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Again, I am questioning myself, am I being unreasonable, or is it that I am letting him manipulate me again? My husband says he is not an alcoholic if he drinks four to six beers a night. I say he is because he is only happy when he is drinking. I also tell him that the reason he won't eat dinner until later is because it will mess up his buzz. He doesn't deny it when I say that, he only perceives me as being a nag. He justifies drinking as being good for a lot of things. He said the other night that beer is the reason he rarely gets a cold. He says when he stops at the corner store after work for his beer there are always guys getting beer. I tell him I am not in love with the other guys. Sometimes, usually without warning, he will drink much more and gets really happy, yet can get confrontational if I challenge him on how much he is drinking. Why can't I keep my mouth shut? I should know by now that I cannot control him. I have read many posts on this forum and I know that nothing I can say will change him. But, I guess I am questioning if I really have it that bad since a lot of people talk about their A loved ones passing out. My AH has only passed out maybe four times in the eight years we have been together. I get so sad because he doesn't really seem happy with me, only his beer. Yet, he says he loves me. This post may not make much sense. I needed to vent this morning. Thank you!
Sounds like my story, and, yes, my hubbie is an alcoholic. You are 100% accurate in your thoughts/feelings; trust yourself. Find some local al anon meetings, participate in the meetings here online and get some support from us through your posts. We will help to guide you. I hope this helps..hugs
Welcome to Our Family :) And YES... KEEP COMING BACK!
I Can Very Much Relate to Were you are Currently when I First Got here My Mouth was my BIGGEST Enemy, it wasn't my alcoholics it was Me! It Truly does take Practice just like anything else! A Friend of Mine always said to me, that When I Feel the Need to Open My Mouth, "Instead Vote with my Feet, and Leave the Room!" And it took me a VERY Long time to Really put it into action, but boy has it changed my life, and the lives of my A's...
I know longer Question thier Motives, but I always Question mine, I Learned once I started to work the steps that I was just as Sick as them because i had Issues I Could not face about myself, and Why I tried to Rely on them so much for my own inner Peace! When I Got Serious about making my life Better, and Working my Program & Going to Meetings, and Sharing Here! The Healing Began... I Still have moments of "Slips" we all do! Its what we learn from them and how we chose the next time that important to me!
You ARE in the Right Place, and if you Keep Coming back, Slowly but Surely the Healing will start! And if You have Face to face meetings in your Area... Check them out! You will be AMAZED at how many people are strugglin with the Very Same Questions, Very Same Picture, Very Same Emotions... You are NOT Alone AT ALL!
And Regardless of wether or not your Husband is Labeled an Alcoholic or not! Your Happiness, and Well Being should be Important, and in Al-Anon you will learn to allow yourself the Happiness You Deserve :)
I think your post makes a ton of sense (or if not sense, then familiarity), with the majority of us... You have an alcoholic saying that he does NOT have a problem, and that any problems are in your head and/or others.....
My wise old sponsor used to ask me: "why do we keep thinking sick and irrational people will behave in healthy and rational ways?"
I always am reminded of the funny saying that "normal is a setting on a washing machine", but I don't think it is "normal" for people to drink 4-6 beers a day (every day), and would guesstimate that it is much more than that.....
The reality is - whether or not he is an alcoholic is less relevant than the fact that his drinking DOES and IS affecting you.
He will either drink (or admit he is an alcoholic), or he won't... what are YOU gonna do?
Choosing recovery - for you - is one of the best gifts you can give to yourself
T
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"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"
"What you think of me is none of my business"
"If you knew the answer to what you are worrying about, would it REALLY change anything?"
I've been where you are, over the years questioning how many beers is too many, counting how many beers he had at the game, watching, obsessing over it all. Is he an alcoholic, isn't he? It really doesn't matter what label I put on it. He said he wasn't, I thought differently. And over the years, it has progressed from a few beers, to a few too many beers, to 8 shots of vodka and three beers in just a couple of hours, to police involvement, many visits to the ER, court dates, and on and on. Alcoholism is a progressive disease and I have witnessed the progression and it is ugly and terrifying. I encourage you to go to a an Alanon meeting, read this board, read the literature, and really really focus on your own well being.
Jozie - thank you for the "shut my mouth, vote with my feet" suggestion. That is one I need to remember every day. I believe my life would be in such a better state today if I had followed that suggestion in the past, but I can only go forward, and will do better today and tomorrow.
Thanks to all for your words of encouragement and support! It really does mean so much to me to have you to talk to. I have been to one al anon meeting and it was good. I plan to continue going once a week. I have a question....if I don't ever say anything to him about his drinking, isn't that like saying to him that I will condone it and live with it? I know he will drink until he is ready to stop anyway, but I guess I am trying to understand it all and it seems that if I just go my merry way and try to "put on a happy face" with him it is saying to him "okay, I accept it now".
