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For those following my story about my A, he keeps calling me crying. He told me he spent the last 3 days living in the streets. He has never been homeless before in his life. I am the first person to put him out and stand up to him (in all his past relationships, he gave his partners the boot).
I need clarity and reinforcement.
1. Does he see the light, being that he has been homeless and without or will he revert back to his old ways if I let him back in. 2. Do I need to continue to stand my ground no matter how much he cries?
I need fire under my feet...you guys are the only ones I can turn to other than God right now. My heart says give him another chance, since he has experienced being homeless for the first time and he hates it, but my mind says not until he has proven that he is clean and on his bipolar meds, consistently...
Somebody help me, smack me... I'm confused...and heartbroken
I am no where near able to tell you what is right for you - I can only share my e, s, & h. . .
For me, I have learned that I can't not base my decisions on the words of people who have proven themselves untrust worthy - it is not in my best interest. Althought they may have the best intentions - the disease of alcoholism and addiction often keeps them from following thru with those intentions.
I need to base my decisions on their actions not on their intentions - once I see long term actions - changed behaviors and healthy lifestyle - then I can believe their actions match their words.
Just what guidance I have received from my HP and thru the program of Al-Anon.
Wishing you Serenity & Joy, Rita
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No matter what me and my God are going to be ok, even better than OK -
jaysbaby, I can only relate my story to you, and trust me, I've been where you are, and again and finding myself there. 23 years ago, I was a single mom of 3 small kids, living with my now AH (we weren't married then). He paid our bills, I stayed at home w/the kids, but he drank heavily and was drunk every single day. He was emotionally abusive, I felt like a prisoner in my own home, had to keep the kids quiet so he wouldn't wake up from his "pass out" and I wouldn't have to deal with him. Finally, after 3 years of this, I left him for 3 weeks (the apt. was in my name), me and my kids stayed with my friend, all the while, I was working on removing him from my apt. I got what was called a "notice to quit", where he was served and had 10 days to be gone or the sheriff would remove him. During those 3 weeks that I stayed with my friend, AH called me many times. Each time, the minute I knew it was him, I hung up on him. I refused to have ANY contact with him. Before the sheriff could remove him, he called his mother and asked her to take him to detox. She told me she was doing that, I told her he'd never get or stay sober. She took him anyway. After detox, he went to inpatient rehab. He had tried many times to contact me but I had my phone no. changed. I was DONE. So he wrote me from rehab. I didn't write him back. When he got out he came to my apt. and asked for a second chance. I told him absolutely not. After several months, he tried again. I told him I'd consider "dating" him once a week, but if I had any inkling he was drinking again, done deal, over! In that dating time, he had no clue where I worked (I had gotten a job), and he did not have my new phone no. I didn't trust him. In any event, he worked his program and we eventually got married, bought a nice house, raised good kids and he never had one relapse. UNTIL ... About 5 years ago (I lost count) he relapsed, and I have been still sticking with him, although I have left numerous times and come back on his empty promises, I've dropped 2 orders of protection against him on his empty promises. It's same words, different day! It has been a horror at times, he's now drinking heavily daily and back to the way he was 23 years ago. I first came on this board to try and learn compassion and live with it, but after last night's "fun", I am done! I am going to get busy making a plan. My main point of this is that when I did not come to his rescue or fall for his "promises" of learning a lesson and let him do what he needed to do, he got sober and remained sober for over 14 years. When I believe his promises and give it another shot, nothing changes, which brings me to the point of the saying "nothing changes if nothing changes" Hope this helps you find your answers. Terri
More advice giving than I like to do, but you said you wanted encouragement.....
My two cents, is to listen to what he is committing to do, and what he is committing to change.... Of course he's upset right now, but most A's, when they are active, have one single goal - "to do the minimum possible to keep everything just as it is".
I guess my inclination is that you have made a huge first step by actually kicking him out, and (in your words), this is the first time he's ever really had that done to him.... Try to imagine how you will feel if you let him back, and he immediately reverts to his old ways?? Doesn't brining him back in right now pretty much shove that pillow back under his butt?? In his sickness, it would also be teaching him another "valuable lesson", in that he can get his way if he whines pathetically, and tugs on your heartstrings....
I got from your earlier posts that you want to love this guy, but you want him whole..... This person is not anywhere near "whole" right now, and he'd be pretty damn sure to disappoint you very soon after you allowed him back....
