bus didn't take long - Al-Anon Family Group

Lindaoakford · ~*Service Worker*~

bus didn't take long

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

Hugs Linda,

There is a reading in C2C I can't remember the page, however the statement "Expectations are premeditated resentments" has popped out at me and stuck in my mind. For me the whole expectations issue leads me straight into the arms of controlling behavior. It's so hard not to think with my AH ok .. he's dry he gets it. That's not on me, that's on my AH to deal with his own sobriety and stay on my side of the street at this point and time. Do I hope he gets it .. oh heck ya. I want that for him, after being on the boards and in the rooms I'm starting to see that he may get sober however emotional sobriety is a whole other issue.

Shoot .. lol .. my original point was and is, it's better to let it go and let God than to be disappointed because the expectation of he got it and the reality is he hasn't yet. Even if he doesn't get it, I can still live my life to the fullest regardless of where my path leads. My AH's sobriety is not my burden to carry. I can't control if and when he "gets" it. The crazy train at my station never changes only my choice to get on it or not does.

Hugs P :)

tommyecat · ~*Service Worker*~

Linda, I had the same thought as pushka regarding expectations as I read your post. If I turn to the serenity prayer in particular,

"...accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference"

Reading it helps me to put one foot in front of the other and keep the focus on my attitudes, actions, and inner being.

T

GailMichelle · ~*Service Worker*~

Getting our hopes up is natural. We've all been there countless times. So lighten up on yourself.

From my experience, little by little, it gets easier to let go and accept that I cannot change anyone else but me. I still feel urges, but usually can control my tongue so that I don't start to preach, nag, or lecture. I wonder if the urges ever sieze. Would be nice, at least the intensity seems to lessen.

I'm also learning to make myself feel better by reframing the way I see situations. I strive to look at what is in the cup and not what is missing. Hard to do at times. But I make it a game. I'm relatively new at this game, so I don't come out a winner every time.

-- Edited by GailMichelle on Monday 26th of September 2011 09:40:17 AM

youfoundme · ~*Service Worker*~

Linda, I did something similar the other day. I had some great days with my fiance. He wasn't drinking and all was well. I was all happy inside because things were so great. Then he drank, and got REALLY drunk. I got so mad. We had an argument (why would you argue with a drunk person?) and then we finally went to bed. The thing is, I had these expectations and they got slammed when he relapsed after a week of not drinking. I was expecting more and more great days and I was totally resentful and fearful when I found out he drank. I work from fear usually so my anger was really just fear in disguise. Guess what? The people that really helped me were my 2 alanon friends and my sponsor. Because of these phone numbers I have, these people some how knew and reached out to me (I have no idea how they knew I was flailing around) and got through to me through texting. I was suddenly tons better when I heard the same words from all three of them.
For me, having these people's phone numbers made all the difference. The alanon program works and giving back (which those ladies did for me) makes it work. This is a WE program and I need the support of others to stop holding onto my expectations of what I "THINK" he should do with himself. Its not easy to stop trying to control him, question him (a way of controlling) and manipulating things so I think he will do as I say...but I am working on it little by little.
Today's courage to change and One Day at a time's readings helped too :)

lory · Member

Hi youfoundme loved your post i can so relate to the expectation of what I think he should do with himself that is me still trying to control my Ah i do find it so hard to let go and detach with love I have so much to learn that is why I do come to this board and read all I can I have not share much will come in time in the meantime I try to understand all I can about this dreadful disease that is slowly taking my Ah.

Mattie · ~*Service Worker*~

Linda, your description of waiting at the bus stop in your last post was so apt.

I read once that people don't change until the consequences of not changing become greater than the consequences of changing. So our addicts won't change until their addiction becomes so painful (to them) that the agony (to them) of giving up the addiction is less than the agony of continuing.

I always hoped my A would wake up one morning and say, "Hey! This lifestyle is totally not working for me! I'm causing pain to those around me and messing up my life bigtime. I'd better change things." In fact, it took a crisis -- not of my making -- to make him say that. And as soon as the crisis waned, he was back at it again.

