Struggling with the guilt of needing time away - feedback requested - any POV
Bogie18 said
Jul 14, 2018
Hi all,
I'm been with my husband 9+ years now. When we first met, a self confident, ambitious, happy man. We married at 40 - both realizing we really had been waiting for each others. All those frogs? I found him (obviously not perfect, who is) but I've never been happier.
Over the years,though, his job changed and he was pushed into roles with toxic management. I am also a professional and had been a single mom raising my son alone until I met him and financially independent and secure. Basically income wise, we're equal.
Within 1 year of that corporate change, he started to change, depression, sad, gaining weight, not sleeping, no desire to do anything, dreading sundays (b/c it meant Monday), alcohol became his way to deal with it (never abusive, angry, but he withdrew). He lost his sparkle, withdrew. I supported however I could up to and including encouraging him to quit his job. We'd be okay. We'd MAKE it work. (we had the means to do so). I laid out the numbers. I helped us consolidate bills and set money aside. WE CAN DO THIS! He resisted for 3 years until finally one night in bed, at one of his lowest points, he rolled over to me and said "can I really quit my job?"
In my head I was screaming and dancing with joy. What I said to him wasn't that, but just supportive - "of course, babe. we ran the numbers we will be okay. I am here. We will be fine. I want you back". He left his job (and was surprised when 90% of his coworkers told him they were jealous and wish they could do same). Once he left he kept saying "why did it take me so long?" He told me "I just need 3 months". Having been in a similar situation before myself I told him to just go day by day. I knew in my heart more like 6-8 months to even start to be ready to work again.
He's been seeing a psychologist 1x a week since he left (we are blessed with insurance) but overall, he sleeps late and spent his days on the couch. I gave him space. 8-9 months in....I started to feel resentment. "when would this get better?" We saw his psychologist together to talk it out. Around this time I started realizing (he takes meds for depression and anxiety) that the drinking obviously counteracts that. NO energy, no desire to do anything, the funny, loving, secure man was a shell of who he was. Patience, I told myself.
We are now 16 months in. 3 months ago he hit a point - he realized the drinking was not helping and started going to AA. Slowly, over time, I'm seeing improvements. But still so much of him is still gone.
We've talked about this a few times b/c part of me feels if I left for awhile? Gave him space? He could focus on himself. NOT leave him. I work remote and have a home office and the last year of seeing him in the exact same space on the couch, or knowing he was sleeping in til 10, 11, noon....was starting to affect me, bring me down. I MISS my husband. I LOVE him. I'm doing everything I can, but I also realize...it's up to HIM. (hard pill for a 'fixer' like myself to swallow)
Over the last few months I've started looking at short term rentals here and there for myself. Every time I've brought it up as an option to give him space, let him heal, he shoots his down. His psychologist told him "that's not a good idea".
I work remote so can go anywhere. Just a short term time away. In my head my biggest fear is I am the one holding him back. (I can be very Type A). My biggest fear is if I do do this, he will realize he doesn't need me and leave me....having said that? I will be okay if that's the case. I want him happy. It would suck beyond measure and devastate me, but someone I love this much? I want him happy. But I believe him when he says it's not ABOUT me, it's about him.
As well, I find myself depressed, not wanting to be home. Business Trip? YES. In the past I HATED them, but now I look at them as a chance to just get away. I'm losing myself. Some folks have noticed as well. I'm not taking care of myself either.
During this time his psychologist has been supportive of my needs when I ask for a timeline, a goal, a baby step. We are now at the point where he agreed he would increase his AA meetings and apply for at least 3 jobs a week. He's been on with his AA and has a sponsor. There are brief moments where I see the old him shine through. But still rare. And the job stuff? barely trying.
He had an AA meeting Thursday night....and before he left I mentioned...it's been 4 weeks since your new agreement and I am SO happy you're doing meetings and I DO see a difference, but you're not following through with anything else, including getting out of the house and applying for jobs. I have told him over and over and over...I don't care WHAT you do. You don't HAVE to make that corporate $ you did. We will be FINE. But I need you to show me ACTION.
