I am struggling a bit today. After spending a WONDERFUL weekend with my RAH on a mini vacation, we really had some time to connect. My Hubby is no doubt got a LOT on his plate these days with work stress, family drama (mainly his side of the family), and I know he is very concerned with trying to stay balanced overall, focused on his continued sobriety (17 years and counting!) and he tells me he is also concerned about keeping his new wife (Me - 10 months and counting!) happy in our new life together. We are thoroughly embedded fixtures in our local AA-Alanon community and both work our programs. Where I am struggling this morning is that during our open, frank discussions over the weekend, I really had the opportunity to share with him about a situation I continue to find no peace with regarding his RAD. I ask every day that my HP please help me to forgive her and the hurt she continues to cause through actions and words towards me. In working my program, my HP showed me where I am at fault for the judgements that I hold of her, and that I need to work on changing my thought processes and attitude. I need to be more compassionate of what she continues to experience as she rebuilds her life. BTW, this was not a heated conversation in any way. It was a friendly conversation actually prompted by him. I was so grateful for the opportunity to open up and let him know that I was making progress on this issue. Bless him, my RAH was not mad, but he just kept saying that I have no faults, and that I do not need to change anything about me. His words to me were foreign to say the least. We ALL have faults, do we not? Nobody is perfect. ... He is so happy and thankful that I am a part of this program and that I am a support to him. He said at one point over the weekend that it would be his RADs loss if she chose not to have a relationship with me in any capacity. I get even more confused because he obviously has a very close relationship with her, especially with the shared Alcoholic gene - which she likes to remind me that I am not a part of. He never corrects her, but rather chooses to let me know that her sometimes bad choices are the result of the disease and it will take time. He continues to try and pull me into situations where we talk together with her on the phone, or visit her in person. I am always uncomfortable because she has let it be known she does not want me to be any part of her life. It is especially difficult when RAH asks me for my opinion in front of RAD on HER life. I have learned to say in a nice way that I think RAD would probably like to try and work this out on her own. (RAD just celebrated 1 year of sobriety).
I try to put myself in my hubbys shoes - I can only imagine what might be going through his mind. And like the good co-dependent wife that I know I am, I do not want to stir up the trouble or make anyone mad, simply because I do not want to deal with the fallout and tempers. I have tried to talk to my RAH and to set some boundaries, but this seems to make him uncomfortable and angry. (I am learning that sometimes I do have to deal with the anger and uncomfortableness even though I would rather crawl under a rock and disappear).
Anyhow, any ESH you can give me? (I used to pray to my HP and ask that He just show me what my RAH was thinking. Right! How can He when I KNOW that I just have a totally different perception of things. There is no way I can possibly understand things as my hubby sees them.)
Thanks for letting me vent a bit, and share. Just had to get it off my shoulders today and stop driving myself crazy.
Blessings Everyone!
SerenityRUS said
Feb 26, 2018
My BF doesn't do conflict. Period. It is better to start with no and work to yes which is such a bad way to go especially when it comes to boundaries and healthy relationships. He's really gotten so much better and I'm very proud of him. The issue with saying no and then flip flopping to yes drives me insane .. LOL .. if you are going to say yes .. just start with yes .. don't do the martyr thing.
He likes to push his parents on me and I don't like it. I push back. Just because I have a uterus doesn't mean it's my job to foster their relationship and my XAH did that to me and it pissed me off big time, especially at the end of our relationship. I do what I want to do in fostering the relationship between us .. I need to drop a line. I am not going to push these people .. we are very different .. they have very different views of the world than I do. My experiences are highly different than theirs and it doesn't make either of us wrong or right .. it just is. I don't want them to feel weird at the same time we are kind of new into things so it's just different.
His kids are not happy with me at the moment and it's my fault that their dad did not go back to their mom. It's also my fault that he's no longer a doormat. All of a sudden he can say no and no one is going to die. You know it is what it is .. and they did not deal with the direct XW's behavior daily and it was out of control. They are both adults and the oldest is living with her mom and that was so not planned again poor choices, these are the direct consequences of them and this was the XW. The daughter now wants to move in with us with her sig other and I'm like WTH .. umm no in my mind .. I did myself the best thing by allowing him to speak before I jumped.
I am so grateful he posed the question as .. how do I say no without being negative about it vs .. so what do you think? LOL .. he took ownership of saying no and we talked about pro's and con's .. the con's were way longer than the pro's and it is also about teaching adult kids how to adult as well. We talked about teachable moments. This was one and he did very well. He did his own thing and didn't put it on me. I am in the middle of that lesson however my kids are far younger than his.
