6/22/21 Courage to Change – Can Others Make Us Angry
Enigmatic said
Jun 22, 2021
Today's writer recalls early Alanon shares describing how the alcoholic 'made' her feel various unpleasant emotions. A sponsor helped her 'begin with me' and see that her words conveyed power to others that they do not have: No one can make us feel something without our cooperation.
Working on perception, attitude, and communication brought the ability to describe how they experienced something rather than what others 'made' them feel. This took away the feeling of being a helpless victim.
Reminder: What do my words communicate? Is it what I am trying to say? Today I will listen more closely to what my words have to say.
"We learn in time that it is not the subjects which are controversial, but the manner in which we communicate about them and the elements of personal blame we add to them in anger." - Dilemma of the Alcoholic Marriage --------------------- When I first arrived at Alanon, I blamed the alcoholic for the unmanageability of my life and insanity I felt. I felt I had no choice, they just wouldn't do what they needed to do so the only way to feel better was to leave.
The incredible truth I discovered in Alanon is that events, actions or words outside of myself are not responsible for how I feel...How I decide to perceive and respond to them is; in this I always have a choice, and therefore the power.
Very grateful for the wisdom of Alanon and the Serenity that I experience when I align with it
Debb said
Jun 22, 2021
Thank you Paul for today's C2C reading, your service and ESH.
I was always aware of perception but never realized, until Al-Anon, how important it is.
Understanding the disease of alcoholism was so important for me and how sick it was making me, even
though I was not drinking!!
I still have my moments where perception needs to be fine tuned, but is so much more manageable.
Thank you HP, MIP and Al-Anon!!
Skorpi said
Jun 22, 2021
Thank you for the daily and ESH!
Words are so important. I think about how words convey certain messages and thoughts/perspectives. I have the benefit of being able to function in 2 different languages, and I found that my Al-Anon work was easiest and most beneficial for me in my second language. The structure and formation of the language just doesn't allow some of the thoughts and perspectives that English does.
What I find really interesting is that, even though I knew this, I didn't appreciate how much it was impacting me personally. Every now and then, I find myself reminded of how impactful my own words are to me. I had a moment this weekend where I found myself dealing with an irate AW via text, and had drafted a text to send, when I read over for typos, I ended up just erasing it, because I realized what I was saying was intended to pacify her behavior and was undermining my own integrity. Choosing not to use those words in that moment meant that I was deciding to let AW keep her issues and problems to herself, and that I wasn't going to enable that particular behavior and undermine my own sense of right and wrong.
JerryF said
Jun 22, 2021
I like your input TT; very good program and I will learn more from it. Before and in early program anger, rage, etc. was a part of my personality and character no matter who or what was on the other side of the argument right or wrong. Of course it was me so there wasn't any wrong there...I was RIGHT!! and if my ego got bruised or seemed to be I was dangerous. I didn't yell much I hit; and hard. My amends making I feel have been short in this area because of the physical responses on my part I gave. I was a monster because my fears drove me over the hill of being human. I continue to stand in the amends line and my Higher Power knows I am there. My amends request is "Place me where you want me...tell me what to do".
In one early morning AA meeting I heard my HP mention a name in my mind; the name of a young lad I had violently harmed and I knew the outcome...2 round trips between Hawaii and California and the amends including him and his family. That took 3+ years and actually it took what was necessary. I learned that my victims always suffered beyond myself. Sad.
Others can make me angry only as I allow it...Another personal responsibility. Again Mahalo for your support.
DavidG said
Jun 22, 2021
Thanks Paul, and y'all.
No one made me feel all these yuck feelings, once I heard the message about detachment, from Alanon.
Learned to love the person and not the problem. The problem being the disease.
I say these simple words out loud. If I have any residual blame and shame I can withdraw it from my account.
It is worthless and destructive. ...
SunnyFrogs said
Jun 23, 2021
Good morning.
Of course the things that others say and do are going to upset me and make me angry and upset. I wouldn't be human if it didn't. It's what I do with that anger that's important.