I can so relate to the comment about it seeming like hes more happy drinking beer than with you...oh, you are so not alne. Ive been at this for 10+yrs ... No matter how hard I work onn me, it hurts to accept that sadly, we the spouses, are often second to the beer.the other part of your post that spoke to me was about the feeling you get when you stay quiet...it feels like your accepting it...i can tell you what ive learned and have to remind myself sometimes hourly, I do accept hes got a problem with alcohol. I do accept thast I have a problem with his prob with alcohol...and I further accept thst I cant do anything for him...only for me. Not an easy road, I know. Keep.pisting..we all get it here
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When all else fails...there is Faith, Hope and Prayer.
Pick up the book " Getting them Sober" by Toby Rice Drew.
What good does it do to let them know you are not happy with his drinking all the time. You have told him this many times I'm sure. I found that actions on my part are much better than words. I have learn to practice "Detachment with Love" and setting boundaries that will let my A know he is not getting away with anything. My boundaries work so so much better than my yelling, begging, pleading and crying. What I used to do just made ME crazy. I was just as sick as my A is. Gave him a great excuse to continue drinking.
When they know your boundaries they will know you are not please with their actions.
((( hugs )))
Take what you like and leave the rest :)
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Lord, put your arm around my shoulder and your hand over my mouth
Speak only when you feel that your words are better than your silence.
Aloha Cheri S and welcome to the board. I had to burst out laughing as some of the rational he uses to justify his drinking and drinking style. I believe I have also used the medicinal postitives of alcohol including that it supresses colds and viruses. I did that also with cigarettes and cigars. One of my thinking paths was "what in hell could survive all the intoxicating (poisoning) chemicals I was drinking? My wife couldn't and she wasn't even touching me. LOL All alcoholics pre-surrender and hitting their bottoms are in denial...some keep up the denial right up until their death. Alcoholism is a fatal disease. If not arrested by total abstinence the alcoholic progresses into insanity and death. You do read alot about the insanity at MIP...glad you are here. Like Tom C says I learned how not to listen to the irrational stuff that came out of the mind and mouth of my alcoholic/addict wife. It was crazy and I was crazy when I was participating in the disease and there were lots of witnesses around to remind me.
Also Alcoholics are not dumb. They can see and read the signs better than a sober person and they talk to themselves about how negatively and bad the alcohol treats them. We all know and often times we talk about it amongst ourselves. I know I did. I've had other alcoholics and plain old drinkers in the past talk about how I drank way to much and that I was hurting myself. I always looked for justifications no one else came up with...gets rid of colds LOL!!
It was an elder sponsor I had that got me out of the denial and fear of calling my wife an alcoholic and an addict. He got me away from the poor justifications I used while all the time I was complaining about how bad I felt. He gave me this simple anology..."If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...chances are IT'S A DUCK!!" That is what helped me stop second guessing and justiifying and I grew in recovery after that. She eventually went into a large rehab and then into AA after we parted and HP used her as a metaphor for me for humility. Thank you God.
I think you're already made up your mind about it and may have the fear that if you called the duck a duck you're whole world will explode...and that is what fear is however you do it for you and not for him. You get to have your own perceptions and realities and you get to speak them and walk into the room called reality. Next meeting look for a woman with time and recovery smarts and ask that lady for help. In support. Keep coming back. (((((Hugs)))))
I like Jerry's analogy about the duck. Honestly, when my AH starts denying his problem, lying about when and how much he's been drinking, or lying about other stuff, oh or blaming me for everything and turning conversations around so that we don't look at him; I call it 'quacking'. There he goes again, quacking about how the other person has a problem, it wasn't his drunk behavior that offended them, no, it must be that this other person has some severe problems in their lives and they have to lash out at AH.
You get the picture, right?
It doesn't matter whether you call him an alcoholic or alcohol dependent or a duck. If you have a problem with his drinking, then there is most likely a problem. I recently went to pastoral counseling at our church. The pastor classified my AH as an alcoholic by just saying this: he's gotten a DUI, he didn't quit. He has had trouble at work, he didn't quit. His wife and son are negatively affected by his drinking, he hasn't quit. That pretty much classifies him as an alcoholic. But, I said(trying to play devil's advocate), he doesn't drink every day as he is a binge drinker. The pastor winked at me and in a gentle way told me that I knew the truth, even if I was afraid to put a label on it.
My AH is traveling down a dangerous path and I have to decide if I want to stay on that path with him or jump off before it gets worse. He's 46 years old, we've been married for almost 18 years, and all of a sudden I'm his enemy because I want him to quit drinking. I don't try to control him, but I have made it clear that we can't begin to rebuild after all the lies and projection and blaming until he gets truly sober. Until then, our marriage(if it survives) will be in a holding pattern.
I'm sorry you are going through this. Al Anon really was my saving grace. Keep coming back!
