The material presented
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AH has been off of prescription clonazepam and Effexor for over a month. I have written before to describe his paranoid behaviours. Much of the time, things go reasonably well (although he still doesn't help out around the house even though he is on sick leave). However, I can usually count on something going wrong each day that makes me question if I can stay in this marriage. This one might be sound trivial, but it is just one in a long list of things. I am furious with him and with myself. Since he has come off the drugs, he is very anti-drug. He is making everyone else's business his business. Today he asked that I call the pharmacy and get them to print out a list of all the drugs that my daughter and I are on. I refused b/c I had been truthful with him all along. He made a big deal about how it was for his recovery, etc. I argued that he needed to learn just to trust that I was telling the truth and that since I had never done anything to make him mistrust me, then I shouldn't have to do this. And furthermore, it is my business what I decide to put into my body (as long as it is approved by a doctor). After awhile I realized that not making the call was going to make it harder on me than giving in. So I gave in and called the pharmacy. He immediately went to get the lists. Of course it showed nothing other than the meds I had told him about. Now I can barely look at him b/c I am so sick and tired of this. There was absolutely no reason for him to request htis list except to prove to himself that I was or wasn't lying. And if I did happen to be on a benzo, then that was my business anyways! I told him that this type of thing is going to be the thing that breaks the marriage. I told him I am willing to answer questions that help him reconstruct the past, but that I will not tolerate being made to feel like a liar (and a cheat...he accused me of an affair a few weeks ago). He insists he has done nothing wrong. I am mad that I gave in, as I had nothing to hide and have never done anything to make him think I would lie to him. Ugh...I am SO ANGRY AND FED UP. I am actually embarrassed that I gave in. It makes me feel weak and manipulated. Anyways...this is my question...should I do these things to help in his recovery?Should I not take it personally and try to understand that he needs clarification on certain issues in order to sort out what is foggy from his past? I want to help him recover but I am not someone's doormat. Living with him now makes me insane just like when he was drinking. I don't even know if I am just a cold person who is refusing to do what is necessary to help him heal...or am I being manipulated and abused? I can't even tell anymore!
What a stressful time in your household. My sense is that Al-Anon teaches us to live our healthiest lives, and that means not bending over backwards to change regular healthy behavior at the insistence of the alcoholic.
I haven't been through exactly the same situation as you, but I remember when my AH insisted he wasn't drinking. He insisted on this deal where I would have alcohol-testing equipment and at random moments I would give him an alcohol test, "so I could see he wasn't drinking." He didn't get that this would make me feel like a police officer, not like a loving partner. The fact is that when he drank, it would always become apparently before too long anyway. Not too many people can be in the grips of addiction and act perfectly normally. So doing all the checking would be unnecessary and also woudl make the dynamic between us pretty weird and, to my mind, unhealthy. If he had proposed testing me for alcohol, I think that would have been even more extreme. Addiction makes them insane, that's clear to me, and even when they stop practicing their primary addiction, the insane thinking can go on and on. And it even affects us to the point where it's hard to know up from down and sane from insane.
I hope you're able to get to some meetings? It's so hard to keep steady on what's right for us when the addict is pushing, pushing, pushing. Keep your eye on the sane stuff -- and keep coming back.
My philosophy is to let my business be my business and everyone else's business be their business. I don't see how sharing your med list with him could in any way aid in his recovery.
Put that baseball bat down that you are beating yourself up with. You will get another chance sooner than you think to start over again. Al-Anon allows us to start for scratch each and every day.
My sponsor told me once that "Sometimes we get it.....and sometimes we get got"
Lynn put the focus back on yourself and start taking care of you first.
HUGS, RLC
-- Edited by RLC on Saturday 31st of July 2010 02:09:21 PM
We never know another person's motives. Most addicts are very manipulative, he may have wanted to see what drugs you have so he can get them.
As far as his getting into your business, I believe taking care of our own inventory. We all have a right to our own life, and what parts we want to share.
Good or bad btw.
We will have to go thru our own consequences.
No way would I allow anyone into my private stuff, especially an A. I used to be an open book too.
No way, we cannot make them use, we cannot help them in recovery. It is totally up to them.
It is manipulation again.
I don't know how he got off those two drugs, but kicking effexor is horribly hard and it can make a person nuts. I know.
I am doing my best to now, am only taking a very tiny bit now.
Al Anon is perfect for you." Getting them Sober" that Tom is giving out is a great book. Tom is wonderful to do this service.
glad you are here.
There are face to face meetings too. Have you done that?
