Getting back to basics and hoping to move forward...
DavidG said
Dec 28, 2019
Getting back to basics-
hopes and dreams... were shattered, over and over again. Boundaries lost. Despair set in.
My dream for these last three months was to do steps 10, 11 and 12. And then next year to take a good look at tradition 5. This was about reaching out to others, from a place of strength.
So I pulled up this basic information. It is basically the same information I received at my first meeting in March 1983. I am looking at it from a completely different vantage point now.
My Plan B. is to just slowly withdraw from Alanon and become what I am- an old timer.
Around the Christmas time I advertised locally for Alanon and gave people a link to our NZ GSO... just testing the waters.
I keep my seat warm at the nearest F2F group...
...trying to keep it simple, one day at a time... ...
Aloha David good for you and for us and others that you have remained "in the program" for as long as you have gaining the experience and then giving it away. I am also a long timer having been in the program since 1979 and working and struggling it since then. I don't move away from the program voluntarily at any time yet still I find it usual when I am affected by a relapse mode. When I am sick or caught up with anything that interferes with my practice such as now that I find myself moving from my home nation to the continental u.s. My practice and way of practice has been disturbed and that affects my spirit, thoughts and physical behaviors taking them back where I was reacting rather than responding to life around me and reducing both my prayer and meditation habits which are chosen basics when I want to keep moving forward and affirming a daily relationship with my HP.
I always respect and enjoy your ESH and want to hear more.
Ho`omaika`i ((((hugs))))
PosiesandPuppies said
Dec 29, 2019
David, thank you for sharing this link.
I have new goals for 2020, one of which is to understand myself on a deeper level. This blog post has things within it that I need to explore further. Thank you for your service!
&
Bo said
Dec 29, 2019
After 25 years in alanon, I still attend beginners meetings regularly and religiously. The primary reason -- in addition to "giving back" -- is because in beginners meetings they focus on the fundamentals and the basics!!! Steps One, Two, and Three, yes, they are a focus, but there is a great deal of time spent on the basics and fundamentals -- what seasoned people, what healthy people, what people who "get it" do on a day to day basis, to get, stay, and live a healthy and happy life, a life of recovery. I love walking into a beginners meeting -- a conference approved, official alanon meeting -- where the focus is on alanon. Not AA, not non-conference approved literature/material, not the AA perspective, nothing other than alanon! Alanon! It's about the alaon STEPS, not the AA steps. It's about the alanon perspective. Not the AA perspective.
As they say in the opening of meetings here where I live..."it's about the focus being on US, and the perspective of and from being the loved one of an alcoholic, rather than being an alcoholic." It also says, "The truth is, you are here because of the alcoholic and not for the alcoholic." It also says, "As you know, we speak from our own experience, which is derived from living with an alcoholic rather than being one. It is a different experience which calls for a different interpretation of the AA program. For your sake, and in order to help the newcomer, we ask that you start by listening to suggested solutions based upon the Al- Anon approach to the family illness."
The basics, the fundamentals...of alanon. That's why I go to beginners meetings.
Iamhere said
Dec 29, 2019
David - great share....love how you set a plan for the last few months and can 'see' the action....Back to basics for me is about digging into what worked when I first arrived. Meetings were certainly suggested, along with self-care, step work, sponsor, fellowship. For me, I really needed much more than a daily meeting, I needed to dig into step work, literature, and have daily dialogue with others who were willing to share ESH with me. I had no issue feeling loved, and peace in a meeting - the other 23 hours of each day presented the real challenges for my sanity.
I feel blessed and grateful to have access to several meetings each week, each unique in structure. I know that's not always the case, so for those who don't, I applaud any/all efforts to embrace this program, the tools, etc. Like Jerry, I do best when I stick to a daily routine focused on recovery, self-care, and alignment with HP. If I feel restless, irritable or discontent, I take a look at what's changed. Most of the time, I've let something slip that matters to my recovery - not always intentional or planned. My sponsor celebrated 46 years in recovery this morning and I had forgotten completely simply because of real life distractions.
Each year, I select a theme to focus on. Beyond my typical step work and daily activities, I dig deeper into the theme and it's been a lovely add to my program and life. I'm not one for resolutions as I believe in change/action as/when needed and resolutions always feel pass/fail to me. The best gift recovery has given me is the ability and desire to just focus on progress and not perfection. When I remain humble, open and willing, change and growth just keep happening. A lovely group of women from recovery in my area are considering a book study for 2020. We've done this in the past, and it's been very insightful as we each read and interpret based on our own experience. Back to basics for me suggests I consider any/all suggestions that brought me peace, willingness, openness and growth - and it's the only way I know how to keep moving forward.
