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Hi all ~ I wanted to share what's been going on lately with my daughter, who is 19 and has finished her freshman year at college (commuting to college, almost an hour away). She has, for the last couple of years (actually longer, but it's been more frequent here the last several months) just been a BEAR to live with, pissy (oops ) towards me ANYTIME I try to converse with her. Each time I call her on it, she will give an excuse...I call it an "excuse of the day", because it can be because of ANYTHING or NOTHING.
I kicked her out last August, but let her come back as long as she followed our house rules...which she agreed to...i.e. being courteous to my husband (her step-dad) and me, doing her part to help around the house (and not much at that), helping care for her cat that she brought home as a stranded kitten (changing litter, paying the vet bills, etc.), letting my husband or me know if she wasn't going to be home at night. Simple, simple things that are just plain common courtesy and easy to do (lol, especially for an alanoner). Not a control thing for me, just if she lives in my house, she needs to respect us and our boundaries. BTW, she does have a job, and is on scholarships for college, so the money she makes doesn't have to go towards much of anything, really.
As of lately, she and I simply can't communicate, and I consulted an older woman from our church, who is my dear friend (she's also a licensed counselor), and she suggested that I tell my daughter that in order for her to live here, she MUST help form and sign a contract with me, and that she would mediate us working on a contract if I needed her to. I told this to my daughter, and she absolutely went freaking nuts ~ as in blowing up, yelling, rolling the computer chair around the hardwood floor into the bookcase as she stormed out of the room, slamming doors behind her. I continued to calmly follow her upstairs and told her that I wanted to work on us communicating and getting along, that I needed someone to help me to do that. She told me that since I was the one that needed help, not her, that she wasn't going to see a "counselor" (it wouldn't be a counseling session, just someone helping to give us both insight into working an agreeable contract). She finally did agree to meet with my friend "just ONE time".
She is such an angry person, thanks to her dad (my ex). I told her to let me know which day she didn't have to work, and we'd set the appointment for then. I'm trying with all my might to try one last-ditch effort, as opposed to just booting her ass ( ). I even went to the police department and asked them what the law was on kicking her our...what kind of "notice" did I have to give her, or could I just make her get out...and they said I should give her enough time to find another place to live.
So, she has still not given me a day that we can work on a contract, even though I have asked her repeatedly when she has available. She gives excuses, like she doesn't know what her schedule is (sigh, not true, as she's a shift leader), and if she tells me her schedule, it usually changes because "she forgot she had to work the other shift". She's been giving me the runaround for the last week and I know it.
Last night I wrote a 3-page letter to her telling her that I loved her, that I am not going to let her treat me like dirt anymore, and that because I've tried and tried to work on the situation, with her not cooperating, then she has to be out of the house by June 15th. I told her that I will NOT tolerate any outbursts, destruction of property or slamming doors. I told her that I am not going to argue about this ANYMORE! I'm done, done, done trying to plead with her to be nice to me. DONE!!
She didn't say anything when I gave her the letter, and I came downstairs. About 1 hour later she left and I asked her if she was going to be home at night, she said no. This morning she came in to get something, and then left. When I came in this afternoon, she was here, had showered, and was walking out the door when I walked in. I asked her if she was coming home tonite, and she said no.
I'm not looking for any advice here, only sharing my experiences with an angry adult child of mine. Part of me is glad I took this action, but a part of me is sad and hurt that she is treating me this way. A lot of me is also very, very sad that she is choosing to live her life this way. She has pulled the "guilt" trip several times lately. She said, "I'm your only child and you're kicking me out...you'd do that to your only child?" Ha, ha, I didn't fall for it. She has said she will never speak to me if I kick her out, and "this time I mean it!", which really isn't any different than what she's doing to me now. The only thing different is that she won't be slamming things, she won't be looking at me like I've just crawled out from under a rock.
One example of what she says to me...she puts her drinking glass with the straw in it in the kitchen sink with all the dirty dishes (the straws usually end up in the sink or on the floor for the cats to play with). I know I can just throw the straws away, but after months of telling her to toss them in the garbage, she still can't seem to remember. So when I load the diswasher with the dirty dishes, I leave her straw in the sink for her to throw out. When I ask her to do that, she says "WHY DID YOU PUT MY GLASS AWAY???" I said, it was in with the dirty dishes. She said "I WASN'T DONE WITH IT!!! I PUT IT IN THE SINK TO SAVE IT FOR LATER!!!!" I told her that if she wanted to save her glass for later, to put it on the counter. And it's not like we only have one glass for her to drink out of. How silly was it that she got so bent out of shape? She takes anything I say and makes it into a huge argument. HUGE. ALL THE TIME. I'm TIRED, TIRED, TIRED. It makes me wonder if she's using drugs.
Anyway, sooooooo sorry this is sooooo long, but I just kept typing and typing and typing...
