Aloha Shosh and welcome to the board...you can bet that your share, your story right now is the common and usual story of the alcoholic relationship...all of it.  How recovery works as I learned it simply was for me to separate myself from the disease...get away from all things alcohol and get into and around the Al-Anon Family Groups the people who came before me and who did what it was that I was doing that didn't work and learned how to change their thoughts, feelings and behaviors in the way that their rescued their own lives.   Understand that as long as the alcoholic has the opportunity to form his own behavior and then follow thru on it you're not to blame at all for the outcome. This isn't the consequence you wanted for your life and is the consequence of being in a relationship with an alcoholic...using or not.   Alcohol is a mind and mood altering chemical and it will do that to both the drinker and those affected by the drinking.  Your situation is normally alcoholic it isn't normally how you want to live.   If you have decided you want him in your life you now understand that you will have to learn another way of living especially when he decided that inspite of the evidence and his awareness he is going to continue to drink...that is what he has decided...what are you going to do.  You came here and that is a best first choice cause you are among others who are or have been where you are at now and we support each other and share our experiences, strengths and hopes so others can find the peace of mind and serenity we have found.  Very many of us are Al-Anon members and the most usual suggestion you will get is to find the hotline number for the program Al-Anon and call it and find out where and when we get together in your area.   That will save your sanity and your life.  He has told you what he isn't going to do and laid some responsibility for the condition on you....Don't even fall for it...that's the disease and not even reality.  He has as much opportunity, facility and time to seek out his own recovery.     Keep coming back (((((hugs)))))

Welcome to MiP. I'm glad you are going to attend meetings. What you are experiencing is very familiar to me. With the help of Al-Anon, I have learned how to ignore the manipulations of the disease that wants to destroy everybody involved. Of course it threatens you with that "it will die if you leave it" line.   The disease doesn't want to die. It just wants to keep on doing what it always does - drinks. If you attend Al-Anon meetings, read the literature, find a sponsor after you've had time to get to know some of the folks in the meetings and work the steps, follow through on your exit plan, the disease might not die since it isn't curable but it can be put into remission at least for you. Your boyfriend might not stop drinking if you do all these things, but you'll be able to save yourself from a disease you didn't cause, can't control and can't cure. Working a program of recovery for yourself in earnest might also aid your A in getting help for himself but there is no guarantee.

Shoosh...one of the things I learned in this recovery program called Al-Anon Family Groups was that my peace of mind and serenity didn't depend on anyone else and while I attempted to find it thru relationships after my marriage with my alcoholic/addict wife I never found it...the program was right.  Happiness, serenity, balance on all levels, sanity and much more are personal choices and endeavors..."inside jobs" and I learned the skill work in Al-Anon.  Yes I'm married again and this time longer that all of my marriages before it together...those marriages were alcohol/addict marriages and so one of the things I needed to change was leaning why I made the choices I made (not only in relationships) and how to change my picker and my own behaviors so that I was rewarded with the peace of mind and serenity that absolutely no one else on the planet is responsible for.  I learned to love without needing.  My wife doesn't have to adhere to any protocol that I think valuable to and for me and I don't have to do that either.  We are both in program and our programs are not identical.  Our Higher Power however is boss.   Keep coming back.   ((((hugs))))  

Thank you grateful2be, hotrod, el-cee, likemyheart, Jerry F., Debilynthank god you people are out thereyou are all beautiful souls and I cant thanks you enough for replying and for what you have said to me. 

