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Hi everyone, I'm new to the forum and so glad to find it! I have been with my fiance for 3 years, and he is an alcoholic. The drunken epsidoes have progressed from just passing out or acting a fool, to major verbal abuse, and slight physical confrontation. My family is burned out on hearing about my problems, though they are great and are there for me when I need them, but truly, it takes someone who's been through this to understand. They can not understand why I haven't left him, and it seems that alot of people in support forums feel the same from what I've experienced so far? Is that always the answer- to leave? Certainly if it's violent and your life's in danger, yes. I am just about at the end of my rope with his alcoholism no doubt, but I guess I'm feel that I wouldn't be giving it my all if I didn't do everyhting I can to help him(not enable.) I do have children from a previous marriage, and that fact is why I will no longer tolerate the vile verbal abuse ect. I've told him I'm going to go if there's one more episode, but I don't think it will matter. He just does what he wants, then cries and apologizes the next day. The cycle is endless. He has admitted that he's an alcoholic and said he would get help when I've left for a day or 2(never has), but, he blames everyone else for his behavior. "We make him mad", work stresses him, finances, he had a bad childhood..ect ect He refuses to be personally accountable for putting the can of beer to his own mouth. He does the flip-flop thing- very good one minute, hard worker, and loving to an abusive, arrogant, mean person I dont even know. I'm sure many of you here have been through all of this- the humiliation at family get togethers, passing out, abuse, financial problems because of the drinking, children being upset and confused ect. I'm glad to have found a place to vent a little!
MidwestMom
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"Faith is the bird that sings while it's yet dark."
I'm also new to the forum, but not new to alcoholism. I have been married to my A for 29 years. Before that we were together 3 years and I did not recognize the alcoholism which WAS there. I know you love this person.If you are finding it difficult now, you will find it even more difficult in 29 years. Do not underestimate the importance of your decision on your children. My A and I do not have children, part of what has allowed me to stay with him. And he displays none of the verbal/physical abuse that you have described. Just my humble opinion. If you choose to marry him, get yourself to some face to face alanon meetings, get a sponsor and prepare yourself bigtime.
Leaving may end up being the right answer for you - we promise to save your sanity at alanon, but we can't promise to save your marriage. However, you have other choices that you can make, first, while you try to get some clarity.
Go to face to face meetings if at all possible. This forum is good, but the rpogram really works in f2f. Read our literature - you can get it at your meeting (buy or borrow, most likely) or buy it from links above, or get it from Amazon or ebay, or borrow it from the library. Read old posts here - not everything you read here will apply to you, but some things will speak to you, I promise.
I did not leave my husband - sounded about like yours. I made some changes to my behaviour and expectations, he made some to his, though he kept drinking. We had several years while he was still drinking and drugging that were actually pretty good, before he finally came to sobriety on his own. In fact, for us the biggest threats to our marriage came after he sobered up, go figure. Some of us are able to use the alanon tools to make our marriages possible. Others use the tools to get the strength to leave. Nobody knows what is best for you - you probably don't even know - so take some time here to learn what your options are.
Thank you both for replying, I'm very grateful. It's funny & sad, as I hear of other's stories, it's like we are all living somewhat the same lives, different places, different people. I haven't found a local meeting to attend yet. I know of one over an hour away, but that's too far and gas is too high. I have done all the things mentioned so many times- ignored him, left, set boudaries which he busted through, gave him AA materials which just angered him, bargained and pleaded("okay, you can have a six pack but no more')...sighs, I am just tired. If there were no children in the picture, I could deal with it I think. Or, I have even thought that if he were a "happy drunk" and would just be happy and pass out I could cope. But, he's not. I myself have depression, and this is def. not helping that. Also, one of my children has adhd which is super hard to cope with, and that child's behavior just sends my finace over the edge. He is a narcisist, and thinks he does no wrong- no compassion for other's problems. He thinks my son is just a bad kid and that I have raised him wrong- he wont accept that he really has a condition called adhd. My son and I am the target of his drunken rages- it's verbal mind you, but unbelieveably destructive and hurtful.
