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Hello everyone. I haven't been here ina while, but I've been reading taking care of myself. Can too much of caring about yourself, too much self esteem be harmful, or am I just not comfortable doing it? In my unconscious do I want to convert back to my old ways....please share your experience.
the reason I ask is because last week was my birthday. I wanted to have people over, turns out a lot of them couldn't come but that didn't matter to me. My AH took it upon himself to invite someone who was not on the invite list for no particular reason, I just didnt feel like it. We got into an argue,ment about that, they ended up coming over and it was really fine and I had a great time. He kept badgering me for weeks about inviting some other people i don't know too well and I kept insisting without fighting, that this was MY BIRTHDAY and it was about me and I would invite whomever I wanted. Finally he called me egotistical and selfish, to which I responded, yes, I am being selfish because it is my birthdat and he had the right to invite whomeever he wanted the other 51 weeks of the year but not on my birthday.
Fast foward to this week, yesterday he shows me a bottle of wine he bought, (he likes to drink both beer and wine. Mind you, I have completely STOPPED looking for the booze, badgering, arguing , complaining, etc, and instead have begun praying for him because he is so sick now that the disease has gotten worse I think. unless he brings it up, I don't say anything, so he bought it up, I said Oh, that's a big bottle...very matter of fact, nothing sarcastic. Two hours later he calls me upstairs to say he feels uncomfortable in this house because I am watching his every move, he feels he can't have a drink without me watching him, and he bought up my birthday again!! It sounded as though he wanted me to apologize he called me selfish again, and I said yes, I have the right to be selfish on my birthday and nothiong he says is going to change my mind about that. he said he has no idea who I am anymore and that he wishes I would be the way I used to. To which I said that will never happen.
So, Does caring about oneself ever become being selfish. It is still hard not to take what he says personally, and although I am not beating myself up over this, there is a question in my mind as to whether caring about yourself "too much" is possible. Frankly, at this point we are not really inteacting much at all since he is drinking every single day and going to sleep drunk. He seems paranoid from what I just described and it seems the disease is getting worse. Last night he left half drunk. He kept saying things that he would never say sober like he wants to split the things in the house and he was taking my car. ( he took his own car) then he turns around and says it's a lie, "I would never want to take the house from you and my girls" like a jeckel and hide. he wanted me to find his shoes. It was so bizarre...scary almost, and sad, so I cried for about an hour feeling sad for him that he is so sick and praying to God to help me continue caring about me and my kids while getting all worked uo about my future with or without my AH. It's so sad to see him like this.
Welcome back. I sure do remember you. I dont think there is such a thing as caring too much about yourself. In fact for me, I put myself last on my list for such a long time a loving sponsor had to teach me how to practice self care and make myself a priority before anyone else.
I am glad you came back and posted again. I would like to encourage you to keep posting and sharing on the board. When time are difficult I find it helps me move through the problems when I am sharing E,S,& H to help someone else.
Hi Odalis, I'm so sorry things are becoming so painful. My husband's drinking is escalating too, and I am challenged with somehow staying connected while I detatch from the drinking and hangovers. I also am not commenting on it anymore, and I stopped playing detective, which frankly is getting easier and is a bit of a relief. I don't believe that standing up for myself and stating my wants and needs is selfish. It is not comfortable for me sometimes, as I am so used to putting others first. Any resistance from my husband is something I don't take on as my issue. I have the right to change, and he has the right to have feelings and reactions to it. My husband has spoken more of leaving since I started changing, but I learned from my sponser to not argue or try to change his mind. it seems to take the winds out of the sails of the threat. Not that he won't at some point, but I am empowered by not trying to convince him or control him. We have a 2 and 5 yr old, so I worry about how it would affect the kids, but I try to put my faith in my higher power and continue to allow my husband the dignity to find his own way, even though it is hard to watch. Take care and I hope you and your family have a nice Thanksgiving!
I am not sure this is the answer you want, but you are describing an insideous progression of his alcoholism. Yeah...it does progress to paranoia and the mood shifts and bizarre statements....powerplays...they all get worse. Blackouts will be next if that has not happened already.
I do not think there is such a thing as you being too selfish in regards to him.
Yes of course there is a thing as being to selfish. But you have to distinguish selfish from self-care. Planning a nice birthday for yourself is self-care. It's just doing something nice for yourself. You already considered his feelings on this and made your decision taking him into account. Selfish is when you don't even think about the other person or people.
Typically, active alcoholics are the epitome of selfish and projection is a chief defense mechanism - That would consist of calling someone else what we know is a label that really applies to us.
