Passive aggressive behavior or ADD? - Al-Anon Family Group

ilovedogs · ~*Service Worker*~

Passive aggressive behavior or ADD?

Otie · Senior Member

Dear ilovedogs. Your post made me smile inwardly (yet, I realize that you are serious.

If AA motivated men to be more helpful around the house, women would be bringing them in by the boxcar-full and signing them up!!

The behavious you described strikes me more of the passive-agressive variety. Of course those with ADD tend to be "forgetful" when there is a list of things to be accomplished. Early learning experiences contribute to the extent one shoulders domestic responsibility. I wonder what he saw in his own family as to gender roles?

You know him best.

From my own experience (UGHhhhhhh!), these are the things that every couple have to negotiate out, regardless if addiction present or not.

You say that he is currently actively using---well, I guess you probably have your hands full just trying to stay detached from that?

Passive agressive behavior can trigger anger----and you often won't know where it is coming from---especially if they are "good" at it. ADD in a relationship requires a great deat of patience---and one needs to become educated about it.

I speak of these things from experience, ilovedogs.

Best of luck, ilovedogs. After dealing with homosapeins--don't we all tend to lovedogs? LOL.

In support, love, Otie smile

ilovedogs · ~*Service Worker*~

LOL, yes I love my dog(used to be dogs), even though she's driving me crazy in her old age. I think I really need to start reading up on ADD/ADHD as an adult. Therapists in the past wanted to label dh as bipolar or as having a personality disorder but the ADHD seems to fit him. Unfortunately, he won't take meds for anything. Also, when he was sober he was not in AA, he had just quit drinking just to quit. So, I had a dry drunk on my hands who had rage issues, passive aggressive behavior, self depricating talk, cynical, surly, angry, AND ADHD. Oh, what did I get myself into? The funny thing is, is that I love him despite all these flaws. Just wish he would love himself one day.

Mattie · ~*Service Worker*~

My AH had ADHD. I didn't even believe in ADHD until I got to know him -- I thought it was some syndrome cooked up by fancy psychologists to pigeonhole active kids. But I'm convinced it's a real syndrome after living with my AH for years! His ADHD behavior was independent of his passive-aggressive alcoholic stuff, in our case. In fact I think being ADHD helped make him an alcoholic. He was so spacy he couldn't remember things from one hour to the next. Everywhere he went looked like a tornado had gone through, he was so messy and disorganized. It used to frustrate him almost as much as me. He couldn't hang on to a set of car keys or an important piece of paper for a day at a time. And you could tell him something and he'd repeat it back and swear he'd heard it and yet an hour later he had no recollection. This was absolutely apart from his drinking -- he had it even when he was a little kid, even when he was entirely sober.

So I'd guess that ADHD would explain your pool saga even if nothing else did. I think ADHD behavior is another thing it requires a lot of maturity and determination to detach from. How to hold them accountable without going over the top is a question. I wonder if maybe he should have been the one to clean out that extra algae from the pool. Even if they can't always help forgetting, rewarding them for it doesn't seem helpful. It can be a hard row to hoe, being involved with someone with multiple cognitive/emotional problems. That's why we need to take extra good care of ourselves.

Otie · Senior Member

Dear ilovedogs, after my recent response to you, I reviewed the other posts that you have made just to become more acquainted with you.

My dear ilovedogs, I must say that the content set me back on my heels. Abuse is abuse. I don't think anyone in alanon or on this board would say to learn to live with abuse.

There is a lot of discussion on this board about control--didn't cause it--can't control it.

Stated quite directly----you can't change your husband even if you turned yourself insideout and upsidedown.

Your 12yr. old son is subjected to the same behaviors as you and he is still in the process of development. This is enormously impactful for him now and for the rest of his life.

Many alcoholics suffer from other undiagnosed and untreated conditions.

I know from my own experience, that one has to face reality and seek as much help as necessary to take care of themselves first. The children have no voice at all, so, of course, they MUST be protected.

Ilovedogs, I consider it my responsibility as a member of this board to try to reach out to you by suggesting that you get more help for you and your son---and your husband also. Extreme tolerance can also be a form of enabling.

I suggest sponsorship, CODA, ACOA, and local abuse organizations would be good starting places. Counselors/therapists with solid experience in addiction and dual-diagnosis are also resources.

My dear, I know my words sound very blunt (because they are). But I sincerely hope that you realize that they are coming from a place of love. I would rather have you angry at me as long as you are treating yourself better. Trust me, I can take it.You can pm me if you need to.

