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I have a younger sister who is 8 years younger to be exact. She lives in another state and we weren't very close until she grew up and got married and had kids, etc. We have more in common now anyway. I've always been the overachieving, organized, straight A student in school, career as an adult, responsible, etc whereas she was the opposite. Disorganized, always late, struggled with her grades, made bad decisions that got her into trouble. I made bad decisions, too, but for some reason, they never really came around to bite me in the rear but that's probably because I never went TOO far with my actions. I always had a danger switch or an off switch and could stop myself before I got out of hand.
My dad always made her live in my shadow and I hated that about him. She could never live up to me in his head and I constantly harangued him about just letting her be, she'll find her way, she isn't studious and that's OK, etc. So, I guess I always felt bad for her and I've tried to help her out quite a bit over the years. Shopping for her kids for clothes, sending her our old DVDs (like 40 of them that my son doesn't watch anymore instead of selling them for profit), sending her gift cards, you get the picture. I never helped her out like my mom has, but I try to keep her needs at the top of my mind because I know how much they struggle.
So, this Christmas I really put a lot of effort into the Christmas presents for her and the kids, including her fiancés 2 kids, too. I told her to open one of the boxes before Christmas Eve because it was a gift for her, a new sweater that I knew she could wear to church as she sings in the choir. Her new man told me that her sweaters were ratty and old and that it would be appreciated. I sent her a text, "Did you get the box?" She said, "Yes, I got it." I asked, "did you open yours?", to which she answered yes. I then asked her another question but got no response. There was no thank you. She made mention to getting the Christmas CD I sent her and told her she got the letter I typed up for them.
We talked via text yesterday but she never thanked me for any of the presents not even for the kids. I don't know why I let this bother me. I don't know why I bother to send them anything because she seems so ungrateful or just plain old inconsiderate. I remember sending her $500 once and she didn't thank me, I had to draw it out of her by asking probing questions. I love her dearly, I love her kids, and when you're standing in front of her she always expresses her thanks and gratitude. But, for some reason, she just can't express thank you's in any other way. I have to find acceptance for this, I go through this every year with her and my own expectations, duh. It just makes you feel unappreciated and, quite frankly, I find it hurtful. Everyone else in the family is over the top with expressing their gratitude and I've talked to my mom about this and she said, "You know that's how she is. You'll just have to deal with it."
Time to work my program and just let it go. I'd love to tell her, gently, how hurtful her behavior is but I am too worn out with my own life to bother with her. In a few days, I'll get over it and if she calls, I'll be kind and nice, as usual. I guess I just needed to vent.
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Never grow a wishbone where your backbone ought to be!
Andromeda: I don't know if this is true for your sister or not but one of the things I learned in the work I did was how hard it was for people to feel like charity cases when others showed up at their door with Christmas baskets and gifts for their children. The donors would leave angry that people didn't seem grateful. The people on the receiving end felt embarrassed and ashamed especially when donors brought their kids to help drop stuff off so the kids could see how good they lived in comparison to those they brought Christmas baskets to or to learn the true meaning of Christmas. We learned to give anonymously so that the donors' expectations of the families' weren't disappointed and the receivers of the gifts weren't put into a position where they felt exposed and embarrassed or expected to behave in a certain way. That seemed to work well for everyone.
I don't know. She is very grateful and says thank you if you are in front of her physically. So, I could fly up to CO and then she would say thank you. And, my presents are never over the top. I got the kids flash lights and wrapped them in a Bible verse about the light of Jesus and then gave them each a $10 gift card to Target. I gave her a $25 gift card to Panda Express to take the kids out for a meal and a also a sweater.
It's just weird how it almost seems like she avoids even saying thank you over the phone or via text. I feel like I have to beg but sometimes I actually have to ask her, "Hey, I shipped some of my son's old clothes to you 2 weeks ago, did you get the box? I want to make sure you at least got it." Her usual response is, "Oh yeah, that came a week ago." How hard is it to just throw thanks or thank you on the end of that sentence? LOL, I know this about me and unmet expectations. I think I need to release this somehow, ugh.
