...is trying to determine the why of an alcoholic's drinking, or actions when not drinking...in short, the why's of someone outside ourselves.
Some will not give up trying, or coming up with reasons why they need to. In truth, even if we are a psych/olog/iatr/ist it is neither important or helpful for our own recovery.
What is, and is within our power and capability? Identifying the why's and what we are doing that lead to our lack of Serenity.
Reminder: When I find myself trying to figure out another's motives, I will turn it around and determine why I acted the way I did. Is it important? Did I overreact?
"Leave off that excessive desire of knowing; therein is found much distraction. There are many things the knowledge of which is of little or no profit to the soul." Thomas 'a Kempis ------------------- When I try to determine the why outside of myself, I gain a certain comfort as I return a sense of order to my world, relax a bit because it 'makes sense to me'...and if I'm being honest, I feel smarter with a dash of smugness and a sense that the world is in my conceptual control.
I have just left the world of Alanon recovery and stepped outside of the circle that marks my serenity. I am attempting to determine the validity of someone else's actions and motive (that I also divined) and cutting myself the slack that is proportionate to the error I perceive in them.
Focusing on my perceptions, motives and actions is where I need to be for serenity and spiritual recovery...grateful for the wisdom of the program
Lyne said
Jul 20, 2021
Thanks Paul for your service and ESH. A therapist I had years ago, long before program, just so happened to be a certified alcohol counselor/therapist. When he started talking about my ability to be in control of my day, my feelings, etc., I thought he didnt know what he was talking about. I felt like everyone was making me miserable and my only choice was to be at their mercy. Ha! He was right! I neednt figure anyone else out. This idea of focusing on myself is the only way to sanity. Focusing on others keeps me locked in a prison. Grateful member.
DM2021 said
Jul 20, 2021
Thank you Paul and Lyne!!
I too struggled trying to find the reasons why, right on down to, it has to be family influence. But at the end of the day it
really didn't matter because I just caused not only the loss of my serenity and wasted precious time, but really did not
accomplish anything significant! Staying in my own lane, minding my own business, taking one day-at-a-time and letting
go and letting God is the best road to serenity.
Maresie888 said
Jul 20, 2021
I have a lot of ideas why I was so dependent on the alcoholic.
I have had to forgive myself for those
I also have ideas why it was so hard for me to give up.trying
I.gsve also had to forgive myself for that
The irony is that whatever the #why# the qualifier drank I.hd no.control of
The qualifier was hopelessly enmeshed with his mother. Any attempt I made to recognize that situation resulted in them being more enmeshed
Everything I tried to do the qualifier sabotaged
That is incredibly painful to look at and acknowledge
It has taken me a long time to find ways to examine how I.cabe to be hopelessly invested in a no.wim situation
The grief limit is spending some many years invested in that has cost ne a great deal in terms of health, wealth and future
As an adult we all have to be invested in our futures
I did not do that. I invested in a hopeless addict who was going downhill
The qualifier is an incredible drain on his family. But that is their choice. His Uncle came up.with the famous metaphor of digging a hole. If you dig s hole feep.enough you cannot get out of it
For some people there is a point of addiction there is no.turning back.
For other people like my younger sister they get to.a functional place. However both her children have significant issues. My sister had to remain in denial to keep her functioning
One of her sons is very much like her completely subsumed in a love affair with alcohol. Right now it is working for him
I have been powerless over my family and their immense chaos ny whole life. Inam.grateful to be at a point where I no.longer have to deal with it. That was and still is the best they can do.
I am also aware that as much as peo people die from alcoholism people die from codependency too. Among my aunts the first to die was the codependent one. The one who.was always there for everyone else. She neglected herself dealing with the never ending crises caused by the family. They included an uncle who died in a reckless accident. They included the non stop financial crises generated by my aunt. They included all the unremitting daily chaos
My cousin lives in that ongoing chaos.
I no longer live in chaos My health has been permanently damaged. My body hurts. My body is damaged. I will not he able to repair it. I can at least try to get healthy
It is indeed sobering to let go.of why. Letting go.of why is the beginning of grief. Intense deep grief at all the lost opportunity
Intense grief at the magnetic attrctiinnto chaotic deprived individuals. I connected people at the #wound#. Now I connect at different levels. The wound no longer has the magnetic qualities it once had
I.aim to connect at #joy# but I am not there yet
I have a goal and that is a worthy goal
Maresie
a4l said
Jul 20, 2021
Thank you for the service Paul. And for the shares above. Recently the whisper of consciousness that is my higher power keeps pointing me to the same essential issue. That of staying on my side of the street. It doesn't matter why. Not just for activedrinking but for every ism. My own isms are another matter altogether. I'm still a dry drunk for example in a lot of my own mental processes. So. I'm grateful to leap back in to the cornerstone teachings of our programmes. Including repeating the serenity prayer in my head over and over lately when I get the itch that can't be scratched.
