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So my husband is easing his way back into drinking after almost a year of sobriety, imposed on him by me of course. I posted a little more about this in an introduction a few days ago.
A few weeks ago he mentioned drinking again, I told him no, he was nice about it, he practically begged on the 4th of July, and I said fine. On the 4th of July, and that's it. Now he thinks that permission is extended, and has just brazenly brought liquor home, as if daring me to make a scene, expecting my silent approval, because telling him he can't drink what he has already brought home is a disaster. Now every night I'm again wondering, is this the night he drinks? Every that night he comes home without liquor he seems smug, like he knows I am suspicious and shame on me for not trusting, but I expect it anynight now. How many months till the problem is bad enough that I can put my foot down again? Why should I wait till hten? Oh, yeah, because I don't need proof, he does. Does he really think that his year off has turned him into a normal drinker who can have a glass or two of wine and be fine? He has already proven in the past week's two incidences that he is still not a "normal" drinker. He has no business even trying to learn how to drink normally. Not when he won't admit to any problem. I know there is no chance of recovery as long as he's in denial.
Does anyone here have a spouse who tries to "earn" the right to drink with good behavior? How do you reason with them?
I'm done with this cycle. A part of me, most of the parts of me, want him to just go off the deep end and prove to me that it's over, so I can stop wasting my time, and my son's time. I don't even want to feel obligated to stay if he agrees, yet again, to put forth the minimal effort required to shut me up. What's the point of a year of relative peace(from my son's perspective, not mine), just to have the constant threat of alcoholism coming back and slowly destroying our home life?
If anyone has been in this particular situation, please share what you learned or how the situation ultimately played out. I know alcoholics have similar patterns an games, but I feel lost, because no one sees what goes on in our home but me, and there are no objective onlookers.
I feel like his drinking/emotional problem has been a vicious sleeping dog, laying on the living room floor, who could wake at anytime, and if I tiptoe around it, things will be fine, but if I wake the dog and throw it outside, it will destroy everything, and I will be blamed for waking it. Don't worry anyone, I know it's not my fault. It's not wrong of me to insist that both of us be emotionally healthy and available for our son and our marriage. It's not my fault if he won't agree to that. I can only hold up my end, but not both of our ends.
I don't know if this will be helpful to you. I have told the story before.
When I realized my husband was an alcoholic, all I had to go on was having read Games People Play by Eric Berne and understanding that Alcoholic is a game that cannot be won. So I told him very calmly that I needed to know if he were going to continue to drink, because I needed to plan my life.
He quit cold turkey. If he hadn't, I would have ended it then and there. I had a 13 year old child and not great job skills, but I would not have stayed in the marriage.. And he realized that. And it was important enough for him to quit.
Part of what woke me to the realization was that my child told me how much vodka was gone from the bottle in the refrigerator that weekend. Children know a lot more than we sometimes like to think they do.
So that is all I can tell you. I don't know about negotiating and trying to manage an alcoholic who wants to drink. I don't think it is a workable solution, but that is just my take. I don't think there is enough leverage or vigilance in the world to get an alcoholic who wants to drink to not do it. Taking myself out of the equation was the only viable course, as far as I was concerned. And he decided he really didn't want to drink that bad.
Good luck. I think you deserve a peaceful life.
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It's easy to be graceful until someone steals your cornbread. --Gray Charles
I wish I had a success story to share with you. About three years ago, after he was drunk the night before and I found a bag of cocaine on the floor, I decided that something had to change. He stopped drinking for a few weeks, then began trying to moderate his drinking. It was nice for that little while. We would go out to dinner and he we could have a few drinks together. I let myself think things were better. However, the few drinks moved back to his usual way of drinking, which is to the point of sloppy drunk.
I gave him a letter letting him know I loved him and I wanted our marriage to last, but I could not continue to live with the drinking. I stated he needed to do something. He chose to stop drinking and began to see a therapist. That lasted a few months. Then he began drinking non-alcoholic beer and smoking pot. Soon the full strength beer was brought back into the mix and things went back to their original way.