I pray to god that I can stop being manipulated by AH. I know I allow myself to do this dance and I think that I have been conditioned into itI am trying so hard to notice when my heart starts thumping and I feel fear in my chest and make deals with myself that I will just escape from the contact rather than do the dance it is so hard, 

and so very hard ATMtoday, I found out that I have a breast lesion and have to have more testsits a long story with genetic history and I wont bore you all with the details, suffice to say, i am faced with making some important decisions sooner than I was hoping to, and it may even be too late (but one step at a time shosh!) anyway, when AH heard (daytime, at work, sober) his first response was that he couldn't come with me for the test or the specialist appointment because he was working and it wasnt a good enough reason to change his shift or get carer leaveI could not believe my ears...it is his coarseness and increasing heartlessness that I find so very hard to cope with.he is so desensitised through his work to normal human emotions...but this felt surreal....

anyway, I told him that I knew he would say something like this, (which I did) and that had I already arranged for one of my daughters to come with me (which I had) and of course, her reaction was where, when, she is there 100% for me, lets take it as we go mumma, one moment and step at a time, not to worry about inconveniencing her and that her work doesnt matter etc in this situation, her boss will understand etc. Such a contrast to AHs response!

He even said, what a load of crap when he heard how my daughter had responded and at that point I instantly realised that I should not even have wasted my time telling him all this about my daughter, that he will never get it because of the disease

I cant wait to learn to work the 12 steps and I hope I am blessed enough to connect with a sponsorI have to get out of this helllove for AH just isn't enough because the disease is taking his soul....

I already feel so blessed to have connected with all of you. Thank you!

DebilynI have cleared a heap of time in my schedule to pack up and I am going to get a real estate agent out to make plans to rent my house out as I figure that will be the fastest way out for me. Ive been thinking for a while now how I would like to live closer to water where I can see it, and my friends and of course my kids have been encouraging me. Seeing that it will take time to get the house "sale" ready, renting may be the fastest and most stress-reducing way to go for now...

I will definitely keep coming back if you will have me. THANK YOU ALL! Thank you for such an awesome welcome to the board...you are all being so wonderful and kind...thanks for sharing your stuff with me too....Hugs

Thanks....right back at you...I wish you and everyone blessings of love and happiness...

Hi Kenny

Thank you for your kind words! I'm finding getting the concepts and actually living them are two different things! It is so hard...last night AH lost it getting so upset at my letting go, saying I am abandoning him and then he got vicious and made a few abusive comments on my Facebook which he has never done before...he never posts! Well not that I have seen..but then I have probably been on restricted ?.... Anyway, I am trying and the support of alanon is awesome and helping me get through! :)

Blessings of light and healing, 

Shosh

Thanks Breakingfree! I hope that happens to me too! I deserve this and I am finding great freedom in detaching even though it is hard. I am very glad I found MIP, I can't begin to tell you how glad I am. I am going to my first f2f tomorrow. 

Take care, 
Shosh

Hi ((Cloudofskies))

Thanks for sharing. 

Well I went to my first f2f meeting tonight. The people were welcoming and kind. There were more than 10 people there and I think that most had been going every week for up to the past 10 years. There were a few relatively newbies. I was a bit surprised that the chair asked everyone to share, which was not what I was expecting but I managed to do it. I could have passed but I thought now is as good a time as any. They were working Step 8 this month but covered Step 1 for me also as it was my first meeting. 

I am feeling it peacefully ATM that I am powerless over my active A's drinking. THere was a little anger towards myself for putting up with this situation for so long but I let that go. There was no guilt about being there. My insight from the meeting was that this weekend when my active A drinks, I am going to just leave and do my own thing and when he carries on that I am punishing him by abandoning him (as I suspect he will), I plan to say something like 'No I am not. My choice to leave this room is a consequence of your choice to drink now. I respect myself now and I have new boundaries and it is up to you what you do for the rest of the evening'. I have no expectations of anything from there from him. However, I do expect that I will either go upstairs and come online here or I will go to the beach and have a nice hot skim chocolate and listen to the waves for a while and then come home and go straight to bed.   

Earlier today he was saying that he is very hurt that I went to a f2f meeting tonight and that I will manipulate everyone there and they will fill my head with rubbish about A. I did not reply because I could see there is just no point. I was strangely comfortable with that, another new feeling. 

