Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene

carolinagirl · ~*Service Worker*~

my life is not how i imagined

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

oh dear. You sound so beat up hon. I didn't realize your girl was only 15.

Has she been to psychiatrist who would do bloodwork, look into her hormones, nutritional imbalance etc?

Your family has been thru so much. Dad was back, dad leaves again. Married? So what happens when she is pg at 16? What happens when YOU may have to raise it hon?

She is a mixed up, totally out of control KID. I know you are doing your best. Have seen that all these years.

Do you have family that may be able to take her for awhile? My mother had my cousin for awhile. That really helped him.

Kids out of control like this need stability. Of course survivor camp would help! I wish she would get a chance to be somewhere, where there is stability and routine, rules, consistancy.

You shared your next daughter is showing the same behaviors. I am not so sure it has anything to do with the 15 year old. I can still remember when my
daddy left the first and only time. Carolina it was horrible. I am almost 57 and it still causes a pain in my heart.

If he had been sick, in and out, geez. I would have not have grown up like I did.

I have been here for you for years. Seen you work so hard. I have to tell you my whole self is screaming,"DON'T GIVE UP!" She is just a baby! 15!

There is theraputic foster care. It looks at her totally. mental, physical, emotional. Kids like this need serious help.

Hon no one can drive us insane. We have control over how we react!

Hope it is the right thing? At least at the moment? So I do see you are unsure. Good. I know you want to stop this insanity hon. Please slow down. It is not the answer.

I know we are not to give advice. MY experience is it is never ok for a 15 year old baby to get married!

You think some guy will take care of her? What happens when he does not like how she acts and may abuse her?

I know it will be hard for others to respond to your post hon. I WANT you to know i KNOW you are very brave to share this. You are hurting so badly.

Again your other two are seeing what I shared before with you. Put yourself in their place. They see their mom allowing their sister to do whatever she wants even if it destroys her.

I have been around kids like your daughter, u know that. I wish I was in better condition to be a theraputic foster mom for her. I loved that venture. Was so darn hard though.

Well you are strong and you can take what everyone will share with you. I have seen ya do it before. Please take it as we love you Carolina!

I am offering, what can I do to help you and your daughter????

love, long hug, debilyn

maresie · ~*Service Worker*~

I've definitely struggled tremendously with the Karpman triangle of rescue, resent, victim, hero. I know when I do that dance it is not exactly a healthy one. At times I have naturally felt absolutely overwhelmed with issues. Right then I've craved being rescued and I tended to interact in an overinvolved way. My counter action to that is to try to be on top of what I need to do for me and have small goals rather than not realizable goals.

My expectations of other people can be way way off. I also have interacted on many levels with people who were black and white and I have to say it is very hard going when you get to grey. When I thought in black and white I was prepared to deal with the drama, stickiness (that is the high level of contact and over involvement) and promises of such a relationship. Now I am not. I know the cost for me of those kind of relationships was very very high. In order not to do them I have had to be far far more grounded than I was in the past.

I don't have any children and I know if I did I would struggle tremendously so I don't have any judgment or suggestions except to say it sounds like you have been abandoned once again by your ex.

Maresie.

Andrea12 · ~*Service Worker*~

Wow,

I can so relate to the insanity of teenagers...I have two of them...my experience is a little different...but not much...my daughter is now 19 and has a 19 month old baby....she is the joy of my life..at the time when my daughter was pregnant I was upset as well but hey, not in my control....she is now in college, working a part-time job and is a pretty darn good mom....she is still home with me.

My son Zach is almost 18 and going to graduate high school this year...never thought I would see this....the road to this life had more insanity in it than one can imagine...and still does at times...lol..for a couple of years it was a fight every morning to go to school and a lot of the time he would win.

I see you talking about these men in your life, before my husband died we separated for awhile and I met someone who was so bad for me that I can not explain....I wondered why or how I would have even let myself get into a situation like this.....then I thought that maybe I thought he was all I deserved....after all I couldn't save my husband, my kids were acting out in all kinds of ways....I was living in hell......I realize now...that this is not true at all
I deserve much better..my kids were reacting.

