DavidG · ~*Service Worker*~

Oh Pushka,

Isn't this what Alanon is all about? Well once we are present and managing any current crisis. For me i was locked up between the 'what if's' and the 'if only's'. There were numerous regrets... far too many for one meeting, or one conversation.

But then the was a lot of anxiety about the future. What could I expect, based on past experience. Oh yes- we can spin out 'one day at a time' at the drop of a hat. Letting go is about 'letting go and letting God'.

Hmmm... i must have gotten here somehow. Getting to figure out how- hmmm again... doing lots and lots of Alanon is a big help.

cheers, aww

DavidG.

PP · ~*Service Worker*~

Pushka,

This is a tough one. I had to ask myself, what is really letting go of the past? For me, it is not forgetting about it, but using it to work the steps, as Betty beautifully illustrated, to really notice how it affects my present situations, to solve the puzzle of "me"...I ask God to show me the wisdom in the situation, help me to see it in a different way and to send grace to it/people involved. When I no longer feel any "charges" when I think about it, or they are minimized, I know I am progressing. Progressing is good enough for me, as I am not sure we ever totally let go..that may be way too high of an expectation. When I have believed I have " let go"...I am sometimes reminded that it is still lurking in my "dungeon" somewhere. I hope my thought processes have helped

NicoleDiver · Veteran Member

Pushka, if this were easy everyone would be able to do it. But I think there is plenty of evidence of how hard it is to let go of the past. Anger, resentment, violence.....all are present in society because of how hard it is to let go of what happened in the past. I know I struggle with it enormously. But like Betty has told me before, it is only hurting me to hold on to it. So I try to let go, only because I see how it is ruining me. And I do mean that. It is destroying me and turning me into what I don't want to be - an angry monster. Don't let the past do this to you. But I know it's hard. Hope this helps a little.

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

Thanks for the responses .. I just wish I could articulate better what I'm actually feeling at the moment. I know somethings even if I DO know about past .. I'm not someone who wants to dig for it either .. usually i know what I know and that is enough because if this hurts what will the rest of it feel like .. thank you no .. some things just need to be left alone .. it's not going to change the situation .. the end result is still the same and again .. it still hurts why do that to myself. I still haven't dealt with the feelings and emotions. I'm constantly being hit with well .. that's in the past you need to move on .. LOL. Ummm .. ok then .. I am starting to see though in just typing this out what I'm looking for is an apology that he can't give (STBAX is not ok .. DUH on my part) .. again back to the why do I waste my time looking for validation from someone who is sick. I need to get my validation from me, the God of my understanding and my sponsor who can listen with an open heart and mind. When I go searching for validation from other people who aren't ok I trip and fall down and I wonder where did that emotoinal bruise come from?

I operate from feelings and emotions, as a weird paradox I'm just starting to feel my emotions and my feelings it is overwhelming. That is such an understatement. It's not the ohhh I'm a victim stuff, poor me, life didn't turn out the way I thought it should stuff .. it's the WTH is this and where did THAT come from stuff. No anger, which is new and different for me. I've got new feelings/emotions and OMGosh I have tools .. I just don't have the instant healthy tools I still want to react with my unhealthy tools of coping when it comes to OMGosh I'm feeling .. again with the WTH .. I'm vulcan .. vulcans operate on logic and rationalizations not emotions and feelings!!

Someone shared that women come to the tables of alanon with sadness and then finally feel anger, men tend to come with anger and find the sadness (I'm generalizing I know trust me, it's that men and women usually do experience emotions differently in terms of getting to the same place just reversed) I came to the tables with anger and have finally found the sadness. The joke was GREAT so what you are saying is I think like a man .. LOL. No wonder i'm confused .. LOL. Now seriously I'm like WTH do I DO with it.

I tried to look it up in ALL of the alanon books I have trust me I am equiped with a small library of alanon lit and there is not ONE entry in ANY book that I have that has ANYTHING about the past. I'm talking about going to the index and looking up the word "Past".

I'm going to look into figuring out how to work steps on this, I'm just at this weird place and am unsure how to operate from here.

Thanks again P :)

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

There is a difference between knowing your history and what it means and being tortured by emotions due to the past.

When a person goes on trial for murder, do they get to tell the judge "Aw man....just let me go! That murder is in the past!" ?

So....While I am extrapolating here, your STBAX doesn't really get to go "Aw man....let it go....that's in the past" about certain things that affect the present. If it has to do with making decisions about what your kids are exposed to, finances...whatever... It is our instinct and our prerogative to judge people by their histories. It's up to the STBAX to make ammends verbally and in the form of "living ammends" if he really wants you to not act like he has been the same person he's always been.