If he's like my A, his next step will be either: a) anger and really ticked off at YOU for this situation....... or, b) something along the line of "Fine, what exactly do I have to do to be able to come back home?"
If I were you, I'd be spending time thinking about your answer to question b, cuz he WILL get there at some point.....
Take care of you...
T
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"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"
"What you think of me is none of my business"
"If you knew the answer to what you are worrying about, would it REALLY change anything?"
I can give you my ESH. The A who I was with and left last year became homeless. He did the same number oh how he needed me and then proceeded to go on and on and on acting self destructively. After a few months of that I cut off from him gradually. Eventually I cut off totally. I have no idea where he is, what he is doing or where he is living. I keep it at that. Not knowing is so so so crucial for those of us who tend to be over responsible.
Its a long journey to not knowing. I don't think it is yes/no for a long long time. Its a process. Over time you'll be able to set boundaries, over times you can obsess less. Right now maybe you cant' and why beat yourself to a pulp because you "care". Not caring is an art, its part of detaching. You can learn to "not know" and live with it.
Don't beat yourself to a pulp because of where he is. Try to take care of yourself no matter what. That isn't necessarily right this minute cutting him off. For you it may be a journey rather than an "event".
Keep coming here and posting what you feel and what you think looks like recovery. I've been here for years and there are some days when I don't know what recovery is at all.
What I did when I had to make my AH leave was tell him he had the burden of proof. I gave away my trust to someone who didn't earn it. That was some of my share of the responsibility. He shattered that trust and it is his job to earn it back this time. BUT, it's my job not to give it away free this time. There has to be a measure of justice for any relationship to work. There has to be some trust even if it is trust that he will act like an A.
There has to be reality, not fantasy. In my experience, if he is still crying, whining, guilting, etc, then he doesn't get it. When my AH was really serious about getting it, he quit all that, and started to take responsibility for his own position in life that he put himself in. Of course it didn't happen all at once, but there was a huge shift in his thinking and it showed. He was almost 2 years into the AA program before that happened though. This is not an instant/overnight program. Progress, not perfection for us and them.
If I take him back and he has not proven his intent to work hard at his program of recovery then I would at least try to be honest with myself about that. I would want to say," OK, Jen, I know he's not serious, yet, but I'm not ready to make him leave long term yet, so I may be in for another ride." At least this is being honest with myself.
But you don't have to make the decision right now. You can take the time to figure out what you need. And that's the most important thing for your own program, finding out what YOU need.
So our program tells us to get to meetings, get a sponsor, work the steps, read CAL. That's what I have done and it's working for me. And of course come here and read and post.
In recovery,
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~Jen~
"When you come to the edge of all you know you must believe in one of two things... there will be earth on which to stand or you will be given wings." ~Unknown
I just have a couple of small things to say - better to keep it about what you need, rather than what he has to do. There is a difference between "You need to sober up" and "I'm not living with a drunk, any more". One is tellling him what to do, the other is about you, rather than him.
Please note that all the focus on my post was on you. Whenever I get into telling anyone what to do I get lost somehow. I set tremendous limits with the A over the years. He walked right through all of them. I'd leave, set limit's he'd promise, not do it and I stayed. So I suggest with any big limits you really explore your options, what are they. Do you want to stop talking to him(easier said than done without a lot of recovery), do you want intermittent contact?
I think the issue is not in telling them what they should do, could do, or will do but in what you want to do.
I know that is tremendously difficult to do because I've been there. I also know if I did not set limits I went into total overwhelm.
At first they were little limits, I was not available, eventually it got to bigger limits, no money to give and more. In time it got to more.
I really don't think any of us get to the point of leaving and saying sayanara overnight because after all we are "attached".
