I guess this is the 1st step. I've looked around for meetings in my area, so maybe that will be step 2. I've reached a critical stage it seems w/my fiancé. More then anything 'different' it's just that I'm fed up w/the cycle.
My story. I'm divorced, mother of 2 teen boys 17 and 18. I divorced their dad when they were 2.5 and 4 yrs old as he was a classic abuser (emotional/verbal/physical). I took several years (5) to heal, have fun, get to know myself, date around, travel and do the day in/day out single mother act.
I met my fiancé during an 'acting out' stage guess you could say- so we were both drinking....eventually over time/growing up things slowed down for me-he continued to escalate....he also went through a period of time not long ago where he got hooked on meth for about 6-9 months and then a year recovery...he hasn't touched it since-of that I'm quite sure. The problem is the classic alcoholic act....when he's drunk he becomes belligerent, angry, verbally abusive...he hasn't been physically abusive but his behavior is just horrid. He's opened his door while I'm driving down the interstate, tries to honk the horn when I'm driving in traffic or just 'annoy' me. Or he starts in w/the relationship pick a part- or tearing me down....then the usual 'doesn't remember' the next day or does, apologizes and behaves for a few days-the bad names calling.
During our time together (we live together) he's only worked a couple of years...has no degree or ambition. His excuse now is because he watches our dogs all day (and he does, and they are high energy dogs, one a pup)- will drive my son and his daughter to school for testing (they do online schooling for HS now) will do the occasional chore/errand run. I've done all the wrong things-classic co-dependent guess you could say.
We lost his dad to an unexpected heart attack about 3 years ago- that same week we miscarried an unplanned pregnancy that we had both come to love the idea of-and we were devastated about it. I had just turned 40. My dad was announced to have stage IV cancer that week as well. We went through a custody change w/his daughter coming to him as the mom ALSO had a meth addiction (way before his). Then the slow/agonizing battle of watching my dad die (this was during his meth addiction)- so he wasn't much support then-worst times of my life. Some few months later we lost our beloved 10yr old dog unexpectedly. In that time we acquired one of our pups (was already in planning) and then our 2nd one a few months ago....during which time AGAIN unexpected pregnancy and miscarried at 6 weeks. Though a relief that time (hard to admit that one) it was still a shock, painful and depressing.
I've been w/my company 20 years....this man was the love of my life. In so many ways he was very good to me at first. Other then his disease, he's a GOOD man, with a good heart, an absolute giver and awesome w/the pups and w/my sons.....but then the other voice/reality kicks in and he changes.
Honestly? I don't want to go through a 2nd failed relationship and I'm so very tired of loss in my life....but I also at times feel like I hate him and can't stand the sight of him and want him gone. To where? HIs mothers? If you want to know what's further messed up....my biggest concern about him leaving his who will take care of the dogs? They are sporting dogs- I can't crate them that many hours? Can I trust my youngest son to engage/feed them? Do I hire a dog walker? Do I allow him to stay during the day and leave in the evenings?
That's not even the full story- my oldest has issues as well- w/the green-but that's a whole other post....I'm surrounded by failing men. My exh wasn't exactly the provider either...he's for years tried to get around his responsibility of time to his sons...so they don't have much to do w/him. I resent coming home- nobody else working, or cleaning up much- I"ll come home w/groceries having to yell for help to get things brought in from car/put away. I'm being used-by all of them...I get not much back in return. I'm miserable, unhappy, bitter-and dread the thought of starting over at almost 44yrs old also. We had dreams. They're broken. I'm broken.
Iamhere said
May 29, 2018
overit2 - welcome to MIP - glad you found us and glad that you have joined right in. I am sorry the the disease all around you and can relate. I have an AH (Alcoholic Husband) and 2 AS (Alcoholic Sons)....I found my sanity in Al-Anon recovery and am glad I finally broke down and found meetings/attended. I too felt used, and felt as if nobody else was 'adding value' in my home. I was angry, bitter and most importantly just felt beaten down and totally defeated. I could NOT understand how I, a reasonably intelligent, hard-working person landed in such a state of 'existence'....did not like my life at all.
