I had to share a story from my oldest who is struggling to make the jump from young adult to an actual grown adult.
He's moved home and things are moving forward .. in a very stutter step way. One thing this child has really driven home in terms of lessons is letting the situation play out and letting go of control of the outcome. It is HARD to do this for me. I am seriously guilty of trying to control the outcome and not let go. You know it would be so much easier for kid if he would just ask me and follow my advice because after all I was such a reasonable young adult .. so not .. lol.
Kiddo got his first check from his job today and saw it last night .. was in a minor uproar over it all. Do you know they only paid him for a week (it's weekly payroll) .. do you know they take things like taxes out?!? For some reason my kid has not followed up on how much money he's making an hour (which I can guess because of the amount of pay) as well as where to get a printed or screen shot of his paystub .. this is lack of life experience. First job that is not on campus and not through the college .. THIS is what I would call his first real world job.
The thing that makes me seriously LOL .. is the outrage of how hard he worked for so little pay .. AND life isn't fair. Ummm .. nope .. this is WHY I am pushing education as well as do something you love because you still have to make money at least enjoy doing it! He's been going on and on about retail jobs .. these are great college jobs and anyone who does it long term I bow to you because people in the world are not always kind or nice .. while I deal with some of that behind my desk it is not always in my face. I have heard nothing except how "I want to work retail" to which my response was ok .. good luck honey .. while I think oh hell good luck with that .. LOL ... this is my kid with terrible anxiety who puts himself into anxiety laced situations and you know I am learning not to say anything .. life is truly a far better teacher than I am as I'm over 40 and stupid in my kids world. What could I possibly know as a person who has lived a life .. many lives and survived in spite of myself at times.
What I'm thinking is I made that living in IL trying to raise two children with no help from dad and he wants to whine about having no bills, being a full time student and the horrors of it all. I hope this opens his eyes a little further to the sacrifices I had to make in order for us to eat and have a roof over our heads. That child SLAYS me with some of the statements he makes. As well as the self entitlement that I have been dealing with since he moved home. I also hope this motivates him to pick the phone up and say hey dad .. do you mind helping me with school? LOL. I can hope however I doubt the last will happen.
Welcome to taking another step to being an adult .. no you can't pay for that tattoo and pay back the money for school that was borrowed from my very generous boyfriend. It will mean having to budget .. it will mean having to put off what you want vs what are responsibilities .. it will mean the shock of nope working retail will not pay the bills the way you think .. this is a perfect job for the real world in terms of he can earn and save money .. it is not going to mean doing whatever he wants. Which actually is good because he needed that shocking wake up call and I hope that is what this is for him that no he can't afford everything and anything. No 500$ tattoo today .. I'm not sorry .. LOL .. and it also drives home my point about the fact he can't afford a car at the moment. Which is a good thing because we are willing to provide the car not the gas however I'm paying you better believe it's a car to and from school and to and from work .. that's it.
So now I sit and breathe and let go to allow whatever will be .. be.
Hugs S :)
DavidG said
Sep 6, 2018
Good topic, Serene...
...not sure if this is crss-talk here, so please tell me is you think so.
We have three kids- all with family of their own now. Our son lives far away and we are visiting him later this month. We had a death in our town this week- a much loved teacher. I asked my So if Da. knew about this- as this woman had taught our daughter.
My relationship with youngest Da has bin fraught- and she challenges me about the quality of her childhood!
So, any way I text her- and she is grateful for the news... [much better to know that to not!] I give her the time of the funeral and our plans and arrangements. I leave it with her.
This came up in group last week- making amends... Step 10 can be ongoing- doing relevant stuff as the opportunity affords it.
Hmmm I don't think this masks your share, Serene. ??? The link for me- are the rites of passage we all go through, especially strong with family...
...yours is about 'first job'. What a great way to embrace and celebrate change!
Mine is different- a different circumstance- but none the less significant... ...
thanks... ...
PosiesandPuppies said
Sep 6, 2018
Oh Lord, Serenity! I was grinning from ear to ear when I read your post!
Even with the best upbringing, our kids can end up with some sense of entitlement! I am going through some very similar circumstances with my own newly minted young adult son!
This past weekend we had a HUGE blow-up with each other. It was all over his attitudes surrounding looking for a job. It's always "I'll do it tomorrow." I then told him I had been holding off, but it is now September, he's comfortable in his college classes, so I expect him to pay for his ambulance bill (I am still paying it off from 2 years ago!), and he needs the job to begin paying $50.00 a month in "rent." His eyes got HUGE and the attitude came out full force! During this time, I was calm, speaking as if I was talking to an another adult. Well, after his diatribe of woe is me, came the blame shifting and gas-lighting... which is the biggest trigger for me! He sounded just like his father!! I yelled at the top of my lungs that he just could not disrespect me in my own house and I would NOT stand for that anymore! I then told him he can either get up off his butt and search IN EARNEST for a job or leave the house! "But where would I go? I would be homeless," he lamented. "Well, I guess you could couch-surf your friends." I said unkindly.