NOW...it's one of those tricky "wisdom to know the difference" things to figure out your motives and what is feuling you actions. Is it because it's logical and factual and the person has shown you this is who they are? Or is it because you are scorn, hurt, angry, wanting revenge? Letting go of the past so it cannot emotionally harm you is different than forgetting.

As far as the past is concerned, the big book states "We do not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it." It doesn't say we wish to be amnestic and forget all about the past. You have to remember the past and act accordingly to avoid the same pitfalls.

PP · ~*Service Worker*~

Since you are asking questions, you will get your answers. My questions are my prayers and they always get answered...sometime I just don't hear I love/hate when I am in confusion and asking questions, means there might be some fabulous insight on the other end. Happy searching....

likemyheart · ~*Service Worker*~

What your post brings to my mind is a recording of my ex ranting on my phone, threatening me to get out of the house with my daughter etc. When he later admonished me for not believing him just because he SAID he changed, I sent him that recording with a note about it reminding me what he'd been like. He scoffed that THAT was in the past, he has moved on from it. Bully for him - but I embrace the concept of learning from the past so as not to repeat it.

Also, I keep getting told things about him now, times he was with other women while married to me, all the while accusing me of operating a revolving door bedroom. I'm also told periodically about his exploits now - living with one woman and seeing others on the sly. Strangely though, I don't have a lot of anger about it, more of a resignation, shrug my shoulders, kind of thing. Though I do sometimes worry that he's given me some disease. And once surety was established in my heart that EVERY word out of his mouth is a lie to serve his purpose, always has been, always will be (unless he works AA, miracles can happen, right?) it is a lot easier to see myself as just another in the string of people he's involved in his schemes.

But I DO get what I think you are saying, just because it is in HIS past, doesn't mean it is in YOUR past, its in your NOW and it causes emotional upheaval that has to be dealt with and boy haven't you dealt with enough and really, can't the people who thrust this past upon you just keep it to themselves because they aren't doing you a favor by disclosing it to you now?

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

LOL Pink .. that is EXACTLY what i'm talking about right there .. the go to gun of it's in the past move along now nothing to see here.

"As far as the past is concerned, the big book states "We do not regret the past nor wish to shut the door on it." It doesn't say we wish to be amnestic and forget all about the past. You have to remember the past and act accordingly to avoid the same pitfalls. "

I said exactly this the other night when talking to a program friend. You have to address the past so you don't do what you did kind of stuff. I no longer have to live there and nor do I expect anyone else to. KWIM? It truly doesn't matter if I get that living amends, it would be WONDERFUL to get that and it would offer closure and comfort at the same time today it's not a realistic expectation to have in terms of someone who nothing has changed, he's not even the same horse with a different color .. he's the same color.

I better keep coming back ... LOL!!

Hugs P :)

ilovedogs · ~*Service Worker*~

What Betty and Mark said is really important because I struggle with this stuff, too. When I no longer feel the pain when the memory comes up than I know that I'm moving past it. Sometimes I forget that I'm human and that I'm not superwoman and that it's OK to feel and it's OK to be angry, etc. I have no words to offer, other than to say: yeah, I know how you feel. Hope your weekend is beautiful and peaceful! HUGS!

el-cee · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi Pushka, why do you feel you cannot bring it up? Is it the A in your life that is saying that because I feel like in my recovery the past is actually brand new to me. Now i am no longer in denial i feel like i have awoken from a deep sleep and I can see the past in a factual way so its all pretty new to me. I think it is really important to face it otherwise how can you move forward and grow? The past is useful to help you learn from but i think its important not to beat yourself or anyone else up about it. For example my best friend recently revealled that my ex would belittle me in company and she was aware of this and of course I believed what he had to say and wasnt aware of this really. So this is something from my past that is new to me but I try to see it as something I now know about the disease (and him) and something else I need to forgive him for and myself for. Take care and be gentle with the past.x

grateful2be · ~*Service Worker*~

I struggle most with letting go of what I've done or not done in the past rather than what somebody else has done or not done. I've learned that looking at myself through the eyes of a person just wanting to understand what might have contributed to any commission or omission that I feel guilty or ashamed about now helps me let go with more integrity once I understand the motivations or thoughts behind past issues. If I need to make an amend, I do. If I discover that I'm feeling guilty or ashamed unrealistically, I change my thinking about the issue. If I have made an amend or discover that what I did or didn't do at the time was the right response for the time and the memory keeps resurfacing, I see that I am mentally abusing myself and stop.

maryjane · ~*Service Worker*~

Hmmmm..... I also came to AlAnon very sad and got angry after I started to understand. I came to AlAnon after I broke out crying in the sentencing officer's office when I said that my hubby had been lying to the sentencing officer about his drinking. I burst out crying when I realized what had happened and the officer gently led me to AlAnon (which up until that time I didn't know it existed).

