"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"

Keel Man · Newbie

Newbie Dying Inside

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

Hugs Keel Man it sounds like you are in a lot of pain and feeling left out. Are you currently in a program for Alanon? It helps to know you are not alone in what you are feeling. There is so much wisdom on the boards, I'm sure someone will have something to share. The best thing you can do is start taking care of yourself :)

Keel Man · Newbie

Thanks Pushka, I have been to 3 Alanon meetings in the last 2 1/2 months. Unfortunately I travel a lot in for my work and I am not able to get to my home group often. I have recently learned since reading posts here it is advised to attend at least 6 meetings. On the rd again this week so hope to hit some in the town I am in.

canadianguy · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi there.... our programs suggest "same sex" sponsorship (and/or mentorship) for this very reason.... even IF there is nothing happening between them, it is hard for you, the spouse, to accept all of that.... I only have two (generic) pieces of advice for you.....

1. Try talking to your wife about it when you are NOT upset, and keep the focus on how much you want/love her, and not so much demanding what she "should" not do (none of us like to be "should" on, least of all newly sober A's...

2. Dive into your program of recovery.... early recovery is really tough - for both of you - the more you can focus on you, and YOUR recovery - and allow her the same - the better chance you both stand....

I empathize with you - the honest reality is, she will either be faithful to you (and her sobriety) or she will not.... Step one reminds us we truly don't have control over others, and that is the case here as well...

Take care, and keep coming back

Tom

hotrod · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi Keel Man Welcome

I recognized the pain "Heart being Ripped Apart" "Dying Inside" I have used those very words You are in the right place.

I am glad your wife is in recovery and now it really is important to leave her to her AA meetings and friends in AA . She must learn a new way to live and you must also develop new tools to live by.

I hope you can get to more meetings, learn to Keep the Focus on yourself, Live One Day at a Time, Learn to act and not react and most importantly,. Find your Higher Power

. Alanon will give you the tools that will lift the pain of this disease and replace it with serenity, courage and wisdom.

Please know that this disease is deadly and each of us, in a relationshop must take care of ourselves so that we can support others.

I urge you to keep coming back

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

Keel Canadian guy put it so simply and true.

Of course it hurts you. How do relationships start? Many times as being friends.Myself, I would not be able to handle that one at all.

Would make that clear, but not expecting him to change, this is my boundary, you are my husband, it makes me very uncomfortable to have you spend time with another woman.

Make a choice.Its up to them to decide what they want. In this instance I would not change me.

Keel for me just the fact he suggested that bike ride is inappropriate. She knew it would bother you.

Turn it around would she put up with you talking to another woman about how YOU feel?

I believe the marriage bond can be strong or not. It is up to us to decide what that means.

Myself I would not worry about it. I would "do" as I said, OF Course it would hurt, but I respect myself too much to put up with that behavior of anyone in my life, who would continue,knowing it hurt me so much.

Great share! hugs,debilyn

Jerry F · ~*Service Worker*~

"Does anyone else have any similar experiences to share and enlighten me as to how I can cope with this. End of Chapter one. It gets better stay tuned."

Oh yes...been there and done that more than several times and with different names for the "other". I'm a slow learner or was anyway until I got into Al-Anon. I did the anger and jealousy routine...suspicion, stalking, following, threatening hmmmm lotsa other stuff too. Then I arrived at the last word of the second step and it said "sanity". I did insanity best...by rote, habit, naturally first and always etc.

All of my alcoholic/addict partners, significant others, wives, etc had absolutely no idea how to see the picture other than from their own angle. Alcoholics/addicts are like that single minded, self centered to the extreem, dead feelings regarding how others feel and just can't relate to normal other than normally sick sick sick.

Hang with them and try to find some kind of normalcy in the relationship and the G ward at you local psych shop will be sending you discount certificates in the mail.

AA at times can be and is a gathering place for sick people having fun pretending that recovery can wait. The ones that "get it" live the program of recovery and don't play at it especially with other alcoholics who can loose their life to the disease.

