I've been fighting the urge to defend myself with AH for 2 days now. It's so hard to not do it though. It feels so important to tell my side,tell all my thoughts and feelings,to try to convince him he's wrong about something.
What's the point though? He will never agree with what I say,he will never say "omg, you're right, I'm so sorry". All it would do is cause a huge argument and I will be the one to lose sleep, feel unwell from the stress,will lose my temper trying to argue my point. It's not worth all that to me. His opinion of me is just that,HIS opinion. It doesn't mean it's true.
So JFT(again) I'm not giving in to that need to defend myself.
JerryF said
Sep 25, 2020
Froggy my spirit is smiling because of the reaffirmation of the program as I learned it. Recovery messages come back that were soooo true and helpful. It's early here as I just got up to take a couple sleeping pills after tossing and turning. I was focusing on "How my HP shows His gratitude to the fellowship by giving us opportunities to practice what we have learned...and then I get the pills, the water, the way back to bed after the computer and here you are with your ESH; echoes from the past that work when I work them. Thanks Sister for being up and caring and Thanks HP for the gift. ((((HUGS))))
Iamhere said
Sep 25, 2020
(((SF))) - I hear you and can so, so relate....I felt I was literally biting my tongue for a long, long while in early recovery. What really helped me was having a sponsor whom I could call and vent and JADE to. With each session, and her loving patience and response, it helped me find peace with the choice to not J-A-D-E, making it feel more normal/natural and not as painful.
For the record, it took every ounce of self-control for me to keep my mouth shut. I had been a right-fighter for so, so long that it felt extremely unnatural and maddening to not engage, take the bait, etc. Like your awareness shared, I knew deep down that if I did jump back in, it would be me who was angry, hurting, disappointed, etc. after. My willingness and ability to fight loudly and proudly for so many years just no longer worked for me and left me shattered, which I found worthy of avoiding. My sponsor used to say, "would you rather be right, or would you rather be happy?" In my mind, I answered 'both' for a while and then realized the truth in that question. I've chosen happy many, many times now and am more serene for it.
Keep working this program as best you can, JFT. I hope you are feeling some benefits and moments of peace. Just keep doing what you're doing - there is always hope and help in recovery.
Maresie888 said
Sep 25, 2020
It was a hige turning pont for me when I . Stopped arguing with the qualifier. I alson now think it was the beginning of self regard
That is a huge step.
Congratulations
Maresie
SunnyFrogs said
Sep 26, 2020
Thanks Jerry,Iamhere and Maresie.
I'm sure I won't always be able to fight the need to defend myself.Right now though it actually feels good knowing it's possible.
Maresie888 said
Sep 27, 2020
Well I most certainly went up and down in the program
The desire to control the addict is truly compelling. For me so much of it was about craving intimacy. When the qualifier wanted something he could certainly tune in.
In fact in many ways I think many alcoholics are able to tune into people very carefully. They are very perceptive
Stopping arguing with the alcoholic is a way I started to tune into myself and my needs. I certainly am worthy of having needs. My life has been one where I tolerated and even believed gaslighting all the time. Alcoholics are very good at gaslightng. I am a real novice at self care
Maresie
Iamhere said
Sep 28, 2020
(((SF))) - what you share is what I find so lovely about recovery....when we practice what we hear, it does feel good. I can't count how many times I would slip in the moment, which is also part of the recovery process. We are not ever expected to be/do perfect, just improve. Today, I can feel 'it' rising up within - sometimes it's rage, other times, it's just discomfort, and other times I don't know exactly what it is - I just feel 'it'. For me, that's when I really lean into the pause so I can pray before I proceed. When I operate on 'self-will', it never ends well. I've been a slow learner on this and finally just work really hard to not 'go there'...keep doing what you're doing - it looks great on ya!
SunnyFrogs said
Sep 30, 2020
Well,I gave into that urge yesterday and it turned very ugly.
But,I did well for awhile. I'm not gonna beat myself up for it. I'm just gonna keep trying.
Iamhere said
Oct 2, 2020
SF - it happens because we're human. Love your strategy - keep practicing and moving forward and certainly don't beat yourself up for being human. I am so grateful we're all about progress, not perfection. Keep doing what you're doing and keep coming back!!
JerryF said
Oct 2, 2020
I was taught to "own my stuff, my part in it" that being the honesty in the situation and when I did most of the struggle faded. I learned to say with humility and honesty "You`re right and "I apologize for that" and then not leave the others with full responsibility including my part. I once was asked, "What in the hell did I do to deserve what you did to me"? What a great inventory question that leveled the field for us both. This works when I work it. (((hugs)))
Maresie888 said
Oct 3, 2020
Not beatimg yourself up.is s tadical self care step
You are in the eye of the storm. I hope you are lookimg for ways to keep respite for yourself. We are heading into the hard season. It is no councidence around Christmas many.AA groups run marathons. That is they run 24 hour groips so people can go to back groups.
These are challenging times. You have made space for yourself. Now you need to step it up to get through the holidays
Maresie
SunnyFrogs said
Oct 12, 2020
Thanks Iamhere, Jerry and Maresie.
Since my last post in this thread 11 or 12 days ago I have really,really been trying my hardest(and my best) to focus on myself and work this program. I have been listening to podcasts,watching YouTube videos,reading posts here etc. and trying to apply all the tools I have been learning.
