The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
Hey everyone! TGIF.....so as you know I had my 50th b-day on Monday. My AH who has been sober 9 months and who has never given me a card, present, bday anything for the last 7 years decided he would take me to dinner. Good! Nope bad, he came in late from work because he decided to stay around with the guys and do extra clean up, then says with a huge smile on his face You will never believe what I did, I drove all the way over here from work and forgot a card so I ran to Walgreens to get one. HMMMMM ok, at least he got a card, on the way to dinner he says you know I told you I am short on money so will you chip in on dinner....Wow.
So I let it all slide for the minute, however I did bring it up yesterday to him that his half measures are no longer acceptable. I told him my girlfriends having the same milestone bdays got spa packages, trips, jewelry all kinds of special treatment on their bday and even though he said he had no money there were 900 things all FREE that he could have done and I had told him several times nice thing he could do and yet he still half-assed it. He put on his pity party routine of he is sorry, then turned it on me and said well how do I know what you expect, now back on the pity party, then says for me to tell him how to make it up.
I am not really a greedy nor materialistic person, I had however thought because he was sober and present for my bday this year he would really try and knock it out of the park to make up for all the other times and also he keeps telling me he is doing his living amends, which I have yet to see....so I guess I expected and assumed and should not have. I do know one thing for sure, I am very serious about not tolerating this kind of behavior any longer. I want more from my partner and I know I deserve to be treated much better. So he can step it up or step out and he can quit trying to turn it on me and guilt me into thinking he did his best. Of course now that I said something and he is trying to twist it I am doubting myself and thinking I should just be grateful he forgot a card and last minute he ran to get one and that at least he was at dinner with me and so it's ok if I had to pay for my own dinner. I don't know, seriously right now what to think of it, other than I know if he doesn't want to step up there are others that more than likely would love to. Sad, confused, angry, and disappointed!
__________________
Linda
Don't worry about tomorrow, tomorrow will have it's own worries
You have wants, needs and desires. Sounds like a mom/ adolescent relationship to me. Keep working your program....he may have made his choice not to work his program.
And, Happy Birthday!
-- Edited by PP on Friday 23rd of January 2015 12:17:15 PM
First of all...Happy Birthday! The main thing I have learned with my AH is that even when he isn't drinking,mthere are still a lot of problems he has that I can't live with. He has major money problems. He drives like a maniac 90% of the time. Has outstanding tickets. he has a hoarding problem. He speaks in riddles because he doesn't like to be straightforward...etc etc etc.
Do you have the money to treat yourself to a spa package? Why not take a trip with a friend or even by yourself and pamper yourself? you deserve it! That's what I do now....I don't rely on AH to make me happy. Because he can't. He is incapable of being who I need him to be.
I do have the money to treat myself to anything I want and generally I don't rely on my AH for anything.
We have been going to marriage counseling for some time now and the counselor tells him how things work in a relationship, what a good husband does, he has told him people in vital marriages are giving people. They meet their emotional needs by doing for others -- and they do not keep score.They have a strong sense of commitment to their marriages. They do not take their happiness for granted, but are determined to make their marriages work, they know that a good relationship requires flexibility and effort to keep it alive.
I think what I did was think that because we are going to counseling, because he is working on recovery, and professes to want to do all kinds of special things for me that not only did I expect it, I got hooked into believing he would really do it. So I can really only blame me for falling for the BS hook line and sinker.
I don't mind doing special things for me at all, but shoot I am married and I would like a husband that can treat me kindly, generously and like I am special to him. As the time draws closer for his grand homecoming next Friday my eyes are wide open to seeing that as far as marriage recovery goes, he hasn't really gained to much growth in that area, so with time and with us both finally living in the same home etc. I will finally be able to make the best choice for my happiness and future. He tells me it will be different when he is able to be home and have life with me because right now he is just being pulled in to many directions. We shall see :)
__________________
Linda
Don't worry about tomorrow, tomorrow will have it's own worries
don't be too hard on yourself for believing he would change. It's hard to wait for someone to change...it' very hard for people to act like you expect them to. I hear you!! Have a good day!
From what I have read, you have been incredibly patient and loving with this guy and given him a lot of room to do as he said he wanted to...grow, recover, and generally find himself. I have a lot of respect for what you say and the steadfast position you take regarding your AH.
