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Hi y'all, I was on here under the name LisaF, but only posted a couple of times... I'm sorry, this is gonna be a long ramble probably (my posts usually are lol) but I have so much going through my mind right now and I just can't get my mind to slow down...
I don't really know much about alanon... I went to a couple of meetings earlier this year but my boyfriend at the time got upset about it and I didn't go back. My AA sponsor and I are going to look up some meetings around here to try out, since we both probably belong in Alanon also. I heard an Alanon speaker last spring at a roundup and could relate to so much that I think I probably belong here... but just haven't found meetings here and really tried it out.
I've had some alcoholics in my life (stepparents, exhusband, exboyfriends... and current boyfriend is a recovering alcoholic)... the only alcoholics in my life now are recovering alkies... which might be why I haven't really seriously looked into Alanon before.
What I'm really struggling with right now though is my family (parents and sister... thankfully my brothers and I get along fine)... and they aren't alcoholics, but that disfunction and chaos is there that I need to get away from. To me it seems like they have the alcoholic mind even if they don't drink like an alcoholic, and it is so hard for me to be around. I got along fine with my family for the most part when I was still drinking... we talked often, got together often, we had our disagreements and fights of course, but we got along fine and the chaos didn't bother me so much I guess because at that time I was still thriving on chaos. My sister and I used to talk on the phone for hours every day, and go hang out together often. I used to go to my mom's several times a week and hang out with her and she'd call me wanting me to come over. Not saying everything was great, because it wasn't, there have always been a lot of issues between me and most my family (probably a lot due to my drinking) but we got along pretty well at least usually and did enjoy spending time together... until I got sober anyway. They look down on me for going to meetings, for being an alcoholic - my mom especially, she has something against alcoholics whether we're recovering or not.
I moved last winter and was living 12 hours away all this year until September, and during that time, my family and I talked often, got along fine again, they'd tell me they missed me, wanted me to come visit... my dad would actually talk to me for more than 5 minutes every few weeks, he and I had never been close, and while I was gone we talked every few days and he showed some interest in my life for once... I came down for a visit last May and they acted like they didn't care to see me at all, and it was right back to looking down on me for going to meetings and stuff, telling me I don't need meetings.
When I moved back down here in September, I bounced around staying with family till I figured out where I was going to live, and it was just like it had been in May. I wound up living 45 minutes from where they all live, and I hardly talk to them now... when I'd call they'd hardly say anything, they never ask me to come see them, nor do they come see me. I talk to my dad maybe 5 minutes every 2 or 3 weeks usually. I did stay with my mom for a week last month while my back was out, and it was ok at first until my stepdad started really getting to me, and then that weekend we did Thanksgiving and it was just total H*ll, too much bickering between everyone and it really got to me... it's always been like that, but I can't handle it anymore, I don't want that chaos in my life, and since then I've mostly stopped calling them, and I don't make special trips into Memphis to see them either.
I've had some close friends tell me they don't really think my family is healthy for me, that it's not healthy for me to be around them so much. And honestly I can agree. At the same time, I don't want to let go. As much as I don't like being around them anymore, I guess I miss how close we'd been before. My sponsor is suggesting a lot of it is loneliness, since my family was my social life mostly before sobriety, and that probably has a lot to do with it. She thinks the more involved I get in AA, the better I will feel. Honestly if it weren't for the little kids in my family, and my younger brother, I'd just cut them off completely and not have anything to do with them, just move on with my life. Seems like it would be so much easier (and probably better for me) to just not have anything at all to do with them.
People have told me I need to detach and let it go, or accept that this is just how it is. and that is really hard for me. I will be moving away again, for school, hopefully next year, will be 14 hours away then... I guess part of me is hoping it goes back to us all being close again if I'm further away, but then at the same time, whenever I come visit I will have this problem all over again. Someone in an AA meeting told me that most families are like this (even "normal" ones) and y'know, I've somewhat accepted my family is the way it is, but I guess what I can't deal with is how this is affecting my serenity and how much worse I feel around them. My dad was here for just a bit today taking care of some things with the property, and just him being here for 30 minutes or less and we hardly even talked... gets me really out of sorts, lately I can't handle talking to them or seeing them at all without getting like this. This just really isn't good for me.