Yup. I went there. I left the house. What an ugly person I was!!! I walked for awhile to get my head together. I then came back and apologized for my behavior, but told him the disrespect was uncalled for and would not be tolerated. I did not say anything about the attitude of entitlement. I told him I needed to understand where my reactions came from, and it might take a couple days to figure it out. It did. I realized I was pushing b/c we lost our cash benefits due to him turning 18. That was a big chunk of money I depended on. So I was/am fearful. I also have resentment that he can sit for hours all day doing almost nothing and I work 2 jobs, and still struggle. So that was the "motivation" for not staying within my hoop. I was trying to force things onto him, and expecting results. And while I am being fearlessly honest, he does help around the house whenever I ask... and I have begun to ask daily - I mean, why not? He's not doing anything else! However, my blow-up, my ugliness was the direct result of C-PTSD from living with my spouse and addiction. I just could not believe I was hearing this from my child! So I went back to him and told him of my findings... about how I was trying to force something due to fear, and again I apologized for not staying in my lane. The second part however, I apologized with the caveat that I will not tolerate any disrespectful behavior, and if he didn't like it, he could find other living arrangements.
Anyway, this long-winded story was really to say, "You are doing an amazing job staying in your hoop, controlling only what you can (your reactions)!! I applaud you!!! You are handling all this WAY better than I am!! This transition from parenting a kid to a new adult is hard! LOL! I see my friends with their kids away at University, and I want to tell them that they really have it easy. LOL! So sending you huge hugs (((((((Serenity)))))))) and support... I am right there with ya, sista!!!
Iamhere said
Sep 6, 2018
I've said it before and I'll say it again - it's too bad there is not an instruction manual for raising children. It's a difficult, thankless job with an unknown reward. Life lessons are so tough for them to accept yet you both are doing great! We had many of these difficult discussions. One thing I did do was make them pay for their phones starting @ 16. I also suggested they would have to pay for their own gas and insurance, which of course led them to find part time jobs @ 16. I can't imagine how fast the disease would have progressed without this time committed to work....I am grateful I chose this path.
At 18, they both left. They both had to return multiple times and then they paid rent. Way less than market value, but rent was required. I am a firm believer that if you think you are an adult, then welcome to what it's about. Both have learned to survive financially in spite of themselves and are now very grateful for the lessons. It was not easy at all and there was a bunch of entitlement...
So - keep setting boundaries that work for you and know they will not 'melt' when forced to adult. I do feel perfectly comfortable that if I were to die tomorrow, my boys would survive financially, emotionally, etc. That was my most important goal - to have them independent as I've seen what happens when they aren't taught this. Keep moving forward ladies! You got this!
SerenityRUS said
Sep 6, 2018
PNP, ..
OMG .. we did that dance the first semester of school and he was a nightmare .. I mean he was at college however still. He never got a job .. actually he worked 1 day and I think lied about it because he was never paid for it. Then tanked that semester .. and that was a lot of different things .. I know one thing I did totally wrong in giving my kid an out was I wish I had listened to my gut instincts then something wasn't right some of it was the whole trans issue, some of it was experimentation, a big part was not being ready to actually go out in the world. It is honestly no wonder I found myself in my closet (which that was hysterical because of the irony crying with a bottle of water although damn it I wish it had been wine, because kid didn't turn in his books and overdrew my checking account for Christmas .. happy holidays to me.) That was when I knew innately .. no no no no .. I can't do this with him for the next however many years .. something has to change NOW .. if not him then let it begin with me. The second semester I heard all about how he couldn't find a job because he had to focus on school .. there were some additional truths that came out at that point. There were some hard things I had to do .. first was kill my debit card so my card was no longer charged as he really didn't care that happened .. he did however when that was going on the kid wasn't present. Basically was handed the you get counseling or don't come home talk because he was totally out of control at that point and spinning so hard for various reasons. That has been to date one of the toughest things as a parent I have had to do. I was clear keep your crazy on your side of the street at this point I can't have it in the house. He stepped up. I did not give him money for the second semester. He had to figure it out. I'm not clear how he did and I honestly don't want to know .. lol. Come to find out he did a poor job of it because it all came out this last month. He has slowly stepped up to the plate thank the lord .. it has not been easy and it has not been simple because nothing with this kid has been simple the only thing simple was my delivery and even then we had joked he walked out eyes wide open. After that it has been one huge learning curve and not all bad .. it has forced me to grow as an individual in ways I did not on my own. Still .. hellooo .. a little break please?? The whole I can't get a job yet .. umm noooo .. you can and you will or you will find yourself living somewhere else and I was super clear about that. I did text and asked if he figured his check out and mentioned I don't think he worked the hours he thinks he worked in terms of the first week AND at 40 hours he got paid what he should have .. now there is a good possibility that he's making more than he thinks he just didn't work the hours he thinks he did. I'm wondering if he actually worked 30 at higher pay. That is a true possibility however unless he talks to his manager he won't know .. he did decide to wait until tomorrow since he's scheduled to work and that's totally fine. I did not push the issue because there is no point. At least in this conversation he was far more level headed than last night .. I can now tell when I am talking to a wall and he knows it all vs when he's open to saying oh I didn't think about that part of things .. he was convienced he worked 40 hours last week and I said no honey you did not .. and he argued and I realized that this was not the time to have the conversation .. LOL .. I said ok .. well .. your manager will have the answers and I'm going to bed. This was after my first shock of my boyfriend shaved the beard he swore he would never shave .. LMAO .. I didn't notice for 2 hours to say that I was preoccupied is an understatement. I went to do my nightly ritual when he's home and I went to tug his beard and it was GONE! LOL .. I don't like that he's messing up my routine!!! I am so slowly learning to just walk away .. walk away .. walk away .. you can't talk sense when someone is in a nonsense frame of mind. The entitlement .. I swear I have threatened this is why some species eat their young to avoid dealing with the in between stages of life with off spring. The money issue is soooo hard though .. and that's where I think my oldest has said ohhh .. this is what it's like and I don't have to pay rent and something I have been discussing is bills .. meaning .. this is what it costs monthly to live here .. this is what I spend on groceries .. this is what it costs to operate a car .. this is what the cell phone bill costs .. and those are the moments the light comes on and it's oohhhh .. ok. Especially when he leans on me and says .. mom I need XYZ to pay for whatever .. if it's books I will do it .. we have had a come to Jesus discussion about this is what I will pay for you to attend school this semester .. this semester it was 200 .. next semester based upon what I can do it might be more we will see .. if he won't talk to his dad I don't feel responsible the same way I did to come up with money I don't have .. I don't make 6 figures and lie about it. So it is what it is at this point.