I again told him I could not continue like this and we went over all of the options. I was no longer going to accept him simply deciding to stop drinking without support. That was his choice, but I have agreed to this approach too many times. He sticks with it as long as his willpower can hold out and the alcohol always wins eventually. He said he would go to an outpatient treatment center. This was on a Thursday and he said he would go on Monday. I told him I would go away for the weekend so he could do whatever he wanted. He asked me to please stay, that if I was there he would be able to not drink. By Saturday he was asking if he could go out and have just a few beers. On Sunday he gave me a plan that had all the conditions of when he could drink - when he was out of town, never around the kids, on special occassions. I could give him a breathaylizer whenever I wanted. If he slipped up he would go to the outpatient center. It was at this point I realized he did not want and was not going to get help. We went another month or so before I asked him for a separation. I asked him to please let me know if he was going to give up the drinking. I told him it was not an ultimatum, just what I could and couldn't live with anymore. During this time he did not alter his behavior. He didn't tell me he wanted to stay with me and the kids. No begging to give him another chance. Just him enjoying his drinking. He ended up chosing the drinking and I thanked him for letting me know so I could move on with my life.
He did at one point tell me he would go to get help if I promised to become more affectionate and I stop drinking. I refused to do either one. First, becoming more sexual with him would take time. It took a while for our marriage to get to this point and it would take a while to get it back. I didn't want a condition of his sobriety to be on whether or not I was living up to his timetable. As for me quitting drinking, there were too many times and occassions when I wasn't drinking - in fact no one else was - and he was drunk. I know it didn't make a difference. Ultimately, I felt that his decision to quit drinking had to be with no strings attached to my behavior. Anytime I didn't live up to what he wanted, he could use it as his reason for going back to drinking. It had to be his choice, not dependent upon me.
We are still separated a year later with plans for divorce when we sell the house. He did almost quit once in this time. He got drunk and was ashamed of his behavior. He told me he was done. I thought to myself, "I guess this is what it took. He needed to reach this point all on his own and there was nothing I could do to get him here." However, he began drinking again two weeks later and still is.
I go between being mad (which is where I am currently and why I found this board) and resentful to thankful and sure. It is hard to see him continuing with his life, dating a twenty-something who is too young to recognize his problem, knowing some of our friends are hanging out with him despite knowing and admiting his drinking is a problem. I wonder if he is ever sorry for the choice he made. It certainly doesn't seem like it. It hurts knowing he chose alcohol over us. I can see him choosing it over me - after so many years of having a drunk for a husband, our sex life was nothing and we did very little together. However, continuing the drinking and putting it above the kids is unforgivable.
I think about trying to work on things again (he doesn't want to though - he is loving his single life with no one to answer to). But I know it will always be a problem. There will always be a part of me wondering if he is out drinking, is he trying to hide the smell, when will he fall off the wagon. I wanted to be a wife. The checking put me into a police officer mode and that was not what I wanted to be.
I wish you luck in your situation. I know mine isn't exactly a happy ending if you are searching for happily everafter. But I hope that by choosing to live my life without an alcoholic I will eventually find it. Good luck
Reason with an Alcoholic , if u figure out how to do that share it with the rest of us . hehe Because your husb stopped drinking at your insistance for a yr , you are assuming u have some control over what he does as u just described one weekend of drinking and wham he is right back in it again , this is a disease all or nothing is the name of it's game . no social drinking ever worked with an alcoholic . Please if your not already find and attend regularly a few meetings for yourself they will help u to understand exactly what your dealing with . forget what u think u know about alcoholism . and learn a new way to live your life to the fullest there is no way u can control what your husb does if u persisit in trying he will only learn to sneak his booze this disease tells them that they are a little smarter than all the rest of us and that they can fool u into a false state of sobriety , crazy stuff starts happening again and soon every one is off the wall one more time . Keep the focus on yourself . Louise
Again there is no answer as he is insane. Using makes them insane. So talking, ordering asking is a waste of time.
