The material presented
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he will be getting out, very shortly. he just called and asked me, "what do you need from me to feel safe if i come home?" i said, i need to know he has a plan to deal with stress far before it comes to feelings of suicide, and also i need to know he has a plan in case he feels suicidal. he says he does have those plans, all written down. he'll be coming by in a bit, to get some of his stuff, to stay at a friend's house (didn't say how long).
my plan for myself is, i want to keep coming here every day, and i want to go to the chat meetings as often as i can. i found a CodA meeting on Sunday nights!! and a meditation center very near my house, with sessions throughout the week. one of my projects is to write to prison "pen pals" to speak about my religion, and another is to make "bottles of hope" for cancer patients going through chemo or hospital stays. i also journal.
i think the next time he criticizes me or says something that i would normally have a knee-jerk reaction to, i need to go to my journal, or HERE, *first*. then decide if what he said/did really even needs a response. i've read stories here of how people are able to let their A be in their disease without getting dragged down into it with them, which is what i aspire to.
ohhhh i'm still going to need to come here a LOT, i think! no matter what he does with his life. i'm very grateful i found this place.
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To know the darkness is to love the light, to welcome dawn and fear the coming night.
To not take what alcoholics say is not easy for most of us to learn. But it is quite doable. First step is to realize that you have a choice how to respond to the caustic remarks. You've taken that first step. It gets easier with practice. You also might revert back to your old ways some times. Don't get down on yourself if this happens, it is part of the process of unlearning old ways that many of us have to go through.
Letting what they say roll off your back really is possible. I speak from experience. When I took a stand and set my boundaries, that is when my AH began to change. I'm very fortunate. I realize that not all AH's change. But if your boyfriend does not, that is his loss. No matter what happens, you gain when you establish your boundaries and reinforce them through your actions.
Since he does have a place to stay you may want to take this time to set some other boundaries that have to do with how he treats you. Needing a plan for dealing with his suicidal thoughts and actions is something for HIM. What are you going to do when he sinks in to his negativity and calls you names etc? We always say to watch what they "do" not what they "say" they will do. Having him gone and observing could give you lots of information as to how things are going to go and time to make some definate boundaries that protect you. Even though we learn to detach and choose not to attend every fight, we still need those boundaries that set limits for unacceptable behavior that won't be tolerated no matter what.
Good Luck Christy
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If we think that miracles are normal, we will expect them. And expecting a miracle is the surest way to get one.
Sadako, I agree with Christy, what are you doing for YOU? And "having a plan or plans" is a great idea but when you/the two of you are in the middle of the hell, plans can fly out the window really fast (I know this from experience). Good luck and hugs, J.
he's here right now, napping upstairs. he showed me his plan, it looks good, for him.
my plan is to continue what i did when he wasn't here. to do my own thing. i can roll my eyes and ignore a lot of the negative things he says. but i can NOT allow him to speak to me that way in front of my daughter!! i've made a list of things i want, "demands" so to speak. when he gets up, i'll show it to him. if he's not interested, or refuses to not yell or swear in front of my daughter, i'll have to ask him to leave, *again*. he has his plan, he shouldn't threaten or attempt suicide from me asking him to leave, if he does, i have to detach, eh? ohhhhh that is HARD. but i have to do it.
i'm sitting downstairs going between reading the forums, working on my "biography" thingy, and working with clay, keeping my hands happy :) i'll show him my list when he comes downstairs, and just keep doing what i'm doing. and praying!
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To know the darkness is to love the light, to welcome dawn and fear the coming night.
Sadako - I agree with what everyone's been telling you. Sounds like you need a little physical distance before you jump back into this thing with both feet, though. It's great that he has a plan, and it's great that you have the beginnings of a plan - but for me, it wouldn't be enough of a boundary for him not to call me names, etc. only while not in front of the child. I'm afraid my boundary would be no name calling (or whatever the offense is) AT ALL. Period. Sounds like he's got a lot of work ahead of him, as do you (as do I!!) - I hope you find the strength to hold the line with him. For your sake. For your daughter's sake.