IAM, .. I wish I had done more to prepare my oldest for real world stuff and I did not because I felt guilty for what they were lacking .. a real childhood .. and I think what I created was a real escape from reality and some of this has been shocking for them both .. my youngest is taking it all in with the oldest. My concern with him is he will not ask for help regardless of how bad he needs it .. for example moving .. and I don't want him to do so at his detriment after all the whole I can do it myself is not the best way to get through life. It took me years to realize that I could count on others .. so I think about that and just encourage him to ask when I can see he's struggling. At this point the band aide is coming off and there is some stinging at least there is that dim light that is coming on so that gives me hope that it will fully come on with time. I can't tell you how many times I have been young and dumb .. hell .. I have moments I'm old and dumb and then remember oh lord .. been there done that already not interested in doing it again.
At least what I see is progress and that's all I ask for .. lol .. and no if children hold their breathe because they don't get what they want .. they will not die .. they might pass out .. however they will not die .. lol.
Hugs S :)
a4l said
Sep 6, 2018
LOL at the title alone. I think that would make a great coffee mug Serenity For myself that is, because it just sums up a lot of this adulting gig. I loved this post, the teenaged realisation and the patient mother duck....still nudging the wee one out of the nest, and the wee one had no idea the nest was not the world.
Well done to you all.
bud said
Sep 6, 2018
Hahaha, SerenityRUS! Classic
Bo said
Sep 6, 2018
Adulting, as you call it...and Parenting...are hard. My perspective, feelings, etc., are very different.
They are supposed to be hard. It's a good thing that it's hard. There's tremendous benefit to it being hard. I am thankful that it's hard. It being hard, made me be my best. It made me do my best. It made me work as hard -- and as smart -- as I possibly could.
In addition, we sometimes hear it's a thankless job. That has become a cliche -- a misguided one IMO. We hear it's a job that is rarely appreciated, often criticized, and more of the like. Sometimes much more. I don't buy into any of that. Not at all. I view it and feel it is exactly the opposite. Those feelings allowed me to absolutely and completely enjoy certain moments -- certain defining moments -- that I will always remember and never ever forget.
My daughter's birthday is tomorrow. She will be 23. All I have to do is look at her, who she is, at her core, how she lives her life...and I know it is not a thankless job. Exactly the opposite. You see, for me, while she is my daughter, I am not her biological father. I was not married to her mother. I wasn't with her mother for the majority of her 23 years of life. However, me being her dad (and I am not her father, but I am her dad) -- that was a job I solicited. It was a job that I begged for. It was a job that made me the man I am today. For that I could never be thankless...I am grateful. And I literally thank God every single day.
Thank you SerenityRUS for posting what you did. It made me feel so very good reading what you wrote -- so thank you, very much.
-- Edited by Bo on Thursday 6th of September 2018 11:43:19 PM
-- Edited by Bo on Thursday 6th of September 2018 11:45:10 PM
-- Edited by Bo on Friday 7th of September 2018 10:12:37 AM
-- Edited by Bo on Friday 7th of September 2018 10:12:59 AM
-- Edited by Bo on Friday 7th of September 2018 10:13:46 AM
SerenityRUS said
Sep 7, 2018
I wanted to peek in real quick and give a funny story update .. ok .. funnier .. LOL.
I am so grateful for people like you Bo especially men .. because so many men do not step up which is so sad .. we are raising fatherless children. I want to be very clear in that statement that I take nothing from single mom's doing it on their own because I am one. I can't teach from a man's point of view .. because I was raised without a father or a father figure in my life .. I can do a hell of a job from a woman's point of view because agree or disagree with my mom I come from a long line of strong stubborn women. Probably dysfunctional .. however I take note that my dysfunction will be less than my mother's and I hope my children's will be less than mine. It's about progress not perfection and thank GOD for that small fact it's a win for me.
My kids are blessed to have a wonderful father figure in their lives and I hope he continues to choose to take us all on .. LOL .. because myself alone .. is a handful ... he's gotten another heaping plate with the kiddos .. who are truly wonderful .. you know as much as I will be the first to say there are times I am angry with God and I am ok with that because He gets me .. there are times I resent my kids and I am angry with them, and I raised them .. LOL .. I guess again back to you better change me God because I need a meeting of the minds even if mine gets blown. I am ok with that too because at the end of the day I am crazy about them because they really are great kids who I am very proud of. Even if I swear under my breath from time to time .. do I get a do over because I screwed up.
