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Miracles In Progress 12 Step Recovery Forums -> Al-Anon Family Group -> Al-Anon Family Group -> how to commit bipolar alcoholic into a treatment?
Post Info TOPIC: how to commit bipolar alcoholic into a treatment?
pinkchip


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how to commit bipolar alcoholic into a treatment?
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I also live in Florida. The Marchman act is absolutely no different than a Baker Act, it is just a way of getting someone into treatment for a short period of time until they can sign themselves out at the point that they are of no imminent danger to themselves. You and I both know the danger continues right when he leaves the hospital or rehab - but that is not the legal definition. They only care about whether he is going to kill himself or die in the next day or so. Once the answer to that is "no," they will turn him loose. You are never going to be able to commit him long term and he will always be able to leave treatment. The Marchman act is harder to use because you have to prove a person is about to kill themselves with drinking or substances if left on their own. Basically, this allows us to involuntarily commit crack addicts, low bottom drunks and such who are about to die but are saying they are not going to hurt themselves or others (the criteria for Baker Act).

One thing I heard in your post is that you are afraid divorcing him will cause him to drink more and there will be a bigger mess. I am NOT saying you should get divorced. That is your choice. However, from what I know of people with bipolar disorder and alcholism and people with the combo - He is going to go on binges, crazy manic sprees...periods of depression regardless. He could win the lottery and that would happen or everything he knows and loves could be taken from him and that would happen. An active alcoholic drinks because it is sunny and they drink because it's raining. He doesn't need a reason. Throw bipolar on top of that and the pattern is even more exaggerated and pronounced.

You have no control over his bipolar disorder, no control over his alcholism, and no control over the spinning tornado that is him. Are you really up for being his caretaker for life? Do you really want that job? At the end of the day, it's just a horrible tragedy but one that there is little you can do about.

As an aside....There are plenty of folks with Bipolar disorder that have achieved lasting sobriety and it's good to pray for that....but theres nothing you can do to make it happen. Trying to soften things for him by not doing what makes financial sense for you and your kids doesn't help because you can't save him from himself.

When I split from my EX-A he was about 3 months out of the mental ward and he went back to drinking. I took a huge financial hit and am still working it out 3 years later (the house is the only thing and that financial mess was equally caused by the market crashing). I'm not sad cuz it was only getting worse and every day I was tied to him financially was a risk for me. That is just how I dealt with it. Now when I see my ex, I can feel for him - I still care about him. I can offer empathy, but my wallet isn't tied to that mess and that was worth the hit that I took.

Wishing you peace,

Mark

**I also wanted to add that the legal definition of insanity is very different from the actual definition.  He knows right from wrong even in his drunken moments and during his manic/depressed phases, hence there are laws in place to preserve his liberty.  Nobody can lock him up or take away his freedom until he commits a crime.  It sucks, but I would stop trying to think of ways to help him cuz it is not a battle you can win.  Even with bipolar disorder, he has to fight this battle on his own.



-- Edited by pinkchip on Saturday 10th of March 2012 10:39:45 AM

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Tuesday


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Need some help and advice. I have been married to the bipolar-alcoholic husband for 6 years. We separated (legally married but living separately) 2 years ago during his major meltdown. During the last couple of years he has been in 7 detoxes, 3 halfway houses, one inpatient treatment center(20 days). He has been diagnosed bipolar twice  in 2001 and 2006 but refuses taking the medication. In 2006 I had court involved he was taken into a rehab involuntarily and court awarded me a temporary conservatorship.

The problem is that when he is sober he is extremely manic. He can be very productive in his work field: wrote a book in 3 weeks, has created many good projects in a short term that has brought him in decent money. Very creative but everything is done in extremes. On the other hand, as far as the daily life goes, he does many irrational things out of the blue. Shopping is the problem. He has an obsession of plasma tv, we have at least 8 of them now. During his last stay in the halfway house, he rented a big house, bought new furniture... Then got depressed relapsed, decided to quit the job, the job that he liked couple of months ago and that brought in the income. Now he is in that big house and drinking.

A week ago he checked into a detox but after leaving the hospital he got extremely manic again. Was talking about buying a dog and going travelling to Thailand for 3 months. Luckily, it lasted only 2 days, he is depressed again, drinking in the house.

I feel I cannot deal with these messes anymore. He does not want to go to the doctors or inpatient treatment on his own. We need to give up the house he rented because we cannot afford it. I am afraid that when he gets manic he will take a trip somewhere and I will be legally liable for all the mess. I want to resolve our marriage but I know if I will start a legal action with a crazy drunk it will create even more mess. I need to get him on medication and into treatment.

We live in Florida. I looked into a Marchman act. I do have multiple court documents gathered together re severity of his addiction and cooccuring mental illness. The problem is that he is not a physical threat to anybody right now. I moved out with our children. In how debilitated state the person has to be in to get served with involuntary Marchman act? I have never done it. Any ideas. I cannot wait. I am afraid more crazy mess will be created. He will buy dogs, go traveling abroad and I will be stuck with the mess.