I waited and waited for the apology. It has been since year 2000 and I am still waiting for one "I'm sorry". It just isn't in him.

What have I done? Do what Betty says. The answers are in the steps. You don't need to forget. You need to know how it has affected YOU...and then what you need to do about the feelings that have been raised in you. I decided that I didn't want to be that person who had been hurt. I didn't want to be that person who needed revenge. I needed to find some new happiness. I needed to use the hubby for those good qualities that I could still find in him and not go to the hardware store for bread anymore. I found my bread at the grocery store of AlAnon and all that it teaches us.

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

LMH - "But I DO get what I think you are saying, just because it is in HIS past, doesn't mean it is in YOUR past, its in your NOW and it causes emotional upheaval that has to be dealt with and boy haven't you dealt with enough and really, can't the people who thrust this past upon you just keep it to themselves because they aren't doing you a favor by disclosing it to you now? "

Some of that statement is totally true .. in some of the recent discussions that we have been having I have brought specific things up that he agreed he was willing to talk about .. I think it was as long as it was on his terms and when it didn't go the way HE thought it should go his automatic response was that's in the past you need to move on. Such as him not paying child support/alimony for 12 weeks out of the 12 month period. I'm suppose to trust him. DUH .. I don't .. LOL .. WHY would I? The most recent bout of not paying was literally Jan of this year. It's in the past .. never mind that I'm still suffering from the devestation of the fact HE chose not to pay me what he was suppose to when he was suppose to, that started in Nov of last year. That's all in the past and he's playing that card. He can't answer the "why" he did that really. Well again with the DUH .. he did that because that's what a keen alcoholic mind does. He's earned far more money take home than he's willing to claim, he lives at home with his MOTHER, he pays no bills, what he does with his money is his business AS LONG as he's paying me I don't care let him have .05 cents every payday, seriously NOT my issue.

I heard a wonderful speaker this weekend through an Alanon conference and he is an RA 30+ years of sobriety. What an amazing horrifying story of hopelessness and finally redemption. He spoke in a way about the keen alcoholic mind. I missed hearing his wife speak .. however I have heard mixed reviews about her after her talk that was disappointing in a way. Anyway, his talk opened my mind the way he explained it .. I mean that whole intention of not wanting to take another drink and the reality of what happened ditto on how his diseased mind rationalized it. For whatever reason and I've gone to MANY AA speaker meetings .. LOVE them .. I think I need to go to more of them. This man was able to speak on a level that I got it .. I mean I really heard what he had to share and I loved it because I got it. He can't even be inside his own head how can he have a relationship with someone when he hates what is going on inside of him? He hates it and knows someone else would too.

Of course he's not willing to dump the past on me because he has no idea what he's said and what he hasn't and I have relegated to whatever he says as someone so beautifully put it to blue smoke, it's the blue smoke of lies coming out of his mouth. All I hear is blah blah blah and know without question that he is incapbable at this point of telling the truth. I feel sorry for him.

He laid the biggest guilt trip on my daughter who is getting ready for a trip to DC this weekend .. sooo excited she leaves tonight with her class. Well HE promised her money for a trip I paid for while he wasn't paying me. Yes, I need to work a step on this issue in a bad way .. LOL. She got the money and he moaned it would leave him with 60$ for the week .. Ummm .. SOOOO? Did he ask us how much we had in January? Did he care if I could take the kids to and from school because I had gas money or not? Did he care if they had food for their meals?

Now I share all this .. LOL .. because this is what I'm dealing with in terms of oh that's in the past. On top of that I have all of these intense emotions of healing and again what I do with these emotions that I am having these mixed feelings about .. on one hand I love them on the other UGH .. get out of my head already!! The most beautiful freeing thing was what this speaker said about God's grace .. God's grace is always there, I didn't know how to accept God's grace. Working the 12 steps prepares me to accept God's grace. I just sat there going I get that .. WOW .. do I get that big time.

Also .. he said he can't be miserable and sober at the same time (I'm assuming he meant emotionally and spiritually fit sober), .. well I can't be miserable and grateful at the same time. When I express gratitude with a "living ammends" (thank you Pink, I have already used that in a meeting) then these emotions/feelings don't feel so miserable, they are awkward .. and I'm adjusting to a "new normal" of feelings and emotions. It has just been a really intense couple of months now, I have to figure out what my part is in my own emotional upheaval and it's just another part of needing to work with my sponsor and make sure I'm sticking to my path.

Hugs P :)

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.