The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
I have posted about this before, but this time it's more about how I perceive me in this. When I was 17 years old I met my A and I was just starting my senior year. He drank and partied and looked very good in his marine Corps uniform. I was blind right away. He got me out of my dysfunctional family of origin and was my tin God.
Fastforward 16 years, we had good and happy times. We had hard and devastating times I am shocked I lasted through. We have a 13 year old and a 3 year old. I had to tell him not to call me just to chat, that we are no longer friends, that I don't want to hear about his life and the only reason we should have to chat is in regards to our children.
This was the saddest conversation I ever had to have with this man who meant the world to me for half of my life. He is so lost in his disease and still tries to emotionally tear me down, with his late at night drunken calls. I have felt scared of him in the past, and recently emotionally and verbally abused. I see how I chose to stay and be the victim. Now that I chose to leave and am feeling better, it's like I have survivor's guilt that hits me from time to time. I feel as though I should have stayed and been more compassionate, but I did try that to my own demise for far too long. I did try everything and boy was I creative. I am doing better than ever and feeling so balanced and solid about myself and my future.
So why the occassional guilt that sidles up to me and says you should have.......????
How come some other people have been able to stay with their A's and be able to find thier balance? I guess maybe it's just another of my perfectionism's, or feelings of inadequacy?
-- Edited by flopadopilus on Wednesday 5th of October 2011 08:10:15 AM
-- Edited by flopadopilus on Wednesday 5th of October 2011 08:12:45 AM
__________________
God grant me the serenity To accept the things I cannot change, Courage to change the things I can, And wisdom to know the difference.
Al-Anon/Alateen Family Group Headquarters, Inc. 800-344-2666
I have chosen to stay with my AH because my sponsor in the beginning suggested as it is mentioned in our literature to wait six months to one year before making a major decision in my life. I was so ready for divorce when I walked into Alanon.
I am very glad I was willing to listen. After I did my 5th step with her, things began to change within me and the relationship with my AH. I felt the gifts of the program work within me and started seeing results in my family. The circumstances were the same, but I had a new perspective into the marriage seeing my contribution to how it steadily erroded the love, caring, and affection. That is just the tip of the iceberg.
For me today I am only married one day at a time. The just for today card says something like "Just for today I will take my luck as it comes and adjust myself to it, not as I would have it to be" "I can do something for 24 hours that would appal me if I had to keep it up for a lifetime" It is a journey for me there is no destination. Individually everyone comes up with what is right for them. For me, it has been the best decision I have ever made.
Guilt is part of the sickness that the family suffers from. Getting them Sober has some really good points about irrational guilt, I think that as codependents, we just become so used to caretaking, covering, and trying to move mountatns to help the alcoholic, that we start to think that is a normal way of life. That we somehow have to be making them feel good, despite the fact that they never seem to feel guilty about the destruction they cause (at least while they are active). The question is, what is more important, taking care of yourself and your children, or allowing your life to go on as is, just so that youre A would prefer it that way. From my experience, they try to make you feel guility even if you do stay with them. Its part of the hold they have over us. Something I remember reading in GTS is if its good for the family, its good for the alcoholic. I try to remember that when I feel bad about separating from my A and letting him deal with the consequences of his drinking. It may not feel good at first, but ultimately it could be the best thing for him, as well as for you. Sending you lots of ESH.
Not every relationship is the same, I know women who have left and had the regrets of "if I had waited" .. guess what .. it didn't change, the guy they were married to is still active in their own disease currently, and these women have moved on and flourished because they have left. It was horrific. It is also goes back after all is said and done, would you have been able to be able to forgive the actions or would they still be there (the resentments). It's also the 3 C's and you aren't responsible for "saving" your ex that is so on him. It must be painful to watch someone you have loved for so long and grown up with not be able to "get it together". I only know how hard it is for me and I don't have the same history you do with your ex.
It still doesn't change the fact that from time to time they get hit with the "why wasn't I enough." I think that seeing the relationship as it is, and this is my two cents, there comes a point that you have to make a choice for your own sanity and that of the kids how much damage is going to be done by staying vs leaving. Again no one's situation is the same. What I can do or have been through is way different than someone else. There are things that if my AH was doing now I would have to leave. That's me and what my boundaries are, they work for me.