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Never grow a wishbone where your backbone ought to be!
Love the wisdom in your share, Andromeda. I, too, have had to drop expectations of others - and then I pick them right back up again from time to time. Fortunately, I have a sponsor who reminds me from time to time of what I can change and usually it does have to do with expectations. Ah, well. Progress for us and not perfection appears to be really, really true - at least in my case. I did learn with "my folks" that one of the best gifts I could give them was to tell them what they gave me. They had been so used to receiving financially more than they could ever give, that they couldn't see what they brought to life and the gifts that they were to me. They couldn't do much financially and yet they supported and loved me in so many other ways that brought me such joy. That helped level the playing field for us in that both parties could offer each other what the other couldn't give. My organization could provide programming, financial assistance and pastoral care and thanksgiving for all that they allowed us to be and to do and to share with them. We were equals with different gifts to share with each other.
-- Edited by grateful2be on Friday 26th of December 2014 11:31:23 AM
I hope you dont take offence but have you ever considered that your sister feels patronised and inadequate with expensive gifts. I mean if shes always lived in your shadow and your the successful one according to your famiky then it sounds like shes treated a bit like a child. If this was me i would maybe feel a bit offended, its like shes getting the message that shes just not good enough, she doesnt dress well enough, earn enough, give her children enough. Maybe thats why she doesnt express gratitude, gratitude for what? The fact that her bf told you behind her back her clothes are tatty, is in itself pretty telling.live and let live sounds like the slogan needed.
El Cee, I've talked to my mom about this because my mom does more than I do as far as getting them things and helping them out. I didn't go overboard, that's why I only gave the kids $10 when I could have easily afforded more. She specifically tells me what her needs are and she has been taking money from my mom for 2 years now. She has no intention of paying my mom back and has pretty much told her so. I've done my step work and made amends to her and we both cried it out and I asked her about this(living in my shadow stuff) and she told me she understands (where our dad was coming from), as much as I understand that I got the shaft when she was sick for 3 years when we were kids. And, I only sent her the sweater because her fiance told me that she needed one and that he couldn't afford it because he just lost his job.
We both have our grudges but we both have moved on from them. Like I said I love her dearly and we talk weekly and share secrets, etc. We are good to each other in every other way.
__________________
Never grow a wishbone where your backbone ought to be!
Went to my noon meeting today. It was a topic meeting. Thanks to your share, I suggested "Expectations." Everybody laughed in our small group and the topic was something we all had to admit we had trouble with from time to time - especially around the holidays. We left the meeting happy. At this particular meeting, I have a difficult time with the fact that folks won't put chairs away and leave them out together with the box that contains handouts and the money for the 7th Step. I decided that I would expect myself to pick up the box and put it in the cabinet, and stack my chair and those on each side of me. The rest were somebody else's problem. If the priest of the church comes in and screams at our group again for not being respectful of the church's space and cleaning up as we've been asked or the 7th Step collection is stolen, it will be on those who refuse to do anything in the way of service even when they know the priest has asked us repeatedly to do so and walk out with a clean conscience. I can express my gratitude for the church member's kindness to us and drop my expectation of others who don't see things the way I do. Thanks for a good topic to consider today. It helped me in a way I didn't expect. (((A)))
I didnt mean to sound judgy, i think it came across that way. I felt sorry for your sister, i had similar dynamics going on with my son. Im glad you and her worked things out and youve got a good relationship now. I just feel that giving, really giving hasnt really got a return. Should gratitude be given? I know what your saying a simple thank you is good enough. Sometimes though theres deeper things going on. Your mum giving her money for years and shes not gojng to return it. I know when i was giving my son money and i wouldnt ask for it back, it was quite damaging. When i looked at my motives, i played the whole martyr fixer type and i got something out of it. It took my sons dignity though, its like a subtle message that reduces self worth in a person. Its like giving andgiving takes away the equality in a relationship and theres a person beneath and a person above. I Think its important to give carefully and to think about motives and the impact. I know that most healthy people wouldnt give this kind of stuff a second thought but ive been very unhealthy in terms of giving. I took my place way above my son for years and told myself i was being kind and he needed me to do this and that. It didnt help it hurted him. Anyway, this may be completely irrelevant to your situation with your family.