I am working on containing and dealing with my emotions rather than trying to not feel them at all.
I know it's not someone else's fault if I get angry and let myself spiral out of control with it,lash out,etc. But if they say or do something that does upset me or make me angry, they are the ones in the wrong for that.
I don't want to be that person where everything just rolls off my back or I overlook everything. I just want to keep learning how to assert myself, set and stick to boundaries, control my anger, communicate better,etc.
mamalioness said
Jun 24, 2021
Oh (((Paul))) what a GREAT share....anything outside of me...person, place, thing only has power over me IF I GIVE IT my power...I have the choice, too, how I respond (hopefully more responding then reacting, but I still can be reacting)
Like dealing with people, places or circumstances, I cannot control stuff that is not WITHIN me..Even if I disagree with a friend, I give up my power if I get all bent out of shape over it and I did that with a friend over a really dumb misunderstanding, mostly on my part..I saw the error of my perception/reaction and made amends..
I try to imagine a chalk circle drawn around my feet...anything outside of that circle is OUT of my control and detachment, casting the burden, keeps me in reality and more emotionally sober
-- Edited by mamalioness on Thursday 24th of June 2021 08:27:27 PM
Maresie888 said
Jun 25, 2021
The qualifier certainly caused immense chaos. Hs choate is s was all consuming
Getting out of the way of his chaos involved al anon for me. It meant that when he didn't pay the electric bill I did not step in and pay it.
When we split up after he vilified me viciously he put my name down on his storage locker as an alternative contact
When they called me to say he had not paid the bill I ekecrd not to act
I no longer have the compulsion to help
In fact around certain people I have no inclination to even respond
Therefore it has been a long hard road to learn how not to blame others for ny problems
I work hard on being around people who.are regulated. If I gave to deal with an alcoholic or someone whom acts like an alcoholic I.set a lot of limits
I work really hard to maintain those limits
So I cant say the alcoholics actions did not cause me tremendous problems. My qualifier was immensely destructive. Getting out of the way of people who.are immensely destructive has been hard. There were a lot of times to undo. That did not happen overnight
As it did happen there was immense relief
Now I am particularly guarded around people who do not behave as adults.
I no longer have the compulsion to rescue
I no longer have the compulsion to help others before myself
But I cant say the alcoholics issues didn't hurt me tremendously. He destroyed everything and I mean everything in his path. He is still on that track. I elected to get off that track.
Maresie
JerryF said
Jun 26, 2021
I learned long ago on the subject of "choices" that my feeling are choices. I use to think that was not so until good work with my VA therapist and my sponsor. I also learned that they, (feelings) are not things when my therapist asked me how I felt while being hurt in a relationship that I responded, "like sh-t". His response was "So like a lump of warm, smelly, stuff that a dog will leave in your front yard"? I snapped back "What are you talking about?!! No Sh-t" and then I got it. Feelings are inner responses to what is going on outside of me. He also told me "Sh-t is a thing...not a feeling". Now I got it right and things are easier and go more smoothly.
Others can make me angry to the extent I allow it...there!! LOL
Maresie888 said
Jun 26, 2021
Actually I find I have to pay attention to my feelings to order my life. This morning I had a very frank discussion with my coworker about our supervisor's behavior.
Lashing out behavior is of course very common. However the management at our job does not seem to be focused on setting limits.
I most certainly have limits .
I have limits on the chaos I endure. I have limits on being bullied.
In fact on a physical level I deal with the consequences of being bullied daily. I have to deal with the aftermath of that bullying on an ongoing basis
The limits are part of the choices. If I encounter a bully who goes out of their way to make other people's lives a misery I have to pay attention. Lashing out is no longer a permissible excuse for me. I am no longer a punch bag
Not paying attention not addressing that this behavior crosses my boundaries gets ne in a lot of trouble.
My choices are not about quelling my feelings. My choices are what I do about those feelings
Some people go out of their way to bully others
That is their chronic pattern. I now go out of my way to deal EU with them. In another month I will be in a better position to leave this job
I am no longer in a place where I entertain being bullied. Bullying on a chronic basis is demoralising
At times in my life I have had to find ways to deal with bullying. As an adult I know where an out of control bully can go
I do not choose to be a victim anymore. Neither do I choose being picked on.