I get where Tommy is coming from as well, I waited and I'm glad I did because my relationship has changed. That has very little to do with me really, yes my behavior has changed and things between my AH and I are better. I have no idea what the future holds I can only speak of for today this is where I am at. We still have a long ways to go.
I have had the feeling you have been in the program for a while and that you came to this decision with eyes wide open and knowing what you wanted and needed to do for you. I look at that avatar picture and I see someone who has grown (in the short time I've been here :)) and flourished (and is continuing to do so). What your ex chooses to do or not to do is on him. You can certainly be compassionate in dealing with the kids, you can extend kindness. Verbal abuse, and that crap about the confessions of late night shenanigans that's not what you need to hear from him. You have a right to your peace of mind. He can call a drunk buddy and do that with them. You deserve better during your own time of healing and being easy on you.
The future is always wide open. You still need to heal and to me it seems healing away from the situation is what is best for you. You can feel good about where you are and good about treating him with integrity without needing to be IN the relationship to fix him.
Hugs P :)
__________________
Stepping onto a brand-new path is difficult, but not more difficult than remaining in a situation, which is not nurturing to the whole woman.- Maya Angelo
Okay this just came to me, why the guilt comes in. I moved out April of 2010 into a shared living situation renting 2 rooms for me and my 2 girls 11 and 1 year olds, it didn't go well. My A didn't come and see the girls for a couple months and partied like a rock star. I then moved into a duplex and realized I could make it on my own, but I had to work a lot. My exAH stopped drinking in July of 2010 and started coming around to see the girls and was trying to get me back and I moved back in with him in August, he was an angry dry drunk and was treating me terrible, because I dared to move out to begin with. I lasted 1 month and moved back out into a nice place with my girls again and was done with him. He started drinking the day I moved out and his parents blame me. I found Al-anon shortly after I moved out the last time and I always wished I had found the program while still living with him, however this is how it worked out and after awhile I filed for divorce in February of 2011, because he was still being so hateful and I am doing much better. So I understand this is the way it had to go and I am much better for it and so are my girls. So the guilt I will have to fight off knowing that I did the best I could and after I found my recovery program I still don't want to continue on with him in a relationship. He is sick and I hand him to HP again. And I can know I found the program when I needed it most and the timing was HP's plan in which I trust in. So it is up to him to find his own program or not and I will stop with the guilt of trying to save someone it darn near killed me trying to do. So I learned a great lesson today and I was trying to insert my will and that never gets me where I want to be! The divorce was final on July 19th 2011 and I guess it is normal as a newly divorced woman to look back, but I have to stop staring! Thanks All!
-- Edited by flopadopilus on Wednesday 5th of October 2011 10:05:19 AM
-- Edited by flopadopilus on Wednesday 5th of October 2011 11:10:43 AM
__________________
God grant me the serenity To accept the things I cannot change, Courage to change the things I can, And wisdom to know the difference.
Al-Anon/Alateen Family Group Headquarters, Inc. 800-344-2666
And there you have it :) Remorse and grief is totally normal don't beat yourself up.
Hugs P :)
__________________
Stepping onto a brand-new path is difficult, but not more difficult than remaining in a situation, which is not nurturing to the whole woman.- Maya Angelo
When I start feeling guilt I check my self judgement and second guessing skills. Also if I was wrong in something, I gotta own it and then amend it all the while staying close to my HP and my sponsor and the program. (((((hugs)))))...good to have you in the house.
Hugs to you! I also experience so much guilt at times now that my AH and I are living separately--we are not divorced as of yet, but frankly it is a relief to have the house to myself. So I often feel "guilted into doing things" for other people (which makes me have a pity party for myself) and then when I do something actually good FOR myself, I feel guilty for that too--like I do not deserve it. How insane
I think for me--a lot of my guilt comes when I think of our children and this sense that I am breaking up the family. That is rough!! But it isn't the reality and I always always always remind myself of the hard facts! We were not safe and we were missing his love while he was here and he is very sick.
I also read a few articles on the different kinds of guilt and that helped a lot. Some guilt is necessary for us to make changes in our lives or make amends--others is unhealthy and misplaced and a lot of what I feel in terms of him is unhealthy. I have to work hard to let it go.