I hit my wall. while he was gone I looked again at part time rentals and found one. He came home from his AA meeting and I told him "I love you, but I have to do this. I have to leave for awhile. I'm holding you back. Im miserable. I want you back and I have no control and this is the only thing I can think of.
He disagrees. And a good convo last night he heard me. I DO fear I'm holding back but also admitted, I DO need time for myself.
I found a place. A small 1 bedroom 3 month, on the water - an oasis for myself for a few months. He came down with me to meet the landlord. I'm doing it.
I find myself excited now. Anytime I thought about leaving for a bit before it made me sick, but now I realize I'm turning into someone I don't want to be. And I also really believe, if he has time? by himself? It will help.
I have close friends, but I'm not talking with them about this. We've played this close to the vest. They realize (and agreed) leaving his job was the RIGHT choice. They realized he had a drinking problem and SUPPORT him and encourage him. But if we tell them they'll assume "you're breaking up" - when nothing is further from the truth.
I don't know what I'm asking. I have no one to talk to. Am I selfish? Should I tough it out? But what if he doesn't change. Leaving him is NOT an option. But I need time for me and I need to give him time for him.
Anyone go through this? I want to hear good, bad, ugly - pros and cons.
Thanks for listening
hotrod said
Jul 14, 2018
((Bogie)) you are not alone . Please search out alanon face to face meetings and attend. It is here you will find new constructive tools to live by and a supportive network of like minded folk who will not give advise but will offer new tools to live by so you can make an informed decision about your life The hot line number is in the white pages
Bogie18 said
Jul 14, 2018
Thank you.
I plan to go to one tomorrow. One day at a time đ
starcatcher2 said
Jul 14, 2018
Hi Bogie,
I think your decision takes an incredible amount of courage. Leaving and taking care of yourself, and your needs is not only unselfish, its admirable. You love your husband, and you want to stay in love with your husband. If it's meant to be, it will be. That's what I say. My Ex-who is now in recovery (for a year),and I have broken up because I didnt take care of my needs (it wasnt the only reason), and I slipped into major depression (for which I am now on anti-depressants). I can't go back and change it, I can only be hopeful for my future.
I really applaud you for knowing your limits, and standing your ground. Be proud of your decision. They are not always easy, but necessary.
Good luck to you. I hope this is a wake up call to him, and you both come back stronger than ever.
Iamhere said
Jul 14, 2018
Hey Bogie - I think it's great you found a meeting and plan to attend! If you love it, keep going - you will find support and others who have similar journeys and the local fellowship is great for bouncing ideas/plans off. I truly feel like I found my tribe in recovery and I'm grateful for it. If that meeting doesn't meet your fancy, find another.
I see nothing wrong with your plan. Al-Anon does usually suggest we wait 3-6 months in recovery to make any big decisions - I don't see a 3 month break as a big decision. I hear you and can see it for what you hope it to be - a chance for each of you to work on yourselves. Honestly, if I could have camped out away from my home for 3 months and just focused on me/Al-Anon/recovery, it would have been a gift. Unfortunately, it wasn't an option because of offspring. I did do the best I could to work my recovery in my insane home and did get better still so...I say rock on!
Recovery is a selfish process, only in that we are asked to put ourselves first. For many, myself included, that felt strange, different, selfish, awkward as I had put everyone else in front of me. But, the program, as designed does work and I am grateful.