It is totally up to him to use or not.
It is totally up to us to take care of our own part of the street. It is not our business, their disease and or choices.
Al Anon will continue to show us how to detach from their disease, and love the person.
This may mean learning to live with them a different way. Or choosing not to live with them anymore.
If he stays exactly how he is forever, would you choose to be there? He may choose to go into recovery he may not. He goes into recovery, and the chance of using again is almost a given.
It might help to think of him in the terms of someone suffering a mental illness such as bulimia, bi-polar disorder or depression. These diseases cause a person to act in extremely self destructive ways, and cannot be controlled by will power alone. I know that if someone told me to stop being depressed, my response would be "I would if I could!" However, I do know that there are steps I can take to control my disease. I take medication, I go to therapy, and I try to manage my thinking. I do my best to manage my disease and minimize its effect on myself and others. But to live with me is to accept the risk that I may spiral out into another depressive spell. To live with an alcoholic is to accept the risk that they may drink again, no matter what you say or do.
I know I've played the game of "it's me or the drugs", and then was foolishly hurt when he chose the drugs! His drug use had nothing to do with me-- I didn't cause it, I couldn't control it and I couldn't cure it. And you aren't responsible either!
I really like the previous post about asking him if he plans to continue drinking. There's some great experience, strength and hope here. I wish you and your family all the best!
Athenssmile- he has tried to make sex for sobriety deals with me too! Sorry, but it's already unbearable enough for me to have sex with him, even after a year of not drinking. You are right that there can be no strings attached whatsoever to his behavior.
THe past few days have been tumultuous for me. Just for me- we haven't been fighting and I have not said a word about his drinking on Saturday night because I've been totally immersed in potential future outcomes, and I know how this will probably end. I know that even if he sobers up for good that our relationship is permanently damaged. His recovery and time will tell if it can be mended, or if my feelings for him will ever be what they were. But if he wants to stay with me despite my sexual unresponsiveness, or no sex at all, I don't care what he does as long as he doesn't do it in front of our son and he isn't abusive. I have no car and no job, and our son isn't even three. I'm going to savor and enjoy the time I have with him now, because it beats having him in daycare full time, or only having partial custody of him. He is so crazy about his dad, and is such a happy child.
For now I will focus on how to live with an alcoholic without playing the codependent games. It's so hard! The minute he brought liquor back into the house I became my old, evil self, like my body was possessed. I never want to be like that again. I have relied on his not drinking to keep my crazies away for so long now, but I can't do that anymore. This will be new for me, but I feel at peace with it.
I owe him an apology for my cold treatment of him over the weekend and last night. I'll explain everything to him. That I've been putting responsibility for my sanity on him, that as long as he wants to drink, there will be limits on our relationship, that I'm still hurting from the past. He deserves to know what's going on.
I would like to share my story, if you don't mind.
About 3.5 years ago, my husband's drinking got out of control. I found out that he cheated on me with a prostitute and I kicked him out of the house. He moved in with a friend and went on a 3-day bender. After that, his friends got together and got him into rehab. He was in rehab for 2 weeks.
Our son was 4 months old at the time. I had no job because I was a stay-at-home mom. I had no idea what to do and felt that I had nowhere to turn, so I stayed. I think I was able to get about 3 months of sobriety from him before he started asking permission to drink. He told me that a therapist told him that maybe he cannot handle hard alcohol, but perhaps he was OK with beer, so I allowed it. Afterall, life was kinda boring and I wanted my drinking buddy back, right?
So as the years went on, he would go on a bender every couple of months. Something would trigger it (stress, lack of sex, holidays, etc.). And each time I asked myself "why didn't I just leave him in the first place?" There were many reason - fear was a major one. Fear of being alone, fear of having nowhere to go, fear of having toshare custody with an alcoholic - you name it.
