((( Gailey )))  I didnt see the movie but I have to assume that the men meant, bc of the support and the fact that they figured out how to stop enalbing their husband's and their own disease (denial & blame shifting).  The men still had to get sober for themselves and take responsibility for their own behavior.  No Lois can, "do it for them."

You have to detach from that remark and not take it personally.  I know I have to work on that daily, bc a week or two of not constantly practising program and using all the tools -- and I am right back to owning someone else's stuff, focusing on what they're doing and how they're feeling.  I can only take responsibility for and own, what is within me.

I'm sorry I missed the movie and hope hallmark replays it sometime soon.

Gail, I have to agree with your son.  I watched the movie and was struck with the fact that in today's world of  treatment centers  and alcoholism psyco babble,she would have been called  a classic enabler.  Of coarse she did not have alanon and she was like the rest of us, trying to cope with this dreadful disease alone!!! She not only lost her family home but she lost everything and  She actually saved his life many, many times, it was his spiritual awakening in the Hospital (that she took him to) that stopped his drinking.  His follow up actions with Dr Bob set up AA.    

But after Bill achieved sobriety, and she was working in her alanon program she still supported his efforts.  She proof read the Big Book, stayed on other people's coaches and finally afer many  years, drew a boundry and was able to move into her own home at "Stepping Stones".  

As someone just pointed out in his later years of sobriety BIll had several affairs that she choose to overlook.  All is not perfect when living with sobriety or the drinking years and marriage and society were much different then than now.

-- Edited by hotrod on Friday 30th of April 2010 09:40:04 AM

-- Edited by hotrod on Friday 30th of April 2010 09:41:50 AM

-- Edited by hotrod on Friday 30th of April 2010 09:52:45 AM

I think too, that there was alot more respect for each other back then. I might have my rose colored glasses on, but the entire society and way of life was different. Regardless of a disease, people were raised to respect each other.

Many A's would fall away from respecting their spouses while in the depths of their disease. When sobriety happened, they found their gratitude, made amends and realized that their spouses stood by them and they had always deserved respect. They were greatful. Even when their spouses didn't stand by them, when they found true sobriety, they were willing and able to own their mistakes and make amends.

I have found that to be true even today in AA. When an A reaches a true level of sobriety, they have no issue in giving credit where credit is due. They are humble enough to tell you what their family and friends did that helped them. To give their wives credit is a natural progression of the program. IMO.

Being in a relationship is difficult and adding a life altering, personality changing disease to a relationship is deadly. So, when a relationship survives, it is perfectly normal and good to celebrate, I think.

Gailey wrote:

---

My hope was that many people that didn't understand the concept of Alanon would be watching the movie. My son's ex watched it. It made her very sad. I did not discuss this particular part with her but I would be upset if I thought she felt that he may have become sober if she would have just stuck it out with him. I don't believe that to be true.

---

I would hope the film doesn't leave anyone with the impression that Alanon is all about "getting them sober"!  I've seen people come to Alanon for years and still somehow think that, even if they don't say it - you can tell by their actions and words, that it is still their obsession to control their alcoholic.

Alanon is, IMO, a much more difficult program to "get" than AA.  The purpose of AA is obvious, even to non-alcoholics.  The purpose of Alanon is every bit as simple, but is perhaps very obtuse to the newcomer and the outsider.  How can someone be addicted to a person... or to that person's addiction?

I grew up in an alcoholic home, with an Alanon mother (at the time), became an alcholic, got sober myself in AA, and somewhere in between dealing with divorce from my non-Alcoholic, Alanon-dropout wife, and my alcoholic daughter - I finally "got" Alanon, after years of coming in and out, either not getting it or just feeling like, as an alcoholic myself, I had no right to be there.

I hear the same excuses in Alanon meetings as I hear in AA meetings.  I see the same misery.  I see people literally die from alcoholism, and in Alanon I see peoples lives brought down even if the person never took a drink.  We Alanons suffer from alcoholism just as surely as the alcoholic does - but sometimes our denial is greater, and our work more difficult.  I found sobriety, fellowship, and a lot of good times in AA.  I don't think I truly found serenity and peace of mind until I really worked my Alanon program for myself, and found forgiveness for myself, my daughter, my father, and the other alcoholics in my life.  I am still processing the impact of the very recent death of an old friend who died drunk - but I hate to think where I'd be without my Alanon program.

Barisax

The man who wrote the script interview Lois extensively. These words may have come right from her mouth. You never know. That was then and maybe couples stayed together no matter what. Today couples don't even marry. I loved themovie and cried through the whole thing.

