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Tonight was my 5th al-anon meeting and i am feeling upset on how it was handled. The first 4 meetings left me feeling hopeful. I thought i had found my tribe! I had hit the bottom of depression and was isolating-even the people I loved most. Tonight's reading included a passage on despair. When it was my turn to speak I started crying about not having anyone to comfort me as a child while my alcoholic parents were trying to kill each other. I had a lot of abuse in my life. I was 2 minutes into talking when the leader interrupted and said that I could stay after the meeting and talk to others. I told her i was here to speak as part of the group and wasn't looking for advice. She then went on to the next person. I felt that this was just another place where my grief was not accepted and respected. I felt dismissed. Other people spoke for much longer then me. It was not about the time. Trust is a huge issue for me. And so is disappointment.
Besides avoiding this meeting, what advice can you give me besides avoiding meetings all together. I don't have a phone list or I would address it with her. Is it ok to bring this Issue into the meetings? My feeling is it should be handled outside the meeting. I don't want to isolate myself into oblivion, but I feel hurt.
Thanks
For me I learned to overcome fear and go back to the source of what I thought (only thought) was hurting me and address it one on one; and or take it up with a sponsor. If you're in flight or fight mode my suggestion from my experiences is put of the fight or flight and go talk to the person herself. I use to say I need some feedback or I need some help...can you help me with this or what happened on so and so night. "This is what I heard and perceived and this is how I feel about it, can you feed me back from your side"? Then of course shut up and listen. Watch the body language also because that is the major part of communications...so listen to her verbal response and non-verbal response. You're trying to understand how you took it. ((((hugs))))
It is sad that you were upset and needing comfort in the meeting and it seemed that you had to wait.
Meetings are often structured so that a reasonable amount of time is given to all, and it could be that the leader thought that your need and upset would be better handed after the meeting with just one or two more experienced members.
Members come with burdens and upsets, to a lesser or greater degree....to learn.
We are not perfect...or trained...we are just on a journey together.
in al anon the say principles before personalities.
The most important thing to me is my recovery, no matter what prob;lems pop up I will not give up on me and my recovery. I agree with the suggestion of approaching the person and explaining how you felt. Getting people numbers is another good suggestion. When we first come we need to get our pain out. I just to chat after the meeting with people I felt a conncetion with. I also today have certain emmbers that i call to get it all out there. this board has also been an amazing part of expressing my hurts.
I really hope you keep coming back, I have had moments like this but I have never let them stop me from working on myself.
Put it back on them. Ask them to be your sponsor. If they refuse ask them every time you see them. You can change sponsors any time but for now they will have to listen to you.
Seriously it took me a long time to learn how to conform to meetings. The reality was that my needs were enormous. Now the reality is that it's good practice to just let it roll off. It all takes time.
If they were wrong others can see it and will befriend you. I have to be exposed to lifes problems to grow.
It is unsettling to be interrupted at a meeting. If you feel strongly about this issue and believe that others spoke longer than you then I would request that this topic to be added to the Group's next Business meeting.
The format of the meetings that I have attended requires that chairperson announces the time frame required for shares. and the direction of the shares. Step, Tradition or Slogan meetings generally request that we stay on the step or tradition or slogan, Alanon speaker meetings request that we share or ESH
. When we share it is with our Experience Strength and Hope.. If we need more time and to go over our past and focus on our pain it is requested that we talk to someone after the meeting or via telephone
Meetings are for all of us to identify with each other and to grow. Sometimes the growth is to be able to share in a concise manner and within given lines.or to simply listen
Thank you all for reaching out. I identified with the flight or fight remark. And though I may not be overflowing in hope I do not see pain and strength being in conflict with each other. I have never had the guts to say what I said out loud to a group of strangers and tend to isolate because of shame. I wanted to say it out loud and let go of feelings of embarrassment surrounding it. For me seeing acceptance mirrored back would be the most healing thing for me. I also find that the majority of people are not adult children of an alcoholic, so there's a different foundation set. I don't have a phone list so I can't call, but I am encouraged by your words of commitment to oneself. Thank you!!
