I have a really awful neighbour. I'm sure some people remember; I used to complain about him here all the time. He never got any better, I have just learned to ignore him and go about my increasingly serene life. Anyway, he is always screaming at people, fighting with his girlfriend, smashing things, having very noisy parties, playing loud music, revving his engine for ages and doing burnouts at all hours (3 am is common) and filling the street with smoke so I have to run around and close the windows before the house fills up, throwing rubbish in my yard- all the stuff that makes a great neighbour. He was cooking meth for a while which was really edge-of-your-seat fun. We had a very aggressive argument a few years ago and I allowed it to really get to me to the point where I stopped leaving the house any time he was out the front so it's important to me not to be intimidated like that again. I take not being a doormat very seriously now and I am all about boundaries.
Recently he has been a bit quieter; he has a new girlfriend who has a kid. They had a huge screaming fight the other day and he was smashing stuff up, when my daughter and her bf left to go out he yelled at them and then hurled his lawn furniture into our yard after the kid's car as it pulled out. He's just really not very fun to live next to and as I am having pretty intensive therapy for PTSD as well as working at al-anon again, how I react to him is something that comes up often, which is why I am bringing it here (it's my action/ reaction I am thinking about). I go from 0-100 very quickly when someone is aggressive near me or towards me and I am hoping for some al-anon perspective on my action/reaction to this sort of stuff.
This evening I played Led Zep at 6:30 pm while I was cooking. It was loud I guess but certainly not as loud as he plays music. I usually use headphones; I'm a pretty quiet neighbor. He rang me and aggressively demanded I turn it off as his girlfriend's kid had gone to bed. I was conflicted as on one hand I am happy to turn off the music so a child can sleep but on the other I don't take orders from anyone, least of all him. So I replied- calmly- "I will turn the music off for your girlfriend's child, but you make more noise than anyone I know so know that I am not doing it for you".
He started texting me threats such as "you better keep the music down for your own good" and "if you play heavy metal at night again you're going to really have a problem" etc. Firstly, Led Zep at 6:30 pm is heavy metal at night? That made me laugh. He's 25, not 150. I said if he continues making threats I will take them to the police and he kept sending ridiculous aggressive messages (not more threats, just aggressive nonsense). It's absurd pot-kettle stuff to the extreme.
So my question is, from an al-anon perspective- I could have just done what he said and let him think I am intimidated by him but not letting people bully me is an important part of reclaiming my self-esteem. I think that telling him I would do it for the child but not for him as he makes so much noise himself was reasonable and his choice to start threatening me for saying that is on him. He could have just taken the win and left it at that.
I'm feeling a bit upset and worked up anyway and I wonder what tools others would have used and whether they would have included a boundary in their response or just shut up to keep the peace. And what tools do people use to calm down during and after conflict? I like living drama-free very much, so I feel really angry that my serenity has been thrown into chaos by his aggressive bs, especially over something so stupid. Input welcome!
Freetime said
Feb 16, 2022
YKM, I'm so sorry you have such a terrible neighbor. I can only imagine how difficult that is. Noise would drive me nuts!
The only Al-Anon response I can think of to nasty behavior is the idea that it's futile to argue with an irrational person or to expect them to respond rationally. I think that the "no-response" response does not necessarily mean we are a doormat. It could mean we are formulating Plan B.
Al-Anon suggests that we reach out to professionals when necessary, so I think that knowing you have the police as an option is good..
The best thing I have found to calm down after a troubling situation has been to reach out and share with someone who understands -- and thankfully I have an Al-Anon sponsor and other friends that would listen to me. Posting here is great, too, but even I -- as an introvert -- find it most healing to talk to a person in real time. Watching, listening, or reading something funny helps too -- laughter gives me some release.
I hope your life gets quieter soon!
DM2021 said
Feb 16, 2022
I have learned that when I feel like my reaction to someone's bad behavior is necessary, I have to, before I react, ask
myself first, am I needing to be right? Usually when dealing with a "drunk in a bar", there is no way to win an argument
so why fluster yourself to begin with and if one needs to be right then we are deluding ourselves, that confronting that
"drunk in a bar" will give us any satisfaction. I am learning not to care what other people think and say, no matter how
much I disagree, detachment is the way to go!! {{HUGS}}
Iamhere said
Feb 17, 2022
Well....your neighbor sounds like a piece of work. What I know is that irrational people do irrational things and rarely/never see their part in any circumstance. What I've learned in dealing with my A(s) is I must establish healthy boundaries and be willing to enforce them. I have called the police for assistance and will do so again. I matter and won't live in a threatening/intimidating situation ever again, for any reason. Tested and proven in my home.