Keep coming back and let us know how things are going. I'm sending prayers for you and your spouse and tons of positive thoughts!
a4l said
Jul 15, 2018
It strikes me reading this that it takes some of us many years to reach the point of courage/faith/resource to make exactly this sort of healthy decision around self-care. On the flip side, the descent into the agonies of a loved ones addiction doesn't happen overnight either and nor is it a descent with immediately recognisable neon signs of warning flashing. Relationships are long haul and so is alcoholism. Taking a short break sounds rational and healthy and nothing to feel guilty about. Love the way the you have been honest about your needs and then acted on getting those needs met. Good on you for seeking out meetings, like the members above me I echo the encouragement to pick up the alanon tools available to you via meetings and literature; why wait for hindsight if the support of collective exeriences and literature is readily available
All the best and keep coming back here as needed too.
milkwood said
Jul 16, 2018
Welcome to MIP
I left my husband for a while because I noticed that I was becoming someone I didn't like. Those building resentments are a bugger!!!
I dealt with the guilt that I felt by telling myself that I wanted to simply be me, and wholly present, when we made it through this difficult time. What use would I be if I was a bitter and twisted old lady when my husband got better??!!
For me finding my own space for a while, and following my own interests, was the best thing that I could have done and I have no regrets at all. I now know that even when times are tough, I can still find things in this world that excite and enthuse me.
I see lots of love in your post, love for your husband and for yourself. This is a wonderful place to speak freely, keep coming back. ((((hugs))))
PosiesandPuppies said
Jul 16, 2018
Welcome Bogie!
I too see nothing but love and compassion for your union by what you are proposing on doing. When I read your post, I thought to myself, "Boy, I wish I could've done that!" And as I thought about it some more (so that I could post a reply to you), I thought that perhaps my marriage could've been saved if I would have had this resource available to me. My husband was/is not a bad man. He doesn't do many of the things an "Ex" does that I read on these boards. But the disease is strong within him so he needs to work his program everyday without fail. Currently he is, and we've had some good convos... but the divorce is still going to go through b/c for me, there has been too much hurt... too many resentments for me to overcome... I have a form of PTSD for Pete's sake! How crazy is that?
I see what you have posted is your way of maintaining your sanity AND not building up more resentments that may be too great to overcome and crumble your marriage.
I hope that it all works out for you and your Qualifier!
Bogie18 said
Jul 16, 2018
First, wow. Thank you guys. I've read every message you all left at least a dozen times. and it's so helped with my feelings of guilt, abandonment, that I don't love him enough.
I have no one here to talk to b/c we're all close - and I know folks will freak out and I don't want every conversation to be "how are you? how is he? are you going back?" - He told one of his friends and obviously his sponsor.
So I'm going to go to meetings up here and down near the rental to meet folks there for support (and the board here :) )
I missed my meeting yesterday, but have one tonight for sure I'm going to and ordered some books as well. As you point out and I'm learning about Al-Anon it's a journey for myself.
I put the deposit down today and expect to move in 8/5. Will keep you posted on how it goes. I'm cautiously excited. But also scared for him. He knows I'm NOT leaving. But I know he's scared. Scared that "I'm afraid you're going to go and not want to come back" - and I have nothing to say to that except - "we are taking it day by day and we can't forecast the future" even though that is NOT my plan.
he's in there. I know he is! I really hope this time will be good for him as well.
Thank you and blessings to you all
bobosensei said
Jul 16, 2018
I just want to share I went through something similar with my ex husband. He wasn't an alcoholic, but has PTSD and went through a similar bout of depression and 9 months without a job. In my case what finally prompted me to leave was that I couldn't take the way he treated me. We moved from Europe back to the US when he was discharged from the army, and I started school. After a few months it was apparent he had no intention of working on himself so I had to add a job to school to get us health insurance coverage. I was working full time, going to school full time, commuting 3+ hours a day 4 days a week, spending all weekend doing homework and trying to take care of the house, and he would not help me one bit. We fought all the time. I cried every day - multiple times. Sometimes any time I was alone. I knew in my head his PTSD was an illness, and if he'd treated everyone else the way he treated me I think I would have hung in longer. I stayed in that marriage years longer than I should have because I was scared of the change. Moving out on my own before we started the divorce paperwork was the hardest thing I've ever done. I felt so alone and scared, but I had finally gotten to the point that staying was just not an option. We had a civil divorce, and I should have taken time for therapy for myself. I wish someone had made me go at least once to get me started. Instead I lost weight started dating, and that is when I met my super kind and loving alcoholic boyfriend. I've had a year of ups and downs, and I have to wonder had I taken care of myself like I should have mentally and emotionally after the divorce would I have ever gotten into this relationship that has gone so wrong.