Now although al-anon doesn't teach us to change other people, one thing I have observed is that people do not treat me with more kindness or respect because they "realise" how much I have sacrificed, or how much I love them and am willing to do for them. That usually makes people disrespect me and take me for granted even more.What does happen is that people treat me with more kindness and respect when I show them I am treating myself with kindness and respect and I am going to continue to do so no matter what. Like when you plant a new lawn, you run strings over it with cloth tied all over it to scare away the birds. When it is new and vulnerable, you sort of have to take bigger measures to protect it. Maybe us al-anoners need to take bigger, showier measures to defend our new boundaries and self-worth?
I know you already have some pretty great integrity and you do care for yourself but I might suggest that instead of thinking about ultimatums and "if he isnt gonna", maybe step it up a notch. Somewhere in the midst of his rehab and self exploration and whatever else he is doing, you have turned 50. You seem like an awesome lady who knows her own mind and just happens to love an addict and has a great deal of patience. I think 50 years of being you sounds like something to celebrate in a big way. How will you show yourself and the world the way you deserve to be treated when you celebrate such a significant milestone? You mention what your friends got from their partners (mine has never given me a gift either so I know exactly where you are coming from). What can you give yourself to mark the occasion and remind yourself that you are worth it?
__________________
If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)
Hey Miss....I am giving myself another trip to Florida, gave myself a brand new SUV, getting my hair done today (gotta cover the gray). It probably sounds like I am giving him an ultimatum but really I am not, really its an ultimatum for me. I know what I want in a husband and a marital relationship. I have gone above and beyond trying to be supportive, encouraging, hopeful and as my years are speeding on lighting fast I am not willing any longer to put up with less than just because he lives in a 3/4 way house or just because he is new in recovery or just because he whatever excuse he comes up with. I want more in a relationship, he professes to want the same but actions speak louder than words. He gushes on with the marriage counselor, then does the exact opposite or does nothing at all.
I don't expect him to treat me in any kind of way because of what I have done, sacrificed, been through none of that, I do expect that if something is important, a major milestone an accomplishment it is celebrated (lack of a better word), in his case if it's not about him then it's about nothing. He wanted me to congratulate him on remembering to get a card, that he still went out to eat with me and that he got permission to spend the night. There is nothing in that mess to praise, so I won't. Sometimes maybe I shouldn't be so brutally honest to him and just pat him on the back for his feeble attempts, but then is that honest, not really.
By the way it drives him bonkers to see me doing for me what I like, he likes to make snarky comments about how I don't really need him anyway so that is why he loves his living arrangement, his job, his meetings because those people really need him and he helps them. I just roll my eyes and walk away. My marriage is not the same relationship as he has with his "brotherhood" and for some reason he just doesn't get that. But as I said before time tells all, he will be home starting next weekend full time. He will either step up and be a good husband or he won't in the latter case I will know then what my choice will be. I am grateful to this program and all of you here because a year ago I may have just dumped him and the whole mess which wouldn't have been right for me, I wouldn't have felt like I gave it my all or gave him a fair and honest chance.
__________________
Linda
Don't worry about tomorrow, tomorrow will have it's own worries
Hi flower, im sorry it didnt work out the way you wanted. I agree with nlg here, he might not have it to give. Some people dont know how to do the birthday thing. Im not that great at it either. Ive got a friend who has a talent for birthdays and celebrations, she goes all out, im not like that. When my kids were young, i had parties for them, it sounds daft but that didnt come all that natural to me, now i keep it low key. I do understand how forgetting a card and not putting a lot of effort in would upset you though, it can grow in our minds to have a much deeper meaning like, he doesnt care, or he doesnt love me enough. It might just be that hes early in recovery, maybe still behaving like a teenager in terms of his development, teenagers are not that thoughtful or considerate. You want a man but hes not a man yet, it might be time he needs, or his brain needs, counselling cant really make him grow up.
Your doing great flower! Time will tell when he comes home fulltime
My ah refused to work on the marriage, we did marriage counseling,
He did not like getting called on his behaviors toward me. That was the
End of that. I did stay on with her for awhile it was good, then i went
to a drug and alcohol therapist she was good for me too. She stated,
She did not Want to bother seeing AH unless he wanted to work on
the marriage.