Keep doing you David, your value and your shares are insightful, helpful and lovely! (((Hugs)))
Enigmatic said
Jan 4, 2020
A new year, always a great time for new endeavors...
Along the lines of meetings, AlAnon and AA, a couple of musings:
It is often the case that members of AlAnon and AA enter each respective program with a slightly different purpose: AlAnoners out of concern for someone elses' drinking, AAers due to problems from their own.
Each member soon (hopefully) makes this common realization, however: The deeper problem lies not in the Alcoholic for AlAnoners, nor with Alcohol or Alcoholism for AAers, but within themselves, regardless of which program they join. The true reason we come to recovery is not because of someone or something else, its because our plan for living is not working, we need to change. The vast majority of work in both programs begins after realizing this.
Interestingly, it is not possible to go to an AlAnon meeting and not encounter AA steps, for that is where AlAnon obtained theirs almost in their entirety in 1951. In fact, AlAnon's Fifth Tradition states:
"Each Al-Anon Family Group has but one purpose: to help families of Alcoholics. We do this by practicing the Twelve Steps of AA ourselves, by understanding our alcoholic relatives, and by giving comfort to families of alcoholics."
The "perspective" of AA, though originally intended for alcoholics, is the same for AlAnon:
* Belief that we are powerless over alcohol, people, places, things, situations
* Belief that a Higher Power can guide us spiritually to serenity and peace
* Belief in the need to change our attitudes and actions
* Belief in the need to share what we have learned with others still in need
* Three Legacies:
* Recovery through acceptance of the Steps
* Unity through acceptance of the Traditions
* Service through acceptance of the concepts
So in fact, the spiritual perspectives and solutions of AA are found in every official AlAnon meeting and all conference approved AlAnon literature.
That makes sense as members of both programs are just as sick, flawed, and helpless as the other, and the solution is the same for both: A spiritual way of living, reliance upon a Higher Power, and guidance from the 12 Steps.
Members of both programs resist giving advice or telling others what they should feel or do, recognizing that each is shaped by their own Higher Power, needs, and personal life experience that guides their spiritual journey of recovery.
For some in AlAnon, that journey involves their own personal struggle with alcohol that shapes how they perceive and deal with alcohol use by others. While it is certainly true that a member of Alanon should not make that experience the focal point at AlAnon meetings, or quote extensively literature from another group, a group member does not have the right to tell another how they should share their own experience or story.
AlAnon and AA operate as separate but cooperative and very related fellowships. One simply cannot avoid the Steps, concepts, or perspectives of AA when attending AlAnon due to the extensive overlap in programs.
With such a rich history of successful spiritual recovery in AA, why would someone want to? I am truly grateful that both programs exist for all those who care to benefit from such rich, spiritual blessings.
Happy New Year and blessings to all!
Iamhere said
Jan 5, 2020
(((Paul))) - so, so, so great to see you! You've been missed and thank you for your share. I too am very grateful for both sides of the program as one would not exist without the other. Happy New Year to you too!
Bo - I have never seen that meeting opening you posted. It's vastly different from CAL as well as the recent Al-Anon/AlaTeen Service Manual. As a double winner, I would feel very unwelcome simply because as Paul says, my experience is my own and it does include recovery from two sides of the program. If I put on my Al-Anon hat only, the opening is concerning to me as it feels controlling/manipulative - a large area of defect for most who seek help. We use CAL suggested opening, and never suggest the A is the problem or the reason we seek help - instead we focus on what inside of us (our insanity) makes us think we can control, change, manage, fix) another person and the disease concept.
We have a much gentler way of suggesting we stay focused on self and Al-Anon, and how WE are doing no matter what the A is doing. We also just stay focused on CAL and don't restrict mention of AA. The meeting leader can certainly redirect any member who is sidetracked by any outside influence (another program, religion, professional services, etc.) Perhaps this is because most of our Al-Anon meetings are held in shared halls/rooms with AA and the slogans, literature, pamphlets, etc. are available for all programs here (together). A quick google search revealed more than 10M results for AA Double Winners, many of them meetings. Al-Anon will not register double-winner meetings, but AA will.