Dear friend, slow down give yourself some time and space to try and think...the serenity prayer seems to come to my mind in these times....I say it over and over when my kids are fighting and dear god some days I want to choke them both.

Being a teenager is hard enough and growing up with this disease in your family was hard for me as an adult to handle can only imagine being a teen and having to handle it.

Only you know if you are doing the right thing by your daughter, you and she have to decide what is the best road for her to take. Do you think she is responsible enough, can he support her? Do you think he loves her and how old is he....those would be my questions.....

I wish you and your kids the best I am praying for God to guide you in the right direction.

With Love and Understanding,
Andrea

maresie · ~*Service Worker*~

I know for me rushing in was a sign that I did not listen. If you take for example the guy who I work with (who I do not have tomantic feelings about). When I first met him I was impressed with his attitude and practicality. I listened to what he had to say over time and learned that he was not what he said he was. I am not disappointed as I did not have a great investment.

I know when I met the ex A and others I was looking for rescue. In that frame of mind I do not listen. I do not reflect and I do not make a choice. My desperation makes the choice for me. I don't know who the guy was that left you. I know I have met plenty of them. They are great at a charade. I don't think this is a male issue but an enmeshed issue. Enmeshment is not about reality but about really working not to be in it and not to feel alone in the world and to grab onto anything in the interim for me. I don't like being alone in the world, don't like not having resources but no longer feel on absolute overwhelm and panic all the time.

maresie.

carolinagirl · ~*Service Worker*~

Thank you guys. I appreciate not having judgment. I know this issue is enormous and most people cannot understand why a mother would make that choice. I really do feel that I am doing the best thing for everyone. The boy is much oder.... He has a good job and comes from a good family and everything I have seen from him has been good. He treats her well and her brother and sister too. I wouldn't marry her off to someone I didn't think would be good to her and take care of her. I love my baby, I just can't live with her under the same roof. She creates chaos the moment she enters the room and sets the standard for all of the other children in the house. Part of making a good decision for her is knowing her and what she is capable of. She is highly intelligent, highly manipulative and capable of doing pretty much everything on her own. She has been raised to be very independent, perhaps too much so.

Maresie, I love what you said about desperation making the choice for you and rushing in without listening and reflecting. The need and drive to be loved is soooooo strong and so hard to resist.

Debilyn, I agree she needs rules, structure and consistency but I am not able to provide those on a consistent basis because I rely on her so much. I'm shooting myself in the foot by sending her off but I think that there is absolutely no hope at this point of her and I having a normal mother/daughter relationship and that by her marrying and moving out we will be able to have a better relationship because we will not constantly be at odds anymore. Her life choices will be hers at that point. She will learn the reality of life, that there are rules and expectations no matter where you go or who you live with and in the end she will not resent me for the rest of her life for making a choice for her that she didn't want. I can still do right for the other two, but she is too far gone. And yes, she was committed for 10 days during Christmas and given Abilify and she refuses to take it. She refuses to take anything that she doesn't feel like taking. She is completely defiant toward me and has no respect at all. I truly believe the only way she will learn is through experience. She is one of those people who has to learn the hard way rather than learning from the mistakes of others. By bringing in the courts and going that route she has become more defiant and feels powerless over her fate, this way she chooses her destiny and I have told her that neither is a good option. I had a discussion with her about the fact that she will resent me either way eventually. But I think this is the best of two bad choices.

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

I did not say she needed pills. Just wondered if she has had extensive blood tests, hormonal tests etc. Was she born like this? When did it start?

I know myself, puberty put me over the edge. We go thru so many changes as women.

Of course it is your decision. I honestly do not see any hope in this doing anything positive from YEARS of experience. BUT I would LOVE to be wrong.

If you as a parent cannot offer a positive, consistant, structured home for her, possibly someone else can?

There is a "reason" she is acting out like this. A person can get a bad cut on their hand, get blood all over the place. It is very deep, cannot heal with out stitches. But a bandaid will stop it for awhile, but it will bleed all over again and may heal but not correctly.

Bandaids are not the answer. The primary problem is fixable.