Al-Anon is in almost every city in the Conus...going somewhere new...check the white pages of the local telephone book for the hotline number. (((hugs))) Keep coming back here also. smile

Rora · Senior Member

This made me think about what I've come to know and that is that the disease of alcoholism is so cunning that it can convince you that you don't have a right to feel anything negative in response to your situation. There have been endless (and I mean endless) examples in my relationship with the A that began with me feeling uneasy and uncomfortable with a situation and it ending with me obviously being uncompassionate, greedy, over-reaactive, unsensible, unreasonable, out to get him, lacking in understanding. My whole life became about doubting myself and my character and my ability to assess a situation properly. I was so taken by his disease and the manipulation. It always seemed like the situation ended in something being wrong with ME. that I was not allowed to have any feelings especially feeling that made it difficult for the A to do what the A wanted to do.

Now being on the outside of that, i realize that I am entitled and it is normal to have feelings about a situation and be able to voice them and in a relationship, reach a reasonable agreement about boundaries. (I'm not in a relationship, but I look forward to one day being able to have one that includes such things!)

If you are feeling uneasy about this relationship that your wife is having with another man (A, or not A, mentor or not mentor, is any of that REALLY relevant?) then you have the option of speaking with her about it and you also have the option of setting some boundaries and you also have the option of following through on your boundaries and consequences according to the behaviour thereafter.

I like what Jerry said that AA is sometimes a gathering place for sick people pretending that recovery can wait. This speaks to me in a very vivid way. My A would claim sainthood nearly because he attended a meeting. Recovery in AA and making an appearance are different things I believe.

Rora

tommyecat · ~*Service Worker*~

Keel Man,

I would feel the same way as you have in your post. When I began in Alanon, my sponsor did caution me about male friendships in the program. That it may be harmful to my spouse in that we were working on trust and repairing our relationship. I recall her saying stick with the women. It was the best suggestion I have had.

Many responses to your post have responded going to Alanon and working a program. For me it really transformed my life and the relationship with my spouse. I do so hope you consider going to as many meetings as you can, as close together as you can before you make a decision whether or not it is for you.

Best,

Tommye

pinkchip · ~*Service Worker*~

Keel man,

I am about 2 years and 9 months sober and here is what I recall of my first 6 months sober: My phone bill went up incredibly. I constantly needed to be in touch with people from AA, as I felt I did not know how to live life without them. People from the fellowship held me up when I couldn't do it myself. It had to be this way for me until I developed a more personal sense of faith and a foundation for sobriety. I can't say that the relationship she has with this guy is on the up and up...but we do make very close relationships in AA because we felt like freaks that didn't fit in anywhere before and in AA we find we are not alone.

So...some of what I am reading in your response does sound like normal newcomer in recovery stuff. Your wife has probably not worked the steps yet and is still rather self-centered...For the first part of recovery, I thing I was even more self-absorbed than when I was drinking.

I do think there is merit in you working a strong alanon program and forming your own contacts. You can always find an alanon meeting in another town too. Do you have an alanon sponsor?

You can tell your wife how you feel, but the jealousy and anger can dissipate because you cannot control her and are powerless over her. Focus on the serenity prayer. Your wife is still very new in recovery and is not well yet.

Otie · Senior Member

Dear Keel Man, I am very much more blunt than most people on this message board. So, please, please understand that this is simply my take on this based on lifetime experience.

I am not in AA, but I hear over and over tht there is strong reason that same gender mentoring/sponsoring, etc. is recommended. It strikes me that it has gone over the line to inappropriate. He is the one that is in the power position and I suspect that he is having secondary gain from this. (I;m not saying that anything has happened at all).

Your wife is very vulnerable right now. I also don't think that just because someone is an alcoholic/addict that they are somehow exempt from the same consequences than anyone else.

Dear Keel, how would you feel and react if this were not an AA situation, but the guy next door or someone she worked with every day? I think the basic issues are the same. Somehow I dont think that mentoring has to involve clinging to someone else on the back of a bike.

I suggest alanon, of course. I would do a lot of talking with some oldtimers in AA (that do not know the partys involved).

In support. I invite you to keepposting.