So my oldest and the whole I'm getting a tattoo, my paycheck is wrong, and why can't you do more .. there are moments I swear I work for their safety especially that child's .. lol. Had a light bulb come on .. he spent the day with my boyfriend and they had a great time together .. lol. My poor BF found out why I like to go to the store alone and why it takes me 2 hours to pick up 3 things .. ohhh look at this .. and ohhh .. what do you think of that .. and OHHHH .. can I get this today .. I swear .. my kids are stuck at the age of 5 when we go to the store .. lol .. I actually find it amusing .. although not when I'm in a hurry .. LOL. BF said he can't do that because he was there for something very specific and wound up spending money he had not planned on spending. I'm like I KNOW!!?? Well, the subject of making a living wage came up and the first year of my separation I did not break double digits as far as yearly income and my X decided not to pay me for about 2 1/2 months maybe a little longer. This is AFTER the court order .. at that point his attorney was irritated with him. LOL .. speaks volumes and you should read some of the letters I used to get .. LOL. Somehow Christmas always came together .. one year was with the help of a dear friend .. another time my ex had to pay me bulk amounts of money .. lol .. actually that wound up happening more than once .. I was able to always pull together Christmas. After the whole check debacle .. my oldest has come to the realization that I was not able to make it on what I had been making. DUH .. can't pay rent AND do everything I was doing AND make it. It was a very humbling sometimes even humiliating time. I think every single parent goes through something similar in the very beginning when you are coming from a position of dependency on someone else who basically is not trust worthy. in talking to each other .. my oldest said .. I just don't know how mom always managed to pull together Christmas for us .. she never missed .. I did when we moved to Texas however they had something under the tree always.
The fact my kid is now having the thought .. of wow .. I'm not making more than mom was when she was working and starting out again (we happened to have that conversation when he started his current job) and she always made sure we had what we needed or even wanted .. not all of the time however as much as I could .. was mind blowing to him. I'm grateful that this has started to be the thought process that the kid is seeing now that adulting is hard .. and adulting means not always getting things your way. I was so glad that he is coming to this idea though that I had a very limited budget and things were not easy and money is not endless in our budget. So I'm hoping that means he will start making some different choices .. better choices when it comes to wants vs needs kind of choices .. although the sully onesie was not what I had in mind .. that is a different story .. lol .. O.o
Hugs S :)
PosiesandPuppies said
Sep 7, 2018
Thank you for posting this, Serenity!!
It gave a positive spin or "outlook" on this thread! To be honest, I knew he would come around to that realization eventually... I think he was faster than most!!
I didn't grow up in an alcoholic/addicted household, but I DO remember having that light bulb moment of what or how much my parents had to sacrifice or "lean-in" to give myself and my brother not only what we needed, but most of what we wanted too! Every year after that on Mother's or Father's Day I pay homage to their sacrifices.
Jokingly, I have told my friend, "Man! I can't wait for that light bulb to shine above my kid's head!!" LOL!
Your eldest son is having his eyes opened to just how strong, brave, thrifty, smart and wonderful you are!! He is now seeing you...really seeing YOU, in a new light!
Huzzah!!!
Have a wonderful weekend, Serenity!
Iamhere said
Sep 7, 2018
(((Serenity))) - love, love, love the follow up!!! It's so marvelous, as a parent, to see the light bulbs come on!!! Especially when we feel that we've been coaching, parenting, talking, etc. and they give that rolling eye-ball look, the 'whatever' verbal and/or act as if they are bored silly while we are talking about real life, maturity, finances, etc.
The greatest part of life/parenting is we are bound by blood and unconditional love forever. We never stop being a mom/dad even when they reach adult age. One of the great gifts I've gotten from both of mine is a thank-you for teaching them 'how to be a man'. While I am still married, my AH truly vacated for the formative years so I did the best I could without throwing their father under the bus and/or shaming. I just smiled as I am not entirely sure what they are talking about and don't need an explanation!
BLUF - Bottom Line Up Front - we do the best we can with what we have. It does feel thankless at times as we rarely hear those simple words - Thank You. It feels like a job as it's full-time, with no scheduled breaks or vacation. Yet, there will come a time when it seems to come together for them - perhaps very different than we wanted/projected but it does seem to come together. My oldest wrote a super special note in his Mother's Day card - a card that I've waited 13 years for and the note was bonus, bonus, bonus.
I love watching my oldest with his boys. He's present, he's involved/engaged and very patient. All of these were lessons he learned by omission and, like I/we did, wanted to be a better father than his own. That's awesome and far from unique - I vividly recall thinking I would never 'be' as my parents were....each generation does hear us, watch us, and then takes the lesson, adds their own flavor and hopes to do better/be better.
You are awesome, you are doing awesome and he's maturing before your eyes! This doesn't mean perfect, which is overrated, it just means progress - the best gift of all! (((Hugs)))
Bo said
Sep 8, 2018
SRUS, thank you for the kind words...