My POV - don't ever feel bad for taking care of yourself. Your husband will find his way when he is ready. If I could have redone anything in my marriage it would have been to do couples counseling and for me to see someone myself. Al anon meetings helped me. Not just with the alcoholic but with setting boundaries at work too. I'll be honest the meetings were often draining, but many times I felt better afterwards. I fell away from meetings when I got busy, but I'm recognizing since my move and change in jobs I need to go back - whether I stay with the alcoholic or not. What a way to get cheap therapy and have some sense of being held accountable with my own mental health journey.
I should have left that marriage years before it felt bad. As long as he was still a nice guy I made excuses for the things that bothered me. Similarly I made excuses for the alcoholic. I'm currently focused on myself again. If the alcoholic chooses to come along he can, but if the boundaries I set are too much I want him gone. Much easier thinking of the future from this perspective. My life is about me. I'm in charge, and no one except me will ever has as much interest in my own happiness and success.
Take your time. Give yourself what you need. Don't ever be afraid to put yourself first.
milkwood said
Jul 17, 2018
Hello Bobosensel,
I just wanted to say thank you for your generous posts about taking care of oneself - that is a kind and appreciated reminder.
Hi all,
I'm been with my husband 9+ years now. When we first met, a self confident, ambitious, happy man. We married at 40 - both realizing we really had been waiting for each others. All those frogs? I found him (obviously not perfect, who is) but I've never been happier.
Over the years,though, his job changed and he was pushed into roles with toxic management. I am also a professional and had been a single mom raising my son alone until I met him and financially independent and secure. Basically income wise, we're equal.
Within 1 year of that corporate change, he started to change, depression, sad, gaining weight, not sleeping, no desire to do anything, dreading sundays (b/c it meant Monday), alcohol became his way to deal with it (never abusive, angry, but he withdrew). He lost his sparkle, withdrew. I supported however I could up to and including encouraging him to quit his job. We'd be okay. We'd MAKE it work. (we had the means to do so). I laid out the numbers. I helped us consolidate bills and set money aside. WE CAN DO THIS! He resisted for 3 years until finally one night in bed, at one of his lowest points, he rolled over to me and said "can I really quit my job?"
In my head I was screaming and dancing with joy. What I said to him wasn't that, but just supportive - "of course, babe. we ran the numbers we will be okay. I am here. We will be fine. I want you back". He left his job (and was surprised when 90% of his coworkers told him they were jealous and wish they could do same). Once he left he kept saying "why did it take me so long?" He told me "I just need 3 months". Having been in a similar situation before myself I told him to just go day by day. I knew in my heart more like 6-8 months to even start to be ready to work again.
He's been seeing a psychologist 1x a week since he left (we are blessed with insurance) but overall, he sleeps late and spent his days on the couch. I gave him space. 8-9 months in....I started to feel resentment. "when would this get better?" We saw his psychologist together to talk it out. Around this time I started realizing (he takes meds for depression and anxiety) that the drinking obviously counteracts that. NO energy, no desire to do anything, the funny, loving, secure man was a shell of who he was. Patience, I told myself.
We are now 16 months in. 3 months ago he hit a point - he realized the drinking was not helping and started going to AA. Slowly, over time, I'm seeing improvements. But still so much of him is still gone.
We've talked about this a few times b/c part of me feels if I left for awhile? Gave him space? He could focus on himself. NOT leave him. I work remote and have a home office and the last year of seeing him in the exact same space on the couch, or knowing he was sleeping in til 10, 11, noon....was starting to affect me, bring me down. I MISS my husband. I LOVE him. I'm doing everything I can, but I also realize...it's up to HIM. (hard pill for a 'fixer' like myself to swallow)
Over the last few months I've started looking at short term rentals here and there for myself. Every time I've brought it up as an option to give him space, let him heal, he shoots his down. His psychologist told him "that's not a good idea".