I did go to meetings and was angry when I was told I needed to focus on me, not them. I wasn't thrilled with that message, so tried more 'managing' on my own. I went back to meetings with an open mind, and truly tried to do what was suggested. It made a huge difference and while nobody around me has changed drastically, I certainly have. Both of my sons no longer live in the family home either which was a move I had to make for their maturity, disease and my own sanity.
I do encourage you to find your courage and make time to try some meetings. You have every right to love who you want and to love yourself too. For me, my best next steps have resulted from working recovery vs. trying to direct the show all around me. You are not alone - keep coming back - there is hope and help in recovery!
Bo said
May 29, 2018
A few thoughts, based upon my experience, and some of which may not make sense as we could be having two different conversations and/or coming at this from two different perspectives. I hear you. I too was broken. Many of us were. So, there's a few things you have to begin to learn, understand, accept, etc. First, he will not stop drinking UNLESS and UNTIL he wants to. Period. And there is nothing you can do about that. You can't make that day come about quicker, yet alone make that day come around at all! It's sad, but true. You can't fix him, control him, or his drinking, you can't change him, or his drinking. There is nothing you can do about him...but there is a lot you can do about you! That's what alanon is. It is not a program to teach you how to get him to quit drinking. That's his decision. It is also not a program to teach you how to tolerate and put up with the intolerable, although, unfortunately, some people use alanon for that. It is not designed to teach you how to accept the unacceptable.
You have to make change. You have to think differently, change your behavior, actions, reactions, etc. You have to focus on YOU. On what's important and what's real for you.
When someone says the person is or was the love of their life -- that of course comes with good and bad. Now, in alanon we learn we do not have to accept unacceptable behavior, but if the he's the love of your life...regarding all the other things you can't stand...how important are those things? Are they deal-breakers? One of them? All of them? You see, you can't have it both ways. Why? Because you can't fix him. You can't get him to stop. You can't get him to stop doing the things you don't like, want, won't accept. You can't turn him on and off and only live with the part you want. Are you justifying staying with him -- in so many ways he was very good to me at first, he's a good man, good heart, absolute giver, awesome with the dogs, your sons, etc. -- or are you simply not sure. Either is OK. That's up to you. And you will handle it as you move forward with this program. But, what about the other stuff you can't stand? Isn't that important? More important? If nothing changed -- is this where you want to be for the next one year? Five? The rest of your life? Or, you can wait and hope he quits, and even more, finds recovery. Just quitting drinking is not the answer all of the time. It's about recovery sometimes. Most of the time actually.
Nothing changes if nothing changes. That means, now, it is about YOU. If you want him gone...it doesn't matter where. None of your business. Break it down and keep it simple. If your biggest concern is about the dogs, then I guess he has to stay? Does that sound healthy? Yes, I get you are overwhelmed. You are new to alanon. There's a lot for you to learn. It took you X amount of time to get here, and it will take you some time to get out. If you are ready, you can start, and you will get better.
Go to face to face meetings. As many as you can. Commit to it. Find a sponsor. Start focusing on YOU...not him...YOU. Learn about acceptance, detachment, letting go, just for today, the 3 C's, enabling, and more. Some of these things might be difficult for you to get a handle on, as you are new, and because they may seem opposite of what you've been doing and thinking for quite some time. That was the case with me. A beginner is often overwhelmed, confused, angry, at wits end, and more. However, being that you are new, you don't want to react or take on too much without getting some clarity and focus around you. It's hard for a beginner to hear about a dozen or so tools, new ideas, new ways of thinking, and understand them immediately. Give it some time. Alanon says don't make any major decisions for 6 months or one year. I say take what you like and leave the rest. Each case, each person is different. There is not a right or wrong. What is best for you, healthy for you -- is for YOU.
All the best.
Mattie said
May 29, 2018
Welcome and I'm glad you have found us. I hope you'll find a good meeting too - this is all so hard and complicated, no one should have to go through it alone.
I just wanted to make two observations based on my experience. They're about how we frame things. I know that for a long time I framed things so I didn't really have a good way out. I'm sure I still do that sometimes, but I really got caught up in it before. So the hard things seem impossible. One thing is about your dogs. Bless you for being determined to take good care of the dogs. In my experience, any plans that requires the cooperation of an A (alcoholic) is a way for things to go chaotic. They use any method they can of wriggle into our lives and making us dependent. I have several friends with energetic dogs and they send them to doggy daycare during the day. Bonus: the dogs are tired as well as happy by evening! A dog walker would also work. Or an outdoor pen where they can race around, if you have access to that.