So for me personally because affect regulation is so essential Ichoose to listen to my feelings. I choose to attend to those feelings. Then I choose to take actions specifically to protect myself. My boundaries come directly from attending to those feelings
Today's writer recalls early Alanon shares describing how the alcoholic 'made' her feel various unpleasant emotions. A sponsor helped her 'begin with me' and see that her words conveyed power to others that they do not have: No one can make us feel something without our cooperation.
Working on perception, attitude, and communication brought the ability to describe how they experienced something rather than what others 'made' them feel. This took away the feeling of being a helpless victim.
Reminder: What do my words communicate? Is it what I am trying to say? Today I will listen more closely to what my words have to say.
"We learn in time that it is not the subjects which are controversial, but the manner in which we communicate about them and the elements of personal blame we add to them in anger." - Dilemma of the Alcoholic Marriage
---------------------
When I first arrived at Alanon, I blamed the alcoholic for the unmanageability of my life and insanity I felt. I felt I had no choice, they just wouldn't do what they needed to do so the only way to feel better was to leave.
The incredible truth I discovered in Alanon is that events, actions or words outside of myself are not responsible for how I feel...How I decide to perceive and respond to them is; in this I always have a choice, and therefore the power.
Very grateful for the wisdom of Alanon and the Serenity that I experience when I align with it
I was always aware of perception but never realized, until Al-Anon, how important it is.
Understanding the disease of alcoholism was so important for me and how sick it was making me, even
though I was not drinking!!
I still have my moments where perception needs to be fine tuned, but is so much more manageable.
Thank you HP, MIP and Al-Anon!!
Words are so important. I think about how words convey certain messages and thoughts/perspectives. I have the benefit of being able to function in 2 different languages, and I found that my Al-Anon work was easiest and most beneficial for me in my second language. The structure and formation of the language just doesn't allow some of the thoughts and perspectives that English does.
What I find really interesting is that, even though I knew this, I didn't appreciate how much it was impacting me personally. Every now and then, I find myself reminded of how impactful my own words are to me. I had a moment this weekend where I found myself dealing with an irate AW via text, and had drafted a text to send, when I read over for typos, I ended up just erasing it, because I realized what I was saying was intended to pacify her behavior and was undermining my own integrity. Choosing not to use those words in that moment meant that I was deciding to let AW keep her issues and problems to herself, and that I wasn't going to enable that particular behavior and undermine my own sense of right and wrong.
I like your input TT; very good program and I will learn more from it. Before and in early program anger, rage, etc. was a part of my personality and character no matter who or what was on the other side of the argument right or wrong. Of course it was me so there wasn't any wrong there...I was RIGHT!! and if my ego got bruised or seemed to be I was dangerous. I didn't yell much I hit; and hard. My amends making I feel have been short in this area because of the physical responses on my part I gave. I was a monster because my fears drove me over the hill of being human. I continue to stand in the amends line and my Higher Power knows I am there. My amends request is "Place me where you want me...tell me what to do".
In one early morning AA meeting I heard my HP mention a name in my mind; the name of a young lad I had violently harmed and I knew the outcome...2 round trips between Hawaii and California and the amends including him and his family. That took 3+ years and actually it took what was necessary. I learned that my victims always suffered beyond myself. Sad.
Others can make me angry only as I allow it...Another personal responsibility. Again Mahalo for your support.
No one made me feel all these yuck feelings, once I heard the message about detachment, from Alanon.
Learned to love the person and not the problem. The problem being the disease.
I say these simple words out loud. If I have any residual blame and shame I can withdraw it from my account.
It is worthless and destructive.
...
Of course the things that others say and do are going to upset me and make me angry and upset. I wouldn't be human if it didn't. It's what I do with that anger that's important.
I am working on containing and dealing with my emotions rather than trying to not feel them at all.
