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Hi All, I have been dating a Recovering A for the last few weeks. Wow! Its been really great! We have alot in common, so our conversation is always great and we laugh alot and have a great time together. I was not crossing the line with him sexually as I didn't want to rush things and wanted to build a solid relationship with him. I didn't see him on Friday because we both had other plans and he called me to tell me that he missed me and that when I wasn't around he felt like something was missing. I thought to myself, "how nice!!" We got together Saturday and went to his sponsor's anniversary and afterward we went out to dinner. We ended up at my place and at midnight I noticed him texting someone. I asked who he was texting so late at night and he told me that it was some young girl who worked down at the local pool hall. I was a bit annoyed with this.
One thing led to the other, and we ended up crossing the line and were intimate. We spent time cuddling and he said he was going home. I was totally shocked and felt like someone punched me and knocked the wind out of me. I felt used and terribly hurt. I don't believe in casual sex or casual relationships (and I thought I had made myself clear with him). I called him after he left and let him know how I felt. Today, I received an email from him asking if we could get together and talk. He says it was not his intention to hurt me and that he is sorry that he did. I am really feeling alot of stuff right now and don't even trust myself anymore. I know that I really suck at setting boundaries sometimes. I let him know that what did is UnAccePtable to me. I know for someone who hasn't been affected by this disease, this would probably be an easy matter to sort out, but for me it isn't. I don't want to make the mistakes that I have in the past and I want to work my program for myself (first and foremost) and in this relationship....But the lines between setting healthy safe boundaries for myself and having expectations often gets fuzzy for me. I dont want to sit and talk with him until I am really okay first...So I thought that I would post here and ask for some feedback from you. I am open to whatever anyone has to share.
I know that someone else's behavior is not about me...but heck, it sure is up to me to make sure that I take good care of myself. Thanking you in advance for your response to this post.
Aloha SBG...you are soooo right that wasn't about the recovering alcoholic at all!! He might have been the convient one at that time and I sure learned a lesson about my choice mechanism when I was there and did that also (all the time). I use to also expect that they come with no history of past or current relationships when we hooked up and if there were any they would have the highest respect and "clean out the closet" just after we became interested in each other. LOL what a kindergarten boy I was...talk about unrealistic expectations...come to find out even I didn't follow that rule. Jealouse, fearful, controling and manipulative were common characteristics of mine when I got here. I am glad I found an empty seat to call my own in face to face meetings and honest and compassionate members willing to tell me there experiences and share the "secrets of recovery" that were shared with them.
Maybe all you got was bee stung this time. Stings hurt and yet I read that you are pretty much awake and self aware. There is a song that has lyrics that suggest that we "pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off and start all over again". You might have underestimated the power of your compulsions also.
Your not angry at him your angry at yourself for moving your boundaries . no one can cross them if they are firmly in place , a few weeks of dating does not make a relationshiip. forgive yourself your human and start over again .
I definitely think its all about us and by that I mean: if we really begin with us and love ourselves we will get or find that "out there". This is my boundary these days. I generally do not call, text, email, etc. unless its in response to someone else. Period. Someone needs to DEMONSTRATE before I will turn my attention towards them. If they do not, no matter how much I may like them, I pass.
I have recently reconnected with an old love. He was the love of my life but we parted company for a variety of reasons, all for the best. I am going very slow. He lives in the same time zone but about 13 hours away. I am taking it one day at a time. He is part of a constellation of things in my life- work, tai chi, running, biking, cooking, al anon/recovery, gardening, spending time with friends, etc. Its been really nice but in order for me to pay attention and consider getting involved with him, he drove here last month to meet with me and see me again after not seeing each other over a decade. Yeah, that got my attention. It was sweet. We had a lot of fun reconnecting over Valentines Day weekend. Now, he calls. He sends letters. I send letters and I take his calls. I will fly to visit him in April. Easy does it. Keep it simple. Stay in the moment.
I am constantly asking myself: what is best for ME right now? What is best for me is slow and simple. No big plans, just sweet and slow and simple. Hugs, J.
I wanted to respond to your post because I really identified with your experience. In fact, it helped me see my own experience more clearly.
What I find for myself is that the relationship between boundaries and expectations is a dynamic for me (they work together). As I thought about my reply, what became clear for me is that what often happens for me is that I "relax" my boundary and then I am hurt/upset/disappointed when the other person doesn't do the same. Then, I am totally confused about whether to express the disappointment, whether I have a right to be disappointed, etc. What a muddle! Ultimately, I, like you, often find myself confused, hurt, even angry and unclear about what my part is in it and what isn't.
