Setting and Keeping Boundaries with Volatile Family Members
FluffyDogMom said
Mar 23, 2021
Hi everyone. I am new to these boards, although I have been to face to face meetings a few times before. I am currently struggling with how to handle a situation with my dad that has escalated over the past several days. A few months ago, he started giving me the silent treatment.... he did not stop talking to me entirely, but things went from normal conversation to single word answers and then weeks or months without reaching out at all. Instead of gathering for the holidays, he declared he was dropping off my presents, and when he arrived at my house he dropped things on the porch and did not speak to me at all, despite my greeting him and asking how he was doing. A few weeks later when my dog died, I reached out to share that sad news, and received no response at all, despite him texting later that day to ask about something completely irrelevant. During all of this, I have not withheld any communication on my part, but have avoided asking the cause of his silence as he has used this tactic many times before to punish me and prompt me to reach out, rather than coming to me with what he is upset about. This past weekend, his girlfriend reached out and set up a plan to get together. I went into it with no idea what to expect, but willing to be open about what might come and even inviting them into my home for the day on Sunday. He came along with her, but barely spoke to me the whole time, going so far as to spend much of the visit in a completely separate room by himself. I was again friendly and cordial and had a really lovely visit with his girlfriend, but I did not feed into his silent treatment and ask what was going on. I ended the day feeling sad that he'd chosen to behave in that way, but feeling pretty good about how I had handled things.
Since then? He has sent an ugly text message yesterday (in the middle of my workday) telling me that I missed my opportunity to "rectify" things, and that he cannot believe he has such an ungrateful daughter. When I didn't answer that (because I am taking some time and space to figure out what to do), he texted before sunrise today angry that I wasn't even answering my own father now, and has since called me multiple times today (again, in the middle of my workday). I have not answered him and I really just want this all to stop but don't want to accomplish that by giving in to his behavior. He has hurt me several times over the past few months of this, and I don't feel this is mine to try and "fix". His anger does not excuse his behavior in my opinion, and I don't think its unreasonable to expect someone to come and talk with you when they are angry rather than lash out at you with silence and then blame.
His texts and phone calls are distracting me despite my not answering. I feel awful about all of this, and I am second guessing my own actions and boundaries in this situation. Maybe I should have reached out at some point??? But do I fix that by reaching out now?? I know that he has proven repeatedly that he will try and guilt and manipulate me into the actions he wants over and over again. (even going so far years ago to tell a friend in front of me that its great to have a daughter who is so very responsive to guilt.) I don't want to show him that being hurtful and mean will get him what he wants.
Has anyone else experienced something like this? Am I right in my expectations of him talking to me, and my expectation for an apology for his behavior? How do I respond to the current repeated attempts to get me to answer him and attempts to guilt me?
Debb said
Mar 23, 2021
Welcome to MIP {{FluffyDogMom}} glad you found us and shared.
Alcoholics use the silent treatment to manipulate and create chaos.
Al-Anon teaches us that detachment with love is the best way to approach and
handle such treatment. You are doing fantastic!! It is very difficult, under the
circumstances to deal with such abuse, but at least you are in different households.
The silent treatment is usually a way to punish and if he chooses to approach the subject
on his own you will then have to, depending on how he handles himself, just listen and
not react in a defensive or argumentative way. It is good that you are not answering
and/or reacting to his texts and phone calls!
I would continue with your Al-Anon f2f meetings, they will be a great support at this
time for you and by all means please keep coming back here to this forum to talk with us.
-- Edited by Debb on Tuesday 23rd of March 2021 01:42:52 PM
Iamhere said
Mar 23, 2021
Welcome to MIP FluffyDogMom (love the name!!). Glad you found us and glad that you shared. I am another who doesn't see this just as a issue with Alcoholics. Many seem to struggle with communication especially within family dynamics. It has been my experience that the males in my life, some Alcoholic and some not, all process at a much different pace than I do.
I'm one when there is an issue or I am hurt, disappointed, angry, etc. I really want to talk it out and resolve it quickly. I have had to learn in recovery that my way is not the only way and unconditional love includes allowing others the space, time, etc. they need or want to prepare for discussions especially when emotions are involved.
His chosen way of handling this certainly is different than mine. I can't honestly say it's super different from my guys. I would love to sit here and give you reasons why they are so vastly different in how they handle conflict, but have come to a place in me where I choose to not judge, analyze or even wonder why another is doing what they or doing as I consider it a form of judgement and taking another's inventory.
When I am faced with these types of situations, I often will send an email/text. What I know about me is I am often kinder and more 'to the point' when I am writing than when I am speaking. It took me a while in recovery to realize that picking a time to discuss things should be convenient to all and agreed upon by all. I used to drop everything often/always because I thought that's what 'love' is/was. Today, my boundaries just give me the same respect I am willing to give others. If you're at work, clearly it's not time to talk. A simple email or text with a time that works for you might diffuse until then.
