The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
Alcoholics do it but Alanoners do too, let's get honest. My mother is a lifelong teetotler and is BRILLIANT at this and living with her has made us all sick and it's a huge part of why I escaped into alcohol, sex, drugs, and trouble. We all have issues. Even I do it (my form of it is people-pleasing.)
Limiting exposure is a huge one that I am working on. I think I'll take my FB page down soon. I have a LOT of people who watch me...and what the heck am I doing on Facebook anyway? The most spiritual people in the world are very anonymous. God does send us people to work with when we let Him.
Let me give you my experience on people who start arguments with us. They do it to get relief from their problems because they have no solid program of recovery or something painful is going on. When we "bite" and get wrapped into the insanity, we give them that relief. It's like a drink or drug to them. But we pay because we were serene and didn't want to take on their stuff. They give it to us to shoulder.
Lately I've been just saying, "Hey listen, I gotta skadoodle. Enjoy your day" and I leave or hang up. I realize they expect that anyway so why not act honestly? When I execute that well I have no resentment and I didn't cause disharmony in the universe by accepting their stuff and saving them from going to recovery (or not - their choice). I'm not playing God when I'm honest.
-- Edited by WorkingThroughIt on Tuesday 25th of December 2012 12:46:25 PM
I happen to deal with a lot of people who perfect manipulation to a science. They will try to get me not to trust myself. I always recognize it and sometimes I do well off-setting it, other times not so much.
When someone is trying to manipulate you what are some good Conversation Enders you use?
Nod and smile and say "you may be right. I'll take that into consideration." It usually throws them off because you are not arguing with them. Arguing is the surest way you lose my serenity. An A or manipulator can argue a fence post out of the ground. Its a losing battle that I never win so I quit trying.
The biggest thing for me is to keep working my program and gaining tools that help me build myself up. And limit my contact with those that would tear me down.
I am going to try hard not to let my mother get under my skin today. She has been in a mood lately and when she gets like that she gets resentful of me. She has done this forever and I have no idea why she resents me, but she manipulates me into spats that ruin my serenity. I will be interested to read more suggestions from others. Maybe one will work better in my relationship with her.
Merry Christmas!
__________________
~Jen~
"When you come to the edge of all you know you must believe in one of two things... there will be earth on which to stand or you will be given wings." ~Unknown
I say, I'm sorry you feel that way or is that how you feel? Thus, acknowledging them, not taking any responsibility for them and keeping my serenity. Works like a dream.
I have started just not saying anything or I nod in agreement. If it requires a response I say, "you may be right. Maybe someday I'll look that up." Or other times I just say, "hmmm, that's interesting. Thanks for your input." I try my best to step aside and ask myself, "How important is it?" For me, I have always had the typical problem of engaging into an argument with someone who doesn't like to lose so I'd get caught trying to prove my point or defend myself when I knew I was right and could back it up with data. I finally ask myself that question about how important something is. I mean, if I know I'm right then all is OK and if I think I'm wrong I can use tools and research to find the real answer(if it's something 'findable', LOL). I'm really working hard at learning to compromise and just going along to get along. Not to just keep the peace, but to maintain my serenity now more than ever.
Gosh I learned in Al-Anon that there are a limitless number of responses I can use under those conditions. Some were from the ESH of others and some just pure imagination and my recovery imagination often time like this condition because I get to try out/practice my program. Most of the time it is not what I say and how I say it. I can use what ever mood or motivation I want. What I have to first choose is the consequences...how do I want it to turn out for me and maybe them too. After I do this thinking then I do the deed...Don't React is one of my finest slogans so I think before I respond and then I follow thru and then I don't second guess myself...it's done and after it's done the door hopefully is still open and the other person alive. This gives you a great opportunity to test your program...it should be tested to come to an understanding of how it works. Remember...it's progress not perfection.
Ever try, "I don't do very well with this kind of conversation and I gotta excuse myself. Maybe we'll talk later." (((((hugs))))) (The hugs can be a part of the ending).
I don't worry about being manipulated. I know from years in AA that nobody can make me do anything I don't want to do. I also try not to spend too much time letting other people live in my head. Sometimes that works better than others, but it's still an ideal I try and live by. Worrying that I am being manipulated is paranoid....especially when there are no addicts or alcoholics in my life at the moment. I could see how this tool might be useful for folks that actually have active alcoholics that yap nonsense at them all the time though. My ex-A used to blab nonstop BS and I would just tune out mostly. I'm sure I did the same thing to him and others.
I say :That is an interesting way to look at that and then change the subject. If the person persists I simply state: Ido understand how you feel on that and I find it interesting" I again change the subject . I do not engage I can also simply state :"I have thought about that and I continue to keep an open mind".
The most important part is to not engage and to change subject asap
What I have found so key in conversation ending is to be busy. I have things to do, projects to take care of. I can certainly still be manipulated. The issue for me was people pleasing. I think it is so hard to really get a grip on it. I wanted to be liked by everyone. The fact is that is not possible. In fact a year or two ago I worked with someone who was a really big people pleaser and I really resented her (now I know why!!!).
There are lots of texts on People pleasing and boundaries. I used to put a lot of clout behind people who manipulated and obess and lable and complain about them. Now I tend to avoid them. If they have manipulated me once I do not often give them a second chance. At the same time many of us have to live in an imperfect world. There are people who I work with who I once had a really difficult time with. Now I say little, keep it very superficial and don't need/obsess about being right, being liked and being needed. I so so so needed to be needed. Now I put myself first and everyone else second. Before it was everyone one first and me the few crumbs they would throw me.
WHen I talk about manipulationI'm talking about people who mention a person or topic they know will be hurtful to you.For instance, you have just gotten divorced from John and you run into relative in the store who says, "Oh, I saw John last night. He looks fantastic." Indirect dishonest manipulation meant to stab through the heart.
What I do know is a lot of people are suffering out there right now and doing this is a way for themto get relief. I have found, as one person said here, that a silence is the most honest answer.I developdiscernment so I know when it'sbeing done. A silent stare with just a hint of humor on my face has caused people to run away ticked off.It'sfunny because they then think they are a victim when really their ego set the whole thing upto get relief and if I don'ttake the bait they blame me.
My experience with that is they canblame me, gossip, etc allthey want - my job is not to savepeoplefrom doing the workby people-pleasing them, it's to be honest under any and all conditionsand be ademonstration of what God can do.
(The hugs can be a part of the ending).