In support,
Nancy

This is a very very good thread and discussion.  I'd like to throw in just a shard of the
picture (you can imagine Lois off to the side somewhere truely participating but...).
I just got this by email from another member friend, sent to her by her son, the son
of a deceased alcoholic; his father, who has dabbled in Al-Anon also.  Imagine the
spider web effect our recovery has if you will.  Our recovery actually reaches out and
touches others like alcohol does in a far different way. 

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/04/20/health/20drunk.html is a link that explains the
shard that reflects the professionals who dealt with alcoholics in their way...different
than that of the family but still fighting the disease.  The family and spouses (Lois) had
our responses which hardly ever at all worked and these professional had their own
which kinda sorta did and then had to be abandoned because it did'nt work.   The "God
Aspect" is the aspect with the highest success. 

Bill said in one of his talks before he died that he thought AA would have never survived
had it not been for Al-Anon.  I believe that is from "As Bill Sees it" or another piece of
AA literature.  I believe that also.  

Like Barisax and unlike Barisax in some ways I am also a dual member of both Al-Anon
at first and then AA nine years later.  Sounds crazy?  Yep and why not this is recovery
from a mind and mood altering fatal disease if not arrested by total abstinence.  More
than a handful for my AA fellows have said "I want what you have" and they are talking
about beyond abstinence from alcohol.  They want the peace of mind and serenity that
comes from the Al-Anon Program...the quiet, still, peaceful depth of spiritual serenity
and I tell them that they can't get it from in the rooms of AA from my experience, they
have got to get it elsewhere. (Al-Anon).  I tell the fellows who ask, that I am a dual
member and that if they want to widen their program I'll help.  That of course doesn't
or hasn't happened.  They have a valid reason; Fear.  An alcoholic knows fear from
anesthesia (alcohol) and an Al-Anon member doesn't have the anesthesia of alcohol
to block out reality...we go thru it wide awake.

What matters most and most to me is what happened when I first got into Al-Anon.
What happened first was that the fellowship stopped me, turned me around and
introduced me to God...a power greater than myself, the God aspect.  I then got
with the program.  Today there is no power greater than God (of my understanding)
and that God gave me the instrument of Al-Anon to rebuild my life and have one
very well worth living.

In the movie "Love is not Enough" Lois takes her shoe within frustration and hurls it
into Bill's chest.  If you ever see the lapel pin of the red high heeled shoe in or
around the program it is the metaphor for "Enough!!"  "I'm done".  My spouse has
one of these and we also have a refrigerator sticker of one to remind ourselves that
we're done...we're done.

We would not be here in the grace of God had it not been for alcoholism which God
used as a tool to bring us back home.  Cunning, Powerful and Baffling.

Humbly  (((((hugs)))))



-- Edited by Jerry F on Friday 30th of April 2010 02:53:22 PM

At one time I had a lot of criticism for Lois and Bill.  I no longer do.  I appreciate that they were indeed human.  As someone who did "everything" for an alcholic for years I know how he manipulated me to feel like he couldn't manage without me.  I left him 4 years ago.  He is still alive and causing chaos somewhere.

Detahcment has helped me a lot.  When people say things that used to send me off in rockets I can step back.  I can let go.  I oould not do that before because I was trying to be the "perfect" companion, girlfriend, sister whatever.  Perfection was one way to try to do it because I really had no idea what was enough and what wasn't.

Lois went through tremendous hardship with Bill.  She was the primary breadwinner for years.  I've been there too and I believe we all have.  I am so glad that out of that horror she managed with others to create a program that has hslped me immensely. 

Maresie.

barisax wrote:

---

I also remember a movie from the 80s or even late 70s starring Andy Griffith as a chronic alcoholic.  It was made for TV I think.  He reminded me very much of my dad, especially the final scenes of him sneaking drinks, lying about it, and then ending up dead.  In his final scene, he's dressed up in a suit, ushering in church (which my dad used to do), trying to put on the act of being normal one more time, when he collapses, puking blood - and dies.  That was pretty blunt stuff for the 70s, and I remember it well because I knew it to be the dead-on truth.

Barisax

---

Was it "Under the Influence"?  http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0092134/ 

 

You know... I just wish they'd spent some more time on the recovery than they did the drama of living with an alcoholic. Although I suppose working Al-Anon recovery and experiencing serenity and support doesn't boost ratings like a movie about a woman living with a raging alcoholic.

In any case... I'm still glad the movie was put out there. Although I think the recovery message was glanced over, it still opened the eyes of a lot of people living with alcoholism, and hopefully steered a lot of people to some Al-Anon meetings.