My opinion is it is far better to allow things to unfold organically vs pushing the issue. Leaving the door open for communication vs shutting it. It is again my opinion it's unfair to push his daughter at you when the daughter has been very clear in her feelings and it's not right for the level of disrespect that comes out of it. I also believe as you all work your programs lots of positive things can come out of it. I say PUSH .. pray until something happens. Allow her to make the moves, let her know you are there and support her. Making clear statements that I don't feel that's fair to have that discussion in front of so and so. I don't have an issue with conflict .. so calling out my sig other respectfully is not off limits. I also say hey not ok to my kids as well.
Your relationship with his daughter is also none of his business. If he wants to discuss something privately that's one thing .. I think it's unfair for him to do that in front of the daughter and it negates her as an adult as well. I give my guy time with his parents as well as time with his kids if they want it. At this point the kids are not interested in developing a relationship with me and I respect that part. It will take a lot of time and honestly it may be after the XW passes on before that relationship will blossom which is sad. It is not my issue. That's all stuff they need to work through. My part is staying out of the way. I encourage my kids to spend time with my BF without me .. it's not always easy for them however they muddle through .. I think we have a different situation because my kids were minors when my BF and I got together. So I respected their feelings however I am one person too. He has been very supportive with them and I am grateful for that.
I get where he's coming from he wants a happy family and move along nothing to see here .. the damage that has been done has to also heal or at least have the opportunity to heal. I'm sure he gets frustrated when he can't control the timeline .. it's not up to him either.
Big hugs it really sounds like you are working your program and firm boundaries and allowing things to just move as they should is just better than forcing.
S :)
AnnieFenk321 said
Feb 26, 2018
My AH also has a difficult extended family. In the end in my case I decided it was right to contact them directly and politely ask them to stop being in touch with me, and that I was happy to have a relationship, but that it would have to be on my husband's terms. Until that point my husband had decided he didn't want to be in touch with them and they were contacting me and my family trying to get us to mediate a relationship with him.
It was a really hard thing for me to do to state this all very plainly in a communication to them, as most of the stuff seemed so obvious to me and I was so angry and indignant it wasn't obvious to them. I had to set my anger aside and write something dispassionate.
I spent so much futile energy trying to make my husband, in the throes of addiction, "take control" of the situation and get them off my back. I didn't have much success with that either, suprise suprise. Once I sent the email, asking them to stop contacting me and my family, they stopped. I had complained so much about them not respecting my wishes, but once I made my wishes known in absolute black and white, they did stop.
It was all very bizarre. I have a pretty dysfunctional family, but this was a whole new type of dysfunction. It was hard to get used to someone else's dysfunction. I found the best thing I could do was protect myself, let go and let Gd.
That's my ESH, I will premise that while I was familiar with recovery when this was going on, I was not actively working an Al Anon program.
All the best with your situation
Iamhere said
Feb 26, 2018
PeacefulLove - where you are and where they are is difficult...it's new for everyone and the best of boundaries will struggle with new relationships, forced relationships and the 'getting to know you phase' of life.
My best ESH is what's in my signature. I've been 'snapped' before telling others what I think as honest as possible when they've asked....why? Because my honesty was not expected. So - I've gotten better at pausing and I even clarify - do you really want my honest response? I am a very direct person and those I allow 'in' know that what is coming may not be what they want to hear.
What I do my best to do is speak I statements. When I can pause, pray and then respond, I am generally decent at determining how this affects me (or if it's even on my side of the street) and then use I statements. You have every right to share what you've posted here - that it makes you uncomfortable to be pulled into their relationship. I agree with Serenity - forced relationships are generally uncomfortable for all involved. Organic grown owns seem to develop in a more healthy way.
My AH has a grown daughter. She's also an A. She was in recovery, then went out for 10+ years and is back in recovery (as best I know). She does like me but doesn't like her father. I stay far, far away from 'all that' and have made it real clear that any issues they have with one another need to be directly managed - I will not be complicit in any of the dysfunction. I too retired from the drama/chaos department a few years back. My boys have to fight it out, they have to tell their dad instead of me their complaints with him and I truly only engage if/when it's my deal.
Parents are always the last to see fault in their offspring. They are even further behind in admitting any of it. This applies to 'earth people' (we say that for those who are not alcoholic). It's even a bigger issue with this disease and the diseased. All the denial in the world can stand between what he sees and what you see. Even when my own boys were making a huge mess of their lives, what was perpetually in my mind was the sweet small smiling faces from way before the disease came. It's tough as a parent to accept the disease and it's even tougher to let go and set healthy boundaries. It does come in God's time though, at least it did for me.
It's perfectly OK to tell him you don't know what to think or how you feel. It's OK to be LTP - Less Than Perfect - even in a new marriage. And, it's OK that they are too. I often find that most people I know, with this disease or without it, want the same thing - to be happy, healthy and emotionally whole - or as close as possible. Our paths to 'there' will be vastly different but if I can keep reminding myself that we all have similar goals and our own HP's - it better allows me to accept where each are and to love them unconditionally.