I also know that feeling of being determined not to have a second failed relationship. Unfortunately we're only half of the relationship, and if the other person fails to "show up" for the relationship, that's out of our control. What I think would be better for us is to be determined that we're not going to be in another bad relationship. That's something we do have control over. Because we can end the bad relationship. That's not a failure, that's running our lives successfully. It's the alcoholic who has failed to enter and work a formal recovery program who has failed. He can also turn that around any time, but unfortunately we all know that that's on his timeline, and not on ours.
Hope you'll stick around. Hugs!
Bo said
May 29, 2018
Mattie wrote:
Welcome and I'm glad you have found us. I hope you'll find a good meeting too - this is all so hard and complicated, no one should have to go through it alone.
I just wanted to make two observations based on my experience. They're about how we frame things. I know that for a long time I framed things so I didn't really have a good way out. I'm sure I still do that sometimes, but I really got caught up in it before. So the hard things seem impossible. One thing is about your dogs. Bless you for being determined to take good care of the dogs. In my experience, any plans that requires the cooperation of an A (alcoholic) is a way for things to go chaotic. They use any method they can of wriggle into our lives and making us dependent. I have several friends with energetic dogs and they send them to doggy daycare during the day. Bonus: the dogs are tired as well as happy by evening! A dog walker would also work. Or an outdoor pen where they can race around, if you have access to that.
I also know that feeling of being determined not to have a second failed relationship. Unfortunately we're only half of the relationship, and if the other person fails to "show up" for the relationship, that's out of our control. What I think would be better for us is to be determined that we're not going to be in another bad relationship. That's something we do have control over. Because we can end the bad relationship. That's not a failure, that's running our lives successfully. It's the alcoholic who has failed to enter and work a formal recovery program who has failed. He can also turn that around any time, but unfortunately we all know that that's on his timeline, and not on ours.
Hope you'll stick around. Hugs!
Excellent post Mattie...and thank you so very much for posting this.
WestMan said
May 30, 2018
I'm sorry you've been going through so much. And. Our. One too. My heart goes out to you. My hope is that you'll find a meeting where you can go get some relief and support. Even though he's not physically abusive the things you describe are very hurtful.
My suggestion is to put the focus on yourself and your sons.
Aline said
May 30, 2018
Hi, overit. I too welcome you on MIP, and its great to hear you are looking for available f2f meetings as well. There's a lot of craziness going on around you, and Alanon can definitely help. It sure helped and continues to help me and so many others who have been affected by another person's drinking. Some of what you're writing about reminds me a lot of my own life before I found this program, like how you perceive your A fiance is good // bad. I sometimes used to think of my now ex-abf as the good him and his evil twin. Unfortunately alcoholism means these are all in one person, and I can't have the good one without the evil one.
However, Alanon is about how we who live with and/or love alcoholics can get better. We focus on ourselves, which kind of baffled me for a while, because I couldn't really grasp how focusing on myself can make anything better when its the alcoholic who is making havoc. I did try to do my best, though, by going to meetings, reading Alanon literature, also coming here on MIP, and eventually finding a sponsor and starting with the steps, and also starting to take notice of how I feel or what I want or need... I'd neglected myself and didn't even realize how much so. I've been in this program for almost 1,5 years, and while there's lots and lots to work on in myself, I am undeniably much better than I was before, which was much like you describe: afraid, tired, very anxious, and for me also feeling like I'm on the verge of losing my mind.
There is hope and help available. I hope you give this program a try. It is suggested to attend some different meetings to see which suits best for you. Wiser folk from this program say its important to look for similarities in meetings, instead of differences. This I found true too. The more open I'm able to be when I listen, the more I can learn from other's experiences.
I guess this is the 1st step. I've looked around for meetings in my area, so maybe that will be step 2. I've reached a critical stage it seems w/my fiancé. More then anything 'different' it's just that I'm fed up w/the cycle.
My story. I'm divorced, mother of 2 teen boys 17 and 18. I divorced their dad when they were 2.5 and 4 yrs old as he was a classic abuser (emotional/verbal/physical). I took several years (5) to heal, have fun, get to know myself, date around, travel and do the day in/day out single mother act.