(((jaysbaby)))There is a saying that people never change. That is not always true. Sometimes people really do change, I know many people who have changed. Alcoholics are not regular people. They are alocholics. They do what Alcoholics do. They have a disease that is out of their control, and will destroy them and everything they hold dear. There is no cure. The "only" thing they can decide to do is to get help, and make a comintment to change their life. They and only "they" can make that decision. Your AH has not, I repeat HAS NOT made that decision. I like canidianguy, (who I respect very much), have never actually given any advice on MIP. This might be as close as I ever come. Jaysbaby you are dealing with a person who is not thinking about anyone but himself. He will take any action to satisfy his needs. He will beg, cry, get angry, Or threaten to kill you. He didn't say he was going to kill out loud , but he was in your kitchen looking for a knife when you and your little girl ran out of the house. I know that is not the person you married. This person is sick, very sick, he has not changed, will not change and can not change. It's the disease, it is not him. You did the best possible thing when you kicked his a-- out, and I asure you he is not as bad off as he says he is. So why even answer his call? It will only make you lose your sernity!!! You can't help him. It is his way for putting you on a guilt trip. Why take another trip on that train? Not until "HE" decides to get help, and stays sober for a long, lond time. I'm just thinking about you and your little Girls safety. You were put in harms way, and you ran out of your house, and thank goodness you ended up here on MIP.When you feel like you do now keep coming back here, I know it is hard, but trust me you are doing the best possible thing for your A whether you realize it on not. I have a daughter who is one year older than you, I raised her by myself from age 9. I love her dearly. She is a Daddy's girl. If she were in the same situation as you I would want her to do the very things you are doing. So Be Strong. There is only one thing different, even though I am an very easy going man who has never been in any trouble in his entire life, I can guarantee you one thing, if you were my daugher I would not be able to write this to you. Why? Because I would be in jail!!!! You are in my prayers. RLC
I recall a close friend of mine whose son would call like this and she realized that SHE WAS KILLING HIM by going and getting him and taking him back. She stopped doing it. She would call the police and remove him from her property. She would go and pick him up and take him to a shelter. But she did not let him back because she knew if she did HE WOULD NOT HIT BOTTOM. He has been clean and sober for 6 years now- because she was tough and did not take him back. J.
We kicked our A son out of our home a number of years ago. With these words, you are not accepting our boundaries of not drinking in our home. You are not staying out of trouble. You refuse to seek help for you addiction, we love you but we can't live with you.
Our son literally had no where to live. It was a terrible blow to him, but the price of allowing him to use our home as a flop house which is what it had become to him was becoming increasingly distressful for the rest of the family.
He told us years later, it was the best thing we could have ever done for him. He's now going on nearly 4 yrs sober. Owns his own home, with wife of 6 yrs, two children, a job, two cars, near a park with a school and by the grace of God he is sober today.
We loved him enough to allow him to make his own mistakes and come back when he could prove himself trustworthy once again. He and his family are very much a part of our lives now. We fish together, have family BBQ's together, keep the grandkids over night on weekends, they enjoy dinners with us to celebrate each others bdays or mothers day or every holiday.
He's back, He's whole, He's alive again, Just for today...his addiction is at bay. It was is and will continue to be his struggle. While here as parents it was too easy to enable, with here's a few bucks, I'll call you off from work, oh we need to pick you up from Jail? What do you mean you're in the ER from another DUI blackout driving stint. It simply became too much for us.
Praise the Lord, he is a living walking miracle. I never once gave up hope. I did however have to do one of the toughest things I ever had to do by asking him to get clean and sober, get help, get it elsewhere.
You are doing what you have to do in order to take care of yourself. You set a boundary and sticking with it. Good job! Nobody said this was going to be the easy part once we ask them to leave. Remember what the chaos was like when he was with you. Do you want to have that back in your life? The love doesn't stop because you are living separate lives. It didn't mean that when I asked AH to leave. It was the hardest thing I ever had to do. But I couldn't live that way anymore.
Here's the other thing: he's an adult. He has choices to make, good or bad. Yes, the disease has a hold of him. He could get the help. He could reach out. The disease may not allow him to do that yet. Allow him the dignity of making choices, right or wrong and the consequences that go along with it. Nobody made the choice for you. Nobody forced you to make the choices you did. I wouldn't like that if someone did that for me. We have to come to our own conclusions about the way we are going to live our lives. Addict or no addict. We are adults. Perhpas now he will begin to realize what he has been doing with his life. Perhaps not. I hope he will. All you can do is turn him over to his HP and let him take care of him. You keep doing what you are doing. You'll be just fine. Love and blessings to you and your family.
Live strong, Karilynn & Pipers Kitty
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It's your life. Take no prisoners. You will have it your way.
Nobody said this was going to be the easy part once we ask them to leave. Remember what the chaos was like when he was with you. Do you want to have that back in your life? 
The love doesn't stop because you are living separate lives. It didn't mean that when I asked AH to leave. It was the hardest thing I ever had to do. But I couldn't live that way anymore. 