I really don't know how to handle this. But when someone mentioned to me earlier today that I need to detach, it made me think of Alanon (cuz of the detach with love thing) and it hit me that the times I've read Hope for Today, I tend to relate it more to my family than to the alcoholics in my life... I thought maybe Alanon could help me with this... probably need to be in Alanon for many reasons, but this is what I'm struggling with so much right now.
I'm sorry this was so long... I really hope someone here has some ES&H to share...
Hey ChicknLisa, it was good to read your post. The first thing that occurred to me was that perhaps you need to take a look at your expectations around your family members. What do you want from them? Can you sit down and have a conversation about this and what they may want from you? It might be an interesting experiment and it might be a mature way for you to engage them in an adult-like way, you know, initiate a conversation.
My ESH is that I have met several AA's at al-anon and they seem to be way ahead of the game and take to it really quickly so I encourage you to attend.
The dance of emancipation away from your family (which is totally healthy, I might add) is always tricky whether there is a history of A or not.
In my family of origin, there was no active drinking but you better believe it the whole rest of the behavior was there as if there was lots of drinking going on- I guess it stemmed from my great grandfather who was a notorious drunk and gangster. My grandmother was raised in his highly alcoholic home, married a tea-totaler in public who drank secretly in the attic, alone. My mom was raised by these people- and I was raised by her- you get the picture- the family disease is all over the place whether there is active drinking or not. Any piece of al-anon literature suits me to a T and my parents rarely drank but the dynamic is totally there- my mom is the center of the universe, the only one who could have feelings or talk- the rest of us revolved around her and her tantrums, rages, moods, you name it. She was the "alcoholic" even though she never drank. My dad was the typical al-anoner- trying to fix and please my mom (nothing worked), isolated, begging, pleading, etc. you get the picture.
I also think that the siblings that "go away" become the darlings of the family in a dysfunctional situation- I have experienced this alot, too. My sister stuck closer to home and she got treated like crap. Me, on the other hand, lived far away and was adored. Another typical b & w alkie thing. The further away you are the better you look/seem!! My sister and I tease each other about how one day she is the "good" daughter and the next I am with the other one being the "horrible" daughter and vice versa. My parents took great efforts to pitch her and I against each other or to choose "sides". Really dysfunctional. So it makes sense that when you are near home they ignore you and when you are away, they pine for you!! Its part of the disease.
And this is a disease so you know exactly what you are dealing with. You are the only one with the recovery going on, not them. they are not going to get it so it may be unrealistic to expect them to- and just when it seems like they are all good and nice and inviting recognize that this is also a part of the disease and that they will ignore you next week...take what you need and leave the rest and welcome to al-anon, I think you are a good fit for it! Hugs, J.
Hi Jean, nice to meet you :) Wow, I'm so glad you shared all that... our families sound so much alike... There is some alcoholism in my dad's side of the family, and drug addiction (and probably alcoholism) in my mom's side of the family with her sisters... and she had an absolutely crazy abusive mother who raised her... and I wouldn't be surprised if there was more addiction or alcoholism in her family... and I can see so many alkie traits in her although she doesn't drink (at most maybe one margarita a year)... And my sister is a lot like her... I can see a lot of both alcoholic and alanon traits in my dad (actually I've questioned if he is an alkie, from things he's said about his drinking this year, but that's not for me to decide)...