All I know is I learn, grow and heal from all recovery efforts. I attend meetings where I feel safe and willingly follow the rules/guidelines established by the group conscience. In my area, while we respect the separation of the two programs, we are also willing to adapt to the needs of those seeking help, and for that, I am grateful! I also know in my area, if a member of Al-Anon showed up intentionally or by accident to an AA meeting, open or closed, they would be supported, welcomed and embraced since both programs have very similar Responsibility Statements, which does not suggest we only help those in our flock. As always, take what you like and leave the rest! I am not certain what the outcome would be in the reverse case scenario, but would hope someone, anyone would be willing (I would)...
For anyone who's not seen or read the Al-Anon Service Manual, there is tons of great information in it. Here's a link... https://al-anon.org/pdf/P2427_online.pdf
Bo said
Jan 10, 2020
"A word to AA members who are new to Al-Anon. If you have a family problem, you have come to the right place and we welcome you. We speak from our experiences which are derived living with an alcoholic rather than being one. It is a different experience which calls for a different interpretation of the 12 steps. We ask that you start out by listening to the suggested solutions based upon the Al-Anon approach to the family illness. We ask that members of other anonymous fellowships remain anonymous and focus on the Al-Anon program. If you are not a newcomer, it is important to remember that when we share, we keep the newcomer in mind, so that we may give them the hope and courage they need to keep coming back. The group has found over time that what is most helpful is to simply share our experiences, strengths, and hope with each other. What we do not find helpful is engaging in crosstalk or advice-giving. Crosstalk is when one person shares and another comments directly to that person. If there is no advice-giving or direct comment to someone when they share, then everyone can feel safe to open up and share what is in their minds and hearts."
David, here's the language from one of the meetings I attend. Others have similar language, more specific. Doesn't matter.
For me, it's really about where the steps come from and the context in which they exist. The content -- semantics, words -- are the same. It's the context that's different. At least for me.
That said, I absolutely disagree that there's no "difference" between the steps, what they mean, their perspective, contexts, etc. -- vis a vis alanon and AA -- simply because the words are the same (except one word).
Debb said
Jan 11, 2020
I saw these and saved them for my self: (1) I Can't; (2) God Can; (3) Let God; (4) Look Within; (5) Admit Wrongs; (6) Ready Self For Change; (7) Seek God's Help; (8) Become Willing; (9) Make Amends; (10) Daily Inventory; (11) Pray and Meditate; (12) Give It Away. I know that they are shortened versions, but for me they are a quick reminder when I lose my way!!! Hope this helps.
Bo said
Jan 11, 2020
That's great Debb! Nice snapshot/summary!
DavidG said
Jan 11, 2020
Bo...this was my take on "doing the steps" along the way. Had this concept... of trudging up the steps... getting to step 12. Crash and burn, pick myself up- and start all over again.
So I pictured the steps like the numbers on the clock- and I often glance at the clock, around this idea. In this province we have "rail trails" which people ride in cycles. Being old railway country nothing is too steep- up or down.
Since I have done the steps a number of times- I just want to go 'around the clock'. Step one and step 12 sit side by side.
I mostly, do steps 10,11, 12, now, anyways...
Iamhere said
Jan 12, 2020
Awesome share Debb - I am all about keeping it simple and that is a great visual for me/my recovery! Thanks girl....love and light!
Getting back to basics-
hopes and dreams... were shattered, over and over again. Boundaries lost. Despair set in.
My dream for these last three months was to do steps 10, 11 and 12. And then next year to take a good look at tradition 5. This was about reaching out to others, from a place of strength.
So I pulled up this basic information. It is basically the same information I received at my first meeting in March 1983. I am looking at it from a completely different vantage point now.
My Plan B. is to just slowly withdraw from Alanon and become what I am- an old timer.
Around the Christmas time I advertised locally for Alanon and gave people a link to our NZ GSO... just testing the waters.
I keep my seat warm at the nearest F2F group...
...trying to keep it simple, one day at a time...
...
https://al-anon.org/blog/al-anon-works-familiesfriends-alcoholics/
Aloha David good for you and for us and others that you have remained "in the program" for as long as you have gaining the experience and then giving it away. I am also a long timer having been in the program since 1979 and working and struggling it since then. I don't move away from the program voluntarily at any time yet still I find it usual when I am affected by a relapse mode. When I am sick or caught up with anything that interferes with my practice such as now that I find myself moving from my home nation to the continental u.s. My practice and way of practice has been disturbed and that affects my spirit, thoughts and physical behaviors taking them back where I was reacting rather than responding to life around me and reducing both my prayer and meditation habits which are chosen basics when I want to keep moving forward and affirming a daily relationship with my HP.