Well - I've seen a few posts like this. Some meetings are more tolerant of discussing all your problems and others are more solution focused. They should have been patient with you as a newcomer. After only 4 meetings it can't be expected that you are in the same place as the rest of them. What you discribed about sharing your pain and just getting understanding and acceptance is a support group. That is not necessarily alanon which relates to utilizing the steps to create change and being open to doing things differently instead of considering yourself prisoner to problems. That could be why they cut you off. The pain and problems and daily life coping is best shared with your sponsor. Meetings are for hearing other people's experience strength and hope and sharing your own....though it's tricky because you were sharing your experience. Nonetheless, if everyone only discusses problems, there's no recovery message in the meeting.
I don't know if there are beginner's alanon meetings like there are AA meetings. That was a format for me to express the pain I was in and get feedback from oldtimers. At regular meetings it as more like "You need to be quiet and listen to the solution instead of telling us all about your problems as if we don't know what it's like even though we were all at the same spot you are at now."
Once again Pinkchip did a better job of saying what I feel than I did. Sometimes I share like a bus load of tourists coming through the front wall.
There are several beginners meetings near here. Even after hundreds of meetings they can be a great way to make corrections to my direction. They are also an opportunity for helping others.
Thanks again. I cannot relate to a group where pain cannot be included. You have to start where you are. They read a chapter on dispair yet it can't be witnessed? And if support and acceptance of being who I am right now in this moment can't be included then it is a group of one face of reality where the shadow is once again not allowed. Thanks for the clarity.
All the above are solid points. "Why do we do it that way? Because we have always done it that way" often doesnt work. Have you tried other groups?
I agree that kindness and understanding are never out of style. How many others are at this group? Have you stayed after the meeting and tried to find someone to chat with? Have you asked someone to be a temporary sponsor so you can realy have time to unload what bothers you?
Thank you. Talking to members after the meeting is great. Holding space for others in pain-is priceless. Presence is healing and where all true compassion arises. Some people can't handle their own pain and what I need to learn is that I can't change people who are not able to meet my needs.
Many people have been offering their insight and ideas as to how alanon meetings work and how attending them have benefited them In your response you state:" I am not able to change people who are not able to meet my needs."
Alanon is a fellowship of equals and here I have learned that I am responsible to meet my own needs and that I am powerless over others.
Learning how to take care of myself, not being a victim and responding differently is the focus of alanon. Meetings reinforce our principles and provide support to everyone who has been affected by the disease of alcoholism.
This support includes telephone lists where we can call and vent to other members on the telephone, Sponsership where we can connect with a member who we identify with and can hear our story and then meetings where we share our growth and struggles. It is a process
I have a different take on this. I think it may be that something in what you said "triggered" the Chair of the meeting. As they were uncomfortable with what came up for them they needed to shut you down. That doesn't mean that anything you said is or was a reflection on you or your worth. Some of us who are in such pain go out in the world and believe that if someone doesn't respond in the way we want them to its our fault and a reflection of our worth. It absolutely isn't but it is indeed incredibly hard to find hep and understanding when you are in a lot of pain.
Currently I have been sharing with a friend of mine many of the struggles I have at work. He is a very nice person, generous, kind and certainly very open but a little short on self knowledge. His response to my sharing is to get very upset and come up with shoulda, woulda, coulda statements of which don't really work for me. In the past I would have been devastated by such a respone. After a couple of years in al anon, working with a sponsor, lots of time working the steps, I can indeed see and hear that other people are definitely triggered by topics I might bring up. Some of those topics are things like childhood grief. Other topics are like trying to brainstorm how to deal with situations at work. Anyone in al anon knows that doing a good job is just part of the parcel of dealing with situations at work. Trying to ignore people doesn't work that great either in my limited repetoire.