Sadly, we can't do anything except get out of the way of the agony coming at them and let them feel it. But as you know, many addicts, in fact most, never hit that point where the agony of changing is less than the agony of continuing.

I have heard the question, "If you knew that nothing would change, what would you do?"

I guess the situation for us is that the agony of staying the same is worse than the agony of changing. So we're here because we're changing to vanquish our agony and attain serenity.

It sounds like your awareness is right on the money. Keep on taking good care of yourself.

White Rabbit · ~*Service Worker*~

I TOTALLY understand this...I've been there.

With time and work in the program, I've gotten to where I can genuinely have no expectations of the active addicts in my life. It didn't happen overnight. But it did happen. You have such good awareness of the situation - you realize that you can't change someone else. It's so darn hard to not get excited when we think THEY finally get it and are going to change themselves, though. I felt that way all the times my AH went to detox/rehab. He showed interest in going and getting sober, and went through the programs - and I got so excited because I thought he was *finally* going to get it and be sober the way I was wanting him to be. No amount of hope sped up that process, though. He didn't get sober until he was ready - and when he was ready he got sober without going to rehab or detox. I agree with Mattie that all we can do is just get out of the way, let them experience consequences, and keep our expectations low. When we don't have expectations, we don't get disappointed...and disappointment was a feeling I was soooo ready to not have anymore.

keep coming back - you're doing so well!

Summer

Lindaoakford · ~*Service Worker*~

Thanks everyone. I am back to crying again, and vomiting and have a headache. I did a bad thing last night after that post... I started the most horrendous argument.

I ended up saying some terrible things.

I feel like I have two people sitting on my shoulders. One is yelling at me to get the hell out of this marriage cos honey this aint never gonna change... the other one is telling me to stick it out for all his good parts and learn and grow to become a better person for me and appreciate the wonderful husband who is also a pot head.

I have apologised for my bad behaviour. He related it back to the smoking, he said every time he smokes I get in a bad mood. I disagreed with that statement.

Anyway.... the argument is still kinda going in that he isn't really talking to me and he is feeling that I don't love him and he is very 'down'. I did explain to him that the smoking was a trigger for my own anger and fear and sometimes crap from my past just snaps me.

Usually I keep a hold on my temper, but last night I just couldn't.

Not sure how to make things better. I too react out of fear.

After I posted I said to myself, QTIP and that it was my disappointment at my own expectations that was getting me angry. I tried not talking and just leaving it alone, but one other little thing totally unrelated triggered a spout of abuse from me to him.

AS I said, I have apologised, but I have hurt him and he relates that hurt back to my reaction to him smoking. It won't change anything though, I know that for sure.

GailMichelle · ~*Service Worker*~

A BIG hug to you, Linda!

I can feel your frustration and confusion. I hope you'll be able to get quiet, meditate, pray, listen to soft music, or whatever calms you down. And then I hope you can turn off the tapes inside your head and listen for your HP's direction.

It's certainly not easy what you're going through. You're handling so much better than I did at your age. You have so much more wisdom.

Keep working it; your life will get better.

take good care

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

Linda,

I want to point something out and maybe when things calm down a bit you can look at this further.

There is a difference between an apology and making amends. An apology is accepting 100% of the responsibility and allowing the other person out of their part of things. An amends is setting the stage that this is about your feelings in a specific situation, it is ONLY owning what is your part and while you don't verbally hold the person accountable for their part. it's totally about you (I statements and what you plan on doing in about the behavior when it comes up again) and only you it has really nothing to do with the other person other than it is the other person you are making an amends to.

This is my take, I have decided I'm no longer apologizing to other people. I am more than happy to make amends where necessary. I am only owning what is my part in any given situation and that takes a load off of me in such a huge way. It also holds the other person still accountable without me saying so. I'm just seeing that when I apologize for something it seems to give the other person power to beat me down in a way I don't know if that makes sense or not, it's just something to think about.