What you said about the siblings that go away being the favored ones... my older brother and sister have always been the favorites and they live close, they were the "good" kids who didn't really cause any problems... it's always been that way. Me and my little brother are the "problem children" in my mom's eyes... and of course it *couldn't* be alcoholism, she wouldn't raise an alcoholic lol She has a lot of denial, and she blames my little brother's problems on me being a bad influence on him... and he is really starting to head down the path I went down, but he never saw the things I did, though I'm sure he saw the affects of it... I've talked to him some about alcohol although he's not drinking yet (yes I want to "fix" him lol) but realize whatever happens happens, and hopefully his path will change. But it seems like she thinks it's even worse for me to be around him now that I actually admit to being an alcoholic... maybe her fear and denial? I don't know.
Honestly, I don't know what my expectations are with my family. I don't know what I'm wanting. I know that I can't change them. So I guess what I want is to get away from it... I'm distancing myself from them lately, which seems to help, but then when I do see them or talk to them I just feel so much worse. And I know even when I move, if we're "close" again, it will just be dissappointment and all this again when I come back to visit, or if I live down here again later on. I don't want to set myself up as far as that goes. Guess that's why I've really felt like I just want to cut them out completely... but also definitely not at a point right now to really make that decision either.
As for talking to them about it... at least with my dad, I've tried a few times to talk to him, to tell him I want a relationship with him, to try to be closer to him... and for quite some time I'd call him to try to get together for dinner or whatever and he never really wanted to, or if we did get together it was him just putting me down and asking when I was gonna straighten out my life and stop screwing around... I'd tried to tell him that I feel judged a lot, I feel put down, like they don't have any faith at all in me... but he keeps on with it. He's always been like that, to me and others... and I can't change that, but I don't want to be around it either. My mom gets horribly defensive if I try to talk to her, so I gave up on that... and my sister is the same way.
A good friend of mine in AA told me tonight maybe I need to focus more on my sobriety rather than to throw Alanon into the picture also... I'm working on my 4th step, so he said maybe that is just making this harder to deal with, which he could be right... but right now I'm wanting to try anything that might help to handle all this, and I've seen before that I should be in Alanon besides this. Haven't struggled so much like this in quite some time now and am not finding much at all to ease this either. The way I see it, trying out some Alanon meetings is also focusing on my sobriety if it will help, considering the lack of serenity and state of mind I've been in lately.
There's an Alanon meeting tomorrow night not too far from me, and I'm thinking about trying it out... gonna talk to my sponsor about it tomorrow, she doesn't know a lot about Alanon, but when I was talking to her about it before she had agreed maybe it'd help.
Sorry, I'm rambling on again... I need to get some sleep... I'd done some reading in How Alanon Works... and I know better than to read late at night, can't fall asleep when I'm reading cuz it gets my mind going more lol But so far am relating to quite a bit of what I've read.
I don't think there is ever a time when Alanon is "too much". Is there such a thing as too much recovery? Alanon can help you accept things and people the way they are and deal with it accordingly. We learn we can't change people so it is our job to adjust our expectations realisticly and find peace in doing so. A meeting is a great idea :)
Good luck Christy
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If we think that miracles are normal, we will expect them. And expecting a miracle is the surest way to get one.
Hi Lisa, and I can relate to a TON of what you have said.
I qualify for AA and Alanon both. Unfortunately we have no Alanon here in my small town, and finances dictate I can't drive out of town, so I have truly enjoyed finding this board in particular, reading, and learning. I also attend our small AA group here regularly and continue to work on my recovery.
I do agree with what your sponsor says in relation to loneliness and working really hard on your program.
I come from a long line of alcoholics on both sides of the family. Neither of my parents have/do drink but they have many of the dysfunctional attitudes/behaviors.
Over the years my relationship with my family, specifically my parents, has gotten better. That is due to the fact that I continue to work hard on my recovery. They have no program of recovery, and are of the belief 'you don't air your dirty laundry in public'. So, essentially, they haven't changed, but I have.
They can be toxic for me IF I engage with them too much, and have unrealistic expectations.
I am blessed in that we all live 80 miles apart. I do talk to my mom frequently on the phone, but there are times I have to cut back on that because I am not right with 'self' and it's easy to get caught up in her problems.
We occasionally get together for a movie and eats, that usually entails half of a day. That I can deal with, and it's enjoyable for all!