Listening is a major part of communications however I did a knee jerk reaction at your "I'm not looking for any advice here..." I am also a retired behavioral health counselor and worked with family dynamics. If you are done? NO is the shortest best sentence you can use and then you go on with your life. She'll be okay. A Power greater than yourself will see to it. "I'm TIRED, TIRED, TIRED." usually is opportunity enough to just let go...and let God or some other Higher Power. Just suggestions that were given to me that worked for whom ever gave them to me and then worked for me when I followed thru on them. My advise never works and the program says we don't give any.
Sorry you're going through this. Sounds like you're at your limit (oops no pun intended ). I think you have to do what is best for you. Ask yourself, if this were anyone else, would you tolerate such behavior? At some point she has to grow up and take responsibility for her actions. She's a smart girl, she'll be able to stand on her own 2 feet. If she stumbles, so be it. That's how they learn.
Love and blessings to you and your family.
Live strong, Karilynn & Pipers Kitty
P.S. I just brought up my Hazelden.org daily meditation. It's on conflict being a positive thing! Check it out.
-- Edited by Karilynn at 06:54, 2007-06-07
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It's your life. Take no prisoners. You will have it your way.
WOW! I can totally relate, on both sides. I feel your daughter's anger and pain. I have done the same thing to my mother. For many reasons. I know what they are but they are nothing I could ever share with her. I have tried but unfourtunatly we are unable to communicate at all. I, too am an only child, and a child of divorce and a child of this disease. Those things make for an angry person. I am still figuring out how to deal with my mother.
And I am a mother of 3 girls. The oldest is 12. She is driving me nuts right this minute. Talk about lack of communication! I can talk at her and her only response is "I don't know" or"ok". Seems I have carried over the don't talk about it trait from how I was raised. With the help of this program I am learning to do it differently. We shall see....
My mom enabled me. I am not an A but she has enabled me all my life as if I was. I have prayed for her to stop because I haven't been able to stop myself from asking. I treat her awfully. I don't like her and she doesn't like me. I am still trying to let go of the resentments I have towards her and I'm 34 years old!!! I know this is a hard situation but it sounds like you have made some boundries and you are sticking to them. I have friends who's parents did not enable them, they were not allowed to move back in, they were not "loaned" money, etc and they have great relationships today with their parents. I am jelous of them. So, maybe this is the best thing that you could do for both of you. Time will tell.....
Can I come stay??? LOL My mom would have me and all my kids in bed by nine or there'd be hell to pay!!! (That's why I don't stay) Maybe being a control freak and having outrageous rules is a good way to get your kids to take responsibility for their lives. When I was 19 I stayed with my mom (I wish her rules were that easy) She ended up taking my key and telling me not to come back. I was so mad at her, I hated her, I didn't speak to her for a year or two. Guess what...we talk all the time now, we get along great and we both got over it. Mind you I would rather stay with a stranger than her because she is a total control freak but we have a good relationship, we can talk, we get along well, we have respect for eachother. I guess my point is this too shall pass and I think back now that my mom putting me out was the right thing to do! I would do the same because having to take care of yourself (someday she'll have kids...) and kids sure gives you a new perspective on your parents and the thinking behind the things that they did.
As a mother of 5 daughters, geez can I relate to your post. How do they say that "Been there, got the T-shirt" - heck that T-shirt's been worn over and over again - still have to pull it out and wear it when the "drama" starts up again - lol
No suggestions, just nods of another understanding Mom who remembers looking at those daughters thinking - "How the heck did we get where we can't even have a simple conversation about a glass or piece of clothes?"
Prayers for you & your daughter, Rita
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No matter what me and my God are going to be ok, even better than OK -
I have no real experience to offer that might help your situation, but in reading your post it occurred to me that maybe your daughter is angry and upset and needs to vent it all in a negative way to someone that she feels safe with. I think that person appears to be you. I don't think she is knowingly doing that, but just is so angry inside she needs to let it out........negative or not. She must feel secure in the fact that you love her unconditionally, so she treats you badly, knowing you will love her anyway. Or maybe she is just testing to see just how much you do love her. I am no expert, for sure, but another mother who loves her children and wants to do what is best for them always. I know you love your daughter......if you didn't, you wouldn't be upset by her behaviour. You would just get her out and write her off. But, you are doing the right things, in my opinion. She has to learn and know that though you love her and want what's best for her, there are consequences to all bad behaviour. You deserve and have earned respect from her......simply because you are her mother. When I was a teen, my mother and I had our problems and I spoke to her in ways that I am ashamed of to this day. I know in most cases we were both wrong in our attitudes toward each other, but she was my mother and I could have been angry with her and still been respectful. I regret that I wasn't. Mother's deserve our respect in my opinion. My mother and I became great friends when I "grew up". We were different in many ways and alike in so many others and I grew to respect our differences. I pray your daughter will "see the light" and realize she is very blessed to have a wonderful, caring mother like you. In the meantime, you have to take care of you and your sanity. You have a life to live and so does she..........together or apart.....it seems like that is her choice at this time.