He did not bother going, he had no intent to work on us,
he had been attending AA for about a year then. Now its been three years
And things are worse than before even though I go to alanon and him AA.
Keep working your program for you, i gave my marriage my all and tried
Everything possible to make it work but it takes two people to make it
Work not one! Most addicts are emotionally immature and stunted
People with poor coping skills.
Flower, I empathize and think I understand a lot of where you are coming from. I think it's going to take him several years of diligent recovery work to be a more mature and thoughtful man. There is also a chance that he just doesn't have that capacity. Even at 6 years sober, my husband still tells me sometimes when I have not been thoughtful with regard to division of chores and not always listening well. Hence, I know these are left of defects from being an alcoholic and it's me failing to work my program to the degree that I am a sensitive, caring, and equally giving partner. It is lame and frustrating that I sometimes have to work to be thoughtful in that way. My nature is to be lazy and make excuses. I am more thoughtful in terms of feelings and what I say. But I would fall for my own BS with regard to birthdays and such....My Husband just turned 50 this year and he did have to tell me what he wanted more or less. He just kinda hinted around it though and I did the rest. I did arrange the birthday celebration with friends at a restaurant. Generally speaking, he is WAY WAY WAY more thoughtful than I am in those ways. This is part of why I love him so much because I actually aspire to be more like that. The way he loves me and cherishes me makes me want to change and go against my selfish and lazy nature.
So...you are then left with the difficult choice of whether or not to hold out for greater healing or to decide "This person is just not capable of meeting my needs and may never be." That is a difficult question and only you can answer it. It is good that you don't have to make any decisions TODAY. "More will be revealed" as they say and I think your HP will give you the answers you need in time.
Happy Birthday. 50 is definitely a milestone to be celebrated. Nine months sober is worth celebrating too. Here they give AA medallions for 24 hours, one month, 3, 6, 9, and then for 1 year sober. The first year is thought to be one of the most difficult. My bf had a few cobwebs in that first year. He was forgetful, sensitive to noise, reactionary to others words and behaviors and generally ashamed of his past behavior.
OK... so maybe asking you to spot him the money for dinner wasn't great but things can get better with time and experience if you have the patience for it and consider your marriage worth it. We use the term compare and despair in Alanon. Even though it commonly refers to measuring our own recovery against someone else's; I think it not unusual to look at others lives in general and compare. The truth is .... we don't know what really goes on in other people's lives or at their house. So your friends got spa days it doesn't mean life with their husbands are like days in paradise! lol People talk a good game Flower especially some women. "Oh my husband gave me this, mine gave me that!" It doesn't mean they're having great lives. Wishing you wonderful memories of your 50th!
Maybe you'll treat yourself to a something you've been really wanting for your birthday. Why not, right? (((hugs))) TT
__________________
Surround yourself with people and elements that support your destiny, not just your history.
Flower: I can empathize with your experience. I really do think we have to pretty much spell out exactly what we want in relationship to some folks - As or not. Men or not. I have no expectations when it comes to my birthday although I do celebrate it an entire month. In that way, I'm never disappointed and when folks apologize for missing it or are concerned that they can't do something for me or with me on my particular birth day, I can always say - that's okay! We've got the whole month to celebrate it. What about lunch on ... or a walk by...or a letter written to me that lets me know one way I've brought some joy or happiness or fun into your life. Then, the concerned person gets to choose what they want to do in the timeframe they can do it and we both wind up happy.
For me, January was always a cruddy time for a birthday celebration. Right after Christmas and the dead of winter. I decided that instead of wrapping everything up in one day, there was nothing saying I couldn't be a happy camper for an entire month. I enjoy telling people who send me belated birthday cards and apologize that they aren't late - they're right on time - since the whole month is mine. Some are taken aback by that and others are doing it themselves. Why not celebrate our birth once a year for a month? Sure beats trying to wrap it all up into one day for me at this time of year.
-- Edited by grateful2be on Friday 23rd of January 2015 03:43:45 PM
Sounds like your husbands "half measures" were more than he has done for your past birthday's ... just thinking that he is moving in the right direction!! When my first husband remembered a few of my birthdays, I got a spaghetti pot, a shot gun (obviously that one was for himself cause I never used it) and a sewing machine as presents!!