Iamhere said
Jul 20, 2021
Thank you Paul for your service and the daily. Thank you to all for your shares & ESH. I happen to be one who, insanely so at times, really, really wanted to get to the 'root cause' of all things - including the motives of others. I have been extremely curious and possibly very nosy for a lifetime and felt that it was my job as a wife, mother, sister, daughter, etc. to inquire, "What were you thinking?"
I've learned in Al-Anon that being curious is not bad. Looking for root causes so as to not repeat mistakes is not bad. What makes it unhealthy for me is that I have obsessive tendencies. No matter how another answers my query, I'm often not satisfied and more questions are raised. If I want to keep my serenity, my chances are way better when I stay within my own hula-hoop. If I want healthy relationships with others, I need to be mindful of their boundaries and privacy. When that 'itch' arises within me, I am much better served by asking myself, "Why is it you believe you need to know." Which, is answered often, if I'm honest - I don't and it's possibly not my business.
The more I practice authenticity and autonomy, the more peace I have in my mind and my heart. When that curiosity comes to mind in me, I really, really need to just check my motives. I no longer enjoy those fleeting moments of superiority and 'right-fighting', which is growth for me. I absolutely live by, when in doubt, don't....it's a great slogan for the way my mind works.
Happy Tuesday to all - of course, I opened my day with a round of golf and came home to continue some canning/cooking. I hope all had a joyful day! (((Hugs)))
Bbrave said
Jul 22, 2021
THANK YOU, thank you for writing this piece. I have just returned from a family intervention that did not go well. In addressing a what appears to be a case of insanity, a group of family members can sure chew on the right of a situation and yes, the smug feeling that accompanies that feels righteous, but hollow. At this moment, in particular, I really appreciate your pointing that out,
Maresie888 said
Jul 26, 2021
Bbrave
I am sure there are lots of family interventions that do not go.well. we only see the carefully choreographed ones on TV. They are that scripted
For me personally there were lots of years of being righteous. Righteousness saved me in a lot of ways. Righteousness meant I believed some things could be changed
I often think.about meeting some people I know who are out there. I no longer believe I can do or say anything to change their perspective. That means I am at a loss for words around them
That certainly is not hopeful realistic but not hopeful
I do not doubt many many families have been in your predicament. My former qualifier had everything to gain by being sober. He would not entertain it
He is no longer in a place where he can cause ne any hardsh
However there us no.question he caused hardship for years. Only a saint would not feel #righteous,# about that. I think it certainly takes a long time to work through those feelings. Certainly all those feelings are absolutely valid
All feelings are valid but is what we do with them that matters
Maresie
mamalioness said
Jul 26, 2021
Thanks enigmatic for your post and your service
The only way I can keep myself even halfway sane is the slogan keep the focus on me. And sometimes I have to keep repeating that--keep the focus on me and check my motives I guess thats why I love the steps and the slogans so much because they make me keep the focus on the only thing I can work on and that is me. Yeah so I can help someone who wants to help themselves but I have to constantly be vigilant and not cross over that invisible boundary between healthy sharing and caring and being codependent
-- Edited by mamalioness on Monday 26th of July 2021 09:36:51 PM
...is trying to determine the why of an alcoholic's drinking, or actions when not drinking...in short, the why's of someone outside ourselves.
Some will not give up trying, or coming up with reasons why they need to. In truth, even if we are a psych/olog/iatr/ist it is neither important or helpful for our own recovery.
What is, and is within our power and capability? Identifying the why's and what we are doing that lead to our lack of Serenity.
Reminder: When I find myself trying to figure out another's motives, I will turn it around and determine why I acted the way I did. Is it important? Did I overreact?
"Leave off that excessive desire of knowing; therein is found much distraction. There are many things the knowledge of which is of little or no profit to the soul." Thomas 'a Kempis
-------------------
When I try to determine the why outside of myself, I gain a certain comfort as I return a sense of order to my world, relax a bit because it 'makes sense to me'...and if I'm being honest, I feel smarter with a dash of smugness and a sense that the world is in my conceptual control.
I have just left the world of Alanon recovery and stepped outside of the circle that marks my serenity. I am attempting to determine the validity of someone else's actions and motive (that I also divined) and cutting myself the slack that is proportionate to the error I perceive in them.
Focusing on my perceptions, motives and actions is where I need to be for serenity and spiritual recovery...grateful for the wisdom of the program
I too struggled trying to find the reasons why, right on down to, it has to be family influence. But at the end of the day it
really didn't matter because I just caused not only the loss of my serenity and wasted precious time, but really did not
accomplish anything significant! Staying in my own lane, minding my own business, taking one day-at-a-time and letting
go and letting God is the best road to serenity.
I have a lot of ideas why I was so dependent on the alcoholic.
