The material presented
here is not Al-Anon Conference Approved Literature. It is a method
to exchange
information, ideas, feelings, problems and solutions on a personal
level.
The alcoholic in my life has been diagnosed with a serious mental illness. They won't discuss it and surprise surprise, are in denial about it. In so much denial that I was not told about it before the marriage, I found out by coming across some legal papers which contained information about the diagnosis.
I have been in counseling for the grief of coping with my marriage to an unapologetic alcoholic who has absolutely no regard for others in their life. The psychologist told me that this is VERY common in alcoholics, mentall illness. I was told that only someone who is very ill mentally continues with an action that is so self defeating with absolutely NO regard for the consequences of their actions and with NO DESIRE TO STOP.
This makes sense on SO many levels. In all seriousness I deal with my own addictions, a food addiction and have been diagnosed with an eating disorder. So, what did I do? I SOUGHT HELP!!! DUH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
When I realized that my eating disorder could affect my health and I might not be around to see my children graduate from high school and I couldn't cope on my own, I sought help, even though I didn't think I needed it before. Also the thought of modeling such unhealthy eating behavior in front of my children caused me to seek help. A little denial is human nature, but the alcoholics level of denial that you pee your pants in your forties and think it is NORMAL is certifiable.
Was it easy for me to seek help? NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Was it humiliating? YES!!!!!!!!!!!! Was it easy? NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Has the road to recovery been easy? NO!!!!!
But, was it worth it? YES!
The alcoholic sees NO need for help and with their continuing decline has lowered and lowered their definition of normal. This does not strike me as being the thinking of a mentally healthy individual.
Well, the inevitable happened, the alcoholic reached a health crisis that sort of forced them to face their drinking problem and they have quit cold turkey a few years ago.
Yet, somehow the indifference, selfishness, total lack of social skills, total lack of empathy and committment skills remain. It has to be due to the mental illness.
I have learned also that long term HEAVY drinking can cause mental illness as well in the form of actual brain damage. So, I have to wonder...which came first? The mental illness or the alcoholism?
Then again...does it matter? I am afraid I am beginning to think as many people do, there is simply no hope for alcoholics to ever be normal or healthy. Most of them suffer from mental illness, and, well, think about it, chemical concussions (black outs which are an actual episode of visible brain damage on CT scans) aren't going to help THAT situation get better now is it? So, they were already impossible to live with and now they are worse AND drink and wet their pants on top of that.
Let's add to this the fact that most alcoholics suffer from the large group of mental illnesses characterized as "Personality Disorders" which are the most horrendous to deal with and most difficult to treat. These people appear normal, live in reality and and know the date and who is president and don't think they can fly, but that is about it for their list of good points. They have NO compassion for others, can't feel or know what love is and walk all over people with PRIDE. For them life is a chess game and caring healthy loving NORMAL people are teh pawns that they use for their purpose at will.
Well, I wrote this post looking for hope, trying to not totally give in to depair.
I know there are some alcoholics who just let binge drinking get out of control until they are addicted, but they at least try to seek help and dont' really suffere from mental illness so have some redeaming qualities. I am not wondering about them.
I wonder what hope there is for the person who is seen by ALL as in family, friends (they really don't have any, I am referring to MY friends who try to be friendly to them) and collegues alike as a TOTAL JERK and this is sober! Only I see the drunk, and believe me, they don't get any nicer.
Ironically I have read that people who suffer from Borderline Personality Disorder are phenomenally attractive, which is extremely ironic. This is perhaps the ONLY thing this person has going for them. It roped me in and it takes a long time for your brain to break through the denial natural to your initial instinct of liking a person who is clean, very good looking, and who is educated and speaks intelligently of big ideas. When you see the jerk your brain keeps making excuses for them until you are so deep into liking them that you get a HORRIBLE wakeup call when their deeds are so henous that your brain is shocked into reality.
Well I have woken up and smelled the coffee FINALLY and it AINT good!
