The material presented
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information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
When I got home from my Al Anon meeting last night, my wife was impaired. I didn't stick around for long to see just how bad it was--just went right to bed to read. This morning, there's no acknowledgement of what happened the night before from either of us. We just talk about the weather or the kids or about our upcoming trip. My wife is in good spirits as if the night before never happened. I'm a bit cold to her because I'm angry about the night before.
I do feel a sense of progress, because in the old days I would have made a big scene when I got home and carried it into this morning as well. Now I just don't say anything. And while not reacting has helped my peace of mind quite a bit, at the same time it also feels wrong. It just reminds me of when I was a kid, and the morning after my parents had had a huge drunken arguement, there would be no discussion of it or acknowledgement of it at all the next day. And I hated that.
I don't know what I would say or what the purpose of it would be. I have to admit, part of the reason I don't like not acknowledging it is because I don't want my wife to feel like she "got away" with something. But I know she doesn't feel that way, and I know she is hurting and embarrassed.
WOW .. can I soooo relate. Thank you for this share. Right what you said about it's like it never happened is a biggie around here. It's hard to remember that we are not judge and jury in this situation. The anger thing for me has been a challenge. I have been moving in and out of anger since Monday. Yesterday was not such a good day for me and my spirits. What I'm so grateful for and the program as well as other reading has taught me I don't have to stay there. I know I have every right to be angry, I remind myself not to allow my A or what he does or doesn't do to define me or define my day. That's all me baby. :) I get to choose. Feeling something, they are my feelings and no one has a right to tell me "I should" or "I shouldn't" feel a specific way.
I'm a very verbal person, like DUH .. lol. So not saying anything or not doing anything is sooo hard because I just desperately want to do or say something because how can this just sit here. It needs to be addressed and it needs closure!! That's the logical sequence of events that I need to move on. Good luck with that and I'll let you know how that's working for me because it's not .. lol.
The reality I have come to find especially with my own situation is I live in reality to the best of my ability, my A can live in denial. At some point the denial and reality will clash. I'm not talking about having a fight or anything like that I'm talking direct consequences for him and aka collateral damage for the kids and myself. Right now all I can do is allow whatever consequences are going to happen, they have to happen for him and shield the kids and myself from the collateral damage. Maybe it's not court for your AW, maybe it's a hangover I don't know, .. there is always something, and again maybe not that second my A's took 10 months to get here and he will be feeling it until 2013 that's a big one. It's a big Let go and Let God on for me.
I also believe and again this is me that at some point there is a time and place to talk about feelings. Def not in the heat of the moment as again so doesn't work for me. As I work the program though, alanon is not about shoving things under the rug, it's really about facing things and really hard things about myself and then finding the tools to appropriately work through them. I know my "style" of arguing has changed, instead of allowing my A to deflect the issue at hand, I am able to redirect back to what I was talking about. Instead of worrying about oh this might upset him, I think how do I feel about this situation, does it upset me. So while I may "do nothing" or "say nothing" it just means it's not the right time and I may decide I don't need to bring it up.
I'm rambling .. lol .. sorry. I really did used to think that alanon you pretended nothing was wrong and it was this last time around for me that opened my eyes and said ohhhh .. now I get it .. lol. We may face them in a different way we still face everything about ourselves and our own situation.
Big hugs,
P :)
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Stepping onto a brand-new path is difficult, but not more difficult than remaining in a situation, which is not nurturing to the whole woman.- Maya Angelo
I know at this stage it might feel she is getting away with something, but she is not. You are making progress. I was married 36 years, the last 26 years I always brought up his drinking to him in hopes he'd see the light. Of course, this is before Al-Anon. I put us through a lot of needless hell.
I hope you are attending meetings, reading the literature, and have a sponsor or in the process of seeking on. The program teaches sanity. That I can say with absolute knowing.
Your wife, perhaps deep down inside, knows something is wrong. But only she can address it. My former recovering AH confirms this.
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You have to go through the darkness to truly know the light. Lama Surya Das
Resentment is like taking poison & waiting for the other person to die. Malachy McCourt
You've made such incredible progress in your program.
I felt like that so many times - like the other person was getting away with something because I didn't say anything. I felt like they should at least be very sure that I knew they drank.
It's still hard to understand that the A doesn't get away with anything by drinking. Their disease won out. They know they drank, and they also know that everyone else knows. They're already experiencing guilt and shame. In my opinion, saying nothing isn't sweeping it under the rug and pretending it doesn't exist. You can admit to yourself and to others that it did happen. By saying nothing, you give the other person the dignity to make their own choices, regardless of whether you agree.
Here's the way that I was taught by my wise old sponsor, when I was struggling with the exact same predicament with my ex-AW...