Again I will shut up. lol Because we all learn as we go. love,debilyn

Debilyn · ~*Service Worker*~

I know I said I would shut up. I reread again. sigh

PLEASE I am just sharing my thoughts, not trying to convince anyone. I am venting. You have been honest and I am being honest.

I get from this, 'daughter cannot be provided a structured, consistant home with strict rules, because the mother needs a babysitter and whatever,
as she is at work or school."

She is a child. A child. My grandson is almost four. He is very, very intelligent, but he is not ready for high school emotionally.

She is showing she has NO life skills, meaning no social skills. She cannot get along with her own family. What makes one believe she will be able to with someone else?
This girl has no foundation to fall back on.We as parents teach this, provide this.

No judgements or anything, just my thoughts.

We are mammals. every other mammal I know of keeps its young until they are ready to go out on their own. This is a natural instinct.If they try to stray off, mother snatches them back, some dads may too.It they misbehave, the parents correct them.

NO mammal throws out their young becuz they are misbehaving. not one.

Did you see Marley and me? I loved that story and you know why? Because he was difficult. He did about every negative thing a dog could do. Yet his person and persons loved him thru it all and did not throw him away, get rid of him to be someone elses problem.They hung in there.He was truly loved not for himself, but in spite of himself. THAT is the truth.

My esh since I have been aware, anyone or anything that is tossed out, is never the same. I have rescued children, adults, countless animals who someone could not put in what that person, or animal needed.Of course it all came from HP. not me.

Still not judging, or critical. That is useless. Is all my esh, blessed to me by hp.

love,debilyn

Iamhere · ~*Service Worker*~

carolinagirl - your oldest daughter sounds identical to my oldest son.

I also have another child, a son and understand what you say about the oldest and their choices/behaviors/attitudes set the tone for the house and the day.

My oldest turns 18 in March. He first began acting out at around 11. So, for 7 years, we have battled. I say We - no so much he and I - we meaning the village.

He's smart, he's headstrong and at 17.75, he's still so unaware of the real world. He's been in-patient, he's been out-patent, he's been in intensive therapy, he's been medicated, he's been ....

I engaged professionals, state agencies, county agencies, law enforcement and more. As time has passed, I have often felt so over-whelmed and like such a failure and drained and ....

As I ponder our next chapter, him turning 18 and being an adult, I have come to realize that:

- There has been improvement. Is he where I want him to be? Is he where he should be? Is he ready to face the world? Is he loving, kind, friendly? These were always a bold and fast and empathic NO. I can say that in spite of the chaos, I can now answer sometimes to a few.

- He views the stays out of home as punishment, not help. This has absolutely made our relationship so very broken. I can't change his perceptions, but I can state, with love and a gentle voice, that my intentions were good and as a mother, I felt I needed to go to 'any lengths....'

- He is moving out at 18 - on his birthday, ready or not. He's asked for my help in looking at apartments. I told him that I can't do that at this time; it makes me too sad.

- He's planning for homeless status with his counselor and going off all meds. Funny and scary at the same time.

He was in state custody for a bit. If I knew then what I know now, he would have stayed for a bit longer - group home or other. He publicly tells me that he hates me, I have ruined his life/teen-age years, etc. If I feel compelled to answer, it's usually simple and calm - I love you and will never give up on you having a happy, healthy, whole life.

There are many things - should have, could have and would have. I can't go back - I can only go forward. As we work hard to learn to talk to each other, I do feel his anger, resentments and pain about being out of home.

I share as our children, especially teenage children are very capable of concluding that 'we have given up' or 'we don't care'. Over and over again I've been accused of placing him in-patient for my own peace of mind. Kind of true -- difficult to sleep, rest, pray, meditate with a self-destructive teen in the home.

Always, always --- check your own motives. I've heard that here, and I've heard it from the many counselors over the years. I know in my head that while I've made many mistakes and wish things were different that I have done the best I could with what I knew and that I've gone to any length to save him from himself.

The rest will be up to him and I need to stay in the here and now and not project.

Best to you - I feel your chaos!

The material presented here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method to exchange information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal level.

Practice the PAUSE...Pause before judging. Pause before assuming. Pause before accusing. Pause whenever you are about to react harshly and you will avoid doing and saying things you will later regret. ~~~~ Lori Deschene