After the f2f meeting, I feel a bit more confident about myself. There were a couple of people who I really connected with that seem to have similar histories and are veterans of alanon and clearly very skilled with the 12 steps. Discussing with them after the meeting during open chat, I felt held and acknowledged non-judgementally. It was a strange but nice feeling that I have not experienced before. To be able to talk about A without being criticised. Like the people in MIP, these f2f people actually get it too because they have lived /are living it. They put a lot of effort into helping me grasp the full reality of my powerlessness over active A's driniking.

So the upshot of all this is that tonight, I am feeling rather empowered and I feel confident that I can manage what is coming at me in the next few days. I am focusing on Step 1. I have realised too that I don't have to feel guilty, that I have a right to respect myself and that doing so is not only okay it is what I deserve. I have not focused on myself in so long, it feels kind of weird. The feelings of anxiety and depression are like raincoats, but there is a new feeling emerging of hope, and self-respect and I feel excited that I am doing something that is good for me that will also set a good example for my children in their relationships.  I realised tonight that on my list of who I have harmed would be my beautiful daughters because I did not show them how to set clear and appropriate boundaries. I can certainly start to fix that from today. 

Healing light and rainbows to everyone on the board,

Shosh

Thanx grateful2be for validating my decision to go to my first f2f meeting for myself. Indeed, my ABF thinks that I am delusional hahaha for thinking that an alanon family program can help me stop his drinking. Funny thing is that I replied that I am not going for him and that the whole idea is for me to get free of this disease, respect myself and break the codependency that has been one of the invisibles in our bad dysfunctional relationship that has gone nowhere. 

My first f2f meeting hammered home to me the reality that I am absolutely powerless to make any changes over anything expect my own life choices. Acting on this, I have feel kind of weird and guilty for first saying that I would see him but no drinking, then realising that that is still trying to control his drinking, so now I am seeing him with strategies to work with that are all about not engaging and doing the sance but focused on healing me and helping me to be protected from his verbal abuse. 

I am trying not to worry about what will happen to him by leaving him to deal with his drinking alone. He sounds pretty depressed but I guess that is part of him realising that I am breaking free of this disease and leaving him to it. I feel like I am in a sea of emotions - scared, anxious, sad, worried, excited, proud, confused, determined, hopeful...so I am surfing the wave and focusing on trying to keep thinking about Step 1 and being true to that and trust the god and the program will take care of the rest. 

Thanks for being out there you guys! 

Sharon x

I've been going to f2f meetings and it is really helping me. My A is not liking me detaching but he seems to be accepting my choices, and to my total shock he even went to an AA meeting last night when I went to my alanon f2f meeting. I couldn't believe it. I did not ask him to do this either. I have been closely following to step 1 and focusing on helping myself heal.

Thought I'd share some good news. My A and I are by no means in the clear but I noticed that he had bought some AA books which is a good start for him. I havent mentioned them though. For me, ATM I feel very supported by the fellowship and I have found a really nice f2f group to go to.

Thanks for all the shares and for your input to try to help support me, hugz Shosh

Well said. I find it fascinating how I try to make manipulative nonsense make logical sense. I, too, have heard, "if you want to leave, you can" which is invariably followed up with "if you leave me, you're condemning me." But somehow, it hadn't sunk in how contrary and manipulative that was until reading your posts. "You're free to leave, but I'll die, and it will be your fault, if you do." Wow.

Insanity circus, indeed!

Cyberspace hug received.  I love that you decided to make an amends for your part in another day's drama.  I, too, have lost it from time to time and part of that losing it came from not dealing with something when it happened and dragging a whole lot of stuff into the next day and the next day and the next day.  Continuing to work the program as you have chosen and working my mess out with my sponsor has been such a big help to me in staying in the day, one day at a time.  You're not alone.  As you have read, many of us have "lost it" from time to time.  I find the most challenging thing for me was the desire to be understood and heard that was thwarted repeatedly.  With Al-Anon support and the care of a sponsor, I was able to stop going to the hardware store to buy bread and reach out to folks who were walking the walk.  You are making progress and together with the fellowship, you'll continue to make it.