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Post Info TOPIC: In need of some perspective from "the other side of the fence"


~*Service Worker*~

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In need of some perspective from "the other side of the fence"


Hi Kent Welcome to Miracles in Progress

I do understand your delima and would like to suggest that since your wife grew up in an alcoholic home and can be considered an adult cihld of an alcoholic you would be eligible to attend alanon meetings.

 Here you  will develop new constructive tools that will enable you to respond and not react.  You are worth investing the time and energy.

 I hope you do check out at least 6 meetings to determine if you would benefit and remember when one person in the family changes everyone must change.

Keep coming back and sharing.  You are not alone  



-- Edited by hotrod on Friday 22nd of November 2013 06:18:02 PM

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Betty

THE HIGHEST FORM OF WISDOM IS KINDNESS

Talmud


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I am a recovering alcoholic in AA with 3.5 years of sobriety.  I went to a few al-anon meetings with my then girlfriend (now my wife) prior to getting sober.  My wife had been a devoted member of al-anon for more than ten years, but since the birth of our son almost two years ago she has been to maybe five meetings.  When I met my wife, I was still in active alcoholism, and she was what some people might describe as an al-anon black belt; she went to 4-5 meetings a week, she was involved in service, and she would even go away for weekend retreats and conferences.  Having grown up in an alcoholic family, my wife found the program and fellowship of al-anon to be crucial in her life.  Through a combination of my own difficulties in recovery and dealing with my own character defects and her abandoning her program, our marriage has deteriorated over the last year with rapid deterioration over the last four months.  Things have gotten to the point where she has been emotionally and verbally abusive and threatened me with physical violence.  She then becomes impatient with our son because she is angry with me, and she takes her anger out on him.  She then blames me for preventing her from being a "good" parent.  It is not a healthy scenario.  We have been in couples counseling for over three months with no improvement, and we have planned a separation of three weeks where my wife will go to Florida with our son.  They left this morning, and I have returned to our house after being asked to leave a week ago.  In sharing about this in the fellowship of AA, I have received many suggestions that I attend an al-anon meeting to gain both some perspective and some support.  I attended an al-anon meeting this morning, and I found it to be very helpful.  I shared about my experience, and someone spoke with me for a while after the meeting and shared their own similar experience.  What I am wondering is how do I practice loving detachment here?  I love my wife, and I want our marriage to work, but I am unwilling to continue in a relationship where I am being treated this way.  I have let her know this.  I am very concerned because I believe she is very sick right now and that perhaps she is experiencing some post partum issues and she isn't aware of it.  How do I walk the line of being loving and supportive without telling her that she needs help?



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~*Service Worker*~

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RE: In need of some perspective from


Alanon doesn't advocate advice .. I would suggest some gentle encouragement. How about I take little Joey and you do something just for you? Make that a weekly thing to give her some down time. I'm asking you this question are you willing to let go of the outcome? Is there a specific reason she stopped going to meetings? Whatever you choose to do don't lead with the words hormonal imbalance or post partum depression. It would be like someone telling you before you were ready .. I think your an alcoholic .. most people need space to figure that out on their own. Hasn't the counselor suggested she go back to alanon? I'm just kind of surprised knowing the history this didn't come up during sessions. Best of luck s :)

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Faith minus vulnerability and mystery equals extremism.  If you've got all the answers, then don't call what you do "faith". - Brene Brown

"Whatever truth you own doesn't own you" - Gary John Bishop



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RE: In need of some perspective from "the other side of the fence"


Thanks SRUS.  I am wiling to let go of the outcome.  She stopped going to meetings because I think she felt like a lot of women were smothering her and our son when he was a newborn and offering unsolicited mothering advice (at least that's what she shared with me back then).  Her counselor did immediately suggest she go back to al-anon, and she went back for one meeting and then never returned.  That was over three months ago.  I fear that she isn't getting good advice from her counselor, and she is no longer in contact with most of her al-anon support group.  I know that I can't tell her what I think she needs to do.  She wouldn't listen to me anyway.  I just know what a difference a program has made in her life, and I see how much it is missing.



