The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
On this one I give carte blanch to give advice. No worries, I sift through it all. I find that outside views give me things to think about that I might not otherwise.
My friend that I've been dating a few months, and who for the basis of giving a short background is a military vet with PTSD, got sober 3 years ago, had two 1 day relapses in the past 6 months and on the second one checked back into inpatient. His biggest issues are handling the pain of PTSD with drinking and his relapses came after failed medication changes and over extending himself by taking the equivelent of about 30 units of college (he has since dropped out and decided health is better).
He can leave for short periods if accompanied by someone the program trusts. They trust me. He's in a safe place and not drinking and I was thinking of having him over for dinner to meet my kids. It would be presented maturely - no displays of affection, just a chance to meet. My kids are 5 years into divorce, and know I date and have only met one other guy in 5 years. I don't drag men into their lives, he won't be taking up "my time" with my kids, I share my kid free time with him.
This would be probably 3-4 hours, just hanging out at the house, talking and having dinner and then I'd take him back. My kids are 8, 13, and 15.
Ok so your thoughts please. This isn't an enabling thing for me, I'm not extending myself, it's going to be low key, low stress. However I'm aware that this "meeting" can occur at any point in time. This weekend I just didn't have any big plans so it seemed to work out. The good news is if I get compelling thoughts myself that it's bad timing, I will easily be honest with him and he will understand so that's not even a consideration for me as far as worrying what he might think if I change my mind.
What I'm hearing is that this is a new relationship, and that in the last six months this person, nice as he is, has had two relapses. So his recovery is not very strong yet -- no one's could be with less than six months' sobriety under his belt this time around -- and less than three years since his first foray into recovery.
My problem has always been jumping into relationships and looking around afterwards. I asked myself "How nice is this person?" (Unfortunately, most people are nice in the first 6-9 months of a relationship -- though some remained nice for the duration.) And "How much does he like me?" And "How do I feel?" (I felt excited, flattered, and clingy, in every case.) What I didn't ask was, "What does the evidence tell me about whether this man is ready to be in a close relationship?", "What have I seen about his ability to deal well with challenges or conflict?" If I had asked those questions, I would have hade to make some very different choices. Of course I was avoiding making those choices. I thought, "Here's a man who seems really cool and likes me! That is so rare! Must not let this go! Must make this work!"
But with the perspective of a number of painful failed relationships, I see that I kept blinkers on for those first 6-9 months, and then I was too deep in to climb out very readily. I had to be pulled out kicking and screaming by the sheer hell that the relationship turned into, from his addictions and dysfunctions, and my own dysfunctions in return.
So what I'm thinking is that the first 6-9 months (or 6-12 months) are a time of tentative exploration, keeping eyes open, and learning. What you've learned, it seems, is that he's a person without a solid handle on recovery. Maybe going back into rehab means he'll stay sober. But that won't be apparent for another year or five years. Right now it's a crapshoot, however well-intentioned he is or however wonderful when sober.
I think personally I wouldn't want my children to meet a new partner unless that partner were solidly established in my life and a promising person.
Your boyfriend may have a real solid handle on his program right now, but it does happen that they get out for a bit and they go right back to their addiction. The chances may not be high -- who knows -- but it is not impossible. That could be awful with kids around.
Sometimes we also have the feeling that "I want to show him I'm supportive," but what they hear is, "I can do anything and get away with it -- she'll stick by me no matter what choices I make. She's okay with the addiction! Just what I was hoping!" Sometimes some detachment is realistic feedback on the situation.
I think, in sum, having experienced what I have, I'd open my possibilities to other partners, and keep this on a friendly but not intimate footing.
Whatever you decide, take good care of yourself and your children.
Hmmm very good feedback Mattie. I'm wavering because actually in the past 5 years I haven't jumped into anything at all. This one I totally admit we grew as friends first, feelings became really strong and it did become physical in time. I've dated, but have actually backed out of several potential relationships based on a number of reasons. This one has been hard because I cared for him as a friend before it went further. So again, I admit to having a hard time taking a step back.
Maybe I'm just kidding myself saying the meeting my kids will be more on a friend level and that's where I need to keep thinking this through. I don't expect or want anything from the meeting, I hope my kids take it as a friend visiting (if it even happens) and I'm VERY good at boundaries with guys and my kids. The one guy they met, he was also a friend first and then the chemistry just wasnt there but he was not allowed to even hold my hand around my kids. I wasn't ready for that. They see him periodically as a friend, they get along with his son, he and I still stay in contact.
As far as open to other relationships, myself I don't handle dating more than one person at a time well at all. It doesn't mean I'm "all in" yet, actually he knows I'm not I've been totally honest about that.
This kind of banter here helps me a lot because I don't want to make a bad judgement call here. Also my kids and I have a really open relationship, they know the truth about him, they have heard a small amount no details. Basically that he has alcoholism, he is working on stopping and he's getting help for it. It opened up a great discussion with my oldest who recognized that alcoholism is in his genetics, his grandparents on dad's side and my grandparents on my mom's side. I explained that it's why I don't drink except on rare occasions (about twice a year tops). I like those talks.
I'm going to re-read what you said, you bring up a lot that already has been going on in my head and just allow myself time to think this through. Thank you for your honesty!!