I know it's not someone else's fault if I get angry and let myself spiral out of control with it,lash out,etc. But if they say or do something that does upset me or make me angry, they are the ones in the wrong for that.
I don't want to be that person where everything just rolls off my back or I overlook everything. I just want to keep learning how to assert myself, set and stick to boundaries, control my anger, communicate better,etc.
Oh (((Paul))) what a GREAT share....anything outside of me...person, place, thing only has power over me IF I GIVE IT my power...I have the choice, too, how I respond (hopefully more responding then reacting, but I still can be reacting)
Like dealing with people, places or circumstances, I cannot control stuff that is not WITHIN me..Even if I disagree with a friend, I give up my power if I get all bent out of shape over it and I did that with a friend over a really dumb misunderstanding, mostly on my part..I saw the error of my perception/reaction and made amends..
I try to imagine a chalk circle drawn around my feet...anything outside of that circle is OUT of my control and detachment, casting the burden, keeps me in reality and more emotionally sober
-- Edited by mamalioness on Thursday 24th of June 2021 08:27:27 PM
Getting out of the way of his chaos involved al anon for me. It meant that when he didn't pay the electric bill I did not step in and pay it.
When we split up after he vilified me viciously he put my name down on his storage locker as an alternative contact
When they called me to say he had not paid the bill I ekecrd not to act
I no longer have the compulsion to help
In fact around certain people I have no inclination to even respond
Therefore it has been a long hard road to learn how not to blame others for ny problems
I work hard on being around people who.are regulated. If I gave to deal with an alcoholic or someone whom acts like an alcoholic I.set a lot of limits
I work really hard to maintain those limits
So I cant say the alcoholics actions did not cause me tremendous problems. My qualifier was immensely destructive. Getting out of the way of people who.are immensely destructive has been hard. There were a lot of times to undo. That did not happen overnight
As it did happen there was immense relief
Now I am particularly guarded around people who do not behave as adults.
I no longer have the compulsion to rescue
I no longer have the compulsion to help others before myself
But I cant say the alcoholics issues didn't hurt me tremendously. He destroyed everything and I mean everything in his path. He is still on that track. I elected to get off that track.
Maresie
I learned long ago on the subject of "choices" that my feeling are choices. I use to think that was not so until good work with my VA therapist and my sponsor. I also learned that they, (feelings) are not things when my therapist asked me how I felt while being hurt in a relationship that I responded, "like sh-t". His response was "So like a lump of warm, smelly, stuff that a dog will leave in your front yard"? I snapped back "What are you talking about?!! No Sh-t" and then I got it. Feelings are inner responses to what is going on outside of me. He also told me "Sh-t is a thing...not a feeling". Now I got it right and things are easier and go more smoothly.
Others can make me angry to the extent I allow it...there!! LOL
Lashing out behavior is of course very common. However the management at our job does not seem to be focused on setting limits.
I most certainly have limits .
I have limits on the chaos I endure. I have limits on being bullied.
In fact on a physical level I deal with the consequences of being bullied daily. I have to deal with the aftermath of that bullying on an ongoing basis
The limits are part of the choices. If I encounter a bully who goes out of their way to make other people's lives a misery I have to pay attention. Lashing out is no longer a permissible excuse for me. I am no longer a punch bag
Not paying attention not addressing that this behavior crosses my boundaries gets ne in a lot of trouble.
My choices are not about quelling my feelings. My choices are what I do about those feelings
Some people go out of their way to bully others
That is their chronic pattern. I now go out of my way to deal EU with them. In another month I will be in a better position to leave this job
I am no longer in a place where I entertain being bullied. Bullying on a chronic basis is demoralising
At times in my life I have had to find ways to deal with bullying. As an adult I know where an out of control bully can go
I do not choose to be a victim anymore. Neither do I choose being picked on.
So for me personally because affect regulation is so essential Ichoose to listen to my feelings. I choose to attend to those feelings. Then I choose to take actions specifically to protect myself. My boundaries come directly from attending to those feelings
Maresie