Of all the crap I've been through with him, one night in particular was the worst.. I had to take this same son to the er for a cough/cold, which was bronchitis. My A insisited on coming along, though I argued and didnt want him to go. So, the doctor, after examining my son ect, says she needs to speak with us alone, and has my son leave the room. She then proceeds to question us about him drinking(she smelled it on him), about who was driving home, and then lectured me basically on the whole thing. THEN, she has a policeman escort us from the hospital, to make sure I was the one driving. My son meanwhile is scared and has no idea why the policeman did this, which I then had to explain. I have strong biblical faith. I know I must forgive, and I know I must put everything in God's hands, but I don't think I have truly forgiven him of that and some other things. I could have had my son taken from me if the doctor would have felt the need to do so- "child endangerment." I'm sure you all have stories like these and worse...I have come to believe alcoholism truly is a disease, or else why would a sane person knowingly cause these things and all this hurt?
hugs, MidwestMom
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"Faith is the bird that sings while it's yet dark."
Welcome to MIP! Yes, we learn alot from each other. There is alot literature too. I was reading How Aalanon Works last night. It talks about communication. It says don't make threats that you don't intend to carry out. Alanon also doesn't tell you to stay or leave. It helps you save yourself and get into recovery. Keep coming back.
Midwest Mom, I will keep you and your children in my thoughts If I could keep just one person from repeating my life with my A . . . Just know that the disease is progressive if left untreated What I face in the future is caring for him as his body fails from the poison That has already started at age 65 I am also a court appointed special advocate for children, you are right, you could loose your children, I am always surprised at how quickly and easily that happens. I am not trying to scare you, I am simply reminding you of what is at stake. ((((((((((((((((Hugs))))))))))))))))))
Glad to have you here! I felt like my story was similiar to yours in ways. I too have been dating my bf for 3years. I also have a son. I too have had the verbal abuse, walking on eggsshells, blaming his drinking on everything and everybody else but him, saying my child was "bad" and I wasn't raising him right, etc. I have heard it all. He admitted for a while that he knew he had a drinking problem, but thought for a long time that he could just cut back, moderate, etc. But he never could. And it always gets worse if they keep on drinking - it is a progressive disease. If I could have watched my life and behavior during these years on a video camera, playing it back for me to watch, I would have been appalled and disgusted with myself. Especillay disgusted in what I put my son through. I have found Al-anon and have been going faithfully for two months. It already has changed so much about me, for the better. Can't really say enough on how good this program is. One thing I have learned is that if you set boundries you must stick to them. You said you have set boundries, but he has broken them? If you really have set boundries then there should be "no breaking them". I am just learning this. If you can't stick to what you set, then boundries mean nothing. I have learned not to say anything unless I can follow through. I hope you will reconsider marrying this man until you can get some help for you. Not telling you to leave him, just know that if you marry this man, and he continues to drink and doesn't seek help, be prepared your life will be a roller coaster ride and your kids will be affected. I have seen such a change in the behavior of my son since my situation has improved. He is laughing now - I am enjoying him so much - and he is enjoying us. He actullay wants to do stuff with us and my bf enjoys his company as well. My bf finally sought treatment and now attends AA reguarly and is in the process of getting a sponser. And even that isn't a guarentee. It is not a perfect recovery process at all. He has slipped up - but I now realize he has to work on himself without my help. There is nothing you can do to get someone to stop drinking. Nothing. But I know now from attending Al-Anon what I will put up in the future and what I won't. I hope you seek out a meeting for yourself and I wish you all the best of luck. Keep on posting here, the people here are wonderful!
There is an awesome quote from Toby Rice Drews, an author - "nobody has the right to tell you to leave, not even your counsellor"....
The "stay vs. leave" decision is all yours - only YOU can know what is right for you and your situation. What Al-Anon, and similar boards and support groups like this will do - is encourage you to choose recovery for YOU, so that you will be in the best and healthiest frame of mind to be able to make these decisions.