You see, my perspective, my thinking, my way of being, is very different. While the stigma might be out there vis a vis a single-mother, I never agreed with it. For a man, if dating or being involved with single-mother is not something that is in-line with what you are looking for, so be it. Then don't do it. However, for fathers, or men who "don't step up" -- you see, all that does, 100%, exclusively, solely...tell you about the man. It tells you exactly what kind of man he is, who he is, at his core. It tells you about his integrity. It tells you about his morals, values, and ethics.
We can pleasantly debate about children being raised by a single-mother, no father, father figure, etc. I get it. While there will be certain things that "won't be part of the equation" -- there are other things that will be part of it that wouldn't be if otherwise. It's like when you lose your vision -- your hearing becomes vastly improved. Not to oversimplify of course. However, SRUS, I hear you, I agree, and I completely understand.
For me, I look at a single-mother...and I say...there's a hero.
I had to share a story from my oldest who is struggling to make the jump from young adult to an actual grown adult.
He's moved home and things are moving forward .. in a very stutter step way. One thing this child has really driven home in terms of lessons is letting the situation play out and letting go of control of the outcome. It is HARD to do this for me. I am seriously guilty of trying to control the outcome and not let go. You know it would be so much easier for kid if he would just ask me and follow my advice because after all I was such a reasonable young adult .. so not .. lol.
Kiddo got his first check from his job today and saw it last night .. was in a minor uproar over it all. Do you know they only paid him for a week (it's weekly payroll) .. do you know they take things like taxes out?!? For some reason my kid has not followed up on how much money he's making an hour (which I can guess because of the amount of pay) as well as where to get a printed or screen shot of his paystub .. this is lack of life experience. First job that is not on campus and not through the college .. THIS is what I would call his first real world job.
The thing that makes me seriously LOL .. is the outrage of how hard he worked for so little pay .. AND life isn't fair. Ummm .. nope .. this is WHY I am pushing education as well as do something you love because you still have to make money at least enjoy doing it! He's been going on and on about retail jobs .. these are great college jobs and anyone who does it long term I bow to you because people in the world are not always kind or nice .. while I deal with some of that behind my desk it is not always in my face. I have heard nothing except how "I want to work retail" to which my response was ok .. good luck honey .. while I think oh hell good luck with that .. LOL ... this is my kid with terrible anxiety who puts himself into anxiety laced situations and you know I am learning not to say anything .. life is truly a far better teacher than I am as I'm over 40 and stupid in my kids world. What could I possibly know as a person who has lived a life .. many lives and survived in spite of myself at times.
What I'm thinking is I made that living in IL trying to raise two children with no help from dad and he wants to whine about having no bills, being a full time student and the horrors of it all. I hope this opens his eyes a little further to the sacrifices I had to make in order for us to eat and have a roof over our heads. That child SLAYS me with some of the statements he makes. As well as the self entitlement that I have been dealing with since he moved home. I also hope this motivates him to pick the phone up and say hey dad .. do you mind helping me with school? LOL. I can hope however I doubt the last will happen.
Welcome to taking another step to being an adult .. no you can't pay for that tattoo and pay back the money for school that was borrowed from my very generous boyfriend. It will mean having to budget .. it will mean having to put off what you want vs what are responsibilities .. it will mean the shock of nope working retail will not pay the bills the way you think .. this is a perfect job for the real world in terms of he can earn and save money .. it is not going to mean doing whatever he wants. Which actually is good because he needed that shocking wake up call and I hope that is what this is for him that no he can't afford everything and anything. No 500$ tattoo today .. I'm not sorry .. LOL .. and it also drives home my point about the fact he can't afford a car at the moment. Which is a good thing because we are willing to provide the car not the gas however I'm paying you better believe it's a car to and from school and to and from work .. that's it.
So now I sit and breathe and let go to allow whatever will be .. be.
Hugs S :)
Good topic, Serene...
...not sure if this is crss-talk here, so please tell me is you think so.
We have three kids- all with family of their own now. Our son lives far away and we are visiting him later this month. We had a death in our town this week- a much loved teacher. I asked my So if Da. knew about this- as this woman had taught our daughter.
My relationship with youngest Da has bin fraught- and she challenges me about the quality of her childhood!
So, any way I text her- and she is grateful for the news... [much better to know that to not!] I give her the time of the funeral and our plans and arrangements. I leave it with her.
This came up in group last week- making amends... Step 10 can be ongoing- doing relevant stuff as the opportunity affords it.
Hmmm I don't think this masks your share, Serene. ??? The link for me- are the rites of passage we all go through, especially strong with family...
...yours is about 'first job'. What a great way to embrace and celebrate change!
Mine is different- a different circumstance- but none the less significant...
...
thanks...
...
Oh Lord, Serenity! I was grinning from ear to ear when I read your post!
Even with the best upbringing, our kids can end up with some sense of entitlement! I am going through some very similar circumstances with my own newly minted young adult son!
This past weekend we had a HUGE blow-up with each other. It was all over his attitudes surrounding looking for a job. It's always "I'll do it tomorrow." I then told him I had been holding off, but it is now September, he's comfortable in his college classes, so I expect him to pay for his ambulance bill (I am still paying it off from 2 years ago!), and he needs the job to begin paying $50.00 a month in "rent." His eyes got HUGE and the attitude came out full force! During this time, I was calm, speaking as if I was talking to an another adult. Well, after his diatribe of woe is me, came the blame shifting and gas-lighting... which is the biggest trigger for me! He sounded just like his father!! I yelled at the top of my lungs that he just could not disrespect me in my own house and I would NOT stand for that anymore! I then told him he can either get up off his butt and search IN EARNEST for a job or leave the house!
