"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"

KLotus · Senior Member

Bothered

hawaiilover · Senior Member

I understand how you must feel. If I were in your shoes I would be upset also. This is a good time to praise yourself for being the greatest mom. You are special and valuable. Do not ever forget that. He does not need to validate you. You are the most precious jewel he has and does not know it. The alcohol distorts alcoholics thinking. When you focus on your positive qualities, you will have better moments one day at a time. This disease affects all of our emotions and our self-esteem. That is why we have Alanon and each other. Keep venting and sharing. Just remember that YOU are special and tell yourself that daily.

Hawaii

abbyal · ~*Service Worker*~

This certainly rang a bell with me , I remember those days all too well . Alcoholics are very unhappy people and always have to find something wrong its part of thier disease . let those remarks go its sick thinking continue to do the best you can cleaning etc and expect nothing in return except the knowledge that you live in a clean house . In sobriety that behavior stopped almost imeaditly when I said to my husb if your looking for perfect your looking in the wrong direction , if the house is not up to your standards please feel free to clean it yourself it will not offend me one bit . funny he never said anything again hehe .. occasionally when still drinking my husb would take it upon himself to clean the cupboards he liked all the cans and labels facing in the same direction sheeeesh it used to really upset me when he did that , now when i clean I take the time to line them all up just the way he likes em and I love the look on his face when he turns to me and smiles at which time I remind him to enjoy cause tomorrow it will be back to normal we laugh together and move on .

Betterfuture · Veteran Member

LOTUS...

I'm sorry.. I know how you feel my AH used to always say I dont do anything at all. When I clean the house, do the laundry, take care of our baby, work, study, and pay for everything else. He pays the rent thats it. I think he thinks that utilities, toiletries, paper towels, pull ups, wipes, HBO, and just about everything else just come w/ the rent lol.

He also says that watching our daughter is the easiest thing to do yet he can't spend the 10 minutes w/ her w/o complaining. SO funny huh? I can understand why you are so frustrated!!

Then I realize it all comes down to remembering we have no control over anything but ourselves. I can't help the way my AH feels about anything because no matter what I do he'll find something negative so I say F*ck it. I'm not gonna worry about whether or not anything meets his standards or whatever other BS he's saying. I'm going to worry about ME and MY CHILD and what makes us happy. Needless to say my days have gotten easier..

I'm not HURTING anymore. Like what I've read here so many times.. "what someone else thinks of me is non of my business". I know I'm not perfect but I try my best to be a good mother, daughter, sister and friend because I know that ultimately its ME who I have to live w/ for the rest of my life.

Wishing you the best in your recovery..

xoxo

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

I have changed so much Lotus. To me there is NO excuse for this. Myself I would not tolerate it.

He chose too you know.I would tell him I overheard the conversation of you putting me down. If you don't love me the way I am then there is the frigging door., I deserve so much more than this.

I would ask myself what makes me put up with this bolony? OH I know it hurt. I never knew mine was talking bad about me as he never did to my face. But his friend said to me on the phone, well what about this and what about that? I was stunned it hurt me so bad I started crying! I told him I never heard any of that! His friend felt horrible and told me so. Treated me so nice after that.

It changed how i felt about the A. Maybe I am too sensitive, but I don't believe so, i will not allow anyone to talk bad about me, even to me. I know who and what I am, I know how I treat others. If a socalled loved one is that evil they can get out of my life. I mean it. There is NO reason for ANYONE to put someone else down or talk about them behind their back.

This is the person who is suppose to always have your back!. ugh!!!! no one dares talk nasty about anyone to me either, ya know I learned here how to put it into words. We teach others how to treat us.

So what lesson are you putting together? Hey they all call us crazy, nutcases, mentally ill. I swear it is a symptom of the disease.

hugs,debilyn

Otie · Senior Member

Dear Klotus, in my experience, the healthier one becomes the less tolerance there is for mistreatment from others.