I am so sorry you are going through this. There is no pain like the pain that our children can inflict on our hearts.......in my opinion. Don't lose you, dear friend. Your daughter will find her way. I remember a saying I had one time, it goes something like this "Parents give their children roots and wings. Roots to know where home is, wings to fly away and exercise what's been taught them." You gave your daughter her roots, now it seems as though it's time to give her her wings.
Take what you want and leave the rest. You are in my prayers.
I'm with the councelors here. I have found contracts to hands down be the best way to make sure all the cards be on the table, be it parents or room mates. that way the expectations don't become resentments. and, lets be straight: what do landlords do when tenants move in besides collect rent? If your daughter was a tenant and behaving this way, the landlord would have filed for eviction. I know if she was living in campus housing and treating her room mate this way, judicial affairs would have removed her from campus housing and would have filed notice to the university to recommend expulsion from the university because she is causing and unfit leanrning environment.
(((LMT)))) I remember all that you did for her in the past, and I'm so sorry she doesn't treat you better. I refuse to give advice because it could result in things going more askew. I just hope you find serenity on the situation, whatever it takes. Thinking of you, PW
When I read this - my first thought is what is going on in your daughters life? Did she just finish finals? You talk about your daughter finishing her semester, on a scholarship - and I am now speaking purely as an adult student taking MBA classes with the stress of it very fresh in my mind - but what she accomplishing takes a tremendous amount of dedication and hard work. You must be very proud of her.
When I was doing my undergrad degree I used to stomp around the house, throw things in my room, scream, pound the walls. My mom, god bless her, just went into her room and got out a book and read. It was the best thing she could have done. I wasn't mad at her - school is very very stressful - just very tough. Very tough. For me, I was taking Computer Science classes, upper division Physics and Calculus - at 28 years old - with kids who were 19. It was really hard. If your daughter is just finishing finals - you might consider something I did for my daughter that she still talks about 3 years later. A coupon for a spa treatment and massage. And not quite so much attention on the nuances on her behavior while she is trying to compete in college. Cut her a little slack. Some real kindness right now will go a long way towards helping her have a good college life and she will thank you for it tremendously later on.
I have a coffeehouse and have several kids working for me who are 18 and graduating from high school. Two of them are having real difficulties with their moms and in both cases it seems like the mom is having an excruciating time letting go. One of the moms actually comes up to the coffeehouse while her son is on shift and interrupts what he is doing with customers and makes him pay attention to her. For no reason. There is another mom who will come up and sit at the table during her daughters shift and actually talk to the customers as if she is the one waiting on them. I would have to say - women whose kids are leaving home are a little nutty - and alot controlling. I know - I was one of them.
As for working the program, the one sentence in this that leapt out at me was the fight over a straw in the sink. One thing we Alanoners tend to do when behaviors are not as desired is to start focusing on them more ...and more...and more...and the crux of this whole program- getting our attention off of other peoples' behavior and onto our own. Its what we do with Alcoholics that drives everyone around us crazy and ourselves as well.
It takes a really long time to really understand just how much we cannot under any circumstances control another persons behavior and even long to understand the reasons we want to in the first place. Fear, anger, sense of powerlessness. You really can't do much about how your daughter behaves but you can use this opportunity to do some 4th step work and figure out some of your own issues with the family dynamic with your daughter. If nothing else - this approach will completely catch her by surprise. When I first did this with my son, he about fell of his chair. My own self revelation and lack of spite went a long way towards healing the rift we developed when he was 19.
The most we can do with others it try to understand their motivations and love them. The more strident and demanding you get with her - the more she will react in kind. People can sense when someone is in their corner and when they are just being controlled. The calmer you get, the more firm you are, the more centered you stay with your own program - the more she will deescalate. Her reactions are not a reflection of her feelings for you - they are a reflection of the very real agony she is having trying to grow up in this crazy world. Your daughter sounds like a responsible capable young woman. Anyone who is 19 in college on a scholarship and working can't get to that place without those traits - which she probably got from you. Be proud of her. Its a tough world out there and right now she probably just wants you to love her. Let go and Let God.
) towards me ANYTIME I try to converse with her. Each time I call her on it, she will give an excuse...I call it an "excuse of the day", because it can be because of ANYTHING or NOTHING.
). I even went to the police department and asked them what the law was on kicking her our...what kind of "notice" did I have to give her, or could I just make her get out...and they said I should give her enough time to find another place to live. 
She takes anything I say and makes it into a huge argument. HUGE. ALL THE TIME. I'm TIRED, TIRED, TIRED. It makes me wonder if she's using drugs. 
). I think you have to do what is best for you. Ask yourself, if this were anyone else, would you tolerate such behavior? At some point she has to grow up and take responsibility for her actions. She's a smart girl, she'll be able to stand on her own 2 feet. If she stumbles, so be it. That's how they learn.