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~*Service Worker*~

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RE: In need of some perspective from


When my oldest was born I think I made the mistake thinking I had to do everything and that left little to no time for me. I made the same choices with child number two and I did suffer from ppd with him. Little by little I completely lost myself. That was a long time ago and my story is complicate that with a dysfunctional marriage and the mini and major crisis coming from my stbax .. miserable doesn't describe my mindset adequately. My stbax didn't and doesn't pick up any slack in terms of the kids never has. He was a body in the house that was it. I needed a break, emotional support, I was so far out of touch with myself I didn't know what to do with free time. If taking the baby with her to meeting was to much staying home with you is an option.

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Faith minus vulnerability and mystery equals extremism.  If you've got all the answers, then don't call what you do "faith". - Brene Brown

"Whatever truth you own doesn't own you" - Gary John Bishop



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RE: In need of some perspective from "the other side of the fence"


Thanks, Betty.  I did attend an al-anon meeting this morning, and I found it to be both very welcoming and very helpful.  I am planning on attending more meetings, and I hope to gain more perspective on the family part of this disease.



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bud


~*Service Worker*~

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Kent, I can appreciate your wanting things to be better and enjoy a cohesive, harmonious family unit. I'm wondering if the counselor is ineffective or not savvy with the dynamics between you and your wife and/ or if there are other reasons why couple's therapy isn't working.

Have you asked her directly, "What can I do at this very minute to help make things better?" or "What do you need?" For me, the more specifically I can identify a need and ask for help the better things generally go. Parenting, especially being a new parent, has inherent challenges. I remember being highly irritable from lack of sleep... would have done almost anything for a nap.

No one needs to accept abuse- detach- take a time out- remove yourself from an escalating situation... "That isn't nice; let's talk after you cool down so we can find a good solution that will help." And, then follow through when things are more calm.

What does your sponsor suggest for you?





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Thanks, Bud.  I believe couples therapy isn't working because while couples sessions themselves seem to make progress, the cyclical pattern of my wife micromanaging my every move and my (admittedly at times) childish response to her demands have made any real and lasting progress impossible.  In other words, things are one way on the therapist's couch and another way entirely when we return to the house.  I can own that I am at fault for engaging in this pattern and allowing it to escalate, and I am just now learning that I don't need to do that.  Admittedly, it is hard to break a pattern of behavior that has existed for over 25 years, but it's necessary if I want to avoid useless argument.  There are certainly my own underlying issues of codependence and a general inability to stand up for myself and set healthy boundaries.  Again, I am just now learning how to start doing that.  My sponsor suggested going to al-anon to help with some of these issues, and I have also had quite a few people in AA make the same suggestion to me in the last few days. 



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~*Service Worker*~

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smile Hi Kent...

                     ...when I am at a meeting I usually practise 'no cross-talk'. But sometimes here on in there appears to be no time- time to throw a lifebouy, or practise some emotional first aid.

The first aid for this is some something like the serenity prayer... sometimes we do have to put recovery to one side to get on with real life...

          ...family, kids etc etc... ...and if your wife is from an alcoholic home- how much genuine support can she expect at the crucial time in her life?

I am so glad you found a warm welcome at your Alanon meeting... it is a family illness, and we are all in this together.

DavidG.



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Each Alanon member is my teacher.                                                                                                                  

bud


~*Service Worker*~

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Understand. Welcome-you're in the right place! I'm glad you're here. Keep coming back, attend face to face meetings, learn all that you can, and tons of practice, practice, practice. Please be gentle with yourself in the process.

In support

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~*Service Worker*~

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Aloha Kent also glad you found the MIP Family.  Won't try to analyze your wife.  Obviously the consequences are negative for you now and what I learned when I ws going thru that (My wife was Alcoholic/Addict and I'm also an AA fellow) the most simplest instructions worked best for me and then I was able to understand more and see more the lessons got wider.  The short of it is when my wife and I were having personal trauma and sand bagging and sabotaging each other the best rule for me was "Don't React" and I pasted that on the inside of my head.  Reacting made it worse for me because so often I was taking the chaos and crises personal...how could I not just react to everything.  What many of our "situations" needed was quiet.  One of the participants had to stop participating and for me I chose that task because I was like a pit bull when I just thought, right or wrong, I was being attacked.  When I stopped reacting and took on the attitude of "Oh well" smiled and walked off I got myself out of the battle.  I was told I didn't have to attend every fight I was invited to and that works.  As for what's going on with them...I might know and I might not know and I'm still powerless.  She had to go to some one other than I because I was so close to the problem myself.  You're not being trusted right now regardless of how you see yourself.  You're not being trusted and respected and being honest with.  She's hiding stuff from you because ________ fill in the blank with any idea if you like or just let it go.  You've got you and a child that are not treating you badly.  Two out of three odds isn't all that bad.  Nother thing I learned to do was not ask my alcoholic/addict questions in detachment...If I'm powerless I don't have answers.  "Call your sponsor use to be a better response for me".   Do keep coming back often.   (((hugs))) smile



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~*Service Worker*~

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Hi Kent, congratulations on 3.5 years sober. I'm sorry you are having a tough time of it and I think that you are very right to recognise that it is not ok to live with verbal and emotional abuse. It is great that the alanon meeting worked out for you and I'm sure that they have more to offer you as well.