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"If a dog will not come to you after having looked you in the face, you should go home and examine your conscience." - Woodrow Wilson
Well my ESH is that dysfunction can be on many levels. I think the task of being aware how dysfunctional your family is/was is so key. I also know for me I have a huge comfort level for dysfunctional (I grew up with it). For me beocming uncomfortable with dysfunctional involved a lot of grief and anger. I do not hold out much hope in dealing with my family of origin anymore. I did for years. I think it takes quite a while for some of us to work through.
There are numerous numerous books/groups/places to go for support around dysfunctional family issues. I can't say I just read a book and got over it. I read lots of books talked about it a lot and grieved a whole lot. I also can't say it doesn't hurt anymore. I have to say it does hurt. At the same time having processed it I do not hurt in the same way anymore.
This Board is a wonderful wonderful place to come with these issues. I have now been here over 2 years. Detaching was very very hard for me. I have to say it still can be but when I can do it I can be happy no matter what which is a first for me.
Hey chicknlisa, I had to completely sever all ties with my intensely dysfunctional/alkie family for a good 5-6 years (29-34). I mean nothing- no contact at all. I was the youngest and they all just kept treating me like the baby. I think the severance was really useful- they kind of forgot about me and I about them so that when we re-connected it was like we were all adults and it moved to another level.
I have always felt that I had "families" everywhere, not just my biological family which was really useful to me. I think this program encourages this also. There was absolutely no unconditional love and acceptance in my family and a great deal of judgement- not just their judgement but the law of god kind of judgement, too. Really toxic. Sometimes you just need to cleanse yourself of that and get out of dodge.
I am working a 4th step in al-anon and its been a real trip. Good luck with yours.
In so many ways I see more and more that al-anon and AA are just flip sides of the same coin. I could just as easily be on the "other side" as on this one. I am hoping to attend some AA meetings soon, I am working up the courage (as if I need more meetings in my life- geesh, I attend 3-4 a week already!) But I have heard some al-anoners say that they are really helpful to see that "whole" picture or this horrible disease.
Thanks for your post, it was very thought provoking and useful and I wish you all the best. Hugs, J.
Thank you so much for your replies, and nice to meet y'all :) When I'd tried out those couple of meetings before, what had prompted me was someone at an AA meeting saying "AA saved my life the first time, and Alanon saved it the second" and then I'd also heard something like "AA taught me to live with myself, Alanon taught me to live with others"... it's something I'm starting to see could be a really big help to me, especially after what y'all have shared.
Christy, I agree with you about "is there such thing as too much recovery?" I didn't really agree with the friend that had said maybe I should hold off on Alanon... but I wasn't really sure... I have a friend that had been my online sponsor for quite awhile this year, and so I brought it up with him, and he said the same thing you did more or less. And said he thinks it could help, and if it doesn't then I don't have to keep going, but to give it a try. So I think I'll get to that meeting tonight.
TenderheartsKS, believe me I know how the small town thing is. There aren't many close Alanon meetings around here. I'm in a "town" of 200 people, we don't even have a gas station in my town, much less meetings lol I drive anywhere from around 25 minutes to an hour to go to AA meetings. This Alanon meeting I found is in a town 25 minutes north of me where I also go to an AA meeting. Then there is one about 45 minutes from me once a week. My homegroup is up in TN about 45 minutes to an hour from here, and my sponsor has told me there's a lot of good AA meetings up around there, I need to sit down with her and look up Alanon meetings in that area, because I don't know where all these towns are that were listed in TN on the alanon site. Even when I lived in Nebraska, Lincoln didn't have a whole lot of Alanon meetings either when I'd looked into it. So I'm hoping this forum will help some, I've been in chat here some but it's been awhile.