"But where would I go? I would be homeless," he lamented.
"Well, I guess you could couch-surf your friends." I said unkindly.
Yup. I went there.
I left the house. What an ugly person I was!!! I walked for awhile to get my head together. I then came back and apologized for my behavior, but told him the disrespect was uncalled for and would not be tolerated. I did not say anything about the attitude of entitlement. I told him I needed to understand where my reactions came from, and it might take a couple days to figure it out.
It did.
I realized I was pushing b/c we lost our cash benefits due to him turning 18. That was a big chunk of money I depended on. So I was/am fearful. I also have resentment that he can sit for hours all day doing almost nothing and I work 2 jobs, and still struggle. So that was the "motivation" for not staying within my hoop. I was trying to force things onto him, and expecting results. And while I am being fearlessly honest, he does help around the house whenever I ask... and I have begun to ask daily - I mean, why not? He's not doing anything else!
However, my blow-up, my ugliness was the direct result of C-PTSD from living with my spouse and addiction. I just could not believe I was hearing this from my child!
So I went back to him and told him of my findings... about how I was trying to force something due to fear, and again I apologized for not staying in my lane. The second part however, I apologized with the caveat that I will not tolerate any disrespectful behavior, and if he didn't like it, he could find other living arrangements.
Anyway, this long-winded story was really to say, "You are doing an amazing job staying in your hoop, controlling only what you can (your reactions)!! I applaud you!!!
You are handling all this WAY better than I am!! This transition from parenting a kid to a new adult is hard! LOL! I see my friends with their kids away at University, and I want to tell them that they really have it easy. LOL!
So sending you huge hugs (((((((Serenity)))))))) and support... I am right there with ya, sista!!!
At 18, they both left. They both had to return multiple times and then they paid rent. Way less than market value, but rent was required. I am a firm believer that if you think you are an adult, then welcome to what it's about. Both have learned to survive financially in spite of themselves and are now very grateful for the lessons. It was not easy at all and there was a bunch of entitlement...
So - keep setting boundaries that work for you and know they will not 'melt' when forced to adult. I do feel perfectly comfortable that if I were to die tomorrow, my boys would survive financially, emotionally, etc. That was my most important goal - to have them independent as I've seen what happens when they aren't taught this. Keep moving forward ladies! You got this!
OMG .. we did that dance the first semester of school and he was a nightmare .. I mean he was at college however still. He never got a job .. actually he worked 1 day and I think lied about it because he was never paid for it. Then tanked that semester .. and that was a lot of different things .. I know one thing I did totally wrong in giving my kid an out was I wish I had listened to my gut instincts then something wasn't right some of it was the whole trans issue, some of it was experimentation, a big part was not being ready to actually go out in the world. It is honestly no wonder I found myself in my closet (which that was hysterical because of the irony crying with a bottle of water although damn it I wish it had been wine, because kid didn't turn in his books and overdrew my checking account for Christmas .. happy holidays to me.) That was when I knew innately .. no no no no .. I can't do this with him for the next however many years .. something has to change NOW .. if not him then let it begin with me. The second semester I heard all about how he couldn't find a job because he had to focus on school .. there were some additional truths that came out at that point. There were some hard things I had to do .. first was kill my debit card so my card was no longer charged as he really didn't care that happened .. he did however when that was going on the kid wasn't present. Basically was handed the you get counseling or don't come home talk because he was totally out of control at that point and spinning so hard for various reasons. That has been to date one of the toughest things as a parent I have had to do. I was clear keep your crazy on your side of the street at this point I can't have it in the house. He stepped up. I did not give him money for the second semester. He had to figure it out. I'm not clear how he did and I honestly don't want to know .. lol. Come to find out he did a poor job of it because it all came out this last month. He has slowly stepped up to the plate thank the lord .. it has not been easy and it has not been simple because nothing with this kid has been simple the only thing simple was my delivery and even then we had joked he walked out eyes wide open. After that it has been one huge learning curve and not all bad .. it has forced me to grow as an individual in ways I did not on my own. Still .. hellooo .. a little break please?? The whole I can't get a job yet .. umm noooo .. you can and you will or you will find yourself living somewhere else and I was super clear about that. I did text and asked if he figured his check out and mentioned I don't think he worked the hours he thinks he worked in terms of the first week AND at 40 hours he got paid what he should have .. now there is a good possibility that he's making more than he thinks he just didn't work the hours he thinks he did. I'm wondering if he actually worked 30 at higher pay. That is a true possibility however unless he talks to his manager he won't know .. he did decide to wait until tomorrow since he's scheduled to work and that's totally fine. I did not push the issue because there is no point. At least in this conversation he was far more level headed than last night .. I can now tell when I am talking to a wall and he knows it all vs when he's open to saying oh I didn't think about that part of things .. he was convienced he worked 40 hours last week and I said no honey you did not .. and he argued and I realized that this was not the time to have the conversation .. LOL .. I said ok .. well .. your manager will have the answers and I'm going to bed. This was after my first shock of my boyfriend shaved the beard he swore he would never shave .. LMAO .. I didn't notice for 2 hours to say that I was preoccupied is an understatement. I went to do my nightly ritual when he's home and I went to tug his beard and it was GONE! LOL .. I don't like that he's messing up my routine!!! I am so slowly learning to just walk away .. walk away .. walk away .. you can't talk sense when someone is in a nonsense frame of mind. The entitlement .. I swear I have threatened this is why some species eat their young to avoid dealing with the in between stages of life with off spring. The money issue is soooo hard though .. and that's where I think my oldest has said ohhh .. this is what it's like and I don't have to pay rent and something I have been discussing is bills .. meaning .. this is what it costs monthly to live here .. this is what I spend on groceries .. this is what it costs to operate a car .. this is what the cell phone bill costs .. and those are the moments the light comes on and it's oohhhh .. ok. Especially when he leans on me and says .. mom I need XYZ to pay for whatever .. if it's books I will do it .. we have had a come to Jesus discussion about this is what I will pay for you to attend school this semester .. this semester it was 200 .. next semester based upon what I can do it might be more we will see .. if he won't talk to his dad I don't feel responsible the same way I did to come up with money I don't have .. I don't make 6 figures and lie about it. So it is what it is at this point.