My take on it is this: it's rude not to tell you thank you. My opinion. Plain and simple. My MIL is 91 yrs old and complains every single year about what I've sent her...even if it's a simple card she will find something to whine about. So guess what? Since her son and I aren't living together anymore, and it was always ME sending them something, I didn't send a damn thing this year. And I told her I wasn't sending out card too...just so she would know. She sent me and the kids some money...so I will be polite Nd call her and tell her thank you. That's it.
But,mid it makes YOU feel good sending her and the kids something, then do it but do not expect a word of gratitude from her. If it makes you feel bad, then reconsider sending something next year.
Thanks NLG, yes, I do think it's rude. I also think different generations have different expectations of social norms and manners. My parents raised me to be responsible, to respect other people's time, to be on time for appointments and work, and to be grateful even if someone gives you a lump of coal. My sister lost her job a few years ago because she was chronically late. Most of her misfortune she brought upon herself because of her own irresponsibility. It's just hard to see that we came from the same parents, LOL.
Oh, and the other reason I was ticked that she didn't thank me was because she asked me to send her some of the letters that were inside our family's historical ancestry book. I painstakingly(mostly because the paper is starting to fade and tear and I need to figure out how to preserve stuff from decades ago) made copies of letters that my aunt wrote to my dad about some deaths in the family and then copied a few pages out of the book that she was specifically looking for. She didn't even thank me for those and she had ASKED for them herself! I inherited the book after my dad died so my cousins and my sister often call me looking for historical information about our family.
As an aside, this is a 1000 page book that traces my maiden name back to Irish Quakers, previously in England(Cambridge). There are historical documents from William Penn when he granted an ancestor tracts of land in PA and where they had meetings in Ireland before coming to the US. Letters from the Quaker Friendships and various other interesting historical facts, letters, tax statements, personal information, etc. My lineage can be traced directly to a Nicholas Newlin who built the first working grist mill in PA and which is still currently standing and in working order in Concord Township, PA. It is named the Newlin Grist Mill and is on the registry of historical buildings. Our family's have reunions on the grounds every year there but I've never attended. I can't remember the name of the ship they came over on but there are a few pages in the book that are dedicated to the voyage and to the suffering that people endured when they came to America from England. They landed here in March of 1683.
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Never grow a wishbone where your backbone ought to be!
"Tis a gift to be simple, tis a gift to be free..." Love the Quakers' simplicity and from what I think is true since I've never been to a meeting, their silent listening together.
This is a hard one for me, too. You are supposed to give without expectation of anything in return, but I find that is very difficult. A simple "thank you" will suffice (and we are all taught that is good manners, so is to be expected), so when it is not forthcoming, it gets to you.
I would either have a face-to-face with her sometime and just ask why she does not feel the urge to give you this acknowledgement and then listen to what she says.
If you find her answer unsatisfactory, I would stop all gifts and tell her why up-front.
Does she give you anything, or is it all one-way?
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"All we see or seem is but a dream within a dream."
Edgar Allan Poe
Row, Row, Row your boat, gently down the stream.
Merrily, Merrily, Merrily, Merrily, Life is but a Dream.
I'm likely to send only cards following me sending a gift for a wedding, shower, new baby to which I was invited and the gift (a check that was cashed) wasn't acknowledged. To me that is rude and I'm not a bank nor am I aunty who will always send checks when I'm invited to anything - that feels like using me to me. If I give because I want to give, I don't care if the person responds or not, if the person hasn't asked for anything. I've done what my love for them prompted me to do. For me, that's enough.