If you work on you, and choose recovery for yourself, you'll be amazed at the growth and clarity that you will find....
Take care Tom
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"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"
"What you think of me is none of my business"
"If you knew the answer to what you are worrying about, would it REALLY change anything?"
Well I certainly have been there in being embarassed, setting limits, reneging on the limits and more. Then I came to al anon and started to work the steps. I detached, that isn't ignoring the issue, that is actively acknowleding it and working on what I can do for me, not for him but for me. Sometimes it was turning it over, sometimes it was not smoothing things over for him. I worked pretty hard on detaching. I also worked hard on getting busy with my own life, with my own issues (pretty hard when there is a huge theatrical spectacle going on in your life but possible nonetheless). I stopped arguing with the A. That in itself was also a great achievement. I have to remember that when someone is being provocative to me.
I worked on a plan be for a long long time. What would it take to leave. I worked on what I needed, how could I get it. The plan be I had was by no means perfect. I came here and talked about it.
One year ago I left the A, my life was hard with the A, it was and is very hard without him. There were things we had together I do not have now. I did not leave and have a fairytale life. I left and found I had many many issues of my own.
No one here is going to tell you that you "have" to leave, what you need to do or what you can do. The tools are suggestions. I can tell you in my ESH they work but you have to practice them. They were for me very awkward right away. The more I use them the better they get.
The tools helped me along the way to learn how to live with an A, live without the A, live with leaving the A and live with staying with the A. Whatever choice I made they helped. I made choices along the way. I stayed for a very long time. I stayed and grieved and raged. Then I left and grieved and raged. Then I started working the tools more and started looking at myself and now my focus is very much off "him" and onto me.
I hope you will choose to join us, it is a choice. For me it was a desperate choice because I felt I had no place else to go. Now I'm here, this is home. This is the place I feel most comfortable in sometimes more than my own skin. I came here out of desperation and great pain. I found love, understanding, help and care I had been searching for all my life out of great pain and tremendous despair came hope and clarity and a future I am looking forward to rather than dreading. Maresie
If you work on you, and choose recovery for yourself, you'll be amazed at the growth and clarity that you will find....
Take care Tom
MidwestMom:
What Tom stated is true for me. The growth I have had is tremendous. The serinity I experience is priceless. The self-respect I have is delicious.
I've been married to my recovering A for 34 years. In the beginning, my sister, who happens to be a recovering A, too, told me that my husband was an alcoholic years ago. I didn't believe her then; I thought that since she was in recovery, she was against any amount of drinking. But she was right.
Gradually over the years, his drinking became a BIG problem that I couldn't ignore. I did all the classic strategies to try to change him. You name it, and I did it. Nothing worked. . . . except when I began to work on me.
My AH was mainly verbally abusive. But there towards the end of his heavy drinking, he was beginning to make threats of suicide. My adult son, who was living with us at the time while going through nursing school, put a lock on his bedroom door. He and I were very concerned that he'd kill us all with one of his many guns that he collects.
Well, finally one day, I realized how crazy things had gotten: son sleeps behind a locked door; I was fearful of waking up in the middle of the night with a pistol pointed at me; I was fearful of coming home and finding him dead (suicide).
I reviewed all of the things that I tried to do to help him and came to the harsh reality that those things don't work. I then began to read about alcoholism. First I began reading online material, then I purchased some books. The books woke me up, and I then knew what I had to do.
For me, leaving was right. I filed for a divorce, left, and he was served papers two days later. I planned it all without his knowledge. That was very heartbreaking. However, I felt if I had told him in advance, he might surely wipe us all out. That is how crazy things had gotten.
About 2 weeks later, he had a breakdown, went into a 30-day rehab facility, stopping off at a detox center first. That was in August 2007. In April 2008, I moved back in.
