He became engraged, and physical, to the point of grabbing me and tearing my pants. i don't want to make it sound like he hit me, but I don't want to minimize it either.

tried to tear her from my arms, screaming at me while holding her. His threats scare me

I stated that one ground rule is that under no circumstances is it ok for him to become physically abusive with me (and I assume you mean your daughter also in this statement).  He said "I'll try.  But likewise, you can't push me to it." (but apparently you can push him TO do it)

YOU HAVE BEEN PHYSICALLY ABUSED.  I am not judging you, I am not judging him, I am stating facts thats all.

I get what you are saying... I really do.. I have been there... I have said "He only hit me a few times"  I didn't mention the strangling, the dragging, the grabbing, the kicking etc.. he only hit me a few times... he scares the crap out of me every other day.

I left this man with the presence of the police behind me.  I went back to get my belongings, in the presence of the police behind me.  If I were to tell you how to do this I would say that you premediate the leaving and do it at the least vulnerable time for your daughter.  Take her to a friends so she is not part of the equation.  Then you go back with a support person and tell him you are going. 

I am NOT telling you to leave him.  I am saying what I went through and ideas on IF you decide to leave him, how to do it safely.

I did get punched in the nose and two black eyes and a blood nose when I lived in the house of my ex partners mother.  We were naked, extremely drunk, it was new years eve, we were making a right racket and then he got me on the floor and punched me fair in the face while my head was held down on the ground.  I made him do it by arguing with him and following him.  Ok, I didn't realise that was a cause to punch me in the face....

His mother helped to clean me up, sit with me and told him to go away (we were still naked by the way).  She did not seem shocked.  I look back now and wonder why?????  I stayed for another 6 years because he didn't 'hit me very often'.

I'm not sure where the ripped clothes and bruises came from then.  6 years later (I don't know how many more abusive episodes later), he strangled me up against a wall because I was breathing wrong.  It was too noisy for him. 

That day, I said to him.. that is the second last time you hit me.  Because next time is the last.  He never hit me again ... physically... A year or so later I left him becasue of the emotional/financial etc etc abuse that continued.

but I don't want to minimize it either. I ask you to think about this statement.

You have a beautiful one year old gift that is taking this all in.  Read what some other of the Adult Children of Alcoholics have to say on this site.

There are some amazing men and women on here that will have a different point of view to mine.  You need to read and listen to all of them and take what you like and leave the rest.

I know the fear you speak of. 

I, too, have been afraid of the alcoholic in my life, my dad. 

When he stopped getting help for his illness, his illness progressed very significantly and it included not just alcoholism but mental illness and abuse. 

In his case, the abuse was not physical but it was psychological. He used threats--to kill himself, to kill my mom--as a way to try to maintain control when my mom decided to leave. He also got more and more erratic--driving drunk with my brother in the car, broke down the door when he misplaced his keys, calls slurring his words, sobbing with pity for himself, etc. He was unstable and he was unsafe. 

When their illness progresses, it can be so scary. I remember being terrified. 

What our family found helpful was to contact a domestic violence shelter, to read books on family violence (in order to stay in reality when the alcoholic was trying to convince us we caused him to threaten us and be abusive). As an adult, I have also found counseling invaluable. My parents divorced around the time of the scary episodes and we also took our fear seriously and we have not had contact with my dad for long periods (years) when my dad has been at his most scary and unstable. 

I encourage you to take your fears seriously and to contact people who can help (dmv shelter/hotline, etc.) and a counselor so you can do what what you need to do (we had a safe plan before we left for how to leave safely if matters should escalate while we still lived with my dad). Professionals can help guide you and we found that help to be life and sanity saving. 

Dear Klotus, please read BlueCloud's post over again---it was what I would say to you about  contacting a shelter/hotline---you will find numbers in the front of your local phone book.

Your husband does hno have to know.  You don't have to know what to say---they will know what to ask.  They will give you direction and guidence.  Like alcoholism, abuse tends to be progressive over time.

In support, Otie

I felt lost and anxious and sad and angry all the time around an explosive A.

Strategizing what to do next is so so hard.

The more people you can get who are objective the better.  Great his mother is a counselor why not get one of your own.

Great you are in al anon lean on the program, get a sponsor.

I dealt with day in day out the explosions when I asked for anything.  Not taking it personally is so so hard.  I feel for you it is a hard journey to weigh up not asking versus asking.  I think the double binds have to be named. Whatever you do there is one!

Glad you are here.

Maresie.

Update:

Yesterday I called two shelters, and they were very helpful.  I have also left messages with a couple of legal aids but haven't spoken with them yet.  In addition, I've reached out to some friends who told me I can stay with them anytime - one of them counsels abused women/adolescents.  Again, thank you all.  If it weren't for you, I would not have taken these steps. 

They told me that he is behaving as a classic abuser, and that it's probably best not to let him know anything about any plans, as well as to gather things I will need including important papers (the only problem is that he will have multiple copies of tax documents, etc).  They also said he will escalate if I leave, just to be aware.  I have started an e-mail journal of events and feelings. 

To answer a question, I am getting counseling, and I do have a sponsor.  My sponsor told me not to think about legal action right now - I guess to focus on myself more. 

One of the things he was angry about the other day was that I had gone to a counseling appointment alone - his mother said he "felt left out."  Are you kidding?  This was a counselor that we had agreed was not helping us as a couple.  We have upcoming appmts with a new counselor, but I kept the appmt the other day for myself.  It makes sense - he's been upset with me for reading too much recovery material lately anyway.

Last night he was especially nice, considerate, listened, asked some questions and respected my opinions and input on some neutral subjects.  He tried to rub my back, and followed me around.  Yes, this would be a honeymoon phase.  It is making me feel ill, now that I realize how this has been part of an abuse cycle.  If I don't comply or respond well to it pretty soon, he will escalate again.  What do I do?

I had left him a voicemail yesterday morning (after he screamed at me again) indicating that I'd like to spend some time apart until we are on a better track and gotten some counseling.  Of course, no mention of this in the evening.  He thinks that calming things down will keep me from wanting to do this - plus he can say he's "doing better" next week when we're at the appointment.  The manipulation is tearing me apart.

I agree with what people have said about his mother.  The focus was completely on us having a marriage communication issue.  When, in fact, that entire discussion bought him time to "make things right."  It was enabling.  It has been his aproach in the past to contact his mother, give her his perspective, and have her "work with" me.  She eventually realizes that he's manipulated her.  Unfortunately, right now, she is more focused on his recovery and getting him back on track than on my safety - she didn't want me to leave or for him to leave the other day.  She wanted us to be able to live under the same roof and work with the marriage counseling next week.  She wants me to be patient.  The whole thing has me questioning myself. 

Sorry, I'm spinning a bit again.  I've been shaky, and scared on and off - I just keep trying to work on myself. 

Question:  My friend who works with women in Pennsylvania said I could file a police report, but not press charges.  Any thoughts on this?  If my AH found out, he would be furious.

KLotus