Welcome to MIP and hopefully to the Al-Anon Family Groups and face to face Al-Anon meetings which can be found in most countries on this planet. You are not and never have been alone in your resentment and anger and question -ing.
It might be a good idea to check into the AMA (American Medical Association) site and look at their information on alcoholism. It was important for me to learn that it is a primary disease and that my alcoholic was a sick person...not the bad person I thought her to be. That helped calmed me down so that I could learn more. I learned tons in the Al-Anon Family Groups from others who were closely connected to practicing or dry alcoholics who had been victimized by the disease also and I learned more and more by going to college to get a formal education of alcoholism and drug addiction or the simpler version "substance abuse". I learned even more after my own assessment was taken 9 years after I stopped drinking, was a member of the AFG and also a substance abuse counselor. I am the grand-child, child, step child, ex husband(2x), parent of alcoholics and addicts and I am alcoholic. I never say I am an alcoholic because that would personalize the disease. I say I am alcoholic because I carry it just like the tuberculosis disease I also carry which also has been linked to alcoholism.
I have compassion for the depth of your anger and the consequences of your spouses drinking. I also had anger that deep...most called it rageaholism. I came to Al-Anon and worked with a counselor also and now only have to deal with it as a symptom of my "personality disorder" that mostly shows it's very ugly head when I am alone and not with my wife, family, friends, associates etc. The program and a loving HP (Higher Power) help me to keep the negative symptoms in check. There are positive symptoms to the "personality disorder" also and some people have made a ton of money taking it on stage.
One of the things that happens when alcohol takes over the mind, body, spirit and emotions of a person is that they stop growing in all of these areas. We become "stunted" and "disabled" while others around us who are from similar backgrounds and ages and don't drink mature and growup with the times and events in daily life. Alcoholics don't we black out for years or tune out for years or just do what's most important to us...drink and nothing else matters. It was hell being an adult and not relating to adults or trusted as one. I drank often. I thought of drinking often. I was under the influence of the chemical, that is not a normal body chemical and is considered a poison, toxic substance to the human body even at low levels. When I was under the influence of alcohol it was on all four levels, mind, body, spirit and emotions. I did not grow up until I had years of recovery and worked toward a level of maturity with members who had grown up themselves and were willing to help me do the same.
An alcoholic can also regress...lose whatever mental, emotional, spiritual and physical acuity that they have acquired and regress into total dependence upon others for their daily needs. This is the most cunning, powerful, and bafflling disease I have ever watched. It can and will if supported destroy both the drinker and non-drinker and then cause their death.
I was angry. I was angry that she couldn't drink like me and I was angry that she drank the way she drank and seemed to cause all the anguish. There was and still is so much that I don't know. What I do know is that I am here now very much more serene, sober and happy. I am happy that you found this place and this family. You will hear more from them cause they have much of importance to share with you. They have and may still be able to fill your shoes.
Stick around and listen and learn and maybe take a suggestion or two. That by the way is my suggestion for now. My prayers for you and your alcoholic. I wish you both miracles.
Hi TIB, Jerry got you off to a good start there- he is awesome and wise!
My AH has bipolar disorder and drinks to self medicate because he chooses not to take any meds for his MI. I know how you feel/wonder, I used to do this, too. I have detached, though.
Al-anon teaches us that all the A's our there have their own higher powers (HP's) and we learn that they are on their own paths. We did not cause their alcoholism (of mental illness), we cannot cure it and we cannot control it. These are the 3 C's... There is a 4th C: we sure can contribute to the insanity of the situation, though because of our own disease!
Al-anon is for US. It helps us keep the focus on us and not on them and their drama, trauma and hystericalness. We learn one step at a time to look at ourselves, our parts both good and bad and we learn to honor and love ourselves and put ourselves first with dignity and respect.
Keep coming back. The MI piece is really really tough- I am sorry that you have to deal with this, I know how hard it can be. But you are exactly where you need to be right now. I would urge you to pause and take a very careful look around at yourself and your life and get to as many face to face al-anon meetings as you can. Also NAMI (National assoc of mental illness) also has excellent classes for friends and family members of people who suffer from mental illness. Hugs and love, J.