It isn't easy and I am not great at it yet, but I try to recognize it as what it is as the first step. I know how you feel. At a F2F meeting about 2 weeks ago I was so immersed in guilt I just wept through the whole meeting, (the topic was guilt) but it also made me realize, I still have a lot of work to do.
I still experience guilt from my exAH sometimes, when I let my mind start to romanticize how things were and minimize the abuse. I experience guilt because I let myself believe that everyone else in my ex's life left him. His mom committed suicide. His dad left him. He had no family because they all cut him off. He had no friends because they all cut him off. He just had me - and I left him too. When I let myself think like this, I feel guilty.
That thought process is irrational and incomplete, though. This person cheated on me and abused me, just like he cheated and abused pretty much everyone because he was sick. People gradually got sick of being used and cut him off. While I'm sorry about what happened with his parents, me staying doesn't change or fix anything as far as that's concerned. I can't sacrifice my life and myself to make that situation any different. The bottom line was, he didn't treat me well and there was no reason that I needed to stay in that situation when I was afraid and living in fear. While I can certainly have compassion for him as a person and maybe that compassion can help me forgive him, having compassion does not equal "I should've stayed because he's a hurt and damaged mess and I hurt and damaged him worse." I am also a hurt and damaged mess - or I was, rather, I'm healing now - but did I not deserve to have the opportunity to heal in an environment where I could actually do that?
The guilt is consuming, and I so totally hear ya. But it's a figment of your imagination and it's not real. It's a feeling - feelings are not facts. Keep on keeping on - debilitating guilt is part of my sickness and it has the power to tear me down if I let it. Give it to HP every time you feel it, and don't take it back.
I don't feel guilty because I know that IF he came to me immersed in a program and working on his recovery, apologizing, amending, behaving like the man I fell in love with, I would give him a chance to get back into my life - now, remember that I am not going to sit in a corner waiting for him, if someone else comes into my life so be it - but I'd love to have him back - whether that happens depends on him and God.
__________________
I am strong in the broken places. ~ Unknown
All changes, even the most longed for, have their melancholy; for what we leave behind us is a part of ourselves; we must die to one life before we can enter another! ~ Anatole France
Nobody likes to give up on a marriage. Your inclination may also be to stay together for the sake of your kids. Those are hard instincts to fight even though you know you are so right. I think that is probably where the guilt comes in. Also, 50 years ago a wife would have stayed and just been miserable her whole life due to the norms of the day. Thankfully, our definitions of a healthy marriage and shifts towards egalitarianism have occurred allowing women to expect more rewarding relationships. BUT - again, there is a lingering view about "being a good wife" that I think people sometimes still hold onto in their psyche. For all those reasons you might have the feelings you do.
Now, supposing some of this is true? What do you do with knowledge? Forgive yourself and congratulate yourself at the same time. Life is complicated and choices have pluses and minuses. You made the decision with the most pluses and least minuses. Forgive yourself for the minuses created and stay happy and positive about the pluses I guess :)
And this is why I love MIP all of your responses helped me to let go of the guilt today and really hand it over to HP. I don't need to beat myself up over something I know and my 13 year old has told me was the right thing to do. Sometimes I do feel like I was supposed to do more years like I had a life sentence. I have to realize I am free to be happy and not worry about him. That was the old miserable life and now I have a new fresh and free life without abuses and such and it does feel amazing not to have to walk on eggshells and worry about my 3 year old seeing the things my 13 year old has seen. I thank God for you all here! Sending you all love and support on your own journey's!!!
__________________
God grant me the serenity To accept the things I cannot change, Courage to change the things I can, And wisdom to know the difference.
Al-Anon/Alateen Family Group Headquarters, Inc. 800-344-2666
Hey there, I didn't get a chance to say anything yesterday here, but I wanted you to know that I have been through a divorce and I feel guilty about it sometimes too. Eventually it wore off and a year and a half later, I feel a lot better about it. The man who is my 9 year old's dad, he has moved on and has a girlfriend now. I have moved on and we actually work in the same building, so I see him every day. We only talk about our son and we do not bring up crap from the past anymore, like we did at the beginning. It does get better in time... HUGS
__________________
-youfoundme
Let go and let God...Let it be... let it begin with me...