Very sincerely, Otie

mslouise · Senior Member

I believe in diving into a program....but I also believe in loopholes that one looks for, or excuses, or whatever you would like to call it that the As may use. I also think some (and I'm not saying your wife at all), try to get us to "get on board" with anything they want to do, and they use the famous guilt trip to do it - (but I'm not drinking, or I'm going to meetings, etc. so I can....you don't support me....blah blah blah)

I am with Otie....would it be acceptable to you if this were not an AA situation?

xeno59 · ~*Service Worker*~

Tough situation for sure and as stated this is why it is strongly suggested that sponsers/mentors be of the same sex.
In AA there are many of what is called 13th steppers, these are people men and women see a vulnerable newbie come in and they try to form a relationship. It is not condoned.
Neither my husband or I are alcholics or addicts so I am not the best one to give any experience on the marital dynamic. However I am a sexual abuse survivor an can give a little of my experience on that.
Yes I was abused by men ( bad enough ) but and here was this important part for me... I was not proctected by the one person who's job it was to protect me, my mother and not only was I not protected my mother was well aware of the abuse ( by my uncles ) and my mother was a single mom and needed them for money so not only was I not protected I was pretty much served up for the abuse. That made me more distrustful of women rather than men and I am not sure if that makes sense to you.
So most of my friends have always been male. Once I met and married my husband almost 30 yrs ago I still preferred male friends only difference was I always included my husband in these friendships never did anything secretly. Most of my friends were also married or had girlfriends so if there was an activity it was always a double date, no secret phone calls or meetings etc. That to me would have been extremly inappropriate and hurtful to my husband. Thier is a line in the sand that should never be crossed to maintain a healthy relationship.
Maybe you should meet this friend of hers
But the main thing is for you to work on YOU and get into your program. That way you can learn how to set boundaries. Your wife is in early recovery, in that stage they are very self centered much the same as when they were drinking and until she starts working the steps and changing behaviors it is a pretty rough road. Her focus is on herself, your focus needs to be on you and getting yourself healthy. If you are both working your programs idealy you will grow together and form a healthy relationship.
I wish you the best in your program
Blessings

Keel Man · Newbie

Hi All,

What can I say. But I send out hugs to all. Your words of encouragement and LOVE felt here are far beyond what I could ever imagine or expect.

I found an Al-Anon meeting to go to tonight of which I have just returned to my lonely hotel room. However I find my room is not empty, because GOD is here by myside, and he is reflected in your words. I have another meeting planned tomorrow night and then again the next night.

All of your words from so many different angles have spoken volumes to me. It is good to know that so many people can get relief from the hurt of living in the shadow of an Alcoholic.

Thank you ALL.

ifa · Veteran Member

I originally got into alanon many years ago because my first H was an A, and he was in AA. We had been a miserable couple for about 8 years and then he finally got into AA and found God. His recovery was all-important, and my feelings were secondary at best. I had no confidence and I don't remember now how I felt or reacted. He started having women friends in AA and soon after that he ended our relationship. He probably did me a big favor, but it hurt.

I know how you feel because I get extremely jealous and worried. My current qualifier is not an A, but he does a lot of A-like things. He thinks it's ok to have women friends, no matter how much it hurts me. He says I should know he would never be unfaithful and he loves only me. Yeah right, whatever you say hon.

It's hard, very hard, to know if we can really trust someone we love. I cheated on my ex-A, but only because I thought he didn't love me. After the relationship ended, I felt horribly guilty and knew I could never do that to anyone ever again. So I can't imagine my current qualifier doing it to me, when he knows how much I love him.

But who knows? We never know, and no one can tell us. My HP will let me know the truth if I am ready. So far all my prayers on this subject have been answered with the idea that my qualifier does love me. But I am still always skeptical. Will keep praying.

Do not assume the worst of your wife, because she might really love you and just need this guy as a friend for now. On the other hand, your jealousy is perfectly understandable. We cannot demand faithfulness, and too much angry jealousy can actually make things worse. So respect your own feelings, but also respect her, and most of all pray before you speak. I keep on forgetting that one, but it is a relationship saver.

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.

"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"