I always respect and enjoy your ESH and want to hear more.
Ho`omaika`i ((((hugs))))
David, thank you for sharing this link.
& 
I have new goals for 2020, one of which is to understand myself on a deeper level. This blog post has things within it that I need to explore further.
Thank you for your service!
As they say in the opening of meetings here where I live..."it's about the focus being on US, and the perspective of and from being the loved one of an alcoholic, rather than being an alcoholic." It also says, "The truth is, you are here because of the alcoholic and not for the alcoholic." It also says, "As you know, we speak from our own experience, which is derived from living with an alcoholic rather than being one. It is a different experience which calls for a different interpretation of the AA program. For your sake, and in order to help the newcomer, we ask that you start by listening to suggested solutions based upon the Al- Anon approach to the family illness."
The basics, the fundamentals...of alanon. That's why I go to beginners meetings.
I feel blessed and grateful to have access to several meetings each week, each unique in structure. I know that's not always the case, so for those who don't, I applaud any/all efforts to embrace this program, the tools, etc. Like Jerry, I do best when I stick to a daily routine focused on recovery, self-care, and alignment with HP. If I feel restless, irritable or discontent, I take a look at what's changed. Most of the time, I've let something slip that matters to my recovery - not always intentional or planned. My sponsor celebrated 46 years in recovery this morning and I had forgotten completely simply because of real life distractions.
Each year, I select a theme to focus on. Beyond my typical step work and daily activities, I dig deeper into the theme and it's been a lovely add to my program and life. I'm not one for resolutions as I believe in change/action as/when needed and resolutions always feel pass/fail to me. The best gift recovery has given me is the ability and desire to just focus on progress and not perfection. When I remain humble, open and willing, change and growth just keep happening. A lovely group of women from recovery in my area are considering a book study for 2020. We've done this in the past, and it's been very insightful as we each read and interpret based on our own experience. Back to basics for me suggests I consider any/all suggestions that brought me peace, willingness, openness and growth - and it's the only way I know how to keep moving forward.
Keep doing you David, your value and your shares are insightful, helpful and lovely! (((Hugs)))
A new year, always a great time for new endeavors...
Along the lines of meetings, AlAnon and AA, a couple of musings:
It is often the case that members of AlAnon and AA enter each respective program with a slightly different purpose: AlAnoners out of concern for someone elses' drinking, AAers due to problems from their own.
Each member soon (hopefully) makes this common realization, however: The deeper problem lies not in the Alcoholic for AlAnoners, nor with Alcohol or Alcoholism for AAers, but within themselves, regardless of which program they join. The true reason we come to recovery is not because of someone or something else, its because our plan for living is not working, we need to change. The vast majority of work in both programs begins after realizing this.
Interestingly, it is not possible to go to an AlAnon meeting and not encounter AA steps, for that is where AlAnon obtained theirs almost in their entirety in 1951. In fact, AlAnon's Fifth Tradition states:
"Each Al-Anon Family Group has but one purpose: to help families of Alcoholics. We do this by practicing the Twelve Steps of AA ourselves, by understanding our alcoholic relatives, and by giving comfort to families of alcoholics."
The "perspective" of AA, though originally intended for alcoholics, is the same for AlAnon:
* Belief that we are powerless over alcohol, people, places, things, situations
* Belief that a Higher Power can guide us spiritually to serenity and peace
* Belief in the need to change our attitudes and actions
* Belief in the need to share what we have learned with others still in need
* Three Legacies:
* Recovery through acceptance of the Steps
* Unity through acceptance of the Traditions
* Service through acceptance of the concepts
So in fact, the spiritual perspectives and solutions of AA are found in every official AlAnon meeting and all conference approved AlAnon literature.
That makes sense as members of both programs are just as sick, flawed, and helpless as the other, and the solution is the same for both: A spiritual way of living, reliance upon a Higher Power, and guidance from the 12 Steps.
Members of both programs resist giving advice or telling others what they should feel or do, recognizing that each is shaped by their own Higher Power, needs, and personal life experience that guides their spiritual journey of recovery.