"Tom, she is going to either drink, or she won't.... No amount of berating, shaming, talking, coercing, begging, crying, demanding, pleading, or anything else from you is going to be of any value towards her sobriety whatsoever.... So ultimately, you have a choice.... Today, her drinking is causing you great angst, it gets you very upset - both physically and emotionally.... You have to question - for YOU - whether your reactions to her drinking are doing YOU any good... If the answer is YES, then keep doing the same thing..... if the answer is NO, then change your path."
In my opinion, you are choosing to change your path, and I say kudos to you for that - like others have said - it's not like she is "getting away" with anything here - it simply boils down to whether or not you want to allow her drinking episodes to ruin your chance at having a serene or even tolerable day....
Take care
Tom
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"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"
"What you think of me is none of my business"
"If you knew the answer to what you are worrying about, would it REALLY change anything?"
I understand and went through the very same feelings and emotions you are experiencing. It took me way too long to seperate the alcoholic at "night" from the person the "next morning". My experience is the "person" never apologies for the "alcoholic's" behavior the night before. Waiting for an apology that never came is like waiting for a river to stop flowing. I can't get in my alcoholic's head. I do have compassion for the disease. No person in their right mind would want to be consumed by this cunning, baffling, and powerful disease. Acceptance knowing I could detach, as you did last night, and over time realizing the "person" most times would be present the following morning made all the difference in the world for me. The key for me was acceptance. The alternative continued to make my life unmanageable.
Your situation with your alcoholic since you first came to MIP has been almost a mirror image of mine, including getting involved and working your program to the best of your ability. You are in a much better place than last Oct. when in one of your first post you told your wife to "GROW UP AND GET YOUR LIFE TOGETHER." She might not have grown up yet........but thats not the case with you. Your growing in the program one day at a time.
I too have to first of all acknowledge how far you have come in your recovery..I havent been repyling alot because ofg my own personal situation but have been following along. I have to agree with the above posts in that the A didn't away with anything, she knows she drank, you know it etc. If you feel the need to confront her I would ask myself what my motivation is in doing so. Just to make sure you know she's been caught? I think the only time I would confront or do something different is if you felt the children were in danger. If thats the case I would arrange for a babysitter for when you go to meetings. Other than that good job, keep workin it you are doin great! Blessings
Dear usetobeaner, one of the hardest things for me, right now, is learning to lower my expectations of them. they are active and in denial, still. The alcohol rules. My disappointment, anger and pain mean virtually nothing to them. Detachment is the only thing that seems to give me any peace at all.
I suspect, although I may be wrong on this, that you might be expecting the same things from the relationship as when you first married. As I often hear on this board---that is like going to the hardware store to buy a loaf of bread.
If you don't expect anything--TRULY don't expect it---you won't be disappointed. Some people have to lower their expectations down to the ground.
I'm working hard on this myself. It isn't easy. I have had to give up my expectations and the dreams I had attached to them. I am hoping to hang on to the love---and love them from the distance. I pray every day for the grace and strength to do this.
Please take from this share anything you need and leave the rest.
I know exactly how you feel. I could have posted the same thing. And there were so many times that I did shout, scream, guilt trip, coerce, silent treatment on my A. It never did any good, and it just made me feel even worse.
The book Getting Them Sober helped me change what I was doing. I didn't want to change, but I did it because eventually it has become second nature. Its taken me a year to get to this point where I don't get mad at him for drinking. I am even standing by my boundaries that I have set to protect me. I have learned that yelling at him the next day is actually enabling the disease and it caused him to drink more.
The passage in today's One Day at a time for alanon gives a gentle reminder to us about changing: "I can change nothing but myself. Do I need changing? If things are going wrong--or seem to be--maybe it's because of the way I'm reacting to them. If I accept the fact that the principal source of my unhappiness is in me, I'll be giving myself a good reason to do something about me. It isn't easy--but the rewards are beyond reckoning!" "My happiness cannot dpend on my forcing changes in somebody else. Nor does my misery come from anyone but myself" --August 3rd ODAAT page 216.
When I begin to feel the urge to yell at him, I come on here, I read my literature or Getting Them Sober, I do other things, I call my sponsor or I write in my journal. Then I begin to see that it is a disease and I can seperate him from it....
You have come so far! Keep coming ;)
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-youfoundme
Let go and let God...Let it be... let it begin with me...
This thread makes me think of Tony. Tony was a member of an al-anon group I went to back in the former state I lived in. He would come to meetings and during his share, he would ALWAYS say, "I just stopped in for a little detachment fuel...." lol, it cracked me up every time.
But that is what MY recovery is all about.... detaching. Detaching from my expectations (which only set me up for a future resentment...) detaching from all my ATTACHMENTS... to things such as outcomes. I need al-anon because people don't always act the way I want them to act, they just don't. I sometimes forget that I'm not God so I need a fellowship to remind me.