I met my fiancé during an 'acting out' stage guess you could say- so we were both drinking....eventually over time/growing up things slowed down for me-he continued to escalate....he also went through a period of time not long ago where he got hooked on meth for about 6-9 months and then a year recovery...he hasn't touched it since-of that I'm quite sure. The problem is the classic alcoholic act....when he's drunk he becomes belligerent, angry, verbally abusive...he hasn't been physically abusive but his behavior is just horrid. He's opened his door while I'm driving down the interstate, tries to honk the horn when I'm driving in traffic or just 'annoy' me. Or he starts in w/the relationship pick a part- or tearing me down....then the usual 'doesn't remember' the next day or does, apologizes and behaves for a few days-the bad names calling.
During our time together (we live together) he's only worked a couple of years...has no degree or ambition. His excuse now is because he watches our dogs all day (and he does, and they are high energy dogs, one a pup)- will drive my son and his daughter to school for testing (they do online schooling for HS now) will do the occasional chore/errand run. I've done all the wrong things-classic co-dependent guess you could say.
We lost his dad to an unexpected heart attack about 3 years ago- that same week we miscarried an unplanned pregnancy that we had both come to love the idea of-and we were devastated about it. I had just turned 40. My dad was announced to have stage IV cancer that week as well. We went through a custody change w/his daughter coming to him as the mom ALSO had a meth addiction (way before his). Then the slow/agonizing battle of watching my dad die (this was during his meth addiction)- so he wasn't much support then-worst times of my life. Some few months later we lost our beloved 10yr old dog unexpectedly. In that time we acquired one of our pups (was already in planning) and then our 2nd one a few months ago....during which time AGAIN unexpected pregnancy and miscarried at 6 weeks. Though a relief that time (hard to admit that one) it was still a shock, painful and depressing.
I've been w/my company 20 years....this man was the love of my life. In so many ways he was very good to me at first. Other then his disease, he's a GOOD man, with a good heart, an absolute giver and awesome w/the pups and w/my sons.....but then the other voice/reality kicks in and he changes.
Honestly? I don't want to go through a 2nd failed relationship and I'm so very tired of loss in my life....but I also at times feel like I hate him and can't stand the sight of him and want him gone. To where? HIs mothers? If you want to know what's further messed up....my biggest concern about him leaving his who will take care of the dogs? They are sporting dogs- I can't crate them that many hours? Can I trust my youngest son to engage/feed them? Do I hire a dog walker? Do I allow him to stay during the day and leave in the evenings?
That's not even the full story- my oldest has issues as well- w/the green-but that's a whole other post....I'm surrounded by failing men. My exh wasn't exactly the provider either...he's for years tried to get around his responsibility of time to his sons...so they don't have much to do w/him. I resent coming home- nobody else working, or cleaning up much- I"ll come home w/groceries having to yell for help to get things brought in from car/put away. I'm being used-by all of them...I get not much back in return. I'm miserable, unhappy, bitter-and dread the thought of starting over at almost 44yrs old also. We had dreams. They're broken. I'm broken.
I did go to meetings and was angry when I was told I needed to focus on me, not them. I wasn't thrilled with that message, so tried more 'managing' on my own. I went back to meetings with an open mind, and truly tried to do what was suggested. It made a huge difference and while nobody around me has changed drastically, I certainly have. Both of my sons no longer live in the family home either which was a move I had to make for their maturity, disease and my own sanity.
I do encourage you to find your courage and make time to try some meetings. You have every right to love who you want and to love yourself too. For me, my best next steps have resulted from working recovery vs. trying to direct the show all around me. You are not alone - keep coming back - there is hope and help in recovery!
You have to make change. You have to think differently, change your behavior, actions, reactions, etc. You have to focus on YOU. On what's important and what's real for you.