While it's lovely to be a good neighbor, this works best when both are willing/sane. Simply based on his habits shares and where you are, I'd be ringing up the police for each infraction. Behaviors don't change until one has consequences so if the police stop by to tell him to turn it down or stop throwing furniture, etc. so be it.
As far as what happened, my experience is that if I am bothered by an exchange for any reason, after the fact, there's a good chance I need to be looking for a reason/learning opportunity. What's happened is already done and we can't change the past, yet there probably is a lesson in how he received your response. I am certain if you keep processing, you'll figure out what worked, what could be improved and then be armed for another/next exchange.
My best tool for dealing with unreasonable people is to avoid them as much as possible. I am willing to choose joy over being right and I no longer debate others 'for sport'...I used to and enjoyed it - not so much any longer.
(((Hugs)))
Youknowme said
Feb 18, 2022
Thanks, everyone.
I think my main concern is how angry and helpless I felt; that isn't healthy. However, I am glad I stated that his noise is far in excess of mine even if it angered him because I have never complained about it before so at least now it is a known fact that I am very unhappy with his noisy bs. I ended the conversation by saying "I have turned the music off; please know that I won't be tolerating excessive noise from your house anymore either". Well apparently his girlfriend is pregnant now and we share a wall so maybe the noise is about to be so bad we will have to try to move anyway. I don't think I could cope with a newborn screaming especially when I have such intense dislike and ill will for the parents, as much as I love babies. I think that might be an opportunity to be consumed by resentment! I don't like feeling so uncharitable or being annoyed about a baby that isn't even here yet; my anger towards this person is really bringing out the worst in me (and providing growth opportunities, right?)
I appreciate being able to bring this here. Often I get worked up and over-react but I think in this situation I have stayed silent for years and my one calm sentence was pretty tame compared to what I wanted to say/do. The lesson is don't let people treat me badly until I build up huge resentment and explode because it isn't good for me, or the people around me who matter to me. I need to practice saying what I mean, meaning what I say and not saying it mean, or I think that's how the slogan goes. Not wait 7 years getting more and more resentful and then exploding over something relatively small.
Cheers all
Lyne said
Feb 19, 2022
{{{YNM}}} I'm so sorry about the neighbor situation. I have also experienced situations with impossible people. I was wondering if you can block his number so he can't call or text you? That's something I would do. But before you do that (if you want to), I would ask myself--do I feel threatened by him, so much so that he might hurt myself, my family, or my property? And for me, if that answer was yes, I would write some clear notes to myself about what the problems are, print out texts or have them available, and take it to the police now. It is impossible to know what his violence capability really is, and he sounds like he has definite anger issues. All our tools are great to use, pause, think, how important is it, etc. But if you feel in danger, that's a time to act, not react. Wishing you all the best, Lyne
Youknowme said
Feb 19, 2022
It's hard to tell, Lyne. He is very volatile and loud but I have observed he likes to go crazy at women but is very meek when its men, ie if he is confronted by the cops or other guys he's very quiet and compliant and when my ex used to come and stay he was never aggressive towards me, in fact he was really nice and polite. He didn't show his true colours until I stopped having a partner. After 7 years of living next to him I have concluded that standing up to him is safer than letting him win- if he thinks I am intimidated he's worse. For example, I once caught him in my yard putting a broken chair in my rubbish bin- I was surprised by how angrily I yelled at him to take his rubbish and get out of my yard (as I said, I am trying to get over PTSD and part of that is that I really going from 0-100 when I feel threatened- I over-react- I am working on it!). Anyway, he was very startled and took his rubbish and apologised. But when I am agreeable to keep the peace he just pushes further and further. He's a coward and a bully, very simply. I have kept his threats and if it turns out to be more than a one-off outburst I won't hesitate to go to the police, but I suspect the fact that I told him I will is going to have the desired effect.
Today I went out to my back yard and when he heard me out there he turned up his music really loud in his backyard- it was obvious he was trying to antagonise me. I just laughed; I like my music loud so if you want to antagonise me, loud music isn't the way to do it! I started singing along and he turned it off. I thought that was pretty funny but yes, I am very mindful of safety and will not hesitate to call the police if I think he hassles me further or I feel unsafe. In the meantime I am working on not getting drawn into the drama or fighting back out of habit. Singing along was probably silly as it would have irritated him but it was Credence and who can resist singing along to Credence? lol.
