"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"

Jeff · Member

When does the bitterness end?

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

Welcome to MIP.

Al Anon is here for us. We can do nothing for the A. Also there is no figuring out anyone. We have a hard enough time trying to figure out ourselves!

I am sure she knows that when an A comes out of rehab, it is very much stressed and recommended they do 90 meetings in 90 days. And as many as possible after that. Just stopping using whatever they do is nothing. Its only one symptom of a horrible disease.

She is still very, very sick. If she cannot take care of herself, how is she going to co parent?

She feels what she does. We cannot control that. The best thing to do is find a meeting for you to go to. Read as much literature as you can and come here. Theres so much for us as non A's to learn.

Even if you do divorce, your going to Al Anon will help you with the kids.

Her bitterness is her own. She is an adult, until it bothers her, it won't change.

So we learn to take care of ourselves, learn skills to not get pulled into their disease.

You got her into treatment? One thing for sure, the A has to do it on their own, because they want to go, because they desire to get better. They need to find the rehab, call, get themselves there. Then they KNOW they need/want to get further help.

It's like going and getting heart surgery but not following a program to stay well.

Their disease is none of our business. Its our business to take care of ourselves so we can take care of those we love.

It's a very horrible powerful disease, they are never cured. We need to learn to have zero expectations.

hope you keep coming, debilyn

Rora · Senior Member

Good question... one that I've asked myself also. My bitterness tends to come and go in waves. When it comes, I know that I'm off track in my attitude.

The A's bitterness? Well, no amount of convincing, reassuring, explaining, defending, apologizing, has ever made a difference for me, so I've stopped. My experience has been that his bitterness and take on reality has nothing to do with me. As a parent, I've been very concerned about how that will reflect onto our son - again, not something within my control. We are powerless when it comes to the actions and attitudes of anyone but ourselves. It's a vulnerable and uncomfortable place to be. I've found that I have tried to control the situation so it doesn't feel so vulnerable and uncomfortable. When I've done that, it felt a lot like whamming my head (and heart) against a brick wall. So, accepting vulnerability and discomfort has seemed like the most viable option in comparrison.

In my life, the A knows only how to blame me for everything wrong in his life. For his drinking, for his emotional pain, for his failures, for his fear and sadness. I'm far from perfect, but his beliefs about me are not accurate as far as I am concerned. This is also something that I cannot control and also something I've given up on defending or correcting or explaining. Again, I arrive at powerlessness. Active A's are known for blaming those around them because they cannot handle the responsibility of looking in the mirror. I've been given the advice to detach, detach, detach, with love. It's a active and deliberate process every day.

Rora

Jeff · Member

The hardest part is being powerless for me....I understand it, but need to get there. I was so hoping that the treatment would put her well into her recovery. I hoped that she would see her wrongs.....all I was told was that my actions in the past led to her infedility and comments.

We had the perfect life.....it was story book. From the outside anyone wouldve been jealous and wanted the same.

Now Im just hoping she gets thru her ongoing treatment and gains so compasion for others. I realize I cant control that.....Im also worried about my kids. I want to give her half custody as she has requested....but worry she cannot handle the responsibility.

There is no good answer.....other than it is out of my control.

I just pray she gets to the point where her brain begins to act rational. I hoped it would be once she was no longer under the influence of alcohol. I now see its a long, long road.

I understand that this addiction has greatly affected her brain and thought process....I actually have a degree in psychology.....I only wish I knew when she would return to rational thought...and I do know that its out of my control. I guess it helps to type it here on the forum.

Thanks for the previous and continued advice

tommyecat · ~*Service Worker*~

Jeff,

The one thing I have learned is that the disease doesnt like to be called out or identified. I had insane arguements with my loved one about their drinking and it would always be my fault. Suddenly we would be talking about one issue and it would mushroom like an atomic bomb into all of the wrongs from our entire relationship. I was always the evil one. It seemed to me like the disease trying to deflect any the attention from the problem. There are no winners in that situation.

I have discovered that the best thing was to take the next right action for me and keep things really simple. That really helped the relationship in addition to going to meetings, and working the steps with a sponsor. Those things help to me stay sane, strong, and get some clarity as to what I wanted and needed in my life.

Respectfully Yours,

Tommye

likemyheart · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi Jeff - with my AH it isn't just bitterness, its downright hatred. He spews anger and hate at me whenever he is angry and I seem to make him angry almost every week. Funny thing is, during my time away from him and working on myself, my own natural personality and traits are returning and he doesn't really like the person I am - independent being a major one - not of his control. When he is angry, I am just like every woman he's ever known, wanting to steal everything from him, take him to the cleaners (not that he has ANYTHING to take) and I'm to blame for everything wrong in his life. BUT - I've only known him for three years, I can't possibly be to blame, he's had a drinking problem and anger issues a whole lot longer than three years - AND - Where does his personal responsiblity ever come into play?

My father's anger controlled me as a child and for almost three years my not wanting to make AH angry has controlled me - I don't like people mad at me and I will do whatever it takes to avoid confrontation, usually. My AH will get mad, spew hate, I don't speak to him for a week or so, then he'll send a "how come you don't call me back" type of message - its insane because he really expects to be able to say and do anything to me and that I will just take it, be hurt, then be back to "normal".

