I am in the same boat, she is able to lie like it is nothing, everything she says is a lie, everything she does is pure manipulation and covering her tracks.

((Lyne))) you are doing well Keep taking care of yourself and using your tools prayers on the way

(((Lyne))) - love your faith in your recovery and your trust in HP. For me, I see some progress and begin to project an outcome with my own expectations. I am much able to deal with life on life's terms if/when I can embrace Steps 1-2-3 each morning within my morning prayers and then trust the God of my understanding. The insanity of the disease will 'catch me' if I rest on my laurels - that much I know. I too am sending you prayers and positive energy.

On one hand, I always found it shocking why my AW couldn't understand why I didn't believe her, or trust her (trust her words). I was surprised that she said I should believe her and trust her. That said, while I was in a place of acceptance, for me, it was not about turning that over to God. I accepted and was in a place of acceptance because of all the work I did, all the growth I had. God gave me the ability -- BUT -- I had to do the work. Yes, pray for the knowledge of his will for me...and FOR THE POWER TO CARRY THAT OUT...Me, I have to have the power to carry it out. He doesn't do it for me.

That said, I view it as simple. If one can live with that life, that's great. If lying is "acceptable" and you can create a space, a place, a mindset where you are OK with it, and can be happy and healthy, that's great! If you can find peace and happiness that's great! Alanon has tools and resources. And, we many of us know...it works if you work it.

In addition, if you can't...if the lying, lack of trust, whatever is going on, is "unacceptable" to you, and/or you cannot create a space, a place, a mindset where you are OK, and you cannot be happy and healthy, that's OK too. Alanon has tools and resources. And, we many of us know...it works if you work it.

Alanon is not a program that teaches you how to get divorced. Nor is it a program that teaches you how to stay married. It doesn't show you how to leave or stay. It is not designed to get couples to "stay together" or "break up".

Alanon is there so that YOU...can get better, get healthy, and find peace, serenity, health, and happiness. Period.

I like your clarity. And you're working your program. I look forward to hearing how diving back in with both feet helps your life.

I feel like every single day God is asking me to turn things over. From the big important ones like relationships down to cleaning my home. God - this ALL belongs to you. I give it to you freely and trust you. Just show me what I need to do.

Thanks to all of you for your support, encouragement, and ESH. Last night in my F2F, a woman said that she loves her alcoholic, but hates the disease. I have heard this member say this phrase several times over the years, but last night it clicked into my brain. I heard it. And we had been talking about listen and learn in our meeting at one point.

With Step 3, with what my friend said in the meeting, with caring from so many places, I feel better and stronger. I have my alanon mojo again. HP Will guide me through this along with all of you. And I dont have to make any decision today. Bo said a lot in that alanon is not telling me to go or stay. Its between me and HP. Thanks so much everyone, Lyne

((((Lyne))))
Glad to read you are "back on track."

The lies and manipulation is what did my marriage in... not the lack of love. I had to, and I continue to accept that I could not live with a partner that constantly lied (even about the dumbest stuff!) and gas-lighted/manipulated me. To this day my Ex does not understand that behavior in himself... he thinks he is "recovered," and now angry texts me that "I threw everything away."

Happy to hear you have your Mojo back!

There's another element to the lying as well -- for me -- there is always the "my side of the street" factor.

People say they are staying on their side of the street. But, are they?

Acceptance for me, had two starting points at the beginning. So, at the beginning, I didn't have it, and had to begin a serious, laser precision focused doing the work on Step One. Acceptance. That entailed, first, a long process which ended with me realizing that acceptance didn't mean I had to accept everything going on around me and doing nothing about it. Personally, in my experience, I see far too many people collapse acceptance and believing they aren't supposed to, don't have to, and shouldn't, do anything about what's going on around them. Acceptance, to me, doesn't mean doing nothing. Acceptance doesn't mean being a victim. It doesn't mean I have to take getting punched in the face everyday. So, acceptance had to be put in the proper, healthy perspective and context.

Many times, in face to face meetings, but more here, in this forum, I see the "collapse" between AA and alanon, and so much conversation is focused on why the alcoholic says this, does that, behaves this way or that way, and why they are lying, what it means, scientific, medical, psychological, etc. For me, how I work my program -- that's not me staying on my side of the street. That's not me keeping my side of the street clean. I say -- at best -- it's me being on my side of the street, sweeping my side of the street, BUT spending more time looking at the alcoholic on their side of the street. It's me stopping sweeping my side, standing there, holding the broom, and looking, observing, concentrating, etc., on the alcoholic on the other side of the street. Then I start pointing out what they are doing, following what they are doing, etc. That's not ME focusing on ME. That's me focusing on the alcoholic. That's not my recovery, that's not me being healthy.

So, the alcoholic lies. It's not that I don't care why. It's not that it isn't important why. It is. It just is. Dogs bark, infants cry, alcoholics lie. I don't have to accept it. I don't have to do nothing. I have acceptance that it happens, and I don't try to fix it, prove that I caught the person in a lie, I don't try and be right or win. I do what I do. I detach, I don't enable. I set boundaries. I don't contribute. I don't allow myself to be taken advantage of, and I don't accept unacceptable behavior! All of that is why I am happy and healthy.

((((((((((((((Lyne)))))))))))))))) GOOD JOB!!! Taking care of/ focusing on the only one you can----You!!!!! and yes, you CAN have a good life, no matter what the A says or does!!!!