In Support, Love, Otie smile

-- Edited by Otie on Tuesday 28th of June 2011 07:02:47 AM

ilovedogs · ~*Service Worker*~

Thank you Otie for your support and advice. Yesterday I talked to my son about how he feels about when dad gets mad. He said it makes him uncomfortable, I agreed that angry outbursts make most of us uncomfortable and that it's normal. I asked him what he thought about it and if he ever wanted to talk to a counselor about it(he's been to counseling before for anxiety issues and tics). He said no and I asked him why. He told me it's because dad always apologizes for his outbursts and he always asks for forgiveness. He also said that since Dad explains why he's angry or why something angered him, that it helped him understand the reasons behind the anger/frustration/etc.

So, I know it sounds like I should get out. Believe me, I have thought about it. But, he is a good man and has a great heart and he is very quick to point out that we(his wife and son) are not the ones who are to blame for his depression/anger/self pity/etc. He acknowledges he has issues but he's afraid of medication and hasn't had much luck with counselors. I try very hard to not live in the past and to look for a better future with him. Some days it's just not possible. Today will probably be one of those days as he's extremely depressed about his work situation and is getting passive aggressive because of it. At these times I have learned that ds and I need to do our own thing and we stay out of his way. Eventually, he opens up and breaks down and we can talk. Being patient is definitely one of my virtues.

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

Ok I am confused by the ds and dh?

Again there is no rationallyzing insanity. When it comes to an A, especially an A who is using, that's what we are doing.

Also remember the A, especially one who drank a long time, is immature. They never had a chance to meet those milestones most humans and animals do.

We cannot learn with a diseased brain, or drunk one.

Brain damage is a realy thing.

For me I found it was a complete waste of thought to analyze my A loved ones. They do what they do period.

Bugging them, teasing them whatever is almost really abuse on our part. They are sick, very sick people.

Hey I honestly did not do much of that but I did some, so no one is alone in this!

Just cannot expect things of A's. And in my life I don't expect anything. I take things as they come. I am happy if they did help and don't get upset if they didn't. No one is perfect.

I am happy if they show up and oh well if they do not and hope they come later.

Especially is crazy to expect anything from one who has such a serious, horrible, baffling disease.

Hugs, and I had a neat thing that floated in the pool that put out chemicals as needed. I can still see my Daddy out there testing the pool with all that stuff. Now it is much easier.

hugs again, and again, debilyn who will just stick to having a river!

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

I love dogs - there is something in psychology called parsimony which means that the simplest answer is usually the right one. You stated he is depressed, he stated he is depressed. He is depressed. A depressed person finds just getting up and doing the simplest things to be very tedious, overwhelming, and difficult... This could explain him not doing certain chores. A depressed person is irritable.. A depressed person may self medicate to a certain degree using alcohol... So, everything you mentioned as problems sound like symptoms of depression.

A tool I learned in recovery was to live in the solution. Creating new labels and diagnoses for him isn't helping. It's digging for more problems. You don't need to complicate things even more. You have a depressed husband that doesn't want to seek treatment. That is a fact right? All the rest is unsure by your own admission.

Furthermore, the spiritual axiom states that when I have a problem with someone else or with the world around me...the problem is really with me. Even if your husband was ADD (which I doubt) or passive aggressive or whatever...How would it change things for you? He's not seeking treatment for it. He's not admitting or wanting to know about having those problems. All your researching would do is give you a false sense of control over things that you really have no control over.

It may also help to focus on acceptance is the answer from the big book of AA...I know Alanon has it's own books but I do think they also follow the writings in the big book too:

"And acceptance is the answer to all my problems today. When I am disturbed, it is because I find some person, place, thing or situation -- some fact of my life -- unacceptable to me, and I can find no serenity until I accept that person, place, thing or situation as being exactly the way it is supposed to be at this moment.
Nothing, absolutely nothing happens in God's world by mistake. Until I could accept my alcoholism (insert whatever your own issue is here), I could not stay sober; unless I accept life completely on life's terms, I cannot be happy. I need to concentrate not so much on what needs to be changed in the world as on what needs to be changed in me and in my attitudes."

clep · Senior Member

Pinkchip this is a fantastic post. I am not an A and do follow my Al-anon program. When I was in an AA big book study, the quote from the AA book has been imensely helpful to me, and allowed me to put the focus on myself like nothing else did.

I have it underlined and highlighted in my big book and haven't read it in a while. Thanks for the reminder.

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.