I know you have made your decision, I just wanted to ad, that for me, regardless of your side of the story and that of the kids... what about his story right now. I think it would be way too much pressure for a man currently in rehab, to be meeting someone's kids for the first time. Extra emotional stress, however relaxed the environment might be, is not what he needs right now.
(((("C"))))...I only have my own experiences and before I really started taking the suggestions in the program seriously those experiences especially regarding relationships were always traumatic, chaotic and full of crises. I was focusing on the new "them" and they were taking my focus off of myself. The suggestion that I ought not attempt a new relationship while still having need for understanding about myself and how I affect relationships was a major task for me. I had problems taking directions for such a long time before I got into Al-Anon plus I had that inner ego centered voice that told me "it happens to others and won't happen to me....again". When working with my sponsors about the presence of problems in my life...that inventory work...we discovered that for each and every troublesome event no matter how large or small there was always one person involved...me regardless of my thoughts or plans or intentions...there I was. I had to take care of the life I already had and rather than change the people in it; change the person I could; me.
I'm still working it cause I am still here and while I am doing great in some areas...in others I hear the echos of past errors in thinking and doing. There are reasons for this...I am not a bad person and I do have some character defects that continue to hang on. I get to repeat old habits until I change them. My family at times act shocked and at other times act surprised and elated. I don't do it for them...just for me.
It's all a balancing act. When we discussed it I let him know I was open to him rejecting the idea and he knew I meant that. His original yes is his choice, I won't make decisions for him. And I won't avoid asking things to protect him. Those are old games I played.
I don't want him to change. I accept that he has this disease, and only am in his life because he chooses to work on it.
I'm new here but spent the last five years working on boundaries and am confident in myself, I trust my decisions and I do so by seeking input, being honest and listening.
I've been told by his counselors and the doctor assigned to his rehab that I work with him very well and clearly have my boundaries set and don't enable.
I'm in no hurry for anything. I have no expectations of this relationship. I'm not in need of another person, I have loved my 5 years of being single LOL.
But I need to keep learning, and I need to always be mindful that I can fall back into old ways.
I don't know where this will go. I don't need it to be forever. I trust that every person in my life is here to teach me if I learn. And if tomorrow this ends, I know I am strong enough to walk away without resentment or damage. I haven't lost myself at all.
It's about learning. And not living in fear or putting someone else above yourself. Our talk revealed that we both felt the meeting could have been fine but no rush and we agreed we would take the time to make the decision together in the future, and with careful consideration.
Another learning moment :)
1) I am an alcoholic and I have about 3 and a half years continuous sobriety. 2) I have been diagnosed with depression and anxiety and I have had to take meds for that since I was 25 (almost 40 now).
Now - knowing those 2 things I can say that my relationship history has been fraught with drama and break ups all the way up until about a year and a half ago. My current relationship is the 1st one I have been in that has not been overwhelmingly influenced by me being a busted down person. I think I was always a good person. I always had a job. It would appear I had some things to give to a relationship at earlier points in my life. I guess maybe I did have a lot of good things to bring. BUT - this is the 1st time that I don't bring in VICTIM into the relationship. I manage my own crap and therefore am freed up to have a relationship that is on equal footing and is mature.
Even if this guy is not outwardly looking at you as his savior, that dynamic is one to watch out for simply due to his current instability with his own mental health and substance abuse. Yes, unstable people and people who struggle with addiction deserve love too, but it doesn't have to come in the form of an intimate relationship with you. He's not really going to be "the catch" until he sorts out his issues and gets at least another couple of years sobriety back. This doesn't mean kick him to the curb - just be cautious and realistic.
Just based on my experience - Take what you want and leave the rest.
I totally agree about watching out for him seeking someone to save him and being cautious! And I will keep an eye out for victim behaviors.
Before the relapse he was not in victim mode, was supporting himself (stil is), was going to school, had rebuilt his relationship with his kids and was honest and up front with me.
First relapse I knew him, he tried to get me to allow him over, I said "not a chance" and two days later he was in detox in his own without my involvement. Second one I was with him, called him on it immediately and told him I was dropping him off somewhere, either a friend, detox or police station, he had an hour to figure it out. I dropped him off and walked away.
He called 3 days later and was checking into this place. He knows without a doubt I will not allow his illness around me. Next time (I have to say that because I won't pretend its all over) will be the same. Not near me, not my issue. If he is with me, then the drunk tank is fine with me.
I'm no stranger to being firm. And I do care, but I care more about my life and my kids.
I have not seen any victim, blaming or expectations. Everytime I've said no, he accepts it. I spent last night re-reading so many of my books. So far ironically he and I do pretty well. But I'm here because I know how easily that can change.
I'm watching, I've told the truth to all my family, I'm doing this more for me because I will never go back to bad boundaries in my life.
But this relationship is forcing me to go slow and take the time to figure out if it can remain healthy. Time will tell. He will be impatient 2 months, then outpatient. Then is going for treatment for ptsd. All his idea entirely.
I actually told myself after this post I'm taking a weekend free of analyzing and just going to enjoy ky weekend, not worry or wonder, have fun with my kids and let go of this for now. Spending too much time focusing on this isn't good.
