I get it, Buford. At 40, it sounds as if you want a person who doesn't party at dances until 4:00 a.m.? To her credit, she told you the truth about her plans for the night. Is this really the deal breaker or have there been other things prior to this that have bothered you? I read that you've been reading the boards, but didn't post until now. As the former wife of a man with this disease, I have to say I wouldn't go through it again with anybody. Yet, there are others who have stayed with their loved ones.

I do see a possible knee jerk reaction on your part to her going to something you think isn't in her best interest. I've learned that when I react rather than respond, I end up having to repeat things that I could have avoided if I waited until I was deeply certain of what the next right step would be for me in relationship to an SO. 

So, maybe you could attend some meetings before you act on breaking up with her? The meetings (we suggest at least attending six before deciding it is for you or not) may help you see the way to break it off with her that feels right and peaceful for you to do? If that's what you still want to do at the end of your six try sessions?

-- Edited by grateful2be on Wednesday 20th of November 2013 11:42:52 PM

Thank you for the replies. This is my thought exactly. However, she thinks this is actually a step forward in her recovery--to be able to go to such a party and not do drugs or drink. To me, it's a giant step back into that lifestyle, and it tells me that she doesn't have a firm grasp on step one. 

I am not married to this woman, nor do we have a lengthy history. I fell in love with her before I realized the addiction. She has been clean and sober for the bulk of our relationship. I see this party as a huge part of her denial during what she already knows is a difficult season. 

I've been lurking in this forum for a long time, but I never felt the need to post. I am truly unsure of what to do. I love her. It's one thing to be in a relationship with a recovering addict. It's something completely different to be in a relationship with a recovering addict who chooses to be in the drug scene. 

She may stay clean and sober for one party or one hundred parties. But I know without a doubt that relapse is coming, and I can't handle the stress of worrying which night it will happen. 

I hoped that others in this forum would have some insight into how to handle this. 

It's going to be whatever it's meant to be for her. I started going back to bars and clubs sometimes at 2 years sober or so. It was not good or bad for me.

I haven't attended face to face meetings, but I have thought about it. I only know this: I don't want to be in a relationship with someone who goes to raves. Btw, we are 40. We are not in college anymore! She also is a recovering alcoholic, so I would have the same angst if she were suddenly going to a bar on a Saturday night. This addiction stuff is new to me since her. I love her, and I realize that she is going to make her own decisions. I have to make my decisions, as well, and decide if this rave is a deal breaker. Unfortunately, I think it is. :(

Recovering alcoholic/addict going to a rave ... I think you must be right to be concerned.  Now as to whether she'll relapse at the rave (or elsewhere), no one has a crystal ball here, so who knows.  However, you have to live in a relationship that you're okay with.  My ex-AH would say things like, "So maybe I'll drink again [I knew he would], why bother thinking about it?"  The reason I bothered thinking about it is because if he was going to go off the deep end, I couldn't live like that.  It wasn't "all the same to me" whether he drank and passed out or not.  I couldn't live with that kind of behavior, plus I couldn't live with waiting for the shoe to drop.  In a normal relationship, neither partner has to spend time trying to suppress the thought, "Is this the day that things descend into addiction and chaos?"  I knew, finally, that I needed to be with someone for whom that was not a strong danger.

It sounds as if you know where you are on that spectrum.  Some people stay and that's a good choice; some people leave and that's a good choice.  What is probably the most painful choice is not having the tools to leave and trying to leave and then going back on it, or trying to leave but being too addicted and obsessed and then going back on it, or anything that gets you see-sawing between leaving and staying, and makes the whole thing even more chaotic.  You can guess that I've Been There, Done That.  However, I do think that the ability to leave someone we love but know we can't be happy with is a crucial ability.  That frees us to find someone who's healthier for us.  It's also something that Al-Anoners tend to have had trouble with in the past.  You'll probably know from your past experiences whether you've had trouble separating from people who are unhealthy for you.

One thing to remember is that if her addictions are a problem -- either a problem because she relapses or a problem because she takes risks that leave you very anxious -- it won't get any better unless she works harder at her recovery.  If her actions stay the same, the dynamic will stay the same.  I always fooled myself that things were going to change.  They didn't change.  I should have known by my A's actions that they wouldn't. 

Take good care of yourself.

You have had some great responses.  To thine own self be true is a phrase I say often, as I need the reminder.  It sounds like you have made the right choice for you...ending a relationship is hard.  Bringing the issue to this group was wise, and, you may need more time to chew on the responses, your feelings, motivations, etc until you are clear.  And you may be there now...what works for me is to say "this (whatever the "this" is) does not work for me any longer"...you can add what you like.  The saying "Say what you mean, mean what you say and don't say it mean" is a good guideline.  I wish you the best....

These responses have really helped me and made me think very hard about what I want. I see now that it was in fact a knee jerk reaction. I trust her and I believe that she is fully committed to her recovery. She says she wants to go so that she will know once and for all if she likes it without drugs or alcohol. If she doesn't, then she can tell her friends that she tried it, but didn't like it. We talked a lot via Skype about my feelings and fears, as well as her plan to handle the possible scenarios. Obviously, I hope that she will hate it and won't go again. But I have no way to know tha, nor is it something that I can control. The most important thing, I think, at this point is for me to continue to have an open and honest dialogue with her about all of this. And at some point, after a lot of reflection and communication, I have to decid if this is really a deal breaker. To answer a previous question, my trust in her has been restored for a long time. She has been honest with me and I believe her. We Skype nearly every day and stay in constant contact. There have not been other issues like this. She has had some social outings obviously, but none centered on partying as this one will be. I just don't understand why anyone in her situation would go to such a party. Thank you for your responses. This is such a great forum. You are all such wonderful people.