Here are some examples:
A friend is going through a relationship crisis. She reaches out to talk. At first, I am happy to do so. But, then, I start to relax boundaries on time and space by taking calls regardless of whether or not I am in the middle of something else. Or, perhaps I talk for 2 hours when really I only have an hour to give, etc. I don't want to put in a boundary because I don't want to be "not available" (even for a minute LOL). The crisis passes.A year or two later I am in a similar crisis, but my friend does not respond in kind. She does not stay on the phone for hours with me, or drop everything every time and come running. In fact, she makes her boundaries on time and space very clear. I am hurt and disappointed; I am angry and resentful.
I decide to take a trip to see a friend with money I don't have. Due to circumstances beyond her control (but that I believe she could have managed much better than she does), she gets held up, and our meeting gets delayed by several hours. By the time we meet, I am hungry, tired, cranky, and totally annoyed.
Now, add in dating, sex, intimacy and the stakes go up 1,000% for me as does the potential hurt, confusion, etc. I wonder if by relaxing your boundary on intimacy, you were "expecting" (even with out knowing it), him to relax his boundary about staying. For me, I am always hurt and surprised when I relax a boundary and in response the other person keeps or sets a boundary.
Boundaries are setting limits in time, space, money, etc. I find for me that 99.9% of the time, I break my boundaries first. And, I feed into it, by denying my boundaries: "I don't mind". "Oh, I am happy to talk now, etc" Then, I am resentful, when I am not repaid in kind. What a vicious cycle!
For me, the very first step is identifying my part in it and owning up to it to myself. I used to blame other people for stepping on boundaries that I myself broke first. Although I don't have all the answers, it is a huge improvement and empowering for me to realize that setting and maintaining boundaries is within my power and I can reinstate ones I have broken.
I think you are very brave to put all this up front. I know dating has been very difficult for me. Expectations are huge. I did find many potential partners were all expectation and what's great is that I was able to shut down and move on very early. I think what is phenomenal about your post is that you are really clear on your red flags and sense of being upset. I think its also great that this man is acknowledging you are hurt. That is pretty good in my book.
I know for me the physical issue is huge. There are other issues, my dogs being one of them. I can't even imagine how single parents manage, I've met so many people who seem to expect me to up and leave my dogs for days on end because they say so. Of course I don't.
I tend to keep relationships incredibly light for a long long time. So for me they don't go on to being physical. I know I have a lot of issues about being left. I'm sure I would also have issues about someone texting in m prescence.
For me personally I think you are doing great. You lost your boundaries for a minute now they are back. Good for you! That's progress. Be good to yourself.
Wow! Thanks so much for all of your responses. I really appreciate them.
Jerry F: As far as me expecting him to "clean out the closet", I respectfully disagree. What I was realistically expecting was for him to have the courtesy and respect of not texting and phoning others whilst with me.
Abbyal: Yeah, I was a bit upset with myself but I know its because I need to be careful about how I take care of ME. Its always a learning curve for me.
Jean: Thank you. I am doing exactly what you suggest. I am making sure this is good and right for me and that I am not trying to fit with someone who doesn't fit (as far as our values go).
Blue ClouD: CLARITY! Your post was absolutely on the money! You said what I could not. I wasn't even sure if I was making sense (since it was an emotional post at the time). You gave me something to look at and I will discuss it with my sponsor. I will be meeting with my recovering A soon. I guess the reason that I relaxed the boundaries was because he was calling, texting, and looking to see me every day. He told me that he dropped the other woman he was seeing. I asked him to go to a meeting with me the other night (an open mtg) and he accepted. I said, "I would like to see you later." He responded, "I want to be with you all the time"...so this is where the lines started getting fuzzy for me. It seemed to go beyond dating due to the amount of time we were sharing and the things that he was expressing.
Maresie: Thanks! You were like a refreshing affirmation for me. I am working my program to the best of my ability. Thanks for the kudos. Right back at ya!!
I will let you all know what happens after we talk. It will work out the way it is supposed to and I will accept however it does
Thank you for your share, . I have experienced this situation too and am grateful to you for being brave enough to be open about it.
Personally I seem to mistake physical contact and intimacy for love. I find it almost impossible to keep my boundaries when my Abf turnes on the charm. I have found myself very hurt and confused on many occasion recently because of this. I'd be so angry and mad at him for doing this too me. It took more than one occasion for me to get my boundaries firmly in place. You are in a very new relationship and it sounds as though your partner is willing to talk it through, If you can be open and honest with him and set out what is acceptable to you, then hopefully you can put this experience behind you. Keep your eye on those red flags, dont ignore your intuition and watch what he does not what he says.