__________________
"Forgiveness doesn't excuse bad behavior, but it
does prevent bad behavior from destroying your heart". ~ unknown
Flower...I hear you. I have been methodically planning all of my actions with my AH. Sometimes people would ask me about my timeframes, etc of doing things...but I did things when I felt it was the right time for me. I had to try everything before I knew I was really done. You will know when to do what you need to do. You are strong.
A shot gun - who would have thought that it would be an appropriate gift to your wife for her birthday!!! Using it? ... Well let say I do laugh about it now!!!
__________________
"Forgiveness doesn't excuse bad behavior, but it
does prevent bad behavior from destroying your heart". ~ unknown
Flower I do understand your frustrations, I so understand them. In my first marriage I had a mom/adolescent relationship and it was miserable. As I look back, I was constantly complaining about what he did not do for me and for our children. The truth is he could not do or be who I wanted and needed him to be as a spouse and father. He was an eternal boy and that is how he was and that is who he wanted to be. In thinking about us, my actions towards him were mean. I talked about him to others, I teased him in front of others, I appreciated very little about him, because I could only see through my eyes of not enough. Who was I to do these things? I felt entitled to have a life that was not possible with him and I was angry and resentful. I ended up having an affair out of this entitlement...it took me a long time to forgive my actions. He passed on when our children were very young, leaving a void. It was after he passed I could see the gifts he brought to me and our children.
I do understand how you feel, as I have felt that way,but my expectations of my significant other have changed. Early in our relationship I had big expectations and even bigger resentments if things didn't go my way.I wanted him to shower me with gifts, affection and tell me how he felt all the time. I'm glad I stuck it out with him. He's very affectionate now, he offers often to buy me things I need, I no longer want big things. I work a daily gratitude list on just him, in addition to my regular gratitude list. I agree with the others in that it's not healthy to compare my relationship to others. There is no "perfect" partner and these days my relationship is pretty serene and I trust my hp will help me make good choices with my relationship. Wishing you peace love n happiness :)
__________________
I needed these behaviors in my past they helped me survive I'm finding new and better ways to not just survive but thrive
And I learned it just for you!!!!!! 50 is a special birthday. You deserved my multiple hours of making messes and pestering Kenny. Now, I'm a dangerous woman. I just look for reasons to practice my new skill. You inspired me!
First of all, happy birthday! I am right behind you on this milestone birthday... but still have 2 kids in elem. school so am in such a different stage of life, for being the same age!
I hear you on the disappointment. I don't have much to offer, except that I hear you. Esp on that desire not to be in a parent/child relationship in any way.
My AH excels at the little things, like thoughtful little gifts that are just right, flowers, coffee in bed... but he does not try very hard to earn a living. He doesn't work very hard. He doesn't help me much in raising the kids with the values we say we value - like discipline, trying your best, etc. He wants "peace at any price."
For my bday last year, he took me to a diner with local character but so-so food (he knows I like a different type of place to eat), and then took me to a shooting range! I had never before fired a gun or had any desire to! It was nice from the angle that I tried something new - but I thought about all the things I would have loved to have done on that day (like hike through the nearby forest), and instead he dragged me kicking and screaming to do something he wanted to do. Sigh. This year he fell off the wagon on my bday, and handed me a couple items from the drugstore in a plastic bag. This year, when I turn 50, I am going to focus on what brings me happiness.
I truly hope that this is a great year for you, with more peace and serenity - the best gifts of all.
Oh Flower, what a donkey! We all know the whys .... still I think there are moments when we can look at the AHS as men with bewilderment and just go you are a donkey. Before hopping in the new SUV, allowing the wind to blow through the hair were about to have lathered in sweet smelling expensive shampoo and saying the three c's. Happy birthday xx. Debb....just wow! pity were all over the world. I can so imagine all of us doing birthday month in a restaurant. It would be a hoot! Especially with donkey gift list as a theme. My last birthday I asked for flowers and sleep. He bought a new shirt. For himself. Yep, donkey.
LOL! Aquamom! I know this is Linda's thread, but I can't help myself when I read about these weird gifts! I have to laugh out loud and in public. So, he bought himself a shirt, did he? Well, now, that definitely showed a lot of listening to what you wanted for your birthday. How did we pick 'em? How DID we pick 'em? Oh......I remember now. The reason we're all here now.
(((hugs))) TT 
Using it? ... Well let say I do laugh about it now!!!