Driving the kids around - Al-Anon Family Group

ilovedogs · ~*Service Worker*~

Driving the kids around

Michelle814 · ~*Service Worker*~

frustrating. I don't have ESH on the matter since I do not have kids. But here for you in support for whatever choice you make.

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

I think there is something in Getting them Sober that talks about this kind of issue of being in the car with a drunk alcoholic .. you may want to take a look at that part of things and think about what that means to you and your family. I have found trying to rationalize with an irrational person just doesn't work. They aren't rational and they don't have a point and time of reference when it comes to the drinking anytime is an ok time to drink.

Agreed .. here for you in whatever you choose and understand how scary that must be, I can completely relate in terms of protecting the kids.

Hugs P :)

Sally · Member

I certainly feel your frustration there. Life would be so much easier if I could rely on my AH to pick up or drop off my daughter from various activities, school, etc. My daughter's dad & I have split custody, so she swaps houses every Friday. Her school is about 2 miles from my house and her dad's house is about 10 miles away. It would be sooooo convenient for AH to pick her up at school every other Friday, than for me to drive all the way to her dad's once I get off work. Unfortunately, I never know if AH will be sober at the time that he needs to drive her, so I have stopped asking him to help out. For me, I would rather do the driving myself, than not know what condition he is in, and potentially put my daughter in an unsafe situation.

Mattie · ~*Service Worker*~

The sad fact is that if we could prevent an alcoholic from drinking when he shouldn't, so many, many of our problems would be solved. But we can't. The alcohol distorts their judgment, so they think they're not impaired. The denial is at the very heart of alcoholism. They think they're "just fine." They may claim this while lying on the floor unable to get up. They may claim this while falling over because they can't keep their balance to walk two steps.

I have had to face the fact that it is not safe to let an alcoholic drive a child. First there is the obvious fact that they may easily be in an accident and kill someone. The second thing is that the child will sense that something is wrong and that he is unprotected. Even if the drunk got in no accidents in many long years, this can be terrifying for a child. They don't know what is wrong (usually), and they know the drinker is pretending everything is okay, and no one else mentions it. So all they know is that something is wrong and it feels dangerous (which it is) and no one talks about it and so it must be a terrible secret and/or it is normal for things to feel wrong and terrifying. This is a terrible thing for a child even if they're never physically harmed.

And sadly, we all know that confronting an alcoholic with their behavior gets us nowhere, except infuriating us. Because if they could take in how bad their decisions were, they'd change without any suggestions from us. Who would choose to endanger their child? Only a person who can't think straight.

In my experience, it's okay to acknowledge that something is wrong, but we can't expect a specific response or acknowledgement from the alcoholic. I have said things like, "You seemed very much as if you were drinking last week. I'm not interesting in getting in an argument over whether that's true or not." [Of course AH is already rolling his eyes and acting like I'm insane.] "I cannot take the chance with our child. From now on I've arranged for him to be driven by [whatever or whoever]. I wish you'd go into recovery, but if you won't, I need to protect our child. I'm going to go do the laundry now." [End conversation.]

I think all of us have had some confrontations sometimes just to see if they worked. I don't know of anyone who has made it work. That's the sad reality.

Your son is very lucky to have such an aware parent. Keep on taking good care of yourselves.

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

My thought is, he is an active A, he is going to drink. He does not care when or where his NUMBER ONE priority is to drink. So what makes us confront? Does no good.

I did not allow him to drive any kids at all. NO way. Sounds like your son is old enough to say no.

Its so hard to face, being so emotionally involved,that they are insane.Their brains, when they are using or inbetween are compromised.

Just the fact he drives with a cup that smells of alcohol is enough, well too much.AS he is threatening other peoples kids!

I am very proactive in the no leaving kids with A's alone, no driving at all. I would not leave my kids or animals with anyone who was an active addict. no way.

Would not hurt to ask another parent to give your kiddo a ride. Drop him off on the way to your meeting.

I learned the best way to deal with A was not at all. Just figure it out for myself.

great question. I am sorry you guys are going thru this! love,debilyn

ilovedogs · ~*Service Worker*~

Thank you all for the responses. I spoke to him today and flat out asked him if he drank before he picked up our son. He told me no and I decided not to mention the cup. I knew he was going to say one of these two things: that cup was there from the day before or that was non-alcoholic beer in there. After having a very long talk this AM I am convinced I am dealing with an active addict. He blamed me, told me he drinks at night because he won't drink around me because I judge him and the amounts he consumes, and told me that he thinks his drinking is within what is normal. To which I said, "so, passing out on the floor is normal drinking behavior to the point where I couldn't wake you and was ready to call 911? Or, actively drinking at 5:30 AM, is that really within the realm of normal?"