I learned in recovery to not 'pick up the rope' for the tug of war that can often happen in relationships (with alcoholics as well as others). I have also learned to pass the monkey back - 'not my circus, not my monkey'. My sponsor reminds me that I am not a mind reader, nor a fortune teller and I don't have a crystal ball. It's best I stay on my side of the street, in the present and allow others to 'find their words' when they are troubled for any reason.
Hang in there and take good care of you. Our program suggests we 'say what we mean, mean what we say and don't say it mean.' This helps me pass the monkey right back with kindness, grace and respect for self and others.
Keep coming back - you're not alone and there's hope and help in recovery!!
Maresie888 said
Mar 24, 2021
Welcome to this group
Great work on boundaries
Some people do not have them
Al anon had heloed me tremendously
DavidG said
Mar 24, 2021
... hi FDM My dad passed away over 20 years ago. What y'all are saying resonates with me.
There are several ways of describing this phenomenon. And I am sure others will elaborate. Having child-like
emotions- I would have described my dad as being like an eight year old- and like a three year old when angry.
"Throwing his toys out of the cot!" It is so disconcerting. Because we have grown up with them around we have
learned to accept their norms as our norms. But as you describe- it is so mind-warping!
So comparing notes can be such a big relief! coming home to some stark realities. I might be tempted to think
we could all laugh about it- one day. But initially it is no laughing matter- I can tell you! ...
take care...
thanks so much for your share.
Alanon would not exist for us, it's members! ...
pinkchip said
Mar 24, 2021
I don't see any problem with your behavior - the only part I read that seems problematic for you is that you admit feeling really bad and confused over this. That is where alanon comes in and you get better at detachment. I could see you telling him verbally that you don't know what you were supposed to "rectify" and that you've examined your behavior and are fine with it and hope he finds peace with himself. Likely when you state the verbal boundaries like that (rather than just not answer and avoid), you will get extreme push back. So, I'm not saying to go ahead and do that. It is a tricky issues. When you truly accept you are not the cause, cure, and you cannot control his behavior, you ideally stop feeling guilty then are free to set sensible boundaries that are true to yourself and honor yourself.
Maresie888 said
Apr 8, 2021
The really good thing about your response is your restraint. I.have only now got to the point of saying. No to texts when I am at work. In addition no to texts in the.middle of the night.
That includes from my.boss. indeed the issue of sending emails and expecting a response is a real issue in emoloyme t
As I write this I am going back and forth trying to reach one of my.emoloyers.
The message is you are doing really well
None of us ask for dysfinctional parents
None of us
Hope you will reach out to al anon to get help.
Maresie
mamalioness said
Apr 10, 2021
Hi fluffy! You know I dont know what is worse--physical abuse or mental torture and of course the physical abuse we need to stay away from physically but you know the mental abuse, it comes in so many ugly shapes and sizes, and it hurts the recipient and thats why I am glad that we can all come here and share our sadness and our pain and disappointment in our loved ones and get back on track and decide OK it is what it is--I dont like it-- I dont agree with those treatment but this is where we are at right now and what is the next right thing I can do for me because I am the only one who can help me and thats when I hunker down and get into my program and get support from my fellow travelers and I try to be extra nurturing to myself in that what ever feelings come up, I recognize them and I allow them and I Accept them and then I investigate the roots and what can I do for me right now to comfort me and then I go in to nurturing myself and self talk and prayer and just letting go and letting God.
Im glad you came here and shared this because it is sad this happened to you but people that are not in recovery can be really toxic and not even know that they are. And that is why Al-Anon is for us to reclaim our lives and to take back our power by keeping the focus on ourselves and our program and please keep coming back
Hi everyone. I am new to these boards, although I have been to face to face meetings a few times before. I am currently struggling with how to handle a situation with my dad that has escalated over the past several days. A few months ago, he started giving me the silent treatment.... he did not stop talking to me entirely, but things went from normal conversation to single word answers and then weeks or months without reaching out at all. Instead of gathering for the holidays, he declared he was dropping off my presents, and when he arrived at my house he dropped things on the porch and did not speak to me at all, despite my greeting him and asking how he was doing. A few weeks later when my dog died, I reached out to share that sad news, and received no response at all, despite him texting later that day to ask about something completely irrelevant. During all of this, I have not withheld any communication on my part, but have avoided asking the cause of his silence as he has used this tactic many times before to punish me and prompt me to reach out, rather than coming to me with what he is upset about. This past weekend, his girlfriend reached out and set up a plan to get together. I went into it with no idea what to expect, but willing to be open about what might come and even inviting them into my home for the day on Sunday. He came along with her, but barely spoke to me the whole time, going so far as to spend much of the visit in a completely separate room by himself. I was again friendly and cordial and had a really lovely visit with his girlfriend, but I did not feed into his silent treatment and ask what was going on. I ended the day feeling sad that he'd chosen to behave in that way, but feeling pretty good about how I had handled things.