I work remote so can go anywhere. Just a short term time away. In my head my biggest fear is I am the one holding him back. (I can be very Type A). My biggest fear is if I do do this, he will realize he doesn't need me and leave me....having said that? I will be okay if that's the case. I want him happy. It would suck beyond measure and devastate me, but someone I love this much? I want him happy. But I believe him when he says it's not ABOUT me, it's about him.
As well, I find myself depressed, not wanting to be home. Business Trip? YES. In the past I HATED them, but now I look at them as a chance to just get away. I'm losing myself. Some folks have noticed as well. I'm not taking care of myself either.
During this time his psychologist has been supportive of my needs when I ask for a timeline, a goal, a baby step. We are now at the point where he agreed he would increase his AA meetings and apply for at least 3 jobs a week. He's been on with his AA and has a sponsor. There are brief moments where I see the old him shine through. But still rare. And the job stuff? barely trying.
He had an AA meeting Thursday night....and before he left I mentioned...it's been 4 weeks since your new agreement and I am SO happy you're doing meetings and I DO see a difference, but you're not following through with anything else, including getting out of the house and applying for jobs. I have told him over and over and over...I don't care WHAT you do. You don't HAVE to make that corporate $ you did. We will be FINE. But I need you to show me ACTION.
I hit my wall. while he was gone I looked again at part time rentals and found one. He came home from his AA meeting and I told him "I love you, but I have to do this. I have to leave for awhile. I'm holding you back. Im miserable. I want you back and I have no control and this is the only thing I can think of.
He disagrees. And a good convo last night he heard me. I DO fear I'm holding back but also admitted, I DO need time for myself.
I found a place. A small 1 bedroom 3 month, on the water - an oasis for myself for a few months. He came down with me to meet the landlord. I'm doing it.
I find myself excited now. Anytime I thought about leaving for a bit before it made me sick, but now I realize I'm turning into someone I don't want to be. And I also really believe, if he has time? by himself? It will help.
I have close friends, but I'm not talking with them about this. We've played this close to the vest. They realize (and agreed) leaving his job was the RIGHT choice. They realized he had a drinking problem and SUPPORT him and encourage him. But if we tell them they'll assume "you're breaking up" - when nothing is further from the truth.
I don't know what I'm asking. I have no one to talk to. Am I selfish? Should I tough it out? But what if he doesn't change. Leaving him is NOT an option. But I need time for me and I need to give him time for him.
Anyone go through this? I want to hear good, bad, ugly - pros and cons.
Thanks for listening
((Bogie)) you are not alone . Please search out alanon face to face meetings and attend. It is here you will find new constructive tools to live by and a supportive network of like minded folk who will not give advise but will offer new tools to live by so you can make an informed decision about your life
The hot line number is in the white pages
I see nothing wrong with your plan. Al-Anon does usually suggest we wait 3-6 months in recovery to make any big decisions - I don't see a 3 month break as a big decision. I hear you and can see it for what you hope it to be - a chance for each of you to work on yourselves. Honestly, if I could have camped out away from my home for 3 months and just focused on me/Al-Anon/recovery, it would have been a gift. Unfortunately, it wasn't an option because of offspring. I did do the best I could to work my recovery in my insane home and did get better still so...I say rock on!
Recovery is a selfish process, only in that we are asked to put ourselves first. For many, myself included, that felt strange, different, selfish, awkward as I had put everyone else in front of me. But, the program, as designed does work and I am grateful.
Keep coming back and let us know how things are going. I'm sending prayers for you and your spouse and tons of positive thoughts!