As for accepting it or not having expectations... really I think in many ways I have started to do that. Like I know my mom and sister and I can get along great usually as long as I don't have any problems, as long as I don't talk about it. And that's something I'd had to accept just to have any kind of relationship with them. I know certain things that will set either of them off, so I don't bring those things up. And I've been ok with that mostly. My dad I've mostly just learned to avoid and not open up to him... I think I hide a lot from him because I can't take his judgement and it's been that way a really long time, I know in doing that I'm pushing him out of my life, but then I still get upset that he's not really a part of my life. But it's the only way I can have him in my life at all without building up more and more resentments every time I talk to him. But I'm sure there are still expectations there that I'm not acknowledging, I dunno...
Maresie, I think you hit the nail on the head, about grief and anger... I'm feeling a lot of that right now... the first Alanon meeting I went to was some kind of book study and they were talking about grief, and I couldn't relate much at the time, but I also wasn't relating it to my family either... and just here lately is when it has really hit me... and I'm just not dealing with it very well... I guess I feel like I'm missing a big part of my life... although really I'm happy in sobriety, I'm making my own life for myself... but I feel like I'm really missing something... a big hole in me right now.
Jean, I also have my "families" everywhere... There are a few guys from an AA chat I go to that I've become very close with, I got a lot of crap for it from some people, mostly women in that chatroom, about needing to stick with the women... but these guys are like dads to me, they look out for me, and they've kinda helped to fill a void that's been there for awhile... I think of my f2f sponsor sort of as a sister in a way... and several online friends that are definitely considered family... and my boyfriend of course... That grief and anger comes in to play some with it being the holidays, I would so much rather spend my holidays with the new "family" I've found in recovery, than to go deal with my real family. But I'm not ready to deal with all the problems that would come if I didn't go either. I have a lot of guilt because of this, because of having these people that I turn to instead of my family... The "dads"' I talk to online or on the phone, they're a huge part of my life, but I guess I feel it's wrong of me to turn to them and consider them as more of a father than my real dad is. There are women that I look at as mothers or sisters, and I get that same feeling of guilt... and maybe some resentment that I can't go talk to my real family.
Jean, good luck on your 4th step also... I've been working on mine off and on for quite some time now, and procrastinating a lot on it... but it really didn't seem so bad at first, and has been much harder to work on lately... I guess because I'm finally starting to get more honest about my feelings and everything, when I really wasn't before... I'd thought I was ready to go on to my 5th step, then my online sponsor brought up a few things, things I bring up a lot with him, and asked if I included them, and told me I need to keep writing, and since I have, that's when I started really getting honest with it and it has really hit me, it's a bit of a struggle just to work on it, and I'm trying hard to not put it off, to make myself do it.... makin myself work on it today, soon as I have my coffee lol
Welcome back! Long before I even heard of Alanon or was involved with the A I had been having issues with my relatives being so negative. I made a very deliberate decision not to make them part of my life any more. Their negativity was dragging me down. I had had enough of their meddling in my private life. Asking me when was I going to grow up and get married. Gee.... I was 25 and living on my own.... hmmm.... sounds grown up to me. One cousin even called me up and offered me sexual advice on how to keep a man! (Okay now it's funny, but I didn't like the idea of her meddling.) It was a hard choice to make, and one my sister did not understand. But I had to do what was best for me.
Emancipation from something can be scary and empowering at the same time. It can be a bit lonely too. I didn't miss their gossiping etc. Yes, there were plenty of alcoholics on that side of the family. Good heavens these people even meddled at my Dad's funeral. It was a hard enough situation with my lunatic stepmother (who forgot that Dad's kids actually existed). But when I look back at it, I was firm in my decision. If they called me I didn't return their calls. Maybe that's rude to some. I didn't want to give them the chance to start their manipulations again. I also started to cut out a few friends who were the same way. I realized they were not the loving and supportive people I had wanted them to be. When I was with them I was miserable. What was the point of that?
Recovery is about taking back your life. It's living the life you so richly deserve. Take no prisoners when you do this. Do what is best for you.
Love and blessings to you and your family.
Live strong, Karilynn & Pipers Kitty <-- the cat
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It's your life. Take no prisoners. You will have it your way.