My first marriage was l ike what you describe, except that he wasn't an alcoholic---he was a self-centered narcissist. After 6 years (and 3 children), I ended it. It felt like I had left a prison! During the 6yrs. of the marriage I had grown in self-esteem and confidence. That was decades ago, and I hear that he still hasn't changed a bit.

From my perspective, ther is simply no way that living intimately with critical, negative, destructive energy is not toxic. It is not a nurturing environment for adults---and ESPECIALLY for developing children. The world is a tough place, and our home should be our oasis of what is life-affirming---not a place of daily character assinations.

This is the way I see it---many others would take great exception to this. That is o.k I don't have to live their life--just mine.

I was in your shoes at one time. I understand.

In support, Otie

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

Hugs KL,

Unhealthy behavior is unhealthy behavior on that of your A's. It's so much easier to point the finger at someone else than accept the responsibility for our (I'm referring to his in this case) own actions. Easy to say hard to do is not to take it personally, I am not excusing his behavior or minimizing the hurt he caused, the reality is .. it's not your burden to bear it's on him. I really consider the source on a lot of things. Give yourself an atta girl for working so hard on you. You are doing the best you can and I think considering the circumstances and the fact you are taking on so much that you are doing a great job. :)

Keep working your program, keep coming back and know you are perfectly imperfect and that's more than just a little ok, that's way ok, you fit in with the rest of the human race. :)

Sending hugs and support,

P :)

White Rabbit · ~*Service Worker*~

I wonder how many times I made phone calls like that. Where I got on the phone with whoever would listen and discussed my now sober AH ad nauseum, for as long as the other person would listen. I would go on and on and on about what a horrible person he was, how out of control his drinking was, what a mean drunk he was, how he was making my life a living hell, etc.

I made those calls because I was sick. I admit, I made MANY of them. Like, almost every day for years.

It's not easy to overhear the conversation, if you're being talked about. However, I just point out that the problem was not my AH when I made all those calls. The problem was that I was completely miserable and not yet willing or able to accept my part in the whole mess. It's so much easier to just start blaming someone else than it is to even consider for a second that we might have a part.

Hang in there. Hurt people hurt people. It's not personal, even though sometimes it feels like it is. We learn here that we don't need to derive our own self esteem and self worth from what someone else thinks anyway. You know you're working hard - so keep it up!!

canadianguy · ~*Service Worker*~

Boy, does this one hit home for me.... Thank goodness I had my wise old sponsor on my side....

He chided me, when I was struggling with the very same thing and reminded me:

"Tom, you keep expecting a sick and irrational person to behave in healthy and rational ways..... Think of it this way, if she (my A) spoke highly of you at this time, what would that tell you?"

In reality, my A was sick and irrational - and I was deemed (by her) to be a "nutcase" because I wasn't acting as sick and irrationally as she was.....

hope that helps

Tom

maryjane · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi KL,
I totally understand your being bothered. I was there a few years ago. Even after he got sobriety he was unhappy with me. But by that time I had found AlAnon and eventually didn't care what he thought about me. He was stuck with me the same way I was stuck with him. Yes, it hurts real bad to hear anyone talk about you like that, but especially someone who is supposed to be your "soul mate", "have your back", "best friend", all those things that regular people have and spouses of alcoholics finally realize they don't have.

It takes some other best friends to tell you that you are the best you can be. Those other best friends usually end up being those in your AlAnon meetings. Regular friends don't believe that it could be that bad. Unless you live it, you can't understand how it could be that way. Keep coming back to MIP and to your AlAnon meetings. We will support you.

Continue to do all the things that make you feel good. You can call him on his bad behavior or not. That is up to you. Will it do any good? Will it make you feel better?

My hubby started taking his bad behavior out on our 4th daughter who had lived the longest with his drunkeness and showed the most emotional damage from it. In his eyes she was not as good as her older 3 sisters and he delighted in telling her that. Also I had to continuously support my daughter after she would hear another one of his angry onslaughts. She went to AlATeen also for her support and she finally realized and internalized that her dad was mentally ill and it wasn't her fault. It still hurt (like it does to all of us) but she could see the big S on his forehead for "SICK". It is better now that he has had 11 yrs. in AA and after he had cancer he got into cancer support groups.