As far as the "what came first" question, I would offer the immortal words of my sponsor, who used to guide & remind me (over and over again)......
"if you knew the answer to your question, would it REALLY change anything?"
The "why" questions/answers are the ones that eat away at us, and impede US from getting better.... I think, in time, you'll find it is much more beneficial for you to focus on the "what" issues.....
The anger you have about the circumstances and situation is both common & understandable..... Now the trick is to figure out what the heck you are gonna do about it, for YOU to get healthy..... Al-Anon, these boards, and sharing information & education with others of us in recovery is a great start.....
Keep coming back...
Tom
"it is neither good or bad - it just IS"
__________________
"He is either gonna drink, or he won't.... what are YOU gonna do?"
"What you think of me is none of my business"
"If you knew the answer to what you are worrying about, would it REALLY change anything?"
That was really insightful, would it really change anything. That really resonates with me!
I know I used to spend all my moments both spare and taken thinking about why this happened, why did it get worse, why is he choosing it over us, what if he got better this time, what if I leave and miss him getting better, why have I put up with this for so long, why did I let that happen...he must think I'm a total idiot, why did i pretend to believe just to placate him when I knew it was bs? I could go on all day with the whys and what ifs.
The fact of the matter is.. it really doesn't make a difference! That's what I had to come to accept and "get" over all this time. It was so hard for me to get to the place of saying it IS what it IS and I don't like it! Instead of living in the whys and what ifs.
Welcome Blythe, and know... you're not alone! I equate this program (for me) as having been in a long sleep and suddenly waking up. Sometimes the dreams were good, sometimes they were bad but now my eyes are open and I choose my destiny rather than have it unfold in front of me as a surprise.
Welcome to the MIP family. Here you will find great experience, hope, wisdom, strength and humor (good for the ). Lots of good replies here.
I know from hubby's experience that when he got out of rehab and started outpatient therapy he didn't even see a psychologist until he had been a year in the program. Alot of times the alcohol will mask the mental problems. He found a good psychologist and continues to work on his mental health issues. But it doesn't matter which came first. As long as he's getting the help he needs, that's the important thing.
To me, I can't believe that anyone would want to be an addict; be it a drug, alcohol, food, shopping or any other kind of addiction. I know how hard I can struggle to eat properly and I don't have a chemical inbalance in my brain that says I need to eat. I may have some emotional issues that may hinder my ability, but I'm working on those. I believe in my heart that an addict wants to get better (deep down inside) but they may not to be ready too. Being ready vs. want are two entirely different things.
Here's the important thing to remember: Your recovery has to be about you and for you, regardless if he chooses recovery or not. It's about taking back your life and living the life you so richly deserve. It's about living strong. Never, never give up hope!
Turn him over to his HP. Continued success in your recovery. Please keep coming back to us. Love and blessings to you and your family.
Live strong, Karilynn & Pipers Kitty <-- the cat
-- Edited by Karilynn at 12:51, 2008-05-01
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It's your life. Take no prisoners. You will have it your way.
My ex MIL said she always knew, from the time my ex was very little that he was mentally ill. But the thing is, she gave him whiskey in his bottle when he was 3 days old to get him to sleep. So, which came first? Who knows. All I do know is he has a diagnosed mental illness ( a few actually). But he has also been a drug addict/alcoholic for as long as he can remember. He had long periods of "sobriety" with and without AA.
I really liked your description of the personality disordered. That is exactly my experience. You know what you're talking about.
Does it matter which came first? I think it might be interesting to know for sure, but at this point I don't waste my time thinking about it or him. When we were together, and I was advocating for him thru the system, it mattered to me. But no longer. I know what he did to me, how I have been effected by the disease and him, and what I need to do to not get stuck myself and keep growing. It is hard but that is why I am here. I'm glad you're here too!
). Lots of good replies here. 