Some years ago (during round 2 with my ex A bf), I went through this back and forth emotional trauma/drama. He wasn't abusive, or a yeller or curser - but there was a ton of really heavy emotion. Depression, anxiety, job loss, and of course the non-stop drinking. It was an emotional rollercoaster and I thought if I stayed strapped in, that somehow I would be able to control it, manage it, fix it. My son was in elementary school at the time, and though I thought I hid the drama from him, I know now that I didn't do as good a job at that as I had imagined. I regret that. It didn't have to be that way. But my disease kept me involved with all of this. Kept me hanging on. I loved this man. It had (and some moments still HAS) a firm grip on me. Detachment is a big issue for me - and I think for many of us who love an alcoholic. It's a toughie, too.
I pray that you stay with this program and incorporate the many useful tools it provides. Take care ~ Ellen
Sadako.. Just to clarify, "boundaries are different from "demands". Addicts don't do so well with demands. They resent them and worse, ignore them. None of us really like demands. He is no different.
A boundary is placed not especially for his limits, but yours and for self preservation. A boundary sets your limit of what you will tolerate. More importantly, what you will do if the boundary is crossed. Every boundary has to have a consequence and must stick to them without wavering. Once allowed to be crossed, forget it. Your boundaries will mean nothing.
So, I would suggest instead of using the word "Demands" with him, (which will get you the honor of being called controlling), you might say "These are the things I just can't and won't tolerate in my life". Not "these are the things you can't do".
It's best to always use "I" and keep it about you. Using "You" will cause him to be defensive and resentful.
Christy
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If we think that miracles are normal, we will expect them. And expecting a miracle is the surest way to get one.
Christy said exactly what I was thinking. Just to call them boundaries is much easier for the other person to accept than to cll them demands. She is right on about the "I STATEMENTS". I won't tolerate beings cussed out in fromt of my daughter.
If the list says you must not sswear at me in front of my daughter...tha'ts the same thing, but they dont see it that way. Take it as what YOU can't do...not what you won't allow HIM to do.
re-wording your list if it is written like that is a big help.
I learned years ago when my hubby worked out of town often, if I asked him...are yo staying another night? he'd get mad. If I asked, will you be home tomoprow? he was ok with it. It was the same questions. it was jsut how his mind perceived what I wanted to know. Both ways..i wanted to know..will have another night to myself so I can catch my breath?
Good uck. Let us know if you get the list revised in time and how it goes. LIN
Also, keep in mind that what he says and what he does may not be the same - he can promise the moon, but promises don't mean a lot. A plan is all very well - is he following it right now?
I agree with the others about the time and space, why the rush? He has a place to stay right? I also agree that demands and ultimatums usually have the opposite of the desired effect. Once a hairdresser said to me (about 2 months before I left the A). Would you want your daughter to be with a man who treated her that way? Would you allow her to date a man who did? Well then why would you let her mother? That really got me to thinking because I have two girls and a large part of my dilemma was how he treated me in front of them, what am I teaching them, etc. I finally decided that teaching them that they don't have to stay in a bad relationship and tolerate being treated badly was more important than having a male role model who totally sucked anyway. He didn't seem that bad at the time but upon reflection I now see how bad it really was. Time and distance do that.
Anyway, my point was that your demands were that he not yell and swear at you and I wondered does that mean he can treat you like crap as long as he doesn't yell or swear in front of your daughter? Just curious.
I can't emphasize enough how important it was for me to step back and just say no and watch events unfold. Watch his actions and shut my ears to his promises. I think that is what saved me more than anything else.
Sadako, When my Ah was arrested for possession of meth 2 months before our wedding, i stayed up all night writing. I wrote about my feeling and questions I had. And I wrote pages about the "rules" that he would have to abide by in order for our future to work. It was things like "give me your email account passwords and i can check your emails whenever i want", "i can check your text message history", "no atm card, and i would give him an allowance". In hindsight, I know that all those pithy rules are stupid. He opened new email accounts and cleared his text in/out boxes on his cell phone. Pretty much nothing had changed. He agreed to abide by my pages of "rules" but just found ways around them. Maybe if we had postponed the wedding and I had found alanon 3 years ago, my situation now would be different.
I hope that things work out and that you and your daughter are safe and happy.