It will get better if he wants to work on himself. It will not if he doesn't see it and doesn't change his perceptions.

oldgraduate · Senior Member

KL - I can fully understand your being hurt by what he said, but consider the source. And in my case, I often acted like a nutcase in response to my AH's behavior and the chaos created by it. I have had to learn to own my behavior and not take it personally if it is not received as I would like. On the housecleaning - I spent all day Sunday doing it while my AH was out. He noticed the fact that the stove and microwave were not cleaned and that's all he noticed. So I handed him a lysol wipe and said- here, you can clean it. I guess I missed it when I was cleaning the toilets, mopping, sweeping, dusting. He just kind of giggled, so I think I got my point across. It made me feel better to stand up for me, maybe I should have just dropped it, I don't know. But as far as raising the children, that is the most important job you can ever have. And take it from me, I see now that my kids are grown adults that I was a stable force for them and what I did trully mattered. They see their father for who he was and is and it validates even more the quality and importance of the job I was doing. Hang in there, you are doing what's right. I have had to learn NOT to easedrop on my AH. What he is saying is none of my business anyway.

maresie · ~*Service Worker*~

the ex A projected everything all over me. His life was a crater of a mess, debt, crisis, conflict. I was the one with the "problem".

I had to detach, detach, and then detach some more. Change my expectations. People riddled with problems are looking for someone to dump on. I had to become resistant to being dumped on.

I now expect little from any alcoholic except chaos, crisis and travail. How much I let it affect me is another matter. of course it does affect you but when its an obsession you have to detach..and then detach some more. Detaching is an art it takes a lot of practice.

maresie.

Bettina · ~*Service Worker*~

I believe that detaching is what we have to practice, but I found it wasnt something I could do forever. Not to the degree it would take to live with this crazed person. Yes, the alcoholic is a sick irrational person, but does that mean I have to live with it always, while the alcoholic is not getting treatment and continues to act in ways that are unacceptable to me. How long do you allow it, especially when your the one that is doing all the work.

Solutions is what I try to practice. Boundaries, time limits, for me ...my life is passing, Im doing the changing and nothing is changing. What do you think you need to do to exact a change?? Sometimes we need to act, sometimes we dont. The program will help you develop a strong connection to your higher power, as we cannot live with an alcoholic without any spirtuality. There's is gone or they never developed it.

Remember Klotus, we are born with free will and get to decide what we want to do with our lives, instead of being caught up in this game and disease. We have free choice and self worth. Which we seem to forget from dealing with the nut case that is drinking away his life.

Take the focus off of him and work your journey to recovery! We cannot tell you what to do with your marriage, that is your decision. Many people join Alanon hoping that this will stop their loved ones from drinking, it wont!! The alcoholic has their own journey and path.

Alanon helps us live and make the right choices for our own lives. Its not about doing a perfect program. Hoping that if I do this, the alcoholic will stop, you will be greatly dissapointed.

We must first get well ourselves , keep coming back and working it.

Hugs, Bettina

-- Edited by Bettina on Tuesday 16th of August 2011 03:11:16 PM

sookie · Senior Member

I also have experienced this kind of thing--it is maddening. It sounds like you have described my own toxic prison that I called home for years!

At times like that, I would crawl right in to my bed with one of my daughters so it can remind me why I need to be the strong, sober, sane one!!!!

Watching a peaceful little angel sleeping would be all I would need to forget the A, just for a little while. I was reminded that my efforts are worthwhile and NECESSARY...and eventually I found the strength to move in a different direction from my AH. It took a LONG time and I also felt like I had read about 8 dozen self-help books, but you know what--they HELPED so who cares!

Best wishes for peace.

KLotus · Senior Member

You are all amazing!! Thank you!

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.

"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"