I have kept his number only because we share a wall (it's a split house) so I always thought if there was an emergency at the property I'd hope he would call me as my animals are locked inside when I am out. It's probably not worth it; I could exchange numbers with some other neighbours instead and block his number. Good idea.
One thing I have realised through talking about it is there is a part of me that jumps back into drama and conflict out of habit so that's what I am going to work on for now.
-- Edited by Youknowme on Saturday 19th of February 2022 10:55:56 AM
Freetime said
Feb 19, 2022
Singing along with the music -- I love it!!! I wish I had thought of that when my alcoholic spouse would play loud music in the middle of the night. I think it would have gotten my message across in a more appealing way.
Iamhere said
Feb 19, 2022
Raises hand....I would also sing along to Credence - just saying!!
I have a really awful neighbour. I'm sure some people remember; I used to complain about him here all the time. He never got any better, I have just learned to ignore him and go about my increasingly serene life. Anyway, he is always screaming at people, fighting with his girlfriend, smashing things, having very noisy parties, playing loud music, revving his engine for ages and doing burnouts at all hours (3 am is common) and filling the street with smoke so I have to run around and close the windows before the house fills up, throwing rubbish in my yard- all the stuff that makes a great neighbour. He was cooking meth for a while which was really edge-of-your-seat fun. We had a very aggressive argument a few years ago and I allowed it to really get to me to the point where I stopped leaving the house any time he was out the front so it's important to me not to be intimidated like that again. I take not being a doormat very seriously now and I am all about boundaries.
Recently he has been a bit quieter; he has a new girlfriend who has a kid. They had a huge screaming fight the other day and he was smashing stuff up, when my daughter and her bf left to go out he yelled at them and then hurled his lawn furniture into our yard after the kid's car as it pulled out. He's just really not very fun to live next to and as I am having pretty intensive therapy for PTSD as well as working at al-anon again, how I react to him is something that comes up often, which is why I am bringing it here (it's my action/ reaction I am thinking about). I go from 0-100 very quickly when someone is aggressive near me or towards me and I am hoping for some al-anon perspective on my action/reaction to this sort of stuff.
This evening I played Led Zep at 6:30 pm while I was cooking. It was loud I guess but certainly not as loud as he plays music. I usually use headphones; I'm a pretty quiet neighbor.
He rang me and aggressively demanded I turn it off as his girlfriend's kid had gone to bed. I was conflicted as on one hand I am happy to turn off the music so a child can sleep but on the other I don't take orders from anyone, least of all him. So I replied- calmly- "I will turn the music off for your girlfriend's child, but you make more noise than anyone I know so know that I am not doing it for you".
He started texting me threats such as "you better keep the music down for your own good" and "if you play heavy metal at night again you're going to really have a problem" etc. Firstly, Led Zep at 6:30 pm is heavy metal at night? That made me laugh. He's 25, not 150. I said if he continues making threats I will take them to the police and he kept sending ridiculous aggressive messages (not more threats, just aggressive nonsense). It's absurd pot-kettle stuff to the extreme.
So my question is, from an al-anon perspective- I could have just done what he said and let him think I am intimidated by him but not letting people bully me is an important part of reclaiming my self-esteem. I think that telling him I would do it for the child but not for him as he makes so much noise himself was reasonable and his choice to start threatening me for saying that is on him. He could have just taken the win and left it at that.
I'm feeling a bit upset and worked up anyway and I wonder what tools others would have used and whether they would have included a boundary in their response or just shut up to keep the peace. And what tools do people use to calm down during and after conflict? I like living drama-free very much, so I feel really angry that my serenity has been thrown into chaos by his aggressive bs, especially over something so stupid. Input welcome!
The only Al-Anon response I can think of to nasty behavior is the idea that it's futile to argue with an irrational person or to expect them to respond rationally. I think that the "no-response" response does not necessarily mean we are a doormat. It could mean we are formulating Plan B.
Al-Anon suggests that we reach out to professionals when necessary, so I think that knowing you have the police as an option is good..
The best thing I have found to calm down after a troubling situation has been to reach out and share with someone who understands -- and thankfully I have an Al-Anon sponsor and other friends that would listen to me. Posting here is great, too, but even I -- as an introvert -- find it most healing to talk to a person in real time. Watching, listening, or reading something funny helps too -- laughter gives me some release.