His defense was weak but good enough for me to realize that I really need to get active in my program. When I challenged him about how his psychiatrist told him not to drink and take Paxil,he made up some lame story about how that only applies to real alcoholics who have to drink all day long. Not him, he's not like that so he can drink while on an anti-depressant. Ugh! Really? For the first time, though, I could see how good he is with his words and how he can manipulate things around. How he tried to blame me and told me he walks on eggshells around me now because I might freak out about his drinking. Gee, shouldn't that tell you something? He also made a point to say that he has been able to abstain from drinking when in social situations so he, obviously, does not have an addiction. I guess I should have made this a new post but thanks all for reading if you get this far, lol!

Mattie · ~*Service Worker*~

It's almost as if they go to school to learn all these things to say. My AH said so many of the same things, almost verbatim. He only had to hide his drinking because I (he said) have an anxiety disorder focused on his completely normal drinking and really I ought to get some help. The only reason he hides it (he used to say) is because I make him do that by getting all upset when he drinks. And his drinking is completely normal, but he only stashes bottles all over the house and carries tiny bottles in his pockets all the time because I'm weird about it so I make him do it that way. When I used to bring up his passing out he'd say, "Oh, for God's sake!" as if I were making it up, or he'd storm out. The denial just makes you gasp, doesn't it?

But you know what you know. Take good care.

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

I have been saying for a while there is a universal language that addicts speak. I often have wished it was something I could discuss with my husband because he has no idea he has said the exact same things that his dad has said, in similar situations. It is very scary to hear these things and he has acted out in the similar ways as well.

The denial, and the need to get out of being caught is so huge. It's just what happens.

Hugs P :)

PS - totally agree .. you know what you know and sometimes that's exactly just where I have to remember to live.

Breakingfree · ~*Service Worker*~

My exah is not allowed to have our kids if he has been drinking period, I don't think it is safe and we have a signed agreement on this. Would he understand if you just mentioned your concern without pulling out the proof? I am sending you love and support!

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

It would be stupid to drive around while drinking NA beer too. Police are not going to know the difference and he will get a hefty fine either way. You can state that you don't want him driving around drinking beer or NA beer because it's still risky and you don't want him to model poor decision making for your son. Now what he does after hearing that from you is going to be up to him. This is not a "win or lose" thing with your husband. You don't wind up with egg on your face if you don't let the egg get thrown. You state your boundary or value because you need to be true to yourself. He is always going to argue and justify whether he is right or wrong so just expect that. The boundary you set is FOR YOU and for your son. His reaction is secondary.

Hope this helps some.

In support,

Mark

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

Also...about whether he is an alcoholic or not...

It is sooooo obvious it is causing major problems in your marriage. If he was a "normal" drinker he could and would just stop to not have all the drama.

Not that you needed any more proof.

I do get that some of what he says has validity to it and you know you are highly sensitive to his drinking and such. That doesn't make him less of an alcoholic though. He is on a dangerous road and it will take lots of prayer and alanon to let your HP handle it and to keep as much serenity as you can.

danni · Senior Member

So sad (i'm responding to your second post now). It was a relief for me to finally stop having conversations with my AH about whether he had a problem or not. There was nothing good that ever came out of it. Only frustration and resentment for me, and somehow it always came back to what I was doing wrong, which was ridiculous and extremely frustrating. sending you support and encouragment on your progress!

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

The other thing is even if we have our own program to work .. we only have to accept what is our part AND focus on our own recovery. My recovery is none of my Q's business. His recovery is his business. I hope I am not forced to come to this as an issue however it's hard telling at this point. My boundary for myself is no drinking and driving the kids. As hard as it is .. it's not my job to create a crisis or to prevent the natural consequences for taking place. I can protect myself and the kids, I can't save anyone else from themselves.

That BS about you're this or you're that is all about deflection .. I love that word too .. haven't used it for a while .. lol. It IS all deflection away from the fact that HE has an issue. He's gotta figure that out for himself and arguing with him about it is just like arguing with the beer can/bottle it's not going to make a dang bit of difference.

Hugs p :)

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