IAM, .. I wish I had done more to prepare my oldest for real world stuff and I did not because I felt guilty for what they were lacking .. a real childhood .. and I think what I created was a real escape from reality and some of this has been shocking for them both .. my youngest is taking it all in with the oldest. My concern with him is he will not ask for help regardless of how bad he needs it .. for example moving .. and I don't want him to do so at his detriment after all the whole I can do it myself is not the best way to get through life. It took me years to realize that I could count on others .. so I think about that and just encourage him to ask when I can see he's struggling. At this point the band aide is coming off and there is some stinging at least there is that dim light that is coming on so that gives me hope that it will fully come on with time. I can't tell you how many times I have been young and dumb .. hell .. I have moments I'm old and dumb and then remember oh lord .. been there done that already not interested in doing it again.
At least what I see is progress and that's all I ask for .. lol .. and no if children hold their breathe because they don't get what they want .. they will not die .. they might pass out .. however they will not die .. lol.
Hugs S :)
LOL at the title alone. I think that would make a great coffee mug Serenity
For myself that is, because it just sums up a lot of this adulting gig. I loved this post, the teenaged realisation and the patient mother duck....still nudging the wee one out of the nest, and the wee one had no idea the nest was not the world.
Well done to you all.
Adulting, as you call it...and Parenting...are hard. My perspective, feelings, etc., are very different.
They are supposed to be hard. It's a good thing that it's hard. There's tremendous benefit to it being hard. I am thankful that it's hard. It being hard, made me be my best. It made me do my best. It made me work as hard -- and as smart -- as I possibly could.
In addition, we sometimes hear it's a thankless job. That has become a cliche -- a misguided one IMO. We hear it's a job that is rarely appreciated, often criticized, and more of the like. Sometimes much more. I don't buy into any of that. Not at all. I view it and feel it is exactly the opposite. Those feelings allowed me to absolutely and completely enjoy certain moments -- certain defining moments -- that I will always remember and never ever forget.
My daughter's birthday is tomorrow. She will be 23. All I have to do is look at her, who she is, at her core, how she lives her life...and I know it is not a thankless job. Exactly the opposite. You see, for me, while she is my daughter, I am not her biological father. I was not married to her mother. I wasn't with her mother for the majority of her 23 years of life. However, me being her dad (and I am not her father, but I am her dad) -- that was a job I solicited. It was a job that I begged for. It was a job that made me the man I am today. For that I could never be thankless...I am grateful. And I literally thank God every single day.
Thank you SerenityRUS for posting what you did. It made me feel so very good reading what you wrote -- so thank you, very much.
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-- Edited by Bo on Thursday 6th of September 2018 11:45:10 PM
-- Edited by Bo on Friday 7th of September 2018 10:12:37 AM
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-- Edited by Bo on Friday 7th of September 2018 10:13:46 AM
I am so grateful for people like you Bo especially men .. because so many men do not step up which is so sad .. we are raising fatherless children. I want to be very clear in that statement that I take nothing from single mom's doing it on their own because I am one. I can't teach from a man's point of view .. because I was raised without a father or a father figure in my life .. I can do a hell of a job from a woman's point of view because agree or disagree with my mom I come from a long line of strong stubborn women. Probably dysfunctional .. however I take note that my dysfunction will be less than my mother's and I hope my children's will be less than mine. It's about progress not perfection and thank GOD for that small fact it's a win for me.
My kids are blessed to have a wonderful father figure in their lives and I hope he continues to choose to take us all on .. LOL .. because myself alone .. is a handful ... he's gotten another heaping plate with the kiddos .. who are truly wonderful .. you know as much as I will be the first to say there are times I am angry with God and I am ok with that because He gets me .. there are times I resent my kids and I am angry with them, and I raised them .. LOL .. I guess again back to you better change me God because I need a meeting of the minds even if mine gets blown. I am ok with that too because at the end of the day I am crazy about them because they really are great kids who I am very proud of. Even if I swear under my breath from time to time .. do I get a do over because I screwed up.