Things are so much better. He isn't the crazy man he once was while drinking. He has had one relapse that I know of. He drank one day. But he seems to be doing well. IF he ever got to the point where he drank like he did, I believe I'd have to leave for good.
That has been "my" path so far. Your path will be different most likely. But back to what Tom stated: If you work on you, and choose recovery for yourself, you'll be amazed at the growth and clarity you will find . . .
I truly feel as though I've been reborn. I'm actually grafeful for all the Hell I went through, for I know I can weather any storm and come out stronger and wiser. I have a new way of navigating my life.
May recovery become part of your journey. Stormie (Gail)
* I'd like to add that I waited until our adult son finished school and moved out of our home before I left. I didn't want to leave with our son still there, just in case.
Good afternoon everyone..giant thanks and hugs to you all!After another drunken episode last night, and a long call with my mom today, and all the advice I've gotten here and from online materials, I have come to a few decisions!Let me tell you , being in limbo is the worst, so decisions are a relief, even if they aren't exactly what you wanted!We are being evicted due to non payment, at a place we've only been at for 4 months. My A likes to believe he is fine because he works and brings in money, but the problem is, things still don't get paid. So, I have decided to move very close to my parents who will help me with my kiddos. I am going to begin job hunting next week so that I have some stability for the first time in a long time. I'm going to plan and do things with the kids, and yes, work on ME! I can't tell you how I've let myself go- physically and otherwise. This whole black cloud has swallowed me up, and I'm going to break out of it!I'm not going to leave my A, yet. I'm going to detatch even further, and ignore him when he rants. I'm not giving it one more ounce of attention, or blood, sweat and tears.If he chooses to ruin his life and health, then that is his choice. I'm not going down the toilet with him, nor are my children! It's very hard, because I do want to be close to him, but until something changes, I simply can't. I'm also not going to marry him until that happens either, though I will remain faithful and commited.I think when he finally stops getting all the attention, and stops seeing the results the addiction drives him to seek, maybe he will get tired of it himself? The cycle has to be broken somewhere. It wont be fun for him to be left at home, drunk and depressed, while we go and actually live life. Maybe, he will change, maybe he will leave. I dont know, but I AM going to change!I have prayed without ceasing, and will continue. I am even ordained as a minister, but I have never dealt with anything in my life like this. My faith is what has gotten me through.I dream alot. Some I think have been straight from above. I dreamed yesterday, that I was in the synagogue, and a poor man asked me for money. I went to my purse thinking, "this poor man. I know I don't have anything to give him, but I'll look."Inside my purse was a china doll. It was shattered when I went to touch it. I was sad because I was going to give it to him to sell for money. But then it was as if I got the message, "don't worry about it, I will restore it."Many of you may not be bible believers, or believe in these types of dreams but too much as happened with me not to believe. I know it was a message for me- my life has been shattered, but I know HE will restore it!I truly love Al-Anon's saying.."we wont promise to save your marriage, but we will save your sanity." I need my sanity! LoLTime to start living, and stop being sucked into this darkness and doom.blessings to all,MidwestMom
-- Edited by MidwestMom at 13:50, 2008-07-11
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"Faith is the bird that sings while it's yet dark."
You go girl, that is the important first step, to acknowledge how important you are, that makes all the difference. So, Keep coming back and let us all know how you are doing!
HI MM, Good for you for making some steps forward. If you should hang with Alanon you will find the tools are very helpful. I did notice you said you made boundaries andhe busted every one of them. The thing about boundaries are that they need consequences adjoined to them when we make them. If he does this, I will do that. No changies :)
Without the consequences firmly in place and the boundaries have no meaning without the follow through.. Boundaries are put in place for our protection and sanity. When the boundaries are flimsy it causes the alcoholic to do the same thing they've always done, usually with the same result, again and again. It leaves us feeling helpless and nuts.
I do hope you return here often, take back your power and self esteem by using the tools of the program on your journey to serenity.
Christy
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If we think that miracles are normal, we will expect them. And expecting a miracle is the surest way to get one.
