Where is the elusive bottom? - Al-Anon Family Group

laurab · Senior Member

Where is the elusive bottom?

grateful2be · ~*Service Worker*~

If you are waiting for the bottom in hopes that he'll change - that change may never come. I had to remove myself from my son's and his father's behaviors in order to completely detach from the machinations of a disease over which I had no power or control. I did not want to live with either one of them if I had to live with the sabotage, abuse, manipulations and theft of a peaceful home for me those behaviors created. My husband did not want to stop using. My son does not want to stop using. That left me in the driver's seat for my own life. Did I want my home to be a place of comfort and rest or did I want my home to be a place of chaos, pain and unrest. Hard as it was - I've chosen twice in favor of me and the type of home I want and need to be happy and free of behaviors that threaten my well-being - no matter the cause.

My ex husband is dead. My son continues to put himself in harm's way although he has had lots of help and lots of hands reaching out to him and AA, too. I love him enough to let him choose what he wants. I also love myself enough to be honest with myself. I simply can't live that way.

I had to hit my own bottom in relationship to both of my loved ones. I tried to pray my way, counsel my way, Al-Anon and Coda my way out of my limits, but my limits are my limits. I had to accept them if I didn't want to end up beaten to death or insane.

Lots of encouragement as you focus on your recovery and the next right action to take for you.

-- Edited by grateful2be on Sunday 21st of July 2013 10:12:47 AM

grateful2be · ~*Service Worker*~

Been there! Got it! Everything is my fault, too. Goshhhhhh! If I only had as much power as Mother as I'm told that I have, we would all be enjoying prosperity, world peace and heaven by now.

My Mom was not an enabler or codependent in any way. She had her own issues, but codependency - not one of them. Mom had 10 kids, worked from morning to night taking care of all of us, cooking from scratch, multiple loads of laundry per day, on and on her list of chores grew. Multiple trips to ER with rambunctious sons and listening to us girls stories of pain over yet another boyfriend or girlfriend falling out. She sewed and knitted our clothes, did the gardening, taught us how to care for ourselves, others, and to work.

When I got to a certain age, I began to list my grievances for her to her as she was painting one of the rooms in our house (she was also an interior decorator and watercolor artist). She listened. Then she turned and looked at me and said "I let you live, didn't I?"

Nope - my Mom wasn't co-dependent in any way. I've learned what she meant.

-- Edited by grateful2be on Sunday 21st of July 2013 01:01:03 PM

-- Edited by grateful2be on Sunday 21st of July 2013 01:02:10 PM

Cathyinaz · ~*Service Worker*~

(((( laurab ))))

I'm so sorry this is happening again. When the A has the support of enabling they don't need to stop....they have mom that will take care of them so they can continue their drugging and drinking.
I didn't change
After almost 5 years I have learned this. My son will be out on the streets trying to find a place to sleep at night but that's the way it has to be. My changing is the only way now. He will know the consequences of his drinking. He has made his choices without anyone but himself to blame.

As I was told recently the A will survive. That they know how to do well. Mom doesn't need to step in anymore.

My son has no where to go.....zero friends....zero money......but that is his choice. I pray he feels the real pain of his choices.....good or bad.

Let go Let God.....take care of you now so you can have the courage to change.

I will have fear and worry but this is what I need to do to help my son........what I was doing was just killing him slowly.....not helping.

(((( hugs ))))

PS: No more one last change.......no more.....I'm done.

likemyheart · ~*Service Worker*~

The only bottom you know when it hits is your own. When faced with the decision to let "him" back in my life again, step back on the insani-go-round or not, I chose NOT because I had hit that bottom, end of the line, I will fight no more forever point of no return.

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

Yup .. with what everyone else shared .. everyone's bottom is different and what a bottom means to me is where the emotional pain outweighs the emotional gain .. at that point someone gets sick and tired of being sick and tired. It really comes back to ME .. where is my sick and tired of being sick and tired. How do I take care of me while the insanity of addition swirls.

BTW .. as a reminder this is not a one shot deal in terms of sobriety .. just because someone gets into sobriety doesn't mean they are no longer an addict .. once an addict always an addict it just becomes are they active or not. You never hear someone say at an AA meeting .. my name is .. and I used to be an alcoholic. It's always .. my name is .. I'm an alcoholic (sometimes it's a grateful alcoholic, a recovering alcoholic, .. it's never I used to be an alcoholic).

Something my STBAX's mother said to me and I knew there was trouble was .. well he went to rehab there shouldn't be anymore issue. I was like umm .. ookkkk if you say so. She's also an alcoholic and active .. soooo .. that kind of tells you where she is at in her own mind.

Hugs P :)

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

Laura, I had a similar dynamic with my mom but not quite as toxic. It is "a hostile dependency" and this means he is dependent on you but also hates that and resents you for it. For every bit he needs you and can't function without you, it's a reminder of what a screw up he's become. It exacerbates his self hate and he displaces it on you. I also geared more of my crap to my mom and not dad. That was because mom was more invested and I guess more involved in my issues even though none of it was her fault. My dad is kinda meek in demeanor and mom is a strong personality. She is more controlling so it was my copout to blame her for things cuz dad was too innocent it seemed. I don't know when or if his bottom will hit. I suspect you will have to just let go of wanting that answer. Maddening I know...prayers for you and him and the rest of the family.

laurab · Senior Member

Thank you all for the support. I need courage. When I called 911 on Friday to get him to the ER, 5 cars came up the driveway with a tasor. Luckily, one of the troopers knew DS from school and it was easy to cuff him. They took the cuffs off as soon as he got in the car. Seeing him stagger out of the house in cuffs was one of the worse moments ever. And of course he was yelling curses at me.