These days I can indeed take what I like and leave the rest. I have stopped sharing with my friend regarding a job search. I still like him. I certainly am aware his emotional responses are limited but that doesn't mean or need to be a personal reflection on me. For those of us who come from a family of origin where we got none of our needs met the opportunity to go out and negotiate to get our self heard was missed. We did not get to learn how to negotiate, assess, make judgments and reflect. In Al anon we learn how to reflect, not necessarily be going to meetings and beating our head against a wall when people don't responde int he manner we want them to. We get to reflect by taking our needs very seriously which is modelled by having a sponsor who takes you seriously, cares about you, is interested in your life (to hear a fifth step means you have to be interested if you weren't you wouldn't be available to do it.
Rather than encourage you to go to a business meeting and bring the topic up I'd suggest going another route, Try to find a sponsor if you are on this message board there are people here who will sponsor you if you ask them. There are topics here and threads that you can follow through. There are meetings here twice a day. Then go back to al anon meetings with a degree of detachment, watch when you get cut off view it in a different light. No one venue, meeting, person, therapist, convention, friend is going to be perfect at certain times they are not going to be able to meet your needs. Getting back up when you fall down is part of the process of getting better. You are getting back up and trying again and now you are getting a better environment to do that in.
When I am "triggered" by feelings of jeaously not getting enough of I have to go back to the issue of who do I have in my life who will give me time, attention, nuture, kindness and empathy. I don't automatically get that by going to a meeting and having it flow freely. I have certianly found meetings and places where my needs do get met but they are necessarily available all the time and things change..... Personally regarding my own emotional needs, I have to negotiate, calibrate and ask for them and know that on many occasions my needs won't be met in the absolutely perfect way I'd like. When I don't get it them met, I can then review, work through and think about where I am going to get my needs met. For me personally that is an ongoing and pretty difficult task but it is a very very rewarding one because I do certainly have some people in my life who care, love and accept me just the way I am but are routed for my recovery.
In Al anon we have a saying Don't go the butchers to buy bread. The most common trait of an ACA is to be banging their head against the wall trying to get people to change and to be triggered by certain responses to them. None of the patterns you learned as a child is going to change overnight, learning to love yourself while you are sorting them out is going to be a tough task but a very valuable one. You can review the suggestions above, make your choice and try them. You can also give yourself a huge credit for being willing to recover because most of your family wasn't and being willing to change takes great courage, commitment and willingness all of which are necessary to get better.
Thank you for your thoughtful email. I feel really understood by your response. I actually went to a meeting last night and the woman who cut me off walked in. I was afraid of seeing her because I thought she would get defensive and I would somehow be wrong for expressing my feelings. But I asked if we could speak after the meeting, and she agreed. I told her how I felt and that I wanted to get her idea about what the experience was like for her. She listened very well and then explained that she thought I would be better served talking one on one to someone after the meeting. I asked her if thats how she handles her pain and she said yes. I told her that it was compelling to me to say what was in my heart regarding the topic of "dispair." I wanted to say it out loud. I wanted people to hold the space for what I feel I cant handle alone. I didn't want advice, I didn't want to be fixed. I just wanted to be myself in a roomful of strangers, with my pain which feels so unacceptable and shameful in myself. She really heard me and shared with me that she was trying to control the situation because it brought up fear in her. It was the best of conversations. These meeting are bringing the intimacy I have been lonely forcraving. For me the healing comes in bringing ourselves as we are, understanding each other.. and to stay... really stay and hold space for others. I'm almost glad it happened now. My heart feels softer, a bit more receptive. Its so easy for me to get defensive and think everyone is being critical of me if I dont feel understood. I saw myself in your letter. I need to work on this. Looking for intimacy in a world where many people dont want just that is like banging my head against a wall and its lead me to depression. I see my healing as just begininning and I thank you for your kindness, support and honesty!
thanks for sharing this and starting this thread artpulse.
I really identify with dealing with ppl cutting me off, i.e. in meetings. Many people are uncomfortable with pain and there are some meetings and some leaders who deal in their own way.
I too am a very intense, feeling person and I saw myself in you as I read your very courageous share.
It takes courage to deal with different people and different attitudes.
I am working at that.
Dealing with alcoholics has been traumatic and I am conditioned to live in fear all the time.
I esp admire you being able to face that woman and tell her like it is for you and have an understanding.
Allie
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Alanon is about self-care, not caring for the alcoholic.