I will appreciate every feedback.

 



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alexmaui


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I've asked the same question so many times. I'm here in NY and my AH is also addicted to prescriptions. HE is in our house. My lawyer says that unless he destroys the house I really can't get him out. Plus his dr says he willl wind up on the streets homeless because he can't take care of himself....

He is on my medical insurance, too, so the dr bills (from Dr shopping and emergency room visits just keep coming) I can only have him committed for 72 hours, here. I don't know about Florida. But the only recourse I have is divorce. It will keep me from being libel if he hurts someone while he drinks and drives. But if I divorce him he gets half my retirement and IRA. He is on disability.

My AH was also very creative and funny and smart. I don't know who this man is now.

I don't think there is a way to "force" you huband into something...and if there was you KNOW it would all begin again.

Can you find a f2f AlAnon meeting ? People there might know about your state....and the meetings really help. Hugs and blessings to you.



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rrib


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Tuesday wrote:

The problem is that he is not a physical threat to anybody right now. 

 Sounds like a blessing instead of a problem.



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Debilyn


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 welcome. Yes you are in a tough situation.

What I am thinking from your post is this. First the Book,"Getting Them Sober." By Toby Rice Drew, volume one to get you started is my Al Anon Bible. even though it is not an al anon book.

Next meetings. At the end of my response at the bottom are contacts.

Insanity is doing the same things expecting a different result.

Getting him into rehab, and putting him on meds, did that work before?

Nothing changes if nothing changes.

In Oregon you can get a legal separation, means you are only married, but not responsible for any of his bills or anything. I did not put my name on anything with mine after he got in such a mess.

It does NO good for us to do anything. It only works for them to find recovery if they go searching and find it for themselves. I am sure you know that feeling when you want something bad enough, your doing it yourself means so much more.

We can do nothing to help them. If we do we are getting the opposite result. This disease is like no other. Nurturing makes it worse, policing does too. He has to get into that mess you are working at trying to stop. He needs to feel the consequences of his disease of addiction. And he needs to be sick enough or at a point where he will go into recovery no matter what.

I find the best thing is to tell me it is none of my business when an A comes into my life.

It sounds like you care very much. So it will not be easy for you to let go. But it is the best thing for him, you and kids. (if you have them)

When we rescue them, we give them a soft landing, they get a bit well, then they feel good enough to drink or whatever again. They need to land hard, then fight to get up themselves.

We have NO idea what will happen to them. NO use projecting. A's have a way of manipulating, lying etc. We sorta forget they are not healthy in their brains. drugs do horrible things to their bodies. If we don't know that, we think it is just a matter of stopping the drug. It is far from that simplicity.


We here at MIP really care. Its amazing to me. Please come back with any questions.

I know getting them locked up is extremely hard if not impossible. It takes a judge to do it. I just went to court a bunch of times, had to file all these papers to get these squatters off my property. I cannot imagine what it would take to commit someone. Plus I don't know where they even do that anymore.

so glad you found us. love,debilyn

 



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fiddler


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there is a group known as NAMI that might help they are on the web but as a spouse of someone bipolar I know more than I wish I did. Things like tracking medicenes and doctors.going to the doctors apointment with my wife to advocate for her, learning the 5150 laws and conservatorship laws so you know what your rights are.having a crisis plan in place before the crisis, but mostly right now take care of you and make sure you are safe and educate yourself because information can impower youin this otherwise hopeless crisis-I know I been there. good luck and keep coming back



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Hoot Nanny


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TUESDAY: I agree w/ Fiddler; look into NAMI if you can. They will help you w/ advocacy problems & maybe make you feel better about your situation.

I am still a member of NAMI but inactive. I know they do as much as they can in a situation w/ anyone w/ MI.

Kathleen



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Hoot Nanny
Tuesday


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Thank you for all your good advices. I know I cannot make him stop drinking. I have removed myself and kids from the house. My main concern is my safety right now. Although I am out of our house, my husband mental state is getting worse. If he would only not cause me trouble. Last week he went to the psychiatrist. He was prescribed lamictal  and it caused crazy paranoia and psychosis. He got angry, delusional, said I have lovers. Kept calling and threatening. Then he photoedited a photo of me (cut my face off, pasted on the naked models body) with another man, posted all over social media. He seems hearing voices. I am scared. What if he'll get a gun.

I have printed out all these emails, this disturbing photo of me. I contacted our old attorney in CT to get the previous paperwork. He recommended me to file either Baker or Marchman act. 

I want to file the divorce but my attorney adviced to wait till he gets committed for my own safety and for more proof he is incapable of parenting kids.

Has anybody else been in this kind of crazy situation. I have not slept for couple of days. Feeling that I am going CRAZY. I am trying not to look at any emails, blocked the phone calls.

Will Marchman or Baker act give me temporary relief (for how long people can get committed inpatient) to file for divorce? I need some clarity and peace in my life.



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