I'm afraid to admit it but I have probably behaved a little like your wife and in many strange ways I find it more difficult when AH is not drinking. Don't get me wrong, I'm proud and thrilled when he is sober, but I've grown too used to chaos and am having to learn new ways of being. I think that the little vulnerable child in me thinks 'things are calm and perfect? Really? OK, lets test these waters and see what happens Ha! Tsunami! Told you, nothing changes blah blah!!!'

I know it is stupid. And it must seem terribly unfair. But all I can say is that there are a lot of pent up feelings and perhaps, just perhaps, your wife's behaviour is not about you? She might still have some learning to do, but as you know from your own experiences that is totally 100% up to her. (Oh, one other thing - is she giving herself treats from time to time? Looking after a child is, as you know, quite demanding and folks like us are sometimes apt to give 110% and then wonder why we are feeling irritable! Its not rocket science, but giving ourselves a rest from time to time is really really good )

When I'm acting out, and that is really all it is, what I really want is for husband to tell me 'its going to be ok'. And of course this doesn't happen because I'm describing a disaster and all he wants to do is fix it! It might be different for your wife of course.

I have also been on the receiving end of abuse. It is undermining and it hurts even though the words are not true. I found that I started to cope better when I realised that it was my job to protect my self esteem - it was my most precious possession and I was going to nurture it come what may. From that realisation onwards I was somehow able to calmly face AH when he was having a rant. Again, the best response I've had when under siege is when I've said, (with a smile) 'Would you like a hug?' If that doesn't work then I just walk away.

Oh, by the way, I probably having post partum issues as well as hormonal ones - but I'm still a woman so it is quite possible that I would commit bodily harm if AH mentioned it. Just saying !!!! If AH is loving and supportive I might find the space and confidence to go get help for myself. We are not so different really!



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Hi :)

I know what you're going through... I am an adult child of an alcoholic - an alcoholic - and I live with an adult child of alcoholic. WOW that's a mouthful. All that ACOA issue stuff creates a LOT of codependent behaviors! It is so much that most of the time I introduce myself as "Hi I'm Natasha - recovering". But anyway - labels are just words, and the one you're looking for here is codependent - which you described above accurately. Getting your hands on some melody beattie books and meditations will be like drinking water when you're dying of thirst I bet ;)

There are CODA meetings too - and there is a board here, but it isn't active really :( I LOVE my one and only CODA meeting in town, but I must admit it was VERY different - at least here. It took a little bit of time for it to grow on me.

I can't possibly go to ALL the meetings which I qualify for, so I make sure to have pertinent daily readers around... my all time fav. is language of letting go. Hope for today and courage to change are a MUST in my life every day too :) All these recovery programs fit together like a glove. Same 12 steps - all geared toward healing the wounded soul. Same open mindedness is required. Good luck on your journey :)

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Thanks, Tasha and Milkwood.  Your two responses (and those from other folks as well) have given me some great comfort.  In the last few days, I have been consistently reminded that the more I share my experiences with others in recovery the calmer and stronger it makes me feel.  My HP gave me a loving tap on the shoulder as I sat in my fourth meeting of the day yesterday when I received a text from an anonymous friend who was praying for me and thinking of me.  I would not have received that text had I not shared openly about my experiences.  I say this too because I so appreciate the honesty of the people on this board; the fact that many of you have gone through similar experiences with grace and serenity is both comforting and uplifting.  Milkwood, what you shared about your AH needing to 'fix' things when you're having a difficult time really resonated with me.  That is exactly the behavior I exhibit with my wife, and she gets upset that I 'don't understand her', and I end up feeling useless because she doesn't understand my desire to help.  It's a vicious cycle, and I'm beginning to understand that I can get off that merry-go-round any time I want to. 



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