Hang in there - it's awesome that he's including you. Just do what you can to stay on your side of the street and love them both from afar if/when things get sticky....(((Hugs)))
Lyne said
Feb 27, 2018
Hi PL-program has taught me to mind my own business, and try to fix me, as often as I am able to. We also have a saying for when we feel we want to give our opinion: say what you mean, mean what you say, but don't say it mean. I try to follow this guideline. It is really helpful, Lyne
Hello Everyone!
I am struggling a bit today. After spending a WONDERFUL weekend with my RAH on a mini vacation, we really had some time to connect. My Hubby is no doubt got a LOT on his plate these days with work stress, family drama (mainly his side of the family), and I know he is very concerned with trying to stay balanced overall, focused on his continued sobriety (17 years and counting!) and he tells me he is also concerned about keeping his new wife (Me - 10 months and counting!) happy in our new life together. We are thoroughly embedded fixtures in our local AA-Alanon community and both work our programs. Where I am struggling this morning is that during our open, frank discussions over the weekend, I really had the opportunity to share with him about a situation I continue to find no peace with regarding his RAD. I ask every day that my HP please help me to forgive her and the hurt she continues to cause through actions and words towards me. In working my program, my HP showed me where I am at fault for the judgements that I hold of her, and that I need to work on changing my thought processes and attitude. I need to be more compassionate of what she continues to experience as she rebuilds her life. BTW, this was not a heated conversation in any way. It was a friendly conversation actually prompted by him. I was so grateful for the opportunity to open up and let him know that I was making progress on this issue. Bless him, my RAH was not mad, but he just kept saying that I have no faults, and that I do not need to change anything about me. His words to me were foreign to say the least. We ALL have faults, do we not? Nobody is perfect. ... He is so happy and thankful that I am a part of this program and that I am a support to him. He said at one point over the weekend that it would be his RADs loss if she chose not to have a relationship with me in any capacity. I get even more confused because he obviously has a very close relationship with her, especially with the shared Alcoholic gene - which she likes to remind me that I am not a part of. He never corrects her, but rather chooses to let me know that her sometimes bad choices are the result of the disease and it will take time. He continues to try and pull me into situations where we talk together with her on the phone, or visit her in person. I am always uncomfortable because she has let it be known she does not want me to be any part of her life. It is especially difficult when RAH asks me for my opinion in front of RAD on HER life. I have learned to say in a nice way that I think RAD would probably like to try and work this out on her own. (RAD just celebrated 1 year of sobriety).
I try to put myself in my hubbys shoes - I can only imagine what might be going through his mind. And like the good co-dependent wife that I know I am, I do not want to stir up the trouble or make anyone mad, simply because I do not want to deal with the fallout and tempers. I have tried to talk to my RAH and to set some boundaries, but this seems to make him uncomfortable and angry. (I am learning that sometimes I do have to deal with the anger and uncomfortableness even though I would rather crawl under a rock and disappear).
Anyhow, any ESH you can give me? (I used to pray to my HP and ask that He just show me what my RAH was thinking. Right! How can He when I KNOW that I just have a totally different perception of things. There is no way I can possibly understand things as my hubby sees them.)
Thanks for letting me vent a bit, and share. Just had to get it off my shoulders today and stop driving myself crazy.
Blessings Everyone!
He likes to push his parents on me and I don't like it. I push back. Just because I have a uterus doesn't mean it's my job to foster their relationship and my XAH did that to me and it pissed me off big time, especially at the end of our relationship. I do what I want to do in fostering the relationship between us .. I need to drop a line. I am not going to push these people .. we are very different .. they have very different views of the world than I do. My experiences are highly different than theirs and it doesn't make either of us wrong or right .. it just is. I don't want them to feel weird at the same time we are kind of new into things so it's just different.
His kids are not happy with me at the moment and it's my fault that their dad did not go back to their mom. It's also my fault that he's no longer a doormat. All of a sudden he can say no and no one is going to die. You know it is what it is .. and they did not deal with the direct XW's behavior daily and it was out of control. They are both adults and the oldest is living with her mom and that was so not planned again poor choices, these are the direct consequences of them and this was the XW. The daughter now wants to move in with us with her sig other and I'm like WTH .. umm no in my mind .. I did myself the best thing by allowing him to speak before I jumped.
I am so grateful he posed the question as .. how do I say no without being negative about it vs .. so what do you think? LOL .. he took ownership of saying no and we talked about pro's and con's .. the con's were way longer than the pro's and it is also about teaching adult kids how to adult as well. We talked about teachable moments. This was one and he did very well. He did his own thing and didn't put it on me. I am in the middle of that lesson however my kids are far younger than his.