Hugs P :)

Lindaoakford · ~*Service Worker*~

My apology was in the form of "I am sorry I lost my temper, I feel that I didn't keep my anger in check and I was mostly angry at myself not you" I said I was sorry for saying things that were not true, just words of rage and that I am sorry the things I said made him feel bad.

I told him that I do love him and that I do know that he loves me and that he does show my love in many ways.

I said that I wanted love to be expressed a certain way last night and he didnt do it. I lost my ability to ask for what I want and instead I lost my temper and snapped and I am sorry for that.

Is that ammends?????

I also asked him if he said any of the things in anger or did he mean everything he said. His answer was "I don't know" that is his answer for everything unfortunately.

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

I've said before, I am apologizing for loosing my temper. I felt that blah blah blah. Somehow to me the words "I am sorry" let people off the hook. I don't know how to explain that feeling and it's my feeling so there is no right or wrong I don't think, it's just I can't go there in that way. To me I'm putting something out there that I shouldn't, I have a whole metaphysical thing that goes with that .. LOL. It's not complicated it's just how I see things.

You're very in tune to your feelings and what works and so on for you. You've come so far from your first post. I hope you are able to call the alanon person you met with it really helps to have someone else to bounce things off of, it puts a different perspective and they may see things that you don't. At least it gives me something to chew on insight wise. Plus working the steps with someone has proven for me to propel my own healing. I couldn't do it alone, even with the boards. It's just not the same as face to face or even phone conversations.

Giving an apology, amends, or anything and expecting the other person to change because of it OR blaming is not what an amends is about. Not saying that's what you did, I'm just saying blaming and expectation of the other person is not what an amends is. I am there and not there I have many other steps to travel I'm finding that I'm doing different dances with different steps even if my focus is on a particular step it all works together.

There are many other people on the boards who have much more experience than I do in this area, I just know saying I'm sorry doesn't work for me, it doesn't let me off the hook for apologizing or making amends. it's just the words I'm sorry that I have issue with and again that's just me. I'm built a little off kilter :)

Hugs P :)

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

Linda, I would keep expectations at zero until you hear "I am ready to quit smoking." Even then, I would keep expectations at next to zero cuz it's an addiction as you know. Can you live with him smoking before work, having weed in the car, smoking during times when you want to plan time together doing other things? All things to consider. It sounds like he will trounce over boundaries cuz he believes you will accept it anyhow.

maryjane · ~*Service Worker*~

hi Linda,
Mattie said this is something she once heard, "If you knew that nothing would change, what would you do?"

---------------------------------------------------
That statement is what hit me. So much energy is used and wasted on looking at every little piece of what the addict is doing. Instead we could be out there living our lives as best as we can. We could be spending our time in our careers, with our hobbies, with our friends and neighbors, with our family, with our pets, decorating our homes, going on vacation, helping with children or sick patients, so many things. As we learn to let go and give it to our higher power so that we can go on with our lives, we gain so much time. We gain so much power.

We come to AlAnon and we learn to "work" the program and we are told that if we "work" the program that the sick person may have a better chance to get well, so we "work" the program a little harder and then a lot harder and it is "work", and then more "work". We put all our focus on the sick person when what we really need to do is to give them less of a focus. So, I will echo what Mattie wrote, If you knew that nothing would change, what would you do? Can you be content with him if he doesn't change? Can you find serenity in YOUR life if he stays the same? Can you use the program to find that serenity? to not go crazy yourself?

Take care of yourself.

Lindaoakford · ~*Service Worker*~

If I could honestly believe that nothing would change.... then I would learn to cope with what I currently have.

Unfortunately I can't believe that nothing will change... I am scared stiff that things will change for the worse.

From what people say here, that is highly likely, it is only gonna get worse isn't it????