With love hugs and Gratitude Carol
-- Edited by Mariner on Tuesday 17th of March 2009 02:57:02 PM
I haven't heard from him and Im sitting here stewing right now. I feel like it wasn't a priority for him. I will drop him an email and tell him to let me know when he wants to talk. I feel stupid and confused about even putting that much of myself out there...as it seems that I am the only one anxious to get this straightened out. Any comments?
We ended up at my place and at midnight I noticed him texting someone. I asked who he was texting so late at night and he told me that it was some young girl who worked down at the local pool hall. I was a bit annoyed with this.
One thing led to the other, and we ended up crossing the line and were intimate.
Hi Saving Grace,
I am so sorry that you are in pain and struggling to find an acceptable alanon solution to the pain.
In reading you very honest account of the happenings of that night, I was struck by the unfolding of the events. I quoted the portion of your post that was a red flag for me.
If I had recounted this to my sponser, she would ask:
When you saw him texting another young girl in your home:
How Did You Feel? The next question would be: Did you tell him that? If so or not why did you then proceed to be intimate with him?
Only you can answer these questions, and I believe the answers may be the key to setting and holding workable boundries.
This stuff is hard work, be gentle with yourself and believe that the entire program is a process and it is progress not perfection
Hi Betty, You are absolutely right. I think this is why I hedge around with confronting him now...Its like I wasn't taking care of myself and just watching this thing play out like a movie that I wasn't in. Weird, I know. Then later on, the feelings hit me like a ton of bricks. I am aware that I have a tendency to do this....Its like I just stuff things down in the moment and then BAM they come up and I realize that I didn't deal with them when I should have.
I am meeting with him this evening and am pretty nervous about it. I know I shouldn't be. I have said my prayers and used my phone list and am posting here. So, now I have to trust as I work my 11th step that I will be empowered to do what I need to do to take care of myself. I think I'm just afraid that he will have an attitude and I will be more challenged to stand up to him. I know that his attitudes are about him....but confrontations are not always my favorite and I just want to be able to work my program (say what I mean, mean what I say and say it like a LADY! LOL! Dating/Relationships/Intimacy are all real testing/challenging grounds for my communication and recovery tools. I want to be able to feel good about how I handle things this evening. Keep me in your thoughts and prayers. Thanks!
I understand what happened very well as it is something I did often. That is why this program is so successful.
I am glad you will see him tonight and with all the tools you are using I believe you will handle it "Like an Assertive Lady".
Fear is normal. Say the Serenity Prayer. I always remember that courage is not the absence of fear it is having the fear and then being given the Courage from HP to act appropriately.
Please take good care of yourself YOU ARE WORTH IT
Well...My Higher Power worked it all out once again!! Funny enough I went out this afternoon to get some fresh air and I ended up running into my recovering A. Coincidence??..LoL. So, we had our conversation and he apologized to me and said that he didn't mean to hurt me. He said that he would show me the text message from the other night. I told him that it wasn't necessary. I explained to him that I felt it was important for us to get to know each other further and meet each other's people (friends etc) and build the trust so that stuff like that doesn't get in the way. He said that he realizes now that he was inconsiderate of my feelings and what it may have appeared like to me when he did text at that late hour.
I told him that I was not the type of woman to bounce around and that although I wasn't asking him to profess his undying love to me and give me an engagement ring, I would hope that if I were special enough to be intimate with, that I would be special enough to invest in emotionally and spend the night. He said that this is what he wants. He said that he was just tired and wanted to go to sleep that night and didn't think about how it might have felt to me. He said that when I let him know that I was upset and why, he didn't sleep too well and has been smoking like a fiend. We both agree that things are working very nicely so far between us and we want to be exclusive. We both agree that we want to invest in this relationship. He informed me that he has "cleaned out the closet" (Jerry, LOL). So..I am relaxed and happy that we were able to communicate and laugh and come to a better understanding of one another and where we are in this evolving relationship together.
He showed up again this evening with a long stemmed rose...Awww...so sweet! And I got lots of hugs and kisses! Thank you all for your support and sharing your ESH. I know that this relationship is a one day at a time thing and I am so glad that I can come here and share my confusion, struggles and my successes and that with you I am safe in doing so. Many Blessings to You All. Happily & Gratefully, Dee