My opinion is it is far better to allow things to unfold organically vs pushing the issue. Leaving the door open for communication vs shutting it. It is again my opinion it's unfair to push his daughter at you when the daughter has been very clear in her feelings and it's not right for the level of disrespect that comes out of it. I also believe as you all work your programs lots of positive things can come out of it. I say PUSH .. pray until something happens. Allow her to make the moves, let her know you are there and support her. Making clear statements that I don't feel that's fair to have that discussion in front of so and so. I don't have an issue with conflict .. so calling out my sig other respectfully is not off limits. I also say hey not ok to my kids as well.
Your relationship with his daughter is also none of his business. If he wants to discuss something privately that's one thing .. I think it's unfair for him to do that in front of the daughter and it negates her as an adult as well. I give my guy time with his parents as well as time with his kids if they want it. At this point the kids are not interested in developing a relationship with me and I respect that part. It will take a lot of time and honestly it may be after the XW passes on before that relationship will blossom which is sad. It is not my issue. That's all stuff they need to work through. My part is staying out of the way. I encourage my kids to spend time with my BF without me .. it's not always easy for them however they muddle through .. I think we have a different situation because my kids were minors when my BF and I got together. So I respected their feelings however I am one person too. He has been very supportive with them and I am grateful for that.
I get where he's coming from he wants a happy family and move along nothing to see here .. the damage that has been done has to also heal or at least have the opportunity to heal. I'm sure he gets frustrated when he can't control the timeline .. it's not up to him either.
Big hugs it really sounds like you are working your program and firm boundaries and allowing things to just move as they should is just better than forcing.
S :)
It was a really hard thing for me to do to state this all very plainly in a communication to them, as most of the stuff seemed so obvious to me and I was so angry and indignant it wasn't obvious to them. I had to set my anger aside and write something dispassionate.
I spent so much futile energy trying to make my husband, in the throes of addiction, "take control" of the situation and get them off my back. I didn't have much success with that either, suprise suprise. Once I sent the email, asking them to stop contacting me and my family, they stopped. I had complained so much about them not respecting my wishes, but once I made my wishes known in absolute black and white, they did stop.
It was all very bizarre. I have a pretty dysfunctional family, but this was a whole new type of dysfunction. It was hard to get used to someone else's dysfunction. I found the best thing I could do was protect myself, let go and let Gd.
That's my ESH, I will premise that while I was familiar with recovery when this was going on, I was not actively working an Al Anon program.
All the best with your situation
My best ESH is what's in my signature. I've been 'snapped' before telling others what I think as honest as possible when they've asked....why? Because my honesty was not expected. So - I've gotten better at pausing and I even clarify - do you really want my honest response? I am a very direct person and those I allow 'in' know that what is coming may not be what they want to hear.
What I do my best to do is speak I statements. When I can pause, pray and then respond, I am generally decent at determining how this affects me (or if it's even on my side of the street) and then use I statements. You have every right to share what you've posted here - that it makes you uncomfortable to be pulled into their relationship. I agree with Serenity - forced relationships are generally uncomfortable for all involved. Organic grown owns seem to develop in a more healthy way.
My AH has a grown daughter. She's also an A. She was in recovery, then went out for 10+ years and is back in recovery (as best I know). She does like me but doesn't like her father. I stay far, far away from 'all that' and have made it real clear that any issues they have with one another need to be directly managed - I will not be complicit in any of the dysfunction. I too retired from the drama/chaos department a few years back. My boys have to fight it out, they have to tell their dad instead of me their complaints with him and I truly only engage if/when it's my deal.
Parents are always the last to see fault in their offspring. They are even further behind in admitting any of it. This applies to 'earth people' (we say that for those who are not alcoholic). It's even a bigger issue with this disease and the diseased. All the denial in the world can stand between what he sees and what you see. Even when my own boys were making a huge mess of their lives, what was perpetually in my mind was the sweet small smiling faces from way before the disease came. It's tough as a parent to accept the disease and it's even tougher to let go and set healthy boundaries. It does come in God's time though, at least it did for me.
It's perfectly OK to tell him you don't know what to think or how you feel. It's OK to be LTP - Less Than Perfect - even in a new marriage. And, it's OK that they are too. I often find that most people I know, with this disease or without it, want the same thing - to be happy, healthy and emotionally whole - or as close as possible. Our paths to 'there' will be vastly different but if I can keep reminding myself that we all have similar goals and our own HP's - it better allows me to accept where each are and to love them unconditionally.
Hang in there - it's awesome that he's including you. Just do what you can to stay on your side of the street and love them both from afar if/when things get sticky....(((Hugs)))