When I first delved into Al-Anon and he started AA meetings, I had the wild excited hope that he would get it and the miracle would happen that he'd become again the quiet gentle mannered man I fell in love with, was going to spend the rest of my life waking up with; that he'd see the cycle of pain and apologize and we'd work together to vanquish the evil that was holding us down. (Disney music queing up anyone?) Giving up that hope was hard, accepting that I can want till I'm blue in the face but my want won't change anything in him. The only person I control is me. It could take decades or never happen, for him to find his own recovery, especially since right now he is adamant that he doesn't need AA and was only depressed and its all my fault and i'm so horrible and blah blah blah.

Its very sad.

GailMichelle · ~*Service Worker*~

Hi Jeff,

It's quite common for alcoholics to be bitter and blame others. A month's stay at a rehab facility is just the beginning.

What friends and family need is Al-Anon. I hope you find meetings in your area. I finally did after about 26 years of living with a very active alcoholic. I was way late for my first meeting. As a result, I suffered needlessly.

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

Dear Jeff, I was thinking about what you wrote.

For me, I think the bitterness ended in my ears when I realized it was just a sick disease talking. So really what control does it have over me? I don't have to be bothered by her or his bitterness, its all bolony anyway.

I honestly let all his sickness go. After losing all I had but my cloths and a few things, I just feel sorta nothing but a scar on my heart.

Maybe think of it like she has a fever, would you take to heart what she said during that?

The more you figure out how to protect you and your kids the better. Build a healthy happy life.

I was just thinking Jeff. I never, ever put the A down to the kids. never. But as they, mostly my son, grew to young adults they hated him. They saw how he treated me. Now I knew it was the disease after awhile. But it didn't matter what I said or did, they made their own decisions about him.

But then they both experienced an A in their life,listened to me about Al Anon, read Getting Them Sober. Now they both have softened their hearts. No they don't want to see him but they don't carry in pain inside anymore.

I hope you accept our support and love. Even though my AH is not around me now, I still suffer many scars and pain sometimes, these great, and some kooky, people

help me every time. much Love,debilyn who was half asleep when she posted ya last night! zzzzzzz yawn yawn

White Rabbit · ~*Service Worker*~

For me, the bitterness ended when I was able to stop having expectations of other people. Particularly when the alcoholics in my life were drinking and promised to stop, I had expectations that they would actually do what they said. I took it personally and got hurt and upset each time it turned out that they didn't stop drinking. When I was able to stop expecting a particular outcome, I was able to keep myself from getting hurt/upset/angry/bitter/jaded/whatever other negative emotion follows from feeling let down. Alcoholics are sick individuals that can't even keep promises to themselves. In the program, I've learned that I can avoid being hurt when I stop expecting a particular outcome, stop expecting a particular person to act in a particular way, and just detach.

Blessings - keep coming back.

maryjane · ~*Service Worker*~

HI,
She really is very early in her recovery. Coming out of rehab doesn't mean anything more than the fact that she has been without the booze for a few weeks. It doesn't mean that she is fixed or anywhere near being fixed. The years of booze have done a physical number on her brain and her brain function. It takes more than a few weeks to fix that. She also has some psychological and emotional fixing to get done. It will take YEARS. She is only at the beginning.

Go to the getting them sober website and read some of the chapters that are on the web. It is free. You will think that the author has been following you around writing notes about you. It is all pertinent.

Don't give away too much in the divorce. Don't assume she is healthier than she is. For the kids' sake you want her to prove she is capable to raise them. And you want to know that she will be able to handle the stress of raising kids.

Stay on the website and read, read, read. Get to some face to face meetings too. There are a lot of guys in my area that go to meetings.

Pushka · ~*Service Worker*~

I keep seeing this post pop up with new responses, it's so good to see all of the support that is on here it truly helps. Something I would highly recommend is to go to an open AA meeting where the recovering a's share their story of recovery. It makes a big difference to hear the stories of the "other side" of the equation. I agree with the other posters face to face meetings make a very big difference because it splits out what are our issues and what's not. We are not responsible for the A's recovery in anyway. It sounds like you wife has a lot to face and has to be in a lot of pain now that things aren't so hazy for her. Anger is a big tool of deflection. It's still not your issue. She has to find her way back or not. Good luck to you.

Jeff · Member

Thank you for all of the advice on Fathers Day! The posts and information are a great help. The times are going to get worse as the divorce moves on. I know she is projecting her anger etc. on me as a defense mechanism. Ive told her to keep conversation about the kids, as our relationship is over and I can only worry about myself.

Its a baby step for me......My biggest fear is that with all of the anger it gives her a reason to run to the bottle. With that said I keep repeating to myself that this is not my concern.....and that I need to do what is right for myself and my kids.

I really do appreciate the help!

canadianguy · ~*Service Worker*~

For me, my bitterness ended (or at least subsided), when I realized how much damage it was doing to me, and my kids.... I was turning into an angry, frustrated person, who was not pleasant to be around.... When my frustration and bitterness spilled over to my kids and my life in general, I knew I had to stop..... for ME.

I remember, early on in my recovery, hearing some oldtimers in Al-Anon saying things like "I thank my HP for the A in my life, as without him (her), I would have never found all this wonderful program of growth and recovery for myself"..... I remember being astounded to hear that, and couldn't fathom how anyone could possibly be thankful for all this stuff that we encounter with addictions, etc.... Today, I understand that statement much more than I could at that time..... I am truly a better human being because of Al-Anon, and the experiences I have been through.... I would stop short of "wishing" this on anyone, but there ARE positive outcomes that resulted from choosing recovery for ME...

Take care

Tom

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.

"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"