I am to blame for everything and sometimes it is so stupid that it is funny. ASon couldn't find matching black socks this morning. It was clearly my fault because the washing machine did something to hide his sock and since it is my washing machine, it's my fault.

neshema2 · ~*Service Worker*~

laurab wrote:
I don't know if he is back on Lithium. I can't control his meds. He left this morning to do a trade show with DH. DH was calm and they drove out. The plan is if he is nasty or drinks, DH will call 911 and that's it. We will not participate anymore. That is the plan when and if he returns in 2 weeks.

This sounds like a good plan....No more fighting it....When I quit fightin it and just letting them to their own devices I found mypeace...serenity, and my self respect....MAYBE when life keeps slamming them down over THEIR bad choices , they *may* learn??? who knows....I just know I can only take care of me....I am not in control over another...I have to let go ....let the chips fall where they may............

So sorry U are dealing with this again, but we can STOP having to *deal* but just dropping them to their own devices......I like the call 911 when he is nasty for drinks...enough of that, he could be ordered to serve a bit of time in jail, depending on state, but where my A bro. lives in Calif. they dn't mess w/drunks or druggies.....they get put in jail for a while, the police have zero patience for these people......here in TX , too, they haul your butt off if you get 911'd enough by family.....Glad U R not participating anymore......

neshema2 · ~*Service Worker*~

Cathyinaz wrote:
As I was told recently the A will survive. That they know how to do well. Mom doesn't need to step in anymore.

My son has no where to go.....zero friends....zero money......but that is his choice. I pray he feels the real pain of his choices.....good or bad.

Let go Let God.....take care of you now so you can have the courage to change.

I will have fear and worry but this is what I need to do to help my son........what I was doing was just killing him slowly.....not helping.

(((( hugs ))))

PS: No more one last change.......no more.....I'm done.

((((Cathy)))))) I think about you and this sad dilemma a lot.....U R sooo strong...If any son has any hope of hitting bottom, learning, and dragging himself into recovery it is yours....Thanks to your strength, courage, and tough love.......sending you support (((HUGS)))

Breakingfree · ~*Service Worker*~

I love the ESH here and Congatulations to you! I reached my bottom with my exAH before he reached his, which he still hasn't reached and we have been divorced 2 years. I will not feel scared in my own home and I will not put up with any form of abuse verbal, physical or emotional ever again. I know I come from it and married it, but now I have al-anon tools and I know better. It is so hard to love someone so much more than they love themselves, but our job is to love ourselves enough to take the best care of us. I am all about filling up my reserve tank and only then does the energy go into my overflow tank to be given and I am not left exhausted. I am sorry you are going through this. I wear the serenity prayer on a stainless steel ring on my wedding ring finger to remind myself how important it is to my life. Sending you love and support!

-- Edited by Breakingfree on Sunday 21st of July 2013 10:11:28 PM

Jerry F · ~*Service Worker*~

(((Laura))) remember that what you hear here, who you see here if you're not in a meeting is about the insanity. A drugged/drunk person, mind, body, spirit and emotions isn't in reality...they are wholely into the insanity the alternedness so don't take it personal...it isn't true and isn't real; its drunk. The disease will always come hardest and the people who love because the people who love allow it...as the others have mentioned...you decide where your bottom is.

For me I decided and marked my bottom mentally, emotionally, physcially and spiritually with two words. I said them and then acted them out and I continue to act them out 35 years later. "I'm done". When I said those words and was honest about them to myself my alcoholic/addict saw the change, the relaxation in my body, right away. My body was saying what my mouth had been saying for a long time of which I wasn't acting on. When I was "done" she could see the fight was gone from me and she was allowed the full dignity of her choices.

Your bottom is when YOU quit and just before HP takes over and you don't pull him back from HP's hands. Practice, Practice, Practice. Let him go...don't pull him back. Tell your HP you're sorry for being so confusing and taking back what you intend on letting go of completely.

Standing with you...In service and support. (((((hugs))))) smile

oldergal · Senior Member

Dear Laurab, I am a compassionate person, and I have had many trials with my ASon. And I do understand some of what you are going through. We love our sons and daughters so much. But as peaceful, gentle people we must standup for ourselves more than others who will usually not take the treatment that the alcoholic/user puts out. I am here to tell you, never mind his hitting his bottom. Where is your bottom? You would never let a friend, acquaintance, or co-worker, or neighbor treat you like he has. If someone called me a F***Bit**.... in my own house for trying to help them, I would call that MY BOTTOM Line. ...... Go to meetings and read Alanon literature...come to this website and learn that no human being let a lone a mother should be treated as he has treated you. In support Oldergal

laurab · Senior Member

This is so marvelous! I'm looking for ASon's reaching the bottom, but now I know it's about me reaching the bottom. I need to stop. I have let him run me, from supporting him financially, to driving him around, to staying home because I am always scared and watching, to missing work where I am paid by the hour, never seeing my friends of family, letting my garden go, and on and on. I am terrified of letting go and so afraid for him and miserable in my current life. It's time.
thank you all

grateful2be · ~*Service Worker*~

Laurab!!!!!!!! Congratulations! You're on your way to being you again! Keep us posted on your progress. It helps us keep going in health, too.

Cathyinaz · ~*Service Worker*~

Good Start

Let go and let them feel scared and the fear they need to realize what their doing. You being scared for them does nothing for both of you.

Letting go just takes time....one step at a time.

Say the serenity prayer over and over until you understand what it really mean.

(((( hugs ))))

likemyheart · ~*Service Worker*~

Absolutely Laura, it is YOUR bottom you are looking for, do you see it yet?

PP · ~*Service Worker*~

We are here for you. I am in support of all that has been said and I see recovery working in you already! There is much support here and within al anon meetings.

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.