AH isn't liking any of this too much though. He's looking like a sad little unwanted puppy if I say something like "I'm sorry you feel that way" and then don't say much else. Sometimes he even looks and acts mad if I don't react how I was before. Sometimes I feel like I need to explain what I am doing and why and defend myself but I will catch myself and not do it. I
Yesterday he said something very hurtful and then twisted his words around to put the blame on me. I didn't react,instead I said it was hurtful,it wasn't nice to twist his words and I was going to go wash the dishes. And then I did go wash them. I did have to stop myself about 3 or 4 times from going back into the room he was in and defend myself and yell.
I don't really care that he's not liking how I'm trying to do things now. It makes ME feel much better about myself and sure makes MY life much easier.
This is hard work though. It is taking everything in me to make little changes but I am determined to keep at it. Just these past couple of weeks have been really different for me. I love the nights I go to bed and have a clear conscious knowing I am doing the best I can. And when I do feel I have screwed up I acknowledge it and let it go and continue on instead of feeling defeated and giving up.
I have a long,long way to go and so much to learn but omg I am so willing and ready for this.
-- Edited by SunnyFrogs on Monday 12th of October 2020 07:06:26 PM
Maresie888 said
Oct 12, 2020
Whaf a great improvement. Congratulations. I.resisted resistedabd resisted giving up fighting. I could still fall back on that enmeshed style of relating
The skills you have developed in reflectimg pausing and contsining are impressive
I've been fighting the urge to defend myself with AH for 2 days now. It's so hard to not do it though. It feels so important to tell my side,tell all my thoughts and feelings,to try to convince him he's wrong about something.
What's the point though? He will never agree with what I say,he will never say "omg, you're right, I'm so sorry". All it would do is cause a huge argument and I will be the one to lose sleep, feel unwell from the stress,will lose my temper trying to argue my point. It's not worth all that to me. His opinion of me is just that,HIS opinion. It doesn't mean it's true.
So JFT(again) I'm not giving in to that need to defend myself.
Froggy my spirit is smiling because of the reaffirmation of the program as I learned it. Recovery messages come back that were soooo true and helpful. It's early here as I just got up to take a couple sleeping pills after tossing and turning. I was focusing on "How my HP shows His gratitude to the fellowship by giving us opportunities to practice what we have learned...and then I get the pills, the water, the way back to bed after the computer and here you are with your ESH; echoes from the past that work when I work them. Thanks Sister for being up and caring and Thanks HP for the gift. ((((HUGS))))
(((SF))) - I hear you and can so, so relate....I felt I was literally biting my tongue for a long, long while in early recovery. What really helped me was having a sponsor whom I could call and vent and JADE to. With each session, and her loving patience and response, it helped me find peace with the choice to not J-A-D-E, making it feel more normal/natural and not as painful.
For the record, it took every ounce of self-control for me to keep my mouth shut. I had been a right-fighter for so, so long that it felt extremely unnatural and maddening to not engage, take the bait, etc. Like your awareness shared, I knew deep down that if I did jump back in, it would be me who was angry, hurting, disappointed, etc. after. My willingness and ability to fight loudly and proudly for so many years just no longer worked for me and left me shattered, which I found worthy of avoiding. My sponsor used to say, "would you rather be right, or would you rather be happy?" In my mind, I answered 'both' for a while and then realized the truth in that question. I've chosen happy many, many times now and am more serene for it.
Keep working this program as best you can, JFT. I hope you are feeling some benefits and moments of peace. Just keep doing what you're doing - there is always hope and help in recovery.
Thanks Jerry,Iamhere and Maresie.
I'm sure I won't always be able to fight the need to defend myself.Right now though it actually feels good knowing it's possible.
But,I did well for awhile. I'm not gonna beat myself up for it. I'm just gonna keep trying.
I was taught to "own my stuff, my part in it" that being the honesty in the situation and when I did most of the struggle faded. I learned to say with humility and honesty "You`re right and "I apologize for that" and then not leave the others with full responsibility including my part. I once was asked, "What in the hell did I do to deserve what you did to me"? What a great inventory question that leveled the field for us both. This works when I work it. (((hugs)))
Thanks Iamhere, Jerry and Maresie.
Since my last post in this thread 11 or 12 days ago I have really,really been trying my hardest(and my best) to focus on myself and work this program. I have been listening to podcasts,watching YouTube videos,reading posts here etc. and trying to apply all the tools I have been learning.
AH isn't liking any of this too much though. He's looking like a sad little unwanted puppy if I say something like "I'm sorry you feel that way" and then don't say much else. Sometimes he even looks and acts mad if I don't react how I was before. Sometimes I feel like I need to explain what I am doing and why and defend myself but I will catch myself and not do it. I
Yesterday he said something very hurtful and then twisted his words around to put the blame on me. I didn't react,instead I said it was hurtful,it wasn't nice to twist his words and I was going to go wash the dishes. And then I did go wash them. I did have to stop myself about 3 or 4 times from going back into the room he was in and defend myself and yell.
I don't really care that he's not liking how I'm trying to do things now. It makes ME feel much better about myself and sure makes MY life much easier.
This is hard work though. It is taking everything in me to make little changes but I am determined to keep at it. Just these past couple of weeks have been really different for me. I love the nights I go to bed and have a clear conscious knowing I am doing the best I can. And when I do feel I have screwed up I acknowledge it and let it go and continue on instead of feeling defeated and giving up.
I have a long,long way to go and so much to learn but omg I am so willing and ready for this.
-- Edited by SunnyFrogs on Monday 12th of October 2020 07:06:26 PM
Whaf a great improvement. Congratulations. I.resisted resistedabd resisted giving up fighting. I could still fall back on that enmeshed style of relating
The skills you have developed in reflectimg pausing and contsining are impressive