I hope your life gets quieter soon!
myself first, am I needing to be right? Usually when dealing with a "drunk in a bar", there is no way to win an argument
so why fluster yourself to begin with and if one needs to be right then we are deluding ourselves, that confronting that
"drunk in a bar" will give us any satisfaction. I am learning not to care what other people think and say, no matter how
much I disagree, detachment is the way to go!! {{HUGS}}
While it's lovely to be a good neighbor, this works best when both are willing/sane. Simply based on his habits shares and where you are, I'd be ringing up the police for each infraction. Behaviors don't change until one has consequences so if the police stop by to tell him to turn it down or stop throwing furniture, etc. so be it.
As far as what happened, my experience is that if I am bothered by an exchange for any reason, after the fact, there's a good chance I need to be looking for a reason/learning opportunity. What's happened is already done and we can't change the past, yet there probably is a lesson in how he received your response. I am certain if you keep processing, you'll figure out what worked, what could be improved and then be armed for another/next exchange.
My best tool for dealing with unreasonable people is to avoid them as much as possible. I am willing to choose joy over being right and I no longer debate others 'for sport'...I used to and enjoyed it - not so much any longer.
(((Hugs)))
I think my main concern is how angry and helpless I felt; that isn't healthy. However, I am glad I stated that his noise is far in excess of mine even if it angered him because I have never complained about it before so at least now it is a known fact that I am very unhappy with his noisy bs. I ended the conversation by saying "I have turned the music off; please know that I won't be tolerating excessive noise from your house anymore either". Well apparently his girlfriend is pregnant now and we share a wall so maybe the noise is about to be so bad we will have to try to move anyway. I don't think I could cope with a newborn screaming especially when I have such intense dislike and ill will for the parents, as much as I love babies. I think that might be an opportunity to be consumed by resentment! I don't like feeling so uncharitable or being annoyed about a baby that isn't even here yet; my anger towards this person is really bringing out the worst in me (and providing growth opportunities, right?)
I appreciate being able to bring this here. Often I get worked up and over-react but I think in this situation I have stayed silent for years and my one calm sentence was pretty tame compared to what I wanted to say/do. The lesson is don't let people treat me badly until I build up huge resentment and explode because it isn't good for me, or the people around me who matter to me. I need to practice saying what I mean, meaning what I say and not saying it mean, or I think that's how the slogan goes. Not wait 7 years getting more and more resentful and then exploding over something relatively small.
Cheers all
It's hard to tell, Lyne. He is very volatile and loud but I have observed he likes to go crazy at women but is very meek when its men, ie if he is confronted by the cops or other guys he's very quiet and compliant and when my ex used to come and stay he was never aggressive towards me, in fact he was really nice and polite. He didn't show his true colours until I stopped having a partner. After 7 years of living next to him I have concluded that standing up to him is safer than letting him win- if he thinks I am intimidated he's worse. For example, I once caught him in my yard putting a broken chair in my rubbish bin- I was surprised by how angrily I yelled at him to take his rubbish and get out of my yard (as I said, I am trying to get over PTSD and part of that is that I really going from 0-100 when I feel threatened- I over-react- I am working on it!). Anyway, he was very startled and took his rubbish and apologised. But when I am agreeable to keep the peace he just pushes further and further. He's a coward and a bully, very simply.
I have kept his threats and if it turns out to be more than a one-off outburst I won't hesitate to go to the police, but I suspect the fact that I told him I will is going to have the desired effect.
Today I went out to my back yard and when he heard me out there he turned up his music really loud in his backyard- it was obvious he was trying to antagonise me. I just laughed; I like my music loud so if you want to antagonise me, loud music isn't the way to do it! I started singing along and he turned it off. I thought that was pretty funny but yes, I am very mindful of safety and will not hesitate to call the police if I think he hassles me further or I feel unsafe. In the meantime I am working on not getting drawn into the drama or fighting back out of habit. Singing along was probably silly as it would have irritated him but it was Credence and who can resist singing along to Credence? lol.
I have kept his number only because we share a wall (it's a split house) so I always thought if there was an emergency at the property I'd hope he would call me as my animals are locked inside when I am out. It's probably not worth it; I could exchange numbers with some other neighbours instead and block his number. Good idea.
One thing I have realised through talking about it is there is a part of me that jumps back into drama and conflict out of habit so that's what I am going to work on for now.
-- Edited by Youknowme on Saturday 19th of February 2022 10:55:56 AM