For some in AlAnon, that journey involves their own personal struggle with alcohol that shapes how they perceive and deal with alcohol use by others. While it is certainly true that a member of Alanon should not make that experience the focal point at AlAnon meetings, or quote extensively literature from another group, a group member does not have the right to tell another how they should share their own experience or story.
AlAnon and AA operate as separate but cooperative and very related fellowships. One simply cannot avoid the Steps, concepts, or perspectives of AA when attending AlAnon due to the extensive overlap in programs.
With such a rich history of successful spiritual recovery in AA, why would someone want to? I am truly grateful that both programs exist for all those who care to benefit from such rich, spiritual blessings.
Happy New Year and blessings to all!
(((Paul))) - so, so, so great to see you! You've been missed and thank you for your share. I too am very grateful for both sides of the program as one would not exist without the other. Happy New Year to you too!
Bo - I have never seen that meeting opening you posted. It's vastly different from CAL as well as the recent Al-Anon/AlaTeen Service Manual. As a double winner, I would feel very unwelcome simply because as Paul says, my experience is my own and it does include recovery from two sides of the program. If I put on my Al-Anon hat only, the opening is concerning to me as it feels controlling/manipulative - a large area of defect for most who seek help. We use CAL suggested opening, and never suggest the A is the problem or the reason we seek help - instead we focus on what inside of us (our insanity) makes us think we can control, change, manage, fix) another person and the disease concept.
We have a much gentler way of suggesting we stay focused on self and Al-Anon, and how WE are doing no matter what the A is doing. We also just stay focused on CAL and don't restrict mention of AA. The meeting leader can certainly redirect any member who is sidetracked by any outside influence (another program, religion, professional services, etc.) Perhaps this is because most of our Al-Anon meetings are held in shared halls/rooms with AA and the slogans, literature, pamphlets, etc. are available for all programs here (together). A quick google search revealed more than 10M results for AA Double Winners, many of them meetings. Al-Anon will not register double-winner meetings, but AA will.
All I know is I learn, grow and heal from all recovery efforts. I attend meetings where I feel safe and willingly follow the rules/guidelines established by the group conscience. In my area, while we respect the separation of the two programs, we are also willing to adapt to the needs of those seeking help, and for that, I am grateful! I also know in my area, if a member of Al-Anon showed up intentionally or by accident to an AA meeting, open or closed, they would be supported, welcomed and embraced since both programs have very similar Responsibility Statements, which does not suggest we only help those in our flock. As always, take what you like and leave the rest! I am not certain what the outcome would be in the reverse case scenario, but would hope someone, anyone would be willing (I would)...
For anyone who's not seen or read the Al-Anon Service Manual, there is tons of great information in it. Here's a link... https://al-anon.org/pdf/P2427_online.pdf
"A word to AA members who are new to Al-Anon. If you have a family problem, you have come to the right place and we welcome you. We speak from our experiences which are derived living with an alcoholic rather than being one. It is a different experience which calls for a different interpretation of the 12 steps. We ask that you start out by listening to the suggested solutions based upon the Al-Anon approach to the family illness. We ask that members of other anonymous fellowships remain anonymous and focus on the Al-Anon program. If you are not a newcomer, it is important to remember that when we share, we keep the newcomer in mind, so that we may give them the hope and courage they need to keep coming back. The group has found over time that what is most helpful is to simply share our experiences, strengths, and hope with each other. What we do not find helpful is engaging in crosstalk or advice-giving. Crosstalk is when one person shares and another comments directly to that person. If there is no advice-giving or direct comment to someone when they share, then everyone can feel safe to open up and share what is in their minds and hearts."
David, here's the language from one of the meetings I attend. Others have similar language, more specific. Doesn't matter.
For me, it's really about where the steps come from and the context in which they exist. The content -- semantics, words -- are the same. It's the context that's different. At least for me.
That said, I absolutely disagree that there's no "difference" between the steps, what they mean, their perspective, contexts, etc. -- vis a vis alanon and AA -- simply because the words are the same (except one word).
That's great Debb! Nice snapshot/summary!
So I pictured the steps like the numbers on the clock- and I often glance at the clock, around this idea. In this province we have "rail trails" which people ride in cycles. Being old railway country nothing is too steep- up or down.
Since I have done the steps a number of times- I just want to go 'around the clock'. Step one and step 12 sit side by side.
I mostly, do steps 10,11, 12, now, anyways...