When someone says the person is or was the love of their life -- that of course comes with good and bad. Now, in alanon we learn we do not have to accept unacceptable behavior, but if the he's the love of your life...regarding all the other things you can't stand...how important are those things? Are they deal-breakers? One of them? All of them? You see, you can't have it both ways. Why? Because you can't fix him. You can't get him to stop. You can't get him to stop doing the things you don't like, want, won't accept. You can't turn him on and off and only live with the part you want. Are you justifying staying with him -- in so many ways he was very good to me at first, he's a good man, good heart, absolute giver, awesome with the dogs, your sons, etc. -- or are you simply not sure. Either is OK. That's up to you. And you will handle it as you move forward with this program. But, what about the other stuff you can't stand? Isn't that important? More important? If nothing changed -- is this where you want to be for the next one year? Five? The rest of your life? Or, you can wait and hope he quits, and even more, finds recovery. Just quitting drinking is not the answer all of the time. It's about recovery sometimes. Most of the time actually.
Nothing changes if nothing changes. That means, now, it is about YOU. If you want him gone...it doesn't matter where. None of your business. Break it down and keep it simple. If your biggest concern is about the dogs, then I guess he has to stay? Does that sound healthy? Yes, I get you are overwhelmed. You are new to alanon. There's a lot for you to learn. It took you X amount of time to get here, and it will take you some time to get out. If you are ready, you can start, and you will get better.
Go to face to face meetings. As many as you can. Commit to it. Find a sponsor. Start focusing on YOU...not him...YOU. Learn about acceptance, detachment, letting go, just for today, the 3 C's, enabling, and more. Some of these things might be difficult for you to get a handle on, as you are new, and because they may seem opposite of what you've been doing and thinking for quite some time. That was the case with me. A beginner is often overwhelmed, confused, angry, at wits end, and more. However, being that you are new, you don't want to react or take on too much without getting some clarity and focus around you. It's hard for a beginner to hear about a dozen or so tools, new ideas, new ways of thinking, and understand them immediately. Give it some time. Alanon says don't make any major decisions for 6 months or one year. I say take what you like and leave the rest. Each case, each person is different. There is not a right or wrong. What is best for you, healthy for you -- is for YOU.
All the best.
Welcome and I'm glad you have found us. I hope you'll find a good meeting too - this is all so hard and complicated, no one should have to go through it alone.
I just wanted to make two observations based on my experience. They're about how we frame things. I know that for a long time I framed things so I didn't really have a good way out. I'm sure I still do that sometimes, but I really got caught up in it before. So the hard things seem impossible. One thing is about your dogs. Bless you for being determined to take good care of the dogs. In my experience, any plans that requires the cooperation of an A (alcoholic) is a way for things to go chaotic. They use any method they can of wriggle into our lives and making us dependent. I have several friends with energetic dogs and they send them to doggy daycare during the day. Bonus: the dogs are tired as well as happy by evening! A dog walker would also work. Or an outdoor pen where they can race around, if you have access to that.
I also know that feeling of being determined not to have a second failed relationship. Unfortunately we're only half of the relationship, and if the other person fails to "show up" for the relationship, that's out of our control. What I think would be better for us is to be determined that we're not going to be in another bad relationship. That's something we do have control over. Because we can end the bad relationship. That's not a failure, that's running our lives successfully. It's the alcoholic who has failed to enter and work a formal recovery program who has failed. He can also turn that around any time, but unfortunately we all know that that's on his timeline, and not on ours.
Hope you'll stick around. Hugs!
Excellent post Mattie...and thank you so very much for posting this.
My suggestion is to put the focus on yourself and your sons.
However, Alanon is about how we who live with and/or love alcoholics can get better. We focus on ourselves, which kind of baffled me for a while, because I couldn't really grasp how focusing on myself can make anything better when its the alcoholic who is making havoc. I did try to do my best, though, by going to meetings, reading Alanon literature, also coming here on MIP, and eventually finding a sponsor and starting with the steps, and also starting to take notice of how I feel or what I want or need... I'd neglected myself and didn't even realize how much so. I've been in this program for almost 1,5 years, and while there's lots and lots to work on in myself, I am undeniably much better than I was before, which was much like you describe: afraid, tired, very anxious, and for me also feeling like I'm on the verge of losing my mind.
There is hope and help available. I hope you give this program a try. It is suggested to attend some different meetings to see which suits best for you. Wiser folk from this program say its important to look for similarities in meetings, instead of differences. This I found true too. The more open I'm able to be when I listen, the more I can learn from other's experiences.
((((Hugs)))). You are not alone. Keep coming back