Stop beating yourself up, no point in wasting time there I also had to make choices I was not comfortable with at times. Were they the best ones, I don't know. But I did learn what was acceptable to me and what was not in each situation. In general I don't see how his being in your personal business/recovery is helping him anymore than you being in his personal business/recovery would help him, we learn in recovery to stay on our own side of the street. Your descriptions remind me of my xah in his MANIC state, no stopping him from whatever he became focused on at that given moment until whatever was triggered in him was fulfilled. It can be painful to watch and draining to participate in and at times in my situation actually scary. The worst one I saw was after he stopped taking effexor cold turkey. It is a very tricky medication to stop taking without side effects. Keep your focus on you, take care of you first and stay safe,
Yes i believe you are being manipulated and abused , what u take in med is none of his business again he is doing and saying anything to getthe focus off himself . If he is not getting help * meetings * he is stark raving sober . Knowing what med your taking will do absolutley nothing to help him . this is bs and I think you already know that . if your not going to meetings for yourself please find one quick , u go for you no one else . hang in there
Aloha Looking...I've been around for a while and pretty much have experienced that recovery doesn't take hostages. You're not helping his or your own recovery. That giving in sounded like the same ole enabling (things to get worse). You can learn "NO" by practicing it until it becomes a new habit.
He's needing you to stay responsible for what is going on with him and you need to fire yourself from that job...no long explanations just a very short respectful two letter sentence "No".
If he wants to find out if he is being appropriate in recovery let him get into the program and get a sponsor and ask the sponsor to guide him. Having said that I might suggest that you get around Al-Anon more often so that you can get that loving feeling more often and more workable lessons on how to change what you can change which of course is only yourself.
It takes courage to overcome old habits however the alternative if you don't is more insanity. Go build a stronger relationship with a power greater than your addict and yourself. That works when you work it. In support (((((hugs)))))
So glad you posted this. I can definitely relate. One time I asked my AH what he was on (I addressed the behavior of slurring and being drowsy) and he completely turned it on me. He said look at all the pills your taking and opened the cabinet of vitamins and stress supplements. It's kind of funny now but at the time I actually believed the justification for about ten minutes until i was able to run it by a friend in recovery. This disease is cunning baffling and powerful. I would like to also suggest reading "Getting them sober". It was and still is a lifesaver for me. It talks about how the disease turns things around like that. I must admit this program works. I am getting times of serenity - even when he's in the disease. It helps me to imagine him as a 4 year old in pajama's trying anything to get what he wants. Makes it easier to pray for him.
let it begin with youThat means be easy on your self, take a deep breath step back, relax and view the insanity and chaos for what it is.It is his disease.You did not cause it, you absolutely can not control it and only he and God can stop it.
Every time you post you are telling my story, my life.I have been exactly where you are now.I was so consumed by the chaos and insanity I began to think it was normal. I was manipulated with guilt, fear and shame.When I look back now, I see how I had become part of the disease but I am free of that now. I refuse to contribute to it (the disease) anymore.
You owe it to yourself and to your children, even to your husband, to do what is right for you. You have gotten sound advice from the people on this board. Keep coming back keep asking questions, even the same ones, until they make sense to you.You are important and your recovery is important to everyone in your life.
The interesting thing for me is that I was in my relationship with my A and it was insanity through and through. Then we took a year off, I immersed myself in my own recovery, we got back together - and I saw things so much more clearly.
I remember having all fingers pointed at me, the blame, and the lack of trust and sitting on the edge questioning my sanity and whether I had done something wrong. After some time in the program, working the steps, and doing much reading . . . I learned a little more about what healthy behavior is. How I should be acting and how I should expect to be treated. That helped a LOT. When I was faced with unacceptable behavior it was much easier to recognize. Al-Anon also helps you learn how to respond. That I am still working on. I tend to either get too angry or just detach to the point of disconnect. Still a work in progress. The neat thing is that once I was able to see clearly these behaviors it didn't feel insane anymore, even when I was right in the middle of it. I didn't get overwhelmed by it. I wasn't happy about what was happening, but I also didn't let it consume me and feel that I was to blame. As much as he would act out and do unacceptable things and then respond with "But you . . . " they just bounced off. I didn't accept them. It felt REALLY good.
Please don't be so hard on yourself. It takes practice and learning and it is NOT easy. Please keep coming back - you are worth it!
Tricia
__________________
To be trusted is a greater compliment than being loved.
Sorry but I am the sceptic in the room Having been lied to for so many years i just can't believe anything my A says If asked for a print off of all my meds my mind would go first and formost to the fact that this may be a fishing expedition for him to see what if any drugs were being hidden by you or your daughter that he may want to get his hands on. Thats was my very first thought upon reading your post. As a mother of an A with a disability I never told him what meds i was on but he knew there was something out there he may want and has been known to literally rip my room apart looking for what i was taking. And no matter where i hid it that darn kid found it. My last resort was hiding meds from him in the dog bed ( how completly insane is that). Finally I just gave up all meds as he was just taking them anyway Anyway I would check his motives again i am the sceptic lol
I'm very very familiar with the chaos any alcoholic can create. I recently discovered a formula for it, chaos, over reaction, need. If I look at most of my interactions with alcoholics it goes about that way some of the time (not all of it).
If I can step out of the fray its so good for me. One way is to delay, not acede to the urgency, then generally they may go away. Another is to get extremely busy with your own life and recovery. If the alcoholic is in some kind of recovery he should be doing that anyway.
Detaching is such a hard hard task. I know its taken me years to get a grip on it. I really encourage you to explore that tool and work on it. No one is good at it in the beginning. The more you do it the better it gets.
I would also recommend the book Getting them Sober. In there is a lot of sage advice and wisdom about early recovery and expectations.