Buford

I am glad that you havee received such positve responses and feel comfortable sharing  i simply wanted to point out that going to or not going to  the Rave  does not really  prove anything.

Addiction is a progressive fatal disease that can be arrested but never cured.   Many seek recovery and   With the help of   NA/AA  they succeed one day at a time.  

Seeking support for yourself in alanon and on this Board is the first Step in learning new ways of responding without reacting.  

Keep coming back

Thank you all for your welcomes and kind words.

My reaction was to break up. What are some examples of possible responses?

I don't mean to be discouraging, but I wanted to share some things in my experience.  I thought that if the A and I had agreed to be open books, we'd be fine and I'd know what I was dealing with.  But the thing about A's is that lying and secrecy are part of the syndrome.  And they are in denial to themselves, on top of that.  They can be partaking and getting drunk/stoned and passing out, yet to hear them talk, everything is fine, they know their limits, it's all under control, and -- maybe the worst for me -- they wondered what was wrong with me where I was so over-sensitive and suspicious -- couldn't I just trust them?  I'd say, "Just tell me if you feel the urge to drink, it's okay, I won't judge.  If you've relapsed, just let me know, it's okay.  We're in this together, we'll get through it."  "Absolutely," my A would say, "I know you're on my side.  I would tell you if it ever came to that.  I'm confident that things are under control, but if I felt at risk, I'd let you know."  Well, the disease is very clever.  Not once, in more than 15 years of insane (but secret) drinking, did my A ever admit to a specific act of drinking.  The most he would say was, "Well, maybe I drank to excess a few times in the past, but that's over now."  When I eventually discovered the DUI's, the hidden stashes of empties, the hidden stashes of fulls, the trail of lost jobs, the unexplained absences, the slurring ... all that told a different story.  But not once did he do what he promised and come clean with me.  It was all a lie to keep the insanity going.  This is absolutely typical of the syndrome.

So ... someone who is not drinking/drugging will say, "No, I'm not doing any of that, don't worry."  Someone who is drinking/drugging will say, "No, I'm not doing any of that, don't worry."  In short, you can't tell what's happening by what they say.

I worry that since you don't live in the same place or together, you won't know what's going on behind the scenes.  My A and I never moved in before we married.  He said he was against in on moral grounds.  What I found out -- very late in the course of things! -- was that he could appear sober and fine in the many times we talked or were together.  But it was not something that went on 24/7.  When I wasn't around, things were very different.  It was astonishing what a good front he put on.

I worry that this could be the case, or develop, and you wouldn't have a way of knowing.  The way most of us have of knowing is either that our partner has never had an addictive problem, or they are working a program of recovery hard and visibly.  In your girlfriend's case neither of these things is true.

If I had to do it all over again, would I do it?  Not on your life. 

To be clear: there is no question that she is working her program hard and visibly. We Skype after meetings and talk about her experiences.

Thank you so much. I agree. She says that some of the people in NA have also gone to such parties and stayed clean and sober. She said that it should be ok as long as she is honest with herself about how she is feeling there and is willing to leave immediately when she doesn't feel right or if she begins to have cravings. She thinks she will likely stay until 12-2 am--or whenever she doesn't feel right.

I am still very firm in my belief that this is a foolish and risky idea, but I have to accept that it is her recovery and she needs to find out for herself. It's very hard to watch someone I love make what I truly believe is a very risky choice.

It's a surprise to me, because this past summer she talked about going to such a party. I told her why I thought it was a bad idea, and she changed her mind immediately. Something has changed since then. She now wants to experience it for herself. That, coupled with the drinking dreams and the stress of the holiday season, is a huge red flag to me. But it's her recovery. I just have to find something to keep me very busy on that day.

Buford: I, too, was drawn to an alcoholic - many, in fact. I married only one. I didn't know it at the time. My parents weren't drinkers, but after my own recovery process in Al-Anon, I saw that both my parents were adult children of alcoholics and that there had been many hidden deaths in both sides of my family of people who died in their 20s of alcoholism.

I also learned that my own codependency started at a very early age. It felt normal to me because my family and friends were similar. If I think back to my childhood friends, most all of them had at least one parent who drank. My maternal grandmother and great grandmother drank, too, but our idea of an alcoholic was somebody without willpower who lived on skid row. Truth is that people living on skid row are at the tail end of the disease.

The point I'm trying to make is this: it isn't an accident that you fell in love with somebody who needed recovery. There are some people who can enter a room with 50 people - 2 of them alcoholics or addicts - and go straight to the other 48 in the room to strike up a conversation and maybe begin a healthy friendship with 1 or 2 of the 48 in the room who aren't alcoholics. Codependents can enter the same room, bypass the other 48 and go straight to the 1 or 2 who are alcoholics or addicts and be totally unaware that they are drawn to them.

As you can see, there are several of us encouraging you to go to Al-Anon meetings. It's because we recognize some of the red flags that are apparent in your sharing. Alcoholism and drug addiction are both cunning, baffling and powerful diseases. All of us have learned that without Al-Anon, we are setting ourselves up for trouble in many cases and we are totally unaware of it at the time.

Whatever you choose to do is up to you. I do hope you take our suggestions for at least 6 Al-Anon meetings seriously. It could make all the difference in the world to you.

Thank you so much for all of the replies and concern. As I stated before, this is my first relationship with an addict. I had no idea that she was an addict when I started the relationship, and I have no intention of continuing the relationship should she return to drinking or using. I discovered that she was an addict when she told me that she started rehab six months into the relationship. Now that I know, I am comfortable having a relationship with a recovered addict. If she stops recovery, I'm gone. I am not codependent and have had several longterm relationships with normal people. Typically, my SOs are barely social drinkers and definitely none of them did drugs. This relationship is unlike any other. It is not a part of a pattern. Again, thank you everyone for your support.