Since then? He has sent an ugly text message yesterday (in the middle of my workday) telling me that I missed my opportunity to "rectify" things, and that he cannot believe he has such an ungrateful daughter. When I didn't answer that (because I am taking some time and space to figure out what to do), he texted before sunrise today angry that I wasn't even answering my own father now, and has since called me multiple times today (again, in the middle of my workday). I have not answered him and I really just want this all to stop but don't want to accomplish that by giving in to his behavior. He has hurt me several times over the past few months of this, and I don't feel this is mine to try and "fix". His anger does not excuse his behavior in my opinion, and I don't think its unreasonable to expect someone to come and talk with you when they are angry rather than lash out at you with silence and then blame.
His texts and phone calls are distracting me despite my not answering. I feel awful about all of this, and I am second guessing my own actions and boundaries in this situation. Maybe I should have reached out at some point??? But do I fix that by reaching out now?? I know that he has proven repeatedly that he will try and guilt and manipulate me into the actions he wants over and over again. (even going so far years ago to tell a friend in front of me that its great to have a daughter who is so very responsive to guilt.) I don't want to show him that being hurtful and mean will get him what he wants.
Has anyone else experienced something like this? Am I right in my expectations of him talking to me, and my expectation for an apology for his behavior? How do I respond to the current repeated attempts to get me to answer him and attempts to guilt me?
Welcome to MIP {{FluffyDogMom}} glad you found us and shared.
Alcoholics use the silent treatment to manipulate and create chaos.
Al-Anon teaches us that detachment with love is the best way to approach and
handle such treatment. You are doing fantastic!! It is very difficult, under the
circumstances to deal with such abuse, but at least you are in different households.
The silent treatment is usually a way to punish and if he chooses to approach the subject
on his own you will then have to, depending on how he handles himself, just listen and
not react in a defensive or argumentative way. It is good that you are not answering
and/or reacting to his texts and phone calls!
I would continue with your Al-Anon f2f meetings, they will be a great support at this
time for you and by all means please keep coming back here to this forum to talk with us.
-- Edited by Debb on Tuesday 23rd of March 2021 01:42:52 PM
I'm one when there is an issue or I am hurt, disappointed, angry, etc. I really want to talk it out and resolve it quickly. I have had to learn in recovery that my way is not the only way and unconditional love includes allowing others the space, time, etc. they need or want to prepare for discussions especially when emotions are involved.
His chosen way of handling this certainly is different than mine. I can't honestly say it's super different from my guys. I would love to sit here and give you reasons why they are so vastly different in how they handle conflict, but have come to a place in me where I choose to not judge, analyze or even wonder why another is doing what they or doing as I consider it a form of judgement and taking another's inventory.
When I am faced with these types of situations, I often will send an email/text. What I know about me is I am often kinder and more 'to the point' when I am writing than when I am speaking. It took me a while in recovery to realize that picking a time to discuss things should be convenient to all and agreed upon by all. I used to drop everything often/always because I thought that's what 'love' is/was. Today, my boundaries just give me the same respect I am willing to give others. If you're at work, clearly it's not time to talk. A simple email or text with a time that works for you might diffuse until then.
I learned in recovery to not 'pick up the rope' for the tug of war that can often happen in relationships (with alcoholics as well as others). I have also learned to pass the monkey back - 'not my circus, not my monkey'. My sponsor reminds me that I am not a mind reader, nor a fortune teller and I don't have a crystal ball. It's best I stay on my side of the street, in the present and allow others to 'find their words' when they are troubled for any reason.
Hang in there and take good care of you. Our program suggests we 'say what we mean, mean what we say and don't say it mean.' This helps me pass the monkey right back with kindness, grace and respect for self and others.
Keep coming back - you're not alone and there's hope and help in recovery!!
Great work on boundaries
Some people do not have them
Al anon had heloed me tremendously
There are several ways of describing this phenomenon. And I am sure others will elaborate. Having child-like
emotions- I would have described my dad as being like an eight year old- and like a three year old when angry.
"Throwing his toys out of the cot!" It is so disconcerting. Because we have grown up with them around we have
learned to accept their norms as our norms. But as you describe- it is so mind-warping!
So comparing notes can be such a big relief! coming home to some stark realities. I might be tempted to think
we could all laugh about it- one day. But initially it is no laughing matter- I can tell you!
...
take care...
thanks so much for your share.
Alanon would not exist for us, it's members!
...
The really good thing about your response is your restraint. I.have only now got to the point of saying. No to texts when I am at work. In addition no to texts in the.middle of the night.
That includes from my.boss. indeed the issue of sending emails and expecting a response is a real issue in emoloyme t
As I write this I am going back and forth trying to reach one of my.emoloyers.
The message is you are doing really well
None of us ask for dysfinctional parents
None of us
Hope you will reach out to al anon to get help.
Maresie
Im glad you came here and shared this because it is sad this happened to you but people that are not in recovery can be really toxic and not even know that they are. And that is why Al-Anon is for us to reclaim our lives and to take back our power by keeping the focus on ourselves and our program and please keep coming back