-- Edited by grateful2be on Saturday 27th of December 2014 05:04:13 PM
-- Edited by grateful2be on Saturday 27th of December 2014 05:05:40 PM
Not sure if this is at all relevant but, I am considered to be the "youngest and neediest" in my family and thus everyone sends their old unwanted stuff to me, I have posted about it before. I find it offensive and irritating, I always make sure my child is clothed and has what she needs but all of my well-meaning relatives send over bags of dated clothing (that she doesn't want), dated toys (that she doesn't want) and broken furniture...old appliances...basically they assume that i am "needy" so I must want their old stuff. Much like your sister, for many years I would say "thank you" in person because like you, i was taught to say thank-you for a lump of coal... but then later would look at the stuff, sigh and think "great, how am I going to get rid of this crap?" My enthusiatic thank-you's were not genuine, believe me. But they might have seemed as if they were. How many pop-corn makers and slushy-makers did they think we needed?
I thought a lot after reading this; I never really made an effort to call and thank people for these deposits because they weren't appreciated, they were annoying and insulting. After some time in al-anon I was able just a couple of years ago to make a statement to my family members...please stop sending me all of your old junk, I am NOT a rubbish dump.
I wonder if your sister doesn't feel like me...she doesn't know how to say in person "stop this, it's insulting and rude" but in reality she is not in need of your benevolence and wishes you would stop?
I don't mean to be unkind Andromeda, I can just see this from what I imagine to be your sister's perspective. Maybe she doesn't think of herself as "in your shadow" or in need of your help but instead as an individual person facing her own hardships and challenges that she will overcome by herself?
Perhaps by not responding she is actually following her own al-anon type path where she lets you do what you do and doesn't engage?
I know I would be mad as hell if my boyfriend told my sister my clothes were ratty and she sent me clothing and then expected me to be grateful. I also don't thank people when they give gifts to my daughter anymore, because she is not me and I am tired of feeling like i am just an extension of my child. My mother and grandmother buy her expensive gifts, and I encourage my daughter to say thank-you but if she doesn't, I let that be her journey and her relationship with her family. I do not need to be grateful on her behalf.
I am sorry but from what you have described I feel for your sister. Is there any room in your reality for her to be an individual with her own wants and needs and assets or does she only get to be the "poor little sister"?
I'm sorry if my comments are harsh, this just struck a chord with me!!
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If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be. And what it wouldn't be, it would. You see? (Lewis Caroll)
In my family I make a big effort to write thank-yous to people who send presents. My son balks at this, of course. Last year we had a lot of turmoil and we never got two of his thank-yous written. I noticed that those two people did not send him presents this year. I did point this out to him. Actions have consequences. Maybe if the thank-yous aren't forthcoming, that's a sign just to send a cheery card next time around? Or whatever will make you feel happy and not concerned. Hugs.
Oh Melly, I get it. I've talked to her about this before. Both my mom and I call her and ask her if she wants us to send stuff. Most of the time it's actually because she's expressed a need. I don't just send her boxes of junk. She will tell me, "Oh, the boys have no pants that fit and I can't find any at the second hand stores here in town. Any chance you have seen any by you?" So, being the helpful person that I am, I swing by Goodwill while my son is at the orthodontist since they're right next door, and I find her kids a few pairs of pants.
And, I called her before I sent her a box of old DVD's that my son had outgrown. She told me, "Yep, go ahead and send them. My kids will love watching something new."
So, I don't feel like I treat her like a charity case, I feel like I'm helping her meet her needs because she has expressed those things as needs or wants. As for the sweater, it's been a running joke for a year now with her and family. We don't make fun of her because she makes fun of herself first because she loves the tattered sweater and no one makes fun of her(we're just not like that; we're a bunch of people pleasers, lol). I just thought she'd appreciate a sweater with the sparkly threads for the holidays and her boyfriend thought it would be nice for her to have something alternative, as well.
Anyway, it is what it is and I keep getting frustrated because really this is all about manners and expecting people to just be courteous. Again, I guess that's expecting too much from people.
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Never grow a wishbone where your backbone ought to be!