(the weed in the car is not our car and its not his weed, a friend has flown out on holidays and left the car with us and told him about the stuff that is free reign for his use... as of yet, he hasn't smoked any, but I know he will)

I can learn to cope better with him smoking before work because I do not have to put up with it, I am not home, he goes to work and is straight by the time he gets home. Currently he is not smoking after work or during the nights at home with me.

Weekends are a different story. He lately he has been smoking on the Sunday. He tried to hide it from me because he knows I wouldn't like it. He can't hide being stoned.

It was my own expectations that got the better of me. I really thought he would take the opportunity to cut down. I don't know why I thought that. I know from experience that I will be fine about him smoking if it is occassional and I count occassional as getting a bag a few times a year and that bag may last him 2 months. leave it two or three months and buy another bag. I see this as occassional and he was good at that for 3 and half years.

I am having a pity party and I am saying all the stuff I said in my first original posts. I have relapsed myself and I need to get back on track.

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

Hopes in what exactly? He is doing what he has been doing since before you married.

He is an addict hon, this is what addicts do. What we learn to do is realize it is none of our concern.

We choose to live with it and give it all the power and be miserable.

We choose to stay and learn that it is their thing and we have nothing to do with it, accept them as is.

Or we go, or they go.

No waiting,or hoping, or snooping no nothing. We see the person, not their addiction.

His passion is using pot. simple as that.

ya see for me, it would be like someone marrying me and me not having an loving animals, NOT going to happen, you ask me to choose, there is no choice becuz if someone loves me as is they do.,

Its my passion. I would not tell my husband to quit fishing if it was part of him, Sadly this is a disease, makes him ill. But a passion the same.

To ask one to stop is really insanity. again if the person I thought loved me said, you know your dogs bother me, can you get rid of them? ya right. I would not want anyone who wanted to change me, or expect me to do what they want.

playing reversies always helped me.

The concept or feelings are the same. there are no buts about it.

a passion is a passion. If they get where they want to stop, they do there best to stear their passion into sobriety and a program to not use. then many focus their energy into oh work, running, fishing, going to aa, whatever.

What are you going to do? hugs hon deb

Mattie · ~*Service Worker*~

The thing is that if nothing changes about him, I think something does change about us as we keep on living with our addicts. We spend longer in a close relationship with someone who can't be intimate with us (because their drug comes first). They take up space and energy that we could otherwise use getting what we need, either from a genuinely intimate partner or from the rest of our lives. We spend longer giving without getting a proportionate amount back. We spend longer being the only responsible one, the only one who keeps track of the money, tries to keep routines going with household work, taking care of the things that need taking care of. We spend longer in a state of stress because there are two adults living, spending, and making messes but only one adult cleaning up. However strong our serenity, we're caretakers rather than equal partners, because we have to keep a certain level of responsibility going or our lives fall apart too. So the longer we go, the more drained we are and the more used we get to the scenario. That's the way I see it. Sometimes because of all this we lack the energy to separate and the self-belief that our lives could be any better. Been there done that.

In my case, I thought I was staying out of love, but I was staying just as strongly out of fear.

Linda, your situation reminds me of a long period in one of my relationships with A's that I didn't even realize was so stressful until I had come out the other end. I thought I should be strong enough to rise above all his problems. It was like saying I should have been strong enough to row across the Atlantic with only one oar. Right now, to change metaphors, it sounds as if you are stuck between a rock and a hard place -- living with him is ultra-stressful (and no wonder), but you tell yourself that you ought to be able to do it. I remember telling myself over and over, "Just suck it up. You can do it. Just suck it up. Rise above it." The truth, in my case at least, was that no sane person could have risen above what I was dealing with. Only an equally insane person (equal in insanity to the A) could have lived with it. It would have required some kind of numbing drug to live with it. That was the truth in my case.

Hugs.

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

That was very powerful Mattie. Much respect.

Lindaoakford · ~*Service Worker*~

thnakyou everyone

I am glad I am on the bus again in a way. I was away from the boards for a bit when I went on holiday, I am so very glad to be back.

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.