So my oldest and the whole I'm getting a tattoo, my paycheck is wrong, and why can't you do more .. there are moments I swear I work for their safety especially that child's .. lol. Had a light bulb come on .. he spent the day with my boyfriend and they had a great time together .. lol. My poor BF found out why I like to go to the store alone and why it takes me 2 hours to pick up 3 things .. ohhh look at this .. and ohhh .. what do you think of that .. and OHHHH .. can I get this today .. I swear .. my kids are stuck at the age of 5 when we go to the store .. lol .. I actually find it amusing .. although not when I'm in a hurry .. LOL. BF said he can't do that because he was there for something very specific and wound up spending money he had not planned on spending. I'm like I KNOW!!?? Well, the subject of making a living wage came up and the first year of my separation I did not break double digits as far as yearly income and my X decided not to pay me for about 2 1/2 months maybe a little longer. This is AFTER the court order .. at that point his attorney was irritated with him. LOL .. speaks volumes and you should read some of the letters I used to get .. LOL. Somehow Christmas always came together .. one year was with the help of a dear friend .. another time my ex had to pay me bulk amounts of money .. lol .. actually that wound up happening more than once .. I was able to always pull together Christmas. After the whole check debacle .. my oldest has come to the realization that I was not able to make it on what I had been making. DUH .. can't pay rent AND do everything I was doing AND make it. It was a very humbling sometimes even humiliating time. I think every single parent goes through something similar in the very beginning when you are coming from a position of dependency on someone else who basically is not trust worthy. in talking to each other .. my oldest said .. I just don't know how mom always managed to pull together Christmas for us .. she never missed .. I did when we moved to Texas however they had something under the tree always.
The fact my kid is now having the thought .. of wow .. I'm not making more than mom was when she was working and starting out again (we happened to have that conversation when he started his current job) and she always made sure we had what we needed or even wanted .. not all of the time however as much as I could .. was mind blowing to him. I'm grateful that this has started to be the thought process that the kid is seeing now that adulting is hard .. and adulting means not always getting things your way. I was so glad that he is coming to this idea though that I had a very limited budget and things were not easy and money is not endless in our budget. So I'm hoping that means he will start making some different choices .. better choices when it comes to wants vs needs kind of choices .. although the sully onesie was not what I had in mind .. that is a different story .. lol .. O.o
Hugs S :)
It gave a positive spin or "outlook" on this thread! To be honest, I knew he would come around to that realization eventually... I think he was faster than most!!
I didn't grow up in an alcoholic/addicted household, but I DO remember having that light bulb moment of what or how much my parents had to sacrifice or "lean-in" to give myself and my brother not only what we needed, but most of what we wanted too! Every year after that on Mother's or Father's Day I pay homage to their sacrifices.
Jokingly, I have told my friend, "Man! I can't wait for that light bulb to shine above my kid's head!!" LOL!
Your eldest son is having his eyes opened to just how strong, brave, thrifty, smart and wonderful you are!! He is now seeing you...really seeing YOU, in a new light!
Huzzah!!!
Have a wonderful weekend, Serenity!
The greatest part of life/parenting is we are bound by blood and unconditional love forever. We never stop being a mom/dad even when they reach adult age. One of the great gifts I've gotten from both of mine is a thank-you for teaching them 'how to be a man'. While I am still married, my AH truly vacated for the formative years so I did the best I could without throwing their father under the bus and/or shaming. I just smiled as I am not entirely sure what they are talking about and don't need an explanation!
BLUF - Bottom Line Up Front - we do the best we can with what we have. It does feel thankless at times as we rarely hear those simple words - Thank You. It feels like a job as it's full-time, with no scheduled breaks or vacation. Yet, there will come a time when it seems to come together for them - perhaps very different than we wanted/projected but it does seem to come together. My oldest wrote a super special note in his Mother's Day card - a card that I've waited 13 years for and the note was bonus, bonus, bonus.
I love watching my oldest with his boys. He's present, he's involved/engaged and very patient. All of these were lessons he learned by omission and, like I/we did, wanted to be a better father than his own. That's awesome and far from unique - I vividly recall thinking I would never 'be' as my parents were....each generation does hear us, watch us, and then takes the lesson, adds their own flavor and hopes to do better/be better.
You are awesome, you are doing awesome and he's maturing before your eyes! This doesn't mean perfect, which is overrated, it just means progress - the best gift of all! (((Hugs)))
You see, my perspective, my thinking, my way of being, is very different. While the stigma might be out there vis a vis a single-mother, I never agreed with it. For a man, if dating or being involved with single-mother is not something that is in-line with what you are looking for, so be it. Then don't do it. However, for fathers, or men who "don't step up" -- you see, all that does, 100%, exclusively, solely...tell you about the man. It tells you exactly what kind of man he is, who he is, at his core. It tells you about his integrity. It tells you about his morals, values, and ethics.
We can pleasantly debate about children being raised by a single-mother, no father, father figure, etc. I get it. While there will be certain things that "won't be part of the equation" -- there are other things that will be part of it that wouldn't be if otherwise. It's like when you lose your vision -- your hearing becomes vastly improved. Not to oversimplify of course. However, SRUS, I hear you, I agree, and I completely understand.
For me, I look at a single-mother...and I say...there's a hero.