It strikes me reading this that it takes some of us many years to reach the point of courage/faith/resource to make exactly this sort of healthy decision around self-care. On the flip side, the descent into the agonies of a loved ones addiction doesn't happen overnight either and nor is it a descent with immediately recognisable neon signs of warning flashing. Relationships are long haul and so is alcoholism. Taking a short break sounds rational and healthy and nothing to feel guilty about. Love the way the you have been honest about your needs and then acted on getting those needs met. Good on you for seeking out meetings, like the members above me I echo the encouragement to pick up the alanon tools available to you via meetings and literature; why wait for hindsight if the support of collective exeriences and literature is readily available
All the best and keep coming back here as needed too.
I left my husband for a while because I noticed that I was becoming someone I didn't like. Those building resentments are a bugger!!!
I dealt with the guilt that I felt by telling myself that I wanted to simply be me, and wholly present, when we made it through this difficult time. What use would I be if I was a bitter and twisted old lady when my husband got better??!!
For me finding my own space for a while, and following my own interests, was the best thing that I could have done and I have no regrets at all. I now know that even when times are tough, I can still find things in this world that excite and enthuse me.
I see lots of love in your post, love for your husband and for yourself. This is a wonderful place to speak freely, keep coming back. ((((hugs))))
I too see nothing but love and compassion for your union by what you are proposing on doing. When I read your post, I thought to myself, "Boy, I wish I could've done that!" And as I thought about it some more (so that I could post a reply to you), I thought that perhaps my marriage could've been saved if I would have had this resource available to me. My husband was/is not a bad man. He doesn't do many of the things an "Ex" does that I read on these boards. But the disease is strong within him so he needs to work his program everyday without fail. Currently he is, and we've had some good convos... but the divorce is still going to go through b/c for me, there has been too much hurt... too many resentments for me to overcome... I have a form of PTSD for Pete's sake! How crazy is that?
I see what you have posted is your way of maintaining your sanity AND not building up more resentments that may be too great to overcome and crumble your marriage.
I hope that it all works out for you and your Qualifier!
I have no one here to talk to b/c we're all close - and I know folks will freak out and I don't want every conversation to be "how are you? how is he? are you going back?" - He told one of his friends and obviously his sponsor.
So I'm going to go to meetings up here and down near the rental to meet folks there for support (and the board here :) )
I missed my meeting yesterday, but have one tonight for sure I'm going to and ordered some books as well. As you point out and I'm learning about Al-Anon it's a journey for myself.
I put the deposit down today and expect to move in 8/5. Will keep you posted on how it goes. I'm cautiously excited. But also scared for him. He knows I'm NOT leaving. But I know he's scared. Scared that "I'm afraid you're going to go and not want to come back" - and I have nothing to say to that except - "we are taking it day by day and we can't forecast the future" even though that is NOT my plan.
he's in there. I know he is! I really hope this time will be good for him as well.
Thank you and blessings to you all
My POV - don't ever feel bad for taking care of yourself. Your husband will find his way when he is ready. If I could have redone anything in my marriage it would have been to do couples counseling and for me to see someone myself. Al anon meetings helped me. Not just with the alcoholic but with setting boundaries at work too. I'll be honest the meetings were often draining, but many times I felt better afterwards. I fell away from meetings when I got busy, but I'm recognizing since my move and change in jobs I need to go back - whether I stay with the alcoholic or not. What a way to get cheap therapy and have some sense of being held accountable with my own mental health journey.
I should have left that marriage years before it felt bad. As long as he was still a nice guy I made excuses for the things that bothered me. Similarly I made excuses for the alcoholic. I'm currently focused on myself again. If the alcoholic chooses to come along he can, but if the boundaries I set are too much I want him gone. Much easier thinking of the future from this perspective. My life is about me. I'm in charge, and no one except me will ever has as much interest in my own happiness and success.
Take your time. Give yourself what you need. Don't ever be afraid to put yourself first.
I just wanted to say thank you for your generous posts about taking care of oneself - that is a kind and appreciated reminder.