Your share makes me glad because it reminds me that I am not alone... I do that too, I wonder if I'm not sending the "wrong message" by "ignoring" anothers behavior.... like I have some kind of power. Behavior is everything... and your behavior was soo good because you didn't react, you have no amends to make... good on you!!! You may want to vomit up your frustration at a local al-anon meeting, where it's safe to do so... and then, grab yourself a little more detachment fuel while you're there, it's working very well for you, my friend.
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The prayer isn't for Higher Power to change our lives, but rather to change us.
I totally get where you're coming from. And my AH was in so much denial -- he didn't think people could tell he'd been drinking even when he passed out -- that I just hated the feeling of enabling that denial.
Of course we know that trying to get an alcoholic to acknowledge their drinking is futile. If they could acknowledge their drinking and the harm it causes, they'd be in an AA meeting.
But I was brought up in a family where the unspoken rule was "If you don't mention it, it isn't there." And this attitude drives me crazy.
I took to saying, calmly and without expecting a response, "Boy, the drinking is hard on me." A couple of times he tried to argue. I didn't engage. After a while he just ignored it. But it felt to me like I wasn't playing the game of "It doesn't exist." And it was the truth. The drinking is hard on me. However detached and enlightened () I get, it's been hard.
He never has stopped drinking, so it wasn't as if my saying it has ever had any effect on him. But it's had an effect on me. I feel like I'm no longer sweeping the truth under the carpet.
As always, what works for each one of us can be very different. Take what you like and leave the rest.
Thanks everyone, every reply has been helpful to me. And I appreciate the encouragement and kind words. I sometimes feel like this is the world's largest jigsaw puzzle...and I've finished one corner. And I look at that corner, and I feel really proud and excited. But then I look at the rest of the pieces, so many of them just scattered about everywhere, and I feel like I'll never get it all done. But I'm not giving up...and I've got that corner done, so I'm getting there!
Thank you usedto for posting this and thank you to everyone who responded. This has truly helped me and strengthened me today. It is so amazing to know that all I have to do to feel like someone knows what I am going through daily is just log on to this site and read the posts. Makes me feel like I have my own little army of comrades ready to help me battle through my day.
I haven't been here long, but I already love you all! Thanks again!
One more thing...Don't forget to live in and appreciate the NOW. If it's a good day, hold on to it. Try not to allow the disease to take any more of your happiness, time or power then it has. The drinking was yesterday.. past, gone, done, kapoot, over.
I used to battle my thoughts by telling myself I was feeding in to the disease-monster by letting it take over my thoughts. The battle was on to let it go. In a sense it's true. The more we think about or give of ourselves to it, the bigger it gets.
You're doing great :)
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If we think that miracles are normal, we will expect them. And expecting a miracle is the surest way to get one.
You can still be detached in a healthy way and make supportive comments right? If she is trying to stay sober and is in AA but relapsing....a hug and a suggestion to call her sponsor...to go pick up a white chip (it could be either a good or bad idea depending)...If she has no desire to be sober, that is a different story.
First of all I think there is a huge difference between saying nothing and being in denial.
I stuck my nose into everyone else's business most of my life. I had no boundaries because I grew up boundaryless.
When it came to the topic of dysfunctional families, alcoholism and more I was the expert.
I currently live around alcoholics. We've had a ton of conversations about the dishes, cleaning up and more. Generally those conversations end up with me "doing".
Now I say nothing and I don't "do" the dishes, clean up anymore. I've said my piece.
For some of us it is an encylopedia before we've said our piece. I said volumes to plenty of alcoholics, none of them got "it". Now I say little, share little and boundary up. My expectations are very very low as far as they are concerned.
Saying nothing and denial are two different pieces. Sometimes they "feel" the same but I think for me saying nothing is part of boundarying internal as well as external. I've tired of spilling over with resentment. The toll is too high. I did the explaining, asking, arguing, shouting, pleasant asking, direct asking, all the asking got me nowhere. Saying nothing saves my energy.
In the past year I joined an alanon group. I needed support tonight and am grateful to have found this site and already feel calmer. One of the posts said that yelling at the A is enabling and that the A will drink more as a consequence. I understand that we are on our own healing journey of 12 steps but am confused about that idea. Tonight I yelled at my D&AH. Called him a liar etc. Of course I felt really bad for behaving that way. I know that I failed myself but how is that enabling him? What is abbreviation for drug and alcohol addict H? Thank you for all the posts. They're helping me already and this is my first night.
This story resignated with me a lot. My wife after about 7 months of sobriety started to show some of the old flags and even had her "8 month birthday" two days ago. Then last night, bam, drunk and drove my kids. I didn't have a knock down drag out last night, but this morning I left early so we didn't have to speak. I know we will, but not "forcing" a solution isn't natural when dealing with safety of the kids, etc. Rebuilding trust with an A is "mean"time in the meantime as they say. Driving our kids is a no-no and that boundery will have to be addressed.
Wish there wasn't so many of us struggling with this, but I sure appreciate reading everyone's ESH.
) I get, it's been hard.