My gut response to your question is definitely not - certainly not in the situation you describe. I think co-dependents have the opposite issue - caring too little about themselves. Being so focused on maintaining peace in the midst of insanity, and in the process neglecting oneself. I know I did that. Remember that alcoholism and selfishness/self-pity go together. Somehow the A's never really seems to care about how we feel and don't feel guilty about hurting us- they just go about doing what they are doing until/unless the penny drops and they do some serious work on themselves. It seems to me that they are too sick to care about anything other than drinking until/unless they commit to a recovery program. I read somewhere that detachment is actually the most loving thing someone can do for an A. So please continue to take care of yourself - you and your kids deserve it. I hope you enjoy a happy holiday. Sending support, nyc
I certainly don't think that one can care too much about themselves - especially in relation to the addict in our lives. I wish I didn't spend so much time caring more about the addict than myself. I still have work to do in that regard. He certainly doesn't care more about me than himself - that's the nature of the disease.
i dont understand whats ging here.i think you are getting muddled and a certain person is muddling you up to deflect from the real problem- his problem drinking. instead of looking so much to your "selfish" ness (or not- as the case may be) what he really should be doing is looking at his own stuff and until he does that he shouldnt be talking about yu- right? try saying what i said to my mum once-" try psychoanalysing yurself for a change"
Hi Odalis - my experience from my ex is that ANYTIME I asked for anything he didn't want to do, I was accused of being selfish, was accused of always having to have my way - even if i suggested a movie he didn't want to watch, or a restaurant other than the one he really wanted to go to (even though he didn't know which restaurant he wanted to go to) if i even suggested anything, i was being selfish. Seems to me that being an alcoholic comes with a very ego-centric personality, everything is about them so anything you try to make about you is seen as selfish. If concerned you are caring too much for yourself, I would say suggest you ask your friends/family and anyone NOT alcoholic and see what responses you get.
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I am strong in the broken places. ~ Unknown
All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another! ~ Anatole France
This is a really interesting thread. Really good question. I don't think a person can care too much about themselves. It just depends on what you do with it - it's the actions that can take it overboard. From what you've written, it sounds like you are developing healthy self esteem and self care habits. That is hard enough, but when you add in the dynamic of alcoholism in your home, it gets even more difficult! There's been such great ESH in this thread.
I think you're describing a really common dynamic of these relationships, especially as the sober partner tries to establish boundaries and take care of themselves. The alcoholic will react to those changes and often resist, maybe with anger, threats and accusations. I can't count the number of times I was accused of cheating on my BF during those crazy times. I never even came close, I was so in love with him. He just didn't like that I was trying to find balance by spending time on my own without him.
Anyway, as you become healthier and assert yourself, your husband may continue to react this way. He probably won't like some of these changes that are good for you. My BF wanted to be in charge and have things his way. He didn't like when I kept asking to meet my own needs. The point is that you are getting healthier and that is a great thing. He may not like it or recognize it, but you getting healthier can also be a great thing for him.
I don't know if any of that is right or helpful. Please take what you like and leave the rest, just my perspective.
Happy belated Birthday and Happy Thanksgiving! I just read about this in one of my daily readers today, I skip around so not sure what the date was. To trust in yourself no matter what someone else is telling you, especially if you know the other person is sick. I don't think you sound like you are being too selfish at all, especially since you are questioning yourself about who to invite to your own party. My exAH could convince me of almost anything before I found Al-anon. As you grow and change you will feel more secure about your own thoughts and realize you get red flags for a reason. It sounds like you are working a solid program, keep up the good work! I am sending you love and support on your journey!
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Sending you love and support on your journey always! BreakingFree
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" Pain is inevitable, suffering is optional."
"Serenity is when your body and mind are in the same place."
Hi (((odalis))) and welcome back, I have to say, I totally agree with rosielee, he is probably attacking you to deflect attention from himself and his drinking. Your expectations for YOUR birthday do not sound at all selfish to me, but of course I feel my own birthday should be a national holiday! Honestly, though, I have met very few people who live with an A who are selfish people. Many of them, like you, are afraid that they are, because that is what their A wants them to believe. And A's are SO good at finding our weak spots! You sound like a very caring, thoughtful person who deserves to be happy. Think of it this way; If what you do/say isn't hurting anyone and IS making someone happy (and that includes you!), then what is the harm? To me, that is not selfishness. Also, I can SO identify with that Jekyll/Hyde syndrome. It's just another trait that is so common among A's, and another way that they keep the ones who care about them so off balance. I'velearned that whe my A is in 'drinking mode'- not abstaining and seeking support to stop--I can't believe anything he says, good or bad. I honestly don't think HE knows what's true and what's a lie at that point.
Thinking of you and wishing you well today!
Denise
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"The secret of life is enjoying the passage of time."
I don't have anything to add to the wonderful ESH that you have already received. There is a difference between self care and selfishness. Yes, self care takes time to learn how to do. I still struggle with doing things for myself and sometimes have to make myself do them.
Hugs P :)
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Stepping onto a brand-new path is difficult, but not more difficult than remaining in a situation, which is not nurturing to the whole woman.- Maya Angelo