I have had to forgive myself for those
I also have ideas why it was so hard for me to give up.trying
I.gsve also had to forgive myself for that
The irony is that whatever the #why# the qualifier drank I.hd no.control of
The qualifier was hopelessly enmeshed with his mother. Any attempt I made to recognize that situation resulted in them being more enmeshed
Everything I tried to do the qualifier sabotaged
That is incredibly painful to look at and acknowledge
It has taken me a long time to find ways to examine how I.cabe to be hopelessly invested in a no.wim situation
The grief limit is spending some many years invested in that has cost ne a great deal in terms of health, wealth and future
As an adult we all have to be invested in our futures
I did not do that. I invested in a hopeless addict who was going downhill
The qualifier is an incredible drain on his family. But that is their choice. His Uncle came up.with the famous metaphor of digging a hole. If you dig s hole feep.enough you cannot get out of it
For some people there is a point of addiction there is no.turning back.
For other people like my younger sister they get to.a functional place. However both her children have significant issues. My sister had to remain in denial to keep her functioning
One of her sons is very much like her completely subsumed in a love affair with alcohol. Right now it is working for him
I have been powerless over my family and their immense chaos ny whole life. Inam.grateful to be at a point where I no.longer have to deal with it. That was and still is the best they can do.
I am also aware that as much as peo people die from alcoholism people die from codependency too. Among my aunts the first to die was the codependent one. The one who.was always there for everyone else. She neglected herself dealing with the never ending crises caused by the family. They included an uncle who died in a reckless accident. They included the non stop financial crises generated by my aunt. They included all the unremitting daily chaos
My cousin lives in that ongoing chaos.
I no longer live in chaos My health has been permanently damaged. My body hurts. My body is damaged. I will not he able to repair it. I can at least try to get healthy
It is indeed sobering to let go.of why. Letting go.of why is the beginning of grief. Intense deep grief at all the lost opportunity
Intense grief at the magnetic attrctiinnto chaotic deprived individuals. I connected people at the #wound#. Now I connect at different levels. The wound no longer has the magnetic qualities it once had
I.aim to connect at #joy# but I am not there yet
I have a goal and that is a worthy goal
Maresie
I've learned in Al-Anon that being curious is not bad. Looking for root causes so as to not repeat mistakes is not bad. What makes it unhealthy for me is that I have obsessive tendencies. No matter how another answers my query, I'm often not satisfied and more questions are raised. If I want to keep my serenity, my chances are way better when I stay within my own hula-hoop. If I want healthy relationships with others, I need to be mindful of their boundaries and privacy. When that 'itch' arises within me, I am much better served by asking myself, "Why is it you believe you need to know." Which, is answered often, if I'm honest - I don't and it's possibly not my business.
The more I practice authenticity and autonomy, the more peace I have in my mind and my heart. When that curiosity comes to mind in me, I really, really need to just check my motives. I no longer enjoy those fleeting moments of superiority and 'right-fighting', which is growth for me. I absolutely live by, when in doubt, don't....it's a great slogan for the way my mind works.
Happy Tuesday to all - of course, I opened my day with a round of golf and came home to continue some canning/cooking. I hope all had a joyful day! (((Hugs)))
THANK YOU, thank you for writing this piece. I have just returned from a family intervention that did not go well. In addressing a what appears to be a case of insanity, a group of family members can sure chew on the right of a situation and yes, the smug feeling that accompanies that feels righteous, but hollow. At this moment, in particular, I really appreciate your pointing that out,
Bbrave
I am sure there are lots of family interventions that do not go.well. we only see the carefully choreographed ones on TV. They are that scripted
For me personally there were lots of years of being righteous. Righteousness saved me in a lot of ways. Righteousness meant I believed some things could be changed
I often think.about meeting some people I know who are out there. I no longer believe I can do or say anything to change their perspective. That means I am at a loss for words around them
That certainly is not hopeful realistic but not hopeful
I do not doubt many many families have been in your predicament. My former qualifier had everything to gain by being sober. He would not entertain it
He is no longer in a place where he can cause ne any hardsh
However there us no.question he caused hardship for years. Only a saint would not feel #righteous,# about that. I think it certainly takes a long time to work through those feelings. Certainly all those feelings are absolutely valid
All feelings are valid but is what we do with them that matters
Maresie
Thanks enigmatic for your post and your service
The only way I can keep myself even halfway sane is the slogan keep the focus on me. And sometimes I have to keep repeating that--keep the focus on me and check my motives
I guess thats why I love the steps and the slogans so much because they make me keep the focus on the only thing I can work on and that is me. Yeah so I can help someone who wants to help themselves but I have to constantly be vigilant and not cross over that invisible boundary between healthy sharing and caring and being codependent
-- Edited by mamalioness on Monday 26th of July 2021 09:36:51 PM