So now here we are, almost 4 years later. He has gotten a DUI with our 4-year old son in the car and is facing possible jail time, loss of his job, loss of money, etc. That of course sent him on a downward spiral and his friends were able to convince him to go into detox. He wouldn't agree to in-patient rehab, but he did go to out-patient therapy when he was released from detox.
But he's still drinking, only this time he DOES NOT have my permission. This time I am in Al-Anon and I'm learning how to handle these types of things. This time he knows that if he spirals out of control again, I'm taking our son and leaving - I have support now, I have a place to go, I have my family. And he knows that I'M SERIOUS!
Everyone has to do what is best for themselves. Only you know what you can and can't do. I can't remember if you mentioned that you are going to Al-Anon meetings or not, but if you're not, I highly recommend going - they are a lifesaver for me.
n8tsmom- thanks for sharing. Our husbands have the same pattern, except mine never really had my permision before, and this time he's getting it. The artificial controls are just preventing the real issues from emerging to be dealt with. I am terrified of sharing custody with an alcoholic/drug addict or leaving him alone with our son for long periods, even if he's not drinking.
I'm not familiar with the custody laws here, but I obviously can't care for a child with no car or job, and I've already been admitted to a psychiatric ward once over his drinking, so I'm afraid that that would be held against me in court. It was over two years ago, and I voluntarily had follow up treatment for a long time after that, but it worries me.
I am so glad to live with my son all of the time. It would kill me to spend a night away from him worrying about what was going on. I'm just trying to keep my son safe, and if that means staying and dealing, then it's worth it. In this case leaving could ultimately prove to be harmful for my son. However, this is my husband's last chance. I doubt he can control his drinking any better than before, but I obviously cannot stop him because he won't back down. He might drink himself to death. In the time it takes for him to decide how he wants to live his life, I should be able to scrap together a backup plan and learn my rights.
It's funny- yesterday I was angry and in a big hurry for everything to just blow up and be over with, but today I realise that I might look back on these days with my son as the happiest times ever, and I'm in no hurry to take it all away. We might find a workable solution. If he loves our child as much as I think he does, he will agree to do whatever it takes to preserve a nurturing environment, which we have managed to do. But that is a whole new topic. I'm feeling peace about the situation for the first time, since deciding to let go of my stranglehold on his actions. I'm even getting a little excited.
"We admitted we were powerless over alcohol... that our lives had become unmanageable."
Any time I find myself desiring to tell my AH he cannot drink, I recognize it as my wanting to control. "Husband, you change so I can feel happy and secure."
I am powerless over alcohol. HE can't even control it, and it's going into his body... so how can I - a person living outside of him - even possibly think I can make it happen? (And at that, make it happen in the way I think it should happen - ie: he gets sober and turns into this joyous, caring, selfless romantic.)
Nope, his HP has plans for him that are far beyond what I can see. Your will, God, not mine.
This was hard to read because I deal with this quite a bit. He gets sober and says he will NEVER AGAIN have a drink. Then he starts saying that he feels so much better and he thinks he can have one beer a day. What he means is one tall can a day. Then that turns into 2 tall cans... from there, 4 tall cans in a day!!!! Then he is sober again and vows to never drink again. I have been through this process so many times. It is painful and you feel put on the spot. Like they want you to make a decision for them. They want your permission so they can blame you.
The hardest part of this journey for me is that he trys to make up for his NOT DRINKING by making me drink what he would have. He will mix a drink and bring it to me. Or buy me a drink and encourage me to drink it...That has happened a few times... Even this time... Yesterday I made the choice to NOT DRINK! I did this first because, I don't really need to drink and second he throws that in my face when he relapses. Its like he prepares the situation